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Suicide as a Solution
November 16, 2003
8:29 pm
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arwen
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If we believe that people have a right to make a clear and conscious choice about how much physical pain they must endure in order to sustain "life", why do we believe that we have the right to tell a human how much emotional pain they have to endure? Why is it just okay to say "Get over it!" Why is it so easy to walk away from someone you said you loved? Why is it so simple to judge and harden your heart? Is this just the way we protect ourselves from being hurt more?

I am tired of this life. I don't want to live it anymore. But I'm not allowed to "opt" out. Tough shit, girlie! You have kids. Family. Responsibilities. So you just get up, and hobble out there on your broken emotional legs and do what you have to do to make sure that everyone gets what they are supposed to get from you. And don't ask for anything, because that would make you beholdin', and owing someone something is not a safe position to be in, ever. At least, that's how I feel.

If someone out there thinks I'm just feeling sorry for myself, well, if it makes you feel better to simplify my life, good for you. Do I feel "sorry" for myself? No. I feel sorry for anyone who has to be around me. I feel sorry that I can't keep myself from sliding back into darkness no matter what kind or how much anti-depressants I take. I feel sorry that I have not been the best person I can be. I feel sorry that I have sacrificed my heart at the expense of people who never gave a flying fuck about me in the first place. I'm sorry that I am not able to fully realize the value of who I am, and stop people from using me because I'm so pathetic that being used actually feels better than not being noticed at all.

If I kill myself, it is my right to do so. And people can give that "It's the most selfish thing you can do..." speech if they want to, but honestly, how selfish are the people who supposedly love me if all they can think about is that I'm obligated to live in this constant state of "empty"? Wouldn't it be nice to hear "I understand you don't want to hurt anymore, and I support whatever decision you make because I don't know what it's like to live inside your head, and maybe it hurts way worse that I ever realized." That would feel like love to me. That would feel like freedom to me. That would feel like acceptance to me.

So I give myself permission to suicide if I decide that's what's in my best interest. And I don't accept anyone's attempts to make me feel guilty or selfish. No one would do that to me if I had terminal cancer and I was vomiting up pieces of my innards from chemotherapy. People would be giving me their blessing, and holding me close, and whispering in my ear that it was alright to give up, to let go of this life and transition into the next life.

Isn't there ANYONE out there who can comprehend that there is an emotional existance that equates vomiting up pieces of your cancer-ridden innards? Isn't there anyone who knows what it's like to hurt that badly? Isn't there anyone whose one wish for me would be mercy? I guess not. Hell, I can't even wish that for myself. Meaning there must be some part of me who believes I deserve this. God knows I'm not alone in this belief. There are plenty of other people who know me and would say "Yep. She's getting what's coming to her, the fuckin' bitch."

Karma? I don't want to admit that it's a possibility. I want to say, "But you have given love. You have tried hard to raise your children with love and support. You have been there for friends and family in times of need. You chose a profession built around helping people who are hurting inside." So, what have I done? Who have I been to have earned this "paycheck"? Have I been so much worse than other people who have lived here?

Maybe so...

November 16, 2003
10:10 pm
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Ladeska
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I understand where you are, Arwen....been there myself a few times. Wasn't fun and I felt just like you do now. So I can't say all the things that people say, I just can't. I think people do get to a point where the pain is just too loud and suicide looks like a good option. I know I felt that way. The only thing that did save me from doing it - was my daughter.

I knew that as much as I understood what I was doing....she never would. And I would forever be a reminder to her that if things got too tough for her, she should think about suicide herself and as bad as my life was at that point, I just couldn't do it. Didn't have the balls or whatever but I knew what I would leave in her life...a mark that she would never really understand.

I look back now and where I was then was extremely dark and full of hopelessness. The only light I had was her face. At that time, I fully believed that I was done....fully and totally believed that - at that time. But....that wasn't so because - here I am. I can't tell you how bad things were for me then. Every one that ever meant anything to me besides her had betrayed me, right, left and sideways and basically kept kicking me so that I would jump over the edge.

I had just found out information that basically put some things together for me that revealed a plot of extremely horrible magnitude and was just too vile for me to comprehend, much less live with. I just wanted to be very dead. Didn't want to hurt anymore, I was done.

