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Science Without Bounds - the new religion?
June 4, 2006
10:41 pm
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happiness anxiety is something of which I got some, in my bad moods only though.

here OMW, you have NO way of knowing if Christianity is anymore true than Islam or Judaism - dont you guys get it? How obvious can this be? You are no different than Muslims or Jews or people from other religions. You are NO different from them. If you could think on a wider scale and see the bigger picture which I can, thankfully, you would see what I'm trying to say.

June 4, 2006
11:42 pm
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guest,
I am different. Jesus Christ came to earth as a man. He was God but humbled himself and did not cling to his rights as God. He died for me, he died for you. No mere man could have walked that road and lost that much blood and lived to be nailed on a cross if God had not willed it to be so. No one would have gone throgh so much agony and pain if he did not love you. This my friend is between you and God. It isn't up to me to convince you. God says, 'you don't have to get your act together to come to me, he says, come to me and I will get your act together.

The Jews and the muslims do not worship Jesus Christ nor beleive in him. Some Jews do but they are born again Jews or Jews for Jesus they are known as. I am not a Jew and I am not a Muslim.

And I keep telling you it isn't a RELIGION....if Jesus was your friend then he still is. It is you that has walked away, not HIM.

June 5, 2006
8:42 am
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om, continued on the other thread for offtopic, didnt want to do it here.

June 5, 2006
10:30 am
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Tez, this is really very central:

>> Suddenly a terrible fear filled me. I saw a void at 'my' core! < < Do you see that void is the same kind of void John Bradshaw talks about? Its the inner child wounding, our sense of not being enough, when we were raised in dysfunctional families. I think you might reply that, people who cant see this empty core are not able to see it because they are not able to see deeply enough, and you were able. You're saying the empty core exists in everyone. Its just the happy people cant see it ?

June 5, 2006
4:52 pm
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I'm wise in the little glimpses of clarity I have in my life. Those little peeks, I'm glad for. At other times I'm like "was that me who wrote that, it must be a msitake, it'll never come back, its not me" and I feel sad to be down. Now I gotta accept myself.

"Even though I sometimes am not as wise as I am at other times, I accept myself" - yes. Self-acceptance is crucial. I'm aware of these things much more now. I dont know what I was doing for the last 3 years. I think it was cause I was imprisoned by my bad roomate who had the lease under his name. Ok oops, didnt meant to rant. This is a good thread.

June 5, 2006
6:34 pm
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4-Jun-06

"You can be sure that people with healthy parenting and good self-esteem would not feel that fear."

I suspect that "people with healthy parenting and good self-esteem would not feel that fear" - but I cannot be sure of that at all.

And:

"You do agree that not everyone's response to this inquiry in Gestalt would be fear or a negative emotion, right?"

Yes I would certainly agree with you regarding this statement.

" What if a person says in a calm self-assured way "Thats it, I'm myself what I know myself of, there's nothing more"."

I'm sure that some people probably would probably conclude that.

You appear to me to have two misunderstandings here.

Firstly, you seem to have assumed that I base my belief in the non-existence of any separate, permanent, non-divisible entity that I call my 'self', is based on this one emotional experience. Not so. This was only the start of my thinking along these lines. Read and understand D'Adamo's book and you might know a little more about 'duality' and the 'non-self'.

Secondly you appear to me to think that I believe that the process that you think is owned by your 'self' - body, brain, emotions, cognitions etc don't exist at all. Not so. The 'process' that I have both formally and informally studied over many years and am still studying certainly exists to my mind. It is just not a separate, independent, permanent, indivisable entity any more that a motor car is.

"You found your core empty because there was no good self-esteem, self-love or self-acceptance. Thats what I think."

But you seem to misunderstand again. I never experienced any core. What I experienced was an emotional memory in full recall. There was no core there to experience in any other way; e.g. cognitively.

Low self-esteem is a symptom of something else not an independent cause. You don't seem to understand this.

What do you think self esteem is? Of the top of your head, can you define it in your own words for me please - not Nat's words?

June 6, 2006
12:37 am
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Its Nat's words but they're also mine, cause its very simple: How much value we have for ourself. Its not just feeling good or saying "I love myself". It has to be based on what we do. Low self-esteem is a symptom of not doing the 6 pillars of self-esteem, living conciously, self-acceptance , etc. - Nats words but it makes sense, you know?

It goes both way e.g. being assertive raises self-esteem and self-esteem helps being assertive. Self-esteem is how much we love and accept ourselves. In Nat's words, how much we see ourselves fit for life. Are we worthy of happiness? etc.

Nat has changed my thinking a little bit to what you say too: Self-esteem is not built on nothing. It has to be based on something, its built on our actions. It cant come out of thin air (e.g by positive affirmations, maybe)

>> What I experienced was an emotional memory in full recall. < < I would definitely say, people with healthy parenting would not experience the fear you did. Where do you think that terror and fear came from? Whats the reason why other people with good self-esteem and self-acceptance would not feel this fear? This isnt an attack on you ofcourse. I'm just being objective - I cannot see anyone who loves themselves and accepts themselves and is happy with themselves, to experience fear when asked who they are. They keep themselves in a positive state about themselves. Nothing or very little can trigger them to think negatively about themselves. When the doc asked you, you were triggered into revealing your thoughts about yourself -the fear and terror you had. Sorry this is being off-topi but I'm sure we can discuss that still here, its only you and bevdee here for now and some others. Ummm.. so, the empty feeling you felt - why did you feel it? Reason for it? Would everyone else feel it, and if not, why not?

June 6, 2006
7:36 pm
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Tez, thank you for your post, You are a sweetheart for saying, "You are a very clear communicