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The Pope Visits US - and most swoon
April 23, 2008
3:20 pm
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red blonde
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Or by paying people off and sweeping it under the Papal vestments!

April 23, 2008
3:22 pm
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red blonde
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And to think that I once even considered becoming a nun! Thank GOD, I didn't.

April 23, 2008
3:23 pm
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jv63
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Bevdee
The negativity in your comments is that the only thing you choose to post about are the pedophiles and problems i don't hear you complaining or even commenting on the Billions of dollars raised and spent feeding and clothing and medical care for the poor each year. red you don't seem to mention that either and that is exactly what Jesus taught us to do. My point is i hear alot of noise about the few who are doing the wrong horrible things but i don't hear about the millions and millions of Catholics both in the clergy and in the laity who work extremely hard and who sacrifice every day to ease the suffering of humanity. You are talking about a small minority as if you are condemning every Catholic on the face of the earth. I think that is wrong and I am entilteled to my opinion just as you are yours.

April 23, 2008
3:30 pm
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bevdee
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jv?

I was responding to Truthbtold's post.

April 23, 2008
3:30 pm
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red blonde
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No, I am not forgetting the lay person...they can do or think or believe in the Church all they want..I was born a Catholic and I was married a Catholic...I was baptised a Catholic TWICE. I used to believe in the Church and its rituals.

There are alot more people in this world who aren't CATHOLICS who feed the world's poor and have charities and alieve the suffering of humanity...the Church just being one of them...I think that it does not have ANYTHING to do with Catholism or religion...it has everything to do with being human and having a soul and empathy for others in dire situations.

April 23, 2008
3:32 pm
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bevdee
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Your comment about the good the Church does?

Is this in an attempt to downplay the crimes these priests are committing against little kids?

Or is it a red herring to deviate the conversation away from a topic you find uncomfortable?

April 23, 2008
3:33 pm
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bevdee
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I mean, it's true, I didn't say, those priests are STILL raping those kids, but look at all the good they do. I was responding to TruthBtold's post about the pedophilia.

Which is still wrong.

April 23, 2008
3:36 pm
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jv63
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No this is not a red herring or a down play. I am just trying to repond to your HATEFULL comments and wonder why the Bashers on this site have to keep bashing.

April 23, 2008
3:39 pm
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red blonde
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Pedophilia is a sickness, a mental illness, that is NOT curable nor treatable, like cancer or some stds. Perhaps, some joined the priesthood because of they saw it as a haven or protected atmosphere where their deeds would go unpunished and hushed up, under the guise of serving God and the Church?

April 23, 2008
3:42 pm
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red blonde
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I would bash any religion that hides its secrets and sins and crimes behind the guise of tending to or saving our souls in the Name of God or Jesus or Buddha or Mohammad, etc.

April 23, 2008
3:43 pm
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jv63
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Red Blonde

I think the Hate in your words and your heart is the real CANCER here.

April 23, 2008
3:50 pm
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red blonde
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I don't consider my comments to be 'hateful' in the least...nor am I holding any anger or resentment within me - though that is what it may come across as - I am just telling it like it is. If you believe in God and Jesus and find your own meaning or belief in them...why do you need all the trappings of 'religion'. God and Jesus or whomever you believe in should be in your heart and soul always...you do not need a set religion telling you to do this and how to act or how to be compassionate or have empathy or do right instead of wrong..etc.

April 23, 2008
3:53 pm
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bevdee
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JV- "I am just trying to repond to your HATEFULL comments and wonder why the Bashers on this site have to keep bashing." Do you know why you feel compelled to respond?

Ahhhh Bashing. That's the real door - slammer to any conversation, JV. We are hateful and rude and we bash your beliefs - which can't take it.

If I don't believe as you do, then is that bashing? If so, then how very bashed you must feel-

How about a little senstivity to those who have been abused as children? How about NOT treying to gloss over the abuse with a side conversation about money the Church spends? I doubt it comes out of those pedophilic priests pockets!! Probalby tithes from those little abused boys' parents.

How about a little sensitivity to those who were damaged by the Catholic Church? They're here at this site- they just don't beat their chests and scream every time the subject comes up.

April 23, 2008
3:53 pm
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red blonde
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I do not HATE Catholics or the Catholic Church or any other religion and the real CANCER is not being ENLIGHTENED enough to know the the difference.

April 23, 2008
3:58 pm
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red blonde
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jv63 -

If I am not mistaken...didn't you once say on this site: "When I sacrifice truth for peace, I end up with neither."?

I thought that was a very enlightening statement to have been said, but if you didn't state that, please ponder that statement for a long time.

April 23, 2008
3:59 pm
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jv63
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Its funny how the haters allways turn things back on the ones they are bashing. If you don't WANT to be part of religion WHY ARE YOU BASHING THOSE WHO DO????????