But....I guess I wasn't done because something inside me didn't let me totally cut my artery, only knicked it and then I passed out with a wet, heavy towel drapped over my arm as I extended it out from the couch where I finally ended up and it acted as a compress until I woke up later. Lost alot of blood but didn't die. Funny thing, too........when I woke up - I totally did not want to die. Was so freaked out that I almost did it and was horribly ashamed of myself. Only because I thought of her....how could I do this to my baby? When I looked at her, she saw everything good in me, saw the love I had still in my heart, trying so hard to surface and survive and she reflected it back to me in that sweet little smile of hers. She wasn't with me that night, was at a babysitters and I could not wait to get to her later. All I could think about was - we'll get through this together. But all in all, it was more than that. I guess part of me just knew that - I had a right to be here. And I had a right to fight and take my stand against the whole lot of them if I had to. And if I was going to die....it was going to be on the battlefield of all that. Maybe I wouldn't make it, maybe I would fail but I was going to give whoever tried to stop me a bit of hell going there.

But I do know where you are and how you feel. And I would never tell you - that you don't hurt enough to do this. I know you do. And I won't tell you that it's not an option, obviously it is. We do have the power to take our own life. But I will tell you - if I had of done that myself....and if I had of believed everything I was telling myself - I have not lived enough life that has proved that all wrong. So I was not in my right mind when I was there, was not thinking clearly at all and if I took my life then....it would have been an impulsive decision.

November 16, 2003
10:13 pm
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Ladeska
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correction to last paragraph...I have NOW lived enough life...

instead of..

I have NOT lived enough life...

Fumble finger typing.

November 16, 2003
10:31 pm
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tooscared
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Arwen, I know that you are hurting badly right now. I do wish mercy for you dear Arwen, but not in the way you mean. I pray that you will feel a presence with you tonight that is greater than the loneliness and emptiness you feel right now. I pray that you will feel a blanket of love from strangers that can reach out with arms of acceptance and unconditional love. No more struggling to do things right or saying the right thing at the right time - just a peace and calmness of knowing that you are loved and cherished and accepted just for being you.

I agree with Ladeska in thinking about your children. If you can find no reason to live other than the fact that they need you and they do reflect the good that is inside of you Arwen. They know you love them are there for them. They also know that you are not perfect, but you know what - it doesn't matter to them because they know that someone loves them unconditionally - loves them from a deep love that only a mother has for her children.

Arwen, just hang in there and no that tomorrow will come. There will be hope again and laughter and sunshine and love. The darkness will break because where a little light begins to shine, darkness has to fade away. You will find light again Arwen and until then, hold onto the fact that I care, Ladeska cares, and many many others. Your friendship and advice has helped so many on AAC. ((((((((Arwen))))))))))
Love, TS

November 17, 2003
9:25 am
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eve
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I don't think that anybody has the right to decide what you should do whith your life, except yourself. And of course it is nonsense and not helpful at all to be told that you should pull yourself together and *just* pull out of depression. You can't.

But the big difference to cancer in my opinion is: in cancer there is a point during the illness when 99,9% of all medical professionals would agree that there can't be healing. Depression *can* heal. It can even heal after a very long time. Or it can be alleviated somewhat by drugs.

My mother killed herself when I was small. It took a long time for me to realize that it propably was the only option open to her, and to 'allow' her to do so in my mind. But there is still a lot of tension and unopened black rooms in the memory of our family.

November 17, 2003
10:14 am
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mj
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Hugs Arwen....and lots of love is in my heart for you. Please let us help you through these feelings. Life is fuller with you in it. (((((ARWEN))))

November 17, 2003
11:46 am
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arwen
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Still here, for another sunrise, maybe for another sunset...

I can't even begin to explain the freedom I feel to have written the words I wrote last night. To give myself permission to do whatever I feel I need to do. I feel like the weight of the world has been lifted from my shoulders.

I want to look at my life and say that my kids need me. But if you were to ask my family, or a handfull of friends what they think, they would spout out all the reasons that I am a horrible mother. They would tell you all about how I have damaged my kids, and continue to damage them. They would discuss every parenting decision I ever made that they didn't agree with. And if you ask my children, they will say what children are "programmed" to say..."I love my mom. She's a good mom." What the fuck is a "good" mom anyway? No two of us "moms" are alike, are we?

I didn't kill myself. I did cut. Actually, with more of a purpose that inflicting pain or seeing blood. I created an "A"--for Arwen, for Anger, for Angie, for Almost, for Alone, for Always, for Alienated, for Alive.

You see, I know that this depression will abate. It always does. But I also must live with the knowledge that it will return, and that each time it does, it will be worse than it was the last time. And each time it's just a little harder to survive. So, I think that one day I won't be able to get through it. I think I'll make it through this one, maybe the next one, or the next one. But my god what am I going to do when menopause hits and I'm going from manic to depressive like a fucking yo-yo? I think I'm going to die, then. Maybe I'll die sooner than that. I don't know.

I don't want to be dead. I'm just too tired to keep on living this way, and I don't know how to change it. I can't even count on myself.

So, what's the point?

November 17, 2003
12:01 pm
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mj
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Hugs dear Arwen. Do you ever turn it over to a higher power? Maybe you could be directed to the point?
Just know that I care. Love, MJ

November 17, 2003
4:45 pm
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~~~the life that I know isn't easy, the life I live isn't easy as for many of many of people that live on this earth and a crazy place it is, kids killing kids and so on. I was talking to a friend one day about suicide and was told to imagine my funeral and seeing my sprit there at my own funeral watching my dear sweet boy which is now turning into a young man to watch his pain and listen to him say why wasn't I enough for her to live? what did I do wrong? why? why do I have to now live with out a mother? That conversation caught my attention that day and I now focus on all the reasons to live. Just like no one person is the same or mother the same there is no right answer for depression or anger or all of the above. I had a very wise 77 year old woman tell me one time that some times we just have to let it go and do things that others tell us to do to live a better life or to continue to live at all, she was talking about the 12 steps of AA and all the readings in the big book. I hope to live long enough to be a wise old gray haired lady that can help someone such as myself. For me life is different than it was for me just yesterday, events and people that come into our life's I think help mold and shape us into the people that we are some good and some bad. To have the ambulance pull up in front of your house and then go into your drug addicted neighbor house and not knowing if they are going to bring her out alive or in a body bag, wondering were her son is. They brought her out alive but she looked like death they took her away and the 14 year old got to be left behind to be alone, and what do you do? you do what any person would do you comfort him and offer him food and a hug and his eyes so red from crying and fear in his heart that I am sure is getting so hard by now because mom can't change. Sure mom came home three days later acting like nothing happened but why should she, she probable doesn't remember what she looked like much less even the ride to the hospital. I can't even go out today in the fresh air to hang my clothes with out the smell of marijuana in the air, I ask myself what is that boy going to come home to today? drug dealer came and went, Is she going to burn them both up with a lit cigarette? She is the only one that can make change that boy can't do it for her. Sometimes we just have to do what we have to do no matter how bad we don't want to do it. For anyone that knows me knows how much I love my animals and I pore my heart and sole into them, and everytime I find one of them dead in the road it crushes me and I do what I should do, I pick them up or shovel there smashed little brains off the road with big tears in my eyes and heart hurting because I don't want another car to run over them, even though I know they can't feel anymore I don't want to see them hurting any more and I give them a place in the earth. Sure I so wish someone else would come along and do it for me but who would pick up your dead animal and do the right thing? yes that's right no one but maybe the street cleaner or dog catcher and into the trash. I think we as humans should do the right thing, life is a gift from God and short for some and long lasting for others, I think we should help one another and hopefully that doesn't mean washing ones brains off the wall or picking there lifeless body out of a pool of blood. I guess I am kind of emotional today reading this thread and just going though a demoralizing experience and walking away from it a different person I do believe. I don't like to see animals hurting and I don't like to see other humans hurting and life is to short and everyday we don't make change we are wasting another day. Like it is said in "Shawshank Redemption" "get busy living or get busy dieing" bottom line it's our chose, and just like I wouldn't leave one of my dead kitties in the road to be ran over one more time no matter how ugly the mess is or was I wouldn't leave some one all alone to bleed to death with out at least trying to reach out and saying it's ok to hurt and it's ok we have fucked up in life but in my believe it's not ok to take away a gift from God and that would be called life. We become what we are by going through the hard times having the good and the bad and our neighbors can be good or bad but in the end we are all just the same and life is full of decisions and we should all think really hard before we make decisions because we do have to live with them the rest of our lives and today I can set here with head up high and say sure I fucked up much in life but I am here and we are all in it together~~~~~~~~~~~

Life is a chose, just make the right chose for you~

November 17, 2003
8:09 pm
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arwen
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If it's not okay to walk away, look the other way, give up, then why am I here all alone? Crying on a fucking keyboard of a computer instead of in the arms of someone who loves me? I am alone. Alone because I have walked away. Alone because I've been walked away from.