I have never preached to anyone here on this site and yet here you are preaching to me. I think I need a brake from this site

April 23, 2008
4:06 pm
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on my way
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jv63,

With all due respect. I think that it may be a thing where some people (not you necessarilily, so please don't take it personally) some people tend to worship the icon, or the representative, or tend to idealize the representative to the point of believing that he can fix everything. I think people are tired of religious figures being given all of this recognition, when perhaps they have been mislead by religion or Catholicism. Religious tolerance is also tolerating those who disagree. The Pope cannot fix what is wrong. Perhaps he is viewed as having that ability to do so. He is only human. There are people in the world who beleive he is next in line to the throne of God, and he isn't. JC is, but no one else.

I hope I have not offended you, as I did not mean to. I just think it is good to be open to other's belief systems and why they see the Pope as a normal person like anyone else.

April 23, 2008
4:11 pm
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bevdee
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JV-

You have made alot of assumptions. I wasn't bashing your religion of Christianity, was I? I was talking trash about your pope. A man who, by his actions, or lack thereof, appears to endorse pedophilia, child abuse. IMO. I was responding to Truth's post, yet you still seem to percieve this as an attack on your choice of a belief system.

Why do you assume I am a hater because I don't agree with your beliefs? My parents church taught us that, too. Should I assume you hate me because your beliefs don't mirror mine?

I was also stating my right to free speech on this forum. I would defend yours, too, if someone tried to shut down a conversation you started.

Now you are shouting and Capping at me. I can only suggest you question why you are upset. It can't be at me- my opinions are not original.

Peace JV.

April 23, 2008
4:13 pm
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jv63
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I did say that, and I am telling the truth. I am sick and tired of the spiritually self ritieous people like you. You obviously are such a Bigot that you can't find the spiritual advancements made by others because your ego is to big to believe that others may have something to teach you.You can't believe that someone may be able to enlighten you further because you have to condemn the entire church over the child abusers. Yes i have acknowleged that this is a HORRIBLE thing. But I don't see you Catholic Haters out here starting any threads about wichcraft people who breed babies just to murder them in unspeakable torture. I don't see anybody bellyaching about the evil cults that worship satin. I think its important for me to stand for my beliefs. That is my truth instead of ignoring just another string of ignorant bigoted posts on a thread that I personally take exception to. I am not reamaining silent here I am not going to soften up my opinion in order to get along with you. That is what I mean by sacrificing truth for peace. I am am certainly starting to suspect that you have neither.

April 23, 2008
4:15 pm
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jv63
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Thank you bevdee

i don't hate you or anybody else on this site.

and you too red and on my way

April 23, 2008
4:21 pm
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on my way
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jv63,
I wish you many good blessings. We just have different belief systems but I think you and I from what I have read believe God is central. Some here do not believe that way and that is ok too. I personally have a hard time with religion itself. I go to church and study my Bible to get to know God better. So the Pope does not mean very much to me. But if he means alot to you, then ok, but you don't need anyone else's approval to believe the way you do. 🙂

April 23, 2008
4:21 pm
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jv63
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I really don't know why this really pissed me off.
so I guess ill just have to figure that out
Thanks for the dialoge everyone.

Just for clairification I apologise if i am out of line with any of you.

I do respect your opinions and hope i have been clear that i believe everyone has the right to believe what ever they believe and i respect your right to speak

April 23, 2008
4:25 pm
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on my way
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It's tough when someone attacks your belief system. I used to get really mad on this site too. I used to think that if someone attacked my belief system that they were attacking me....and there really is no truth to that belief. People have different belief systems, and to respect those is important. It isn't about us after all, is it?

April 23, 2008
4:34 pm
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jv63
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It's a big part of who I am

There are alot of yahoo's in all churches and i have personally worked very hard to hang in and be a good to those i mini to. Alot of people do get lost in the icons and the ritual. I have not been that type of Christian. And instead of leaving the Christian faith and sitting back and pointing out how things are wrong I have worked very hard to help people understand that the body of Christ is not about the rules or the hierarchy. It's about our love for one another. I feel judged when people lump the entire Cathlic chrch together. It may not be personal but it sure feels that way.

April 23, 2008
4:37 pm
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bevdee
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On My Way,

"It's tough when someone attacks your belief system. Yes, I understand that, and I understand why I get lashed back at and called names as often as I do. I had this conversation about bashing and respect last year, but I want to say this..

I don't think it is disrespecting someone's belief system to state my own. If I thought so, I would be submitting to a type of censorship. How am I to know if someone's belief system is too fragile to withstand conversation that is contrary to it? Once I do know there is someone like that at this site, should I let that knowledge influence what I discuss?

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