My life is not making a difference to anyone. I have no purpose. There is no value in me right now. Maybe tomorrow there will be a happier person in this fat thing called a "body", but right now all there is is pain. And I'm not talking about just emotional pain. I'm talking about the kind of emotional pain that makes your body hurt. I'm talking about pain that makes me want to cut my wrists just so that maybe it will go away. Taking a chance. Rolling the dice. Because so far, nothing else has worked. And every time I come up from the bottom--FUCK!!! I fight so fucking hard to come up from the bottom every time this happens to me. For all my life, hiding it while I fight it and somehow getting through it. And where is the fucking "higher power"? I'm it!!! I'm the only one who can get me out of this. If there was a fucking GOD who could do it, it would already be done because that's how fucking hard I have prayed. That's how much I've begged. And I've done the work. I'd be dead already if I hadn't worked hard enough to earn a little peace in my heart. But that doesn't mean anything in this place where I'm living.

So, what's the point?

I pull myself up, and out of this blackness and emptiness, back into the light of the world of the living, for what???????

So I can look forward to the next time I start feeling the concrete on my feet, the stress building, the loneliness creeping up on me, the voices in my head getting louder and louder and louder.

So that when it happens again, and it always does (even though I trick myself into believing "this is the last time" like some abusive husband saying to his wife "honey, I swear this is the last time...I'll never hit you again...") I can look around and see--no one...

No husband. No children. No family. No friend(s). And no fucking higher power there to help. Just me. Alone. Struggling.

That drug addicted neighbor, maybe she'd be doing her kid a favor if she did finally accidentally overdose so he could go and live with someone healthy, who could take proper care of him. And maybe I'm no different than her, just sick in a different way. And I hear all the voices of all the people who ever let me know what a fuck up I am saying in unison "Just get it over with already because we are fucking sick of you! Go Away! And if that means you die, so be it!"

So what if I do? How interesting it would be, hovering over my funeral, watching the very people who left me run over by the side of the road-- crying--because that's what you do at a funeral. You cry. You act like you cared. You act like you did everything you could, or you guilt yourself out with everyone else until the casket is lowered or the ashes are blowing in the wind, and then you walk away--again. Your life goes on as it should. It's what's right. Your life, going on. My life, going.

So what is the fucking point?

I don't need anyone's permission but my own. And if this life was "given" to me by something who thinks it's "GOD", well all I have to say is Fuck YOU! I want a new life and if ending this one is the only way to have it, then I will. When I say so.

Ain't that the ultimate control trip?

Arwen

November 18, 2003
12:55 am
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arwen
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"I have learned a thing that you haven't. There are some things that are worth having, but those things come at a price--and I want to be one of them." Karyn Blixen in "Out of Africa"

And then later, after she has survived life-threatening illness, a divorce, lost all of her money, and her lover has left her he says to her "Let me help you." when he realizes that her only choice is to leave Africa. She has lost everything. And when he says "Let me help you." she responds "You would keep me, then?" And he stands there, with a look on his face--a look that says "You might be worth the money, but you aren't worth the time."

How I know that look... How I know what it means to be worth any and everything but time. And how I have learned the hard way what "Let me help you." usually means. And how I've learned the hard way what "I love you." usually means. Or "I care what happens to you.", or "I want to help you." or "I'm happy to do what I can for you." or "How are you doing today?"

Like the widow after the funeral of her husband, soon after his body begins to cool she discovers that everyone who came to help her quickly begin leaving again. One morning she wakes up in an empty house, no warmth on her husband's side of the bed, though the smell of him still lingers there. It becomes a fading memory. And then she has to face reality.

She is alone...

November 18, 2003
10:52 am
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arwen
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And just like that...

It's lifting.

I wake up this morning after two days of feeling like there was no way to survive this one, and I'm saying to myself "Now, that wasn't so bad, was it?"

Was it all the chocolate I ate? Was it all the crying I did? Was it the lexapro? The xanax? What made it get better so fast this time?

I think maybe it was setting myself free by saying to myself that I have permission to suicide. That took a lot of pressure off of me. In fact, the kinda scary thing is that today, I feel like I have the energy to explain to my kids that I have a "terminal" illness of the mind, that I'm in a lot of pain, and that there's a chance I won't survive it. I think I could explain it to them and though it would hurt, they would understand. And I could just go take care of business. It would be so easy to just walk off into the woods. No mess to clean up. Let the animals take care of it. Take enough shit to fall asleep and freeze to death. Sounds easy enough.

Then what? Then what? Then what?

Not so easy after all...without an answer to that question. How will I "accomplish" anything. What would my purpose be after death?

But what if...suicide is the way out of this plane of existance. What if by opting out we are saying "I've learned all I need to learn from this place, and I'm ready to move on to a new place." I feel that way all the time.

Ha. I think about the people who might read this and know me. Part of me feels so pissed because I don't think I can gather the strength and courage to suicide. That's one thing I have learned. Everyone always says that suicide is for cowards. I say from my perspective, bullshit. It takes some intense bravery to take your life because you don't know what you're getting yourself into. You don't know where you'll be when your body is dead.

Sure, there might be some impulsive people out there who just do it without thinking it through. I'm not built that way. I have to think it through. So, what am I going to do here? Go. Or wait for the next wave of hell. Today I will decide, to either get busy living or get busy dying. That is my goal.

I'm not being fair to myself when I say that because the very fact that I'm here means I have been busy living, or trying to, anyway. I have worked hard. I'm still working hard. I'm not dead yet.

I've got a lot more to say about this...

Arwen

November 18, 2003
11:40 am
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mj
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I am listening Arwen.

November 18, 2003
11:44 am
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mj
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I have felt suicidal too. I know what you are saying.

It hurts me to know that others find life painful too.

Lucky for me, I never took my life.
Lucky for me, I found a reason to carry on. I feel lucky to have each day that I awake. I have an empty canvas to create my day upon. It is my choice to create a work of art or throw the canvas in the garbage.

I hear your pain. Loudly...and I am glad you are talking about it, Arwen.

November 18, 2003
11:45 am
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tooscared
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I care too Arwen. My heart is a little scared for you because I have come to really appreciate your kind words to people on this site and your presence and I don't want to lose you. 🙂

November 18, 2003
2:15 pm
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arwen
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How is it that kind words and my presence can be of help when I am so completely fucked up? I have no idea where any of it comes from...

I woke up today feeling pretty good. But it wasn't long before that was over again and I started sinking. I'm working at home today because I can't seem to keep from crying and I hate for people to see me cry.

I do want to live, but not like this.

I feel so trapped.

When I did work in the nursing home, I learned a lot about death. I was with my grandfather and my brother-in-law when they were dying. I know it gave them great comfort to hear that it was okay, that there was peace and love waiting for them where they were going. And if I had a dime for every time someone said "I'm glad because now he doesn't have to suffer anymore.", well, I'd never have to worry ever again about how to get the bills paid!

But if I killed myself, what would people say? "How could she do that to her kids!" "She took the easy way out!" "How selfish!" "Her life wasn't that bad." "It's not fair that she left us here to deal with all this pain." "She was crazy."

No one would say "I'm glad for her because she is in a better place and she doesn't have to suffer anymore."

And here's the other thing: I could die any time! I could get hit by a bus or a bolt of lightening. I could have a blood vessel bust in my brain. Look what happened to John Ritter! So, honestly, if I die, does it really make a difference "how"? If I really wanted to, I could make it look like an accident. But why? Why not be honest? Should I suicide secretly so that I won't hurt people who love me? If so many people in my life care about me, where are they? My phone doesn't ring. I don't get any emails. I can't remember the last time I felt loved.

I have been reading Dr. Phil's book "Self Matters". He talks about the authentic self, and "When were you happy?" Shit. I have been who I am for as long as I can remember. I used to dig dead mice out of the trash after my mom took them out of the traps to give them a proper burial and I'd cry my eyes out and be begging god to let them go up to heaven. I think I was about 3 when i started doing this kind of thing. I remember waking up in the middle of the night, still on the bottle, and searching for it everywhere, finding it and just laying there, sucking, wide awake while everyone else slept. I used to wet the bed 2 or 3 times a night. Sometimes I'd be curled up in my pillow case because it was the only warm dry place left. If my oldest sister hummed the Brahm's Lullaby, I would burst into tears because I thought that song was so sad. So, who is my "authentic" self? This shit is just the tip of the iceberg dammit.

What am I not getting? I'm a smart person. Believe me. I'm dangerously smart and insightful. I can't even honestly begin to write about some of the thoughts that haunt me because if I really got down to the bottom of things, someone who knows me will see it and then the shit will hit the fan. I can go this far, that's it. You see, I'm so dangerously smart that I know exactly how much I can say before certain lines are crossed and bridges are burned. I'm not going to spend the rest of my life forced onto medication or living in a fucking nut house.

So what am I going to do? I don't know...

November 18, 2003
3:01 pm
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mj
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I don't know....sounds like an awful place to be.

I know that you have said that others know you here in your private life as well. So you definitely need a anonymous venting place. Hugs....

November 18, 2003
3:25 pm
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Arwen......you know, I think it actually does do something to you kn a freeing kind of way to just SAY IT and vomit it up and out of yourself. Like well I COULD IF I WANTED TO!!!! And if I did - this is what I think about it all, too!! It is freeing actually. It helps. I've done that, too and to be honest, I think that's one thing that turned me away from it. Kinda funny, looking back on all that....

Actually I probably will just wander out into the woods when it's my time to go. I know that if I get cancer tom., I won't have it treated and I won't tell anyone until I absolutely have to. Just won't put my daughter through the agony of watching me go through treatment, etc. That's my cue for - it's all over, just make it quick and let it all go. I just won't die by wasting away like that and putting those who love me through the trauma, the expense and the up and down yo-yo thing.

You don't seem to be "done" here yet though. I think you realize that alot of this is chemical in you. I don't know what this is that I'm going to tell you about.......all I know is I saw it talked about on this one program and I went - what the HELL? It was a story about a couple of brothers who went on a killing spree. One was paralyzed and quite the wheelchair athelete and his brother very much looked up to him and followed his lead. Thing was - the older one was pretty much a psychopath and very much influenced and controlled to a great degree - the younger brother. They started doing break-ins, stealing stuff and then it progressed to - we're now going to kill someone. They did, killed a couple in their hometown. Thing was - it came out later that the both of them had been very abused by their parents. He was a pastor, go figure.... The mom was the more brutal one that abused and of course, the husband just allowed it, thought it was fine and dandy. The daughter squealed on them, finally told what had been going on. The younger son had basically been horribly beaten by his mother and ridiculed and yelled at constantly. He seemed a little slow mentally and that just sat her off.

But wierd thing was - years down the road after the older son got life in prison and the younger one did eventually get out - based on his mental state at the time - they interviewed him later and what a DIFFERENT young man. He had problems before with hearing everything very amplified, like he couldn't turn the background noise down in order to focus on whatever, someone talking or anything. He said you walking across the floor and the carpet crunching was extremely loud to him and that he dealt with this among other things like voices in his head, etc. Well, interesting thing was.......he said - they found out I needed a certain hormone and that IF I had of had this a long time ago - none of this would have ever happened. He could talk coherently, was a totally different person, didn't have the hearing problems, the voices, the bad frame of mind, nothing. It all cleared up when he got this hormone. Not what is that hormone and why don't we hear more about this? I was stunned. I just sat back and went WHAT??? I mean I always knew that, for example, if you had too much testosterone going on - this would lead to anger problems and sometimes physical violence but never knew that - the absence of a hormone could result in all of this.

November 18, 2003
5:55 pm
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arwen
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That is interesting and helpful information, as always. And it's like you are reading my mind. It's not like I think about killing someone in particular, I just think I have done this in a past life or something--been a murderer. If the thought enters my mind, I feel every feeling as if it is happening. I don't see pictures. I don't hear voices telling me to do it. It's like a flashback of memory and I think to myself "If I'm capable of having these kinds of thoughts, am I capable of actually commiting murder?"

I don't think I am. I mean, I have questioned my ability to even take the life of someone who intended to kill me. (Although if someone tried to kill one of my kids or family members, they best back the fuck up...)

But it scares me to bad that I could even know what that would be like. How do I know? It's as if the details of every emotion in every order are imprinted intricately in my head.

A couple of nights ago, when I cut, I woke up in the morning, went to get in the shower, felt something hurting, looked at my arm and went "Oh fuck!" I didn't remember that I did it, Ladeska! I didn't remember until I saw the cuts. And I wasn't on any drugs.

So, what are the possibilities?

Arwen

November 19, 2003
1:25 am
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I don't know, Arwen. I don't exactly buy the past life stuff. I think if that were true, it would be a bit more obvious with alot more people. I don't dig that thing about karma either because, I'm sorry - but what the hell? No one is going to tell me that my abuse, for example, was payment to me from my bad karma for something I did in a past life. How fucked up is THAT? But I've had people tell me that very thing before and try to make it sound nice-nice. Well, they got a not so nice reply from me, very quickly.

I personally don't think that we have to keep coming back until - we get it right. That sounds sooo much like man - creating something to basically keep people in line and to create a caste system, those more evolved and those less evolved. Yea whatever, same old screwed up story you see time and time again, just dressed up different and presented to us.

That's just something that really rubs me wrong when something bad to happens to someone and they say - Wow, they must have had some bad karma in a past life!! Oh BITE ME!! Just like the thing that people say when they are in a tornado and their house is spared and everyone else's house is leveled. Oh GOD blessed US. Soooo....that means that God was mad at everyone else on the block and that somehow - you were more special to God??? How vile is that?

But as far as you are concerned, Arwen, and the question you asked - are you capable of committing murder? Probably. I think we all are, given the right circumstances. We all possess that ability. Can you do it without being in control of yourself while you do it. Dicey proposition. I don't know. I'm sure it's probably happened.

Do you need to worry about this yourself? I don't know. I can see that you don't trust yourself right now and are expressing that here. I just think that you are surrounded by alot of old news. Old situations, people that constantly remind you of the past, which prohibits you from making alot of progress because you keep runnng into the past at every turn. Can't be healthy for you.

That's not the whole picture, by any means, but it is a large part of it. Not to say that it's all their fault. Fault goes around the block to everyone involved. But it can't be good for you to be met with this at every turn.

If it were me, and I were in your shoes, I'd move the hell away from all that so that you aren't reminded all the time. You just keep spinning deeper and deeper here and it just seems logical to me that you need to get out of your surroundings and start a fresh life somewhere. If it were me - that's exactly what I would do. I've done it now three times and it worked. Sometimes you just can't fight the negative forces around you, even if all they do is remind you. You have to get out of all the old memories and stimulate yourself anew, with new things and new people.

Some would say that's running away from your problems and that your problems will just follow you. That's true to an extent but when you really look at it logically, that doesn't quite wash. If I was still in the area where I grew up - I'd be reminded every day of some really toxic stuff that would drive me quite insane. I just could not do it and even visiting back there the few times I did - I got a taste of all that. And realized just how smart I really was, even back then as a young person - to remove myself from the situation, from the old memories and start over. Some things are just better left to die in the dust and to let anyone who wants to wallow in it - in the dust as well. And no, I didn't always have the "means" to move or do whatever. Funny thing though....when you absolutely say that you cannot and will not stay there anymore and that you have to move on for your own sanity - you can move mountains you had no idea you could move and the way is always opened unto you when you get that mindset. But you have to get at that point of - no turning back, I have to do this, no other options.

You can try and work and work the puzzle, but after awhile, the puzzle just isn't going to work itself out with all odds against you. We have to see that at some point and go - I'm only hurting myself by investing any more energy in this direction, it's a hopeless cause, I'm dying here, can't freaking move for getting knocked down again. Yes, some problems will follow you, but you'll have a helluva lot more energy to devote to all that, which was being spent just pushing back the tide that came at you every single day. Something to think about...

November 19, 2003
11:57 am
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Hugs Arwen....

November 19, 2003
12:37 pm
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I don't believe that Karma is "bad things happen to you because you did bad things". I think that it is an energy, to take the negative and make it positive, or to choose to stay in the negative.

I believe in past lives because there are too many people who I've encountered in my time here that I knew in a way that was not "normal". Too many people that I have connected with instantaneously, as if we knew one another all of our lives.

Maybe my suicidal ideation is a manifestation of my desire to get the hell out of this town and settle some place where there is not so much negative energy pulling at me all the time. It makes me angry, though, to think of leaving a place I love so much because I can't deal with the past. And how much of this shit is generated by the past? I don't know. When I feel suicidal, I'm dwelling on the future, not the past. I fear the future greatly because of the next wave of depression.

I have come across some ideas that I think need to be addressed. I did some research on the medications I take, and how they can or can't work together. I think this might be one of the reasons why things have gotten so bad for me lately. I never felt as suicidal before I started taking anti-depressants! But there is one particular anti-depressant that seems to be working very well for me, which is why I think mornings are better for me than nights...

There is a medication I need to stop taking, but it has to be a gradual thing. I think if I can manage to make a few changes, stay focused on here and now, and continue to accept support from people around me, I might get all this shit figured out.

I think about that movie, A Beautiful Mind. I have a beautiful mind. I believe that there has to be a way to conquer this disease without being a drugged out zombie. I just have to keep on working like I always have been, and everything will be alright.

I'm not guaranteed a tomorrow. No one is. So why get all worked up about the next bout of depression? I might not live long enough to have to fight it.

Today is a good day.

Arwen

November 19, 2003
12:59 pm
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Arwen...I hope you don't mind me asking but - what are you taking?

November 19, 2003
4:41 pm
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Celexa 40 mg QD

Xanax 1-3 mg TID PRN

Lexapro 10 mg QHS

Phentermine 37.5 mg QAM

You strike me as the kind of person who can understand what I wrote here...and I did it this way because I know that not necessarily everyone who reads it will understand it completely...

I recently happened upon some medication information that said it is a big no-no to take phentermine with anti-depressants such as Celexa and Lexapro, and that Celexa and Lexapro should not be taken together. Now, my practitioner doesn't know that I'm taking the Celexa and the Lexapro together. I just started doing it because I got desperate. My feeling is that I can probably can the Celexa and the phentermine, start getting some good out-door exercise, and the xanax and the lexapro will get me by until I can do enough work to get my symptoms manageable.

I started keeping a calendar of my depressive cycle just this month. It is amazing how fast I seem to pull out of it these days. Really amazing! I used to be fucked up for at least a week if not longer. But the depth of depression hasn't decreased, so I get as depressed as always, just over a shorter period of time, which makes it send me over the edge easier. When it used to creep up on me slowly, it lasted longer, but the low didn't sweep in over a 24-48 hour period od time.

I had managed to go months without cutting. I'm so irritated with myself for doing it again. I kinda fucked up my arm in a way that it's never going to be completely concealable. That bugs the fuck out of me! I'm taking very good care of the cuts, and after all the hell I went through with my daughter's surgery, and the scarring, I have a pretty good method for keeping the scarring to a minimum. The thing is, I sliced a pen open and rubbed ink all into the cuts. I spent about an hour this morning, very early, scrubbing the cuts with soap and hydrogen peroxide. Then I re-opened the cuts and scrubbed some more. I did not intend to give myself a fucking tattoo! I think I have most of the ink out, and if I don't, I know a good tattoo artist who can cover it up. Still...that is very fucked up of me, especially that I didn't remember doing it until I saw it the next day.

I am wondering if there hasn't been some pretty serious negative side effects as the result of taking the phentermine with the anti-depressants all this time. That was the information I got off the internet. Now that I'm starting to feel better, though, I'm scared to change my meds around. I guess when I feel more stable I'll go ahead and take the plunge.

Arwen

November 19, 2003
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Self medicating and flirting with mixing drugs - is an accident looking for a place to happen, Arwen. Tricky business and not a good idea. I really don't know about alot of drugs to be honest with you. But what I do know is - you have to VERY careful about doing what you're doing. Not good. I think you need to continue doing your research and maybe talk to a doctor about it that you can trust. You can't screw around with yourself like this, Arwen. Your system is going to know what to do with itself, ya know? You yank it this way and then that way. No wonder you're up one hill and down the other one. You can't play with your body and your brain like this without wiring it for sound at some point.

So...........just get more educated about these drugs and their interaction and do it like SOON. Get on top of it, really KNOW what you're doing and how it affects you and the dangers therein. You obviously went into doing this - without knowing and that's kinda jacked up and irresponsible of you, isn't it? (smile) Shake your head, yes it is...

Okay fine, you seem to maybe have something going here that will work, but be very sure about that before you go too far down this road. I'm encouraged to hear that you pop out sooner and don't stay in the darkness as long. But still........I think you're playing with fire here. So check this out more and let me know what you find out.

I have very little knowledge personally of using things. AlL I ever did was Effexor and Xanax. Only took half a tab of Xanax in the morning and one at night and if I had a panic attack, maybe another half. But quickly went down to just using a half to sleep good at night. Was on Effexor for about 6 months. It worked really well for me. I just stopped cold turkey though and that made me dizzy for a few weeks. Wasn't fun. That was stupid of me, should have done a slow withdrawal. Duh. But both did what they were supposed to overall. Got me back up and running again. I do know people though that have done what you are doing, mixing stuff, trying this and trying that and I have to say that - it has broken my heart to see what they went through, too. It's almost like we have become too dependent on drugs to fix things and it's just too easy to try this and then go on that until your whole being just gets so rewired that it's hell ever getting straight again. So if you find something that works, then stick with it and try to get yourself out of this cycle. I hope you're onto something here...with how you are doing this. It's just very dangerous and at some point - something consistent has to be instituted so basically your body can go OHHHH THIS is the plan now!!!

Btw, don't use Hydrogen Peroxide for cuts anymore, it actually destroys tissue. An emergency room doctor told me that, that it's a myth it's good for all that. He said the best thing to use it Dettol, that you can get it at the drug store. Also, Blue Emu is very, very good for your skin in general as far as healing is concerned, great for your face! And Tea Tree is good for cuts. Very strong but a great antiseptic.

Blue Emu though is the bomb!! LOVE that stuff. I'm out now but need to get some more. We can get it at the grocery store here. Is expensive but you can order it online and get it cheaper and get more concentrated emu oil in it as well. It goes deep into the skin and plumps it up. When I used it on my face, I could really tell a difference. Helped it to stay moisturized all day, too.

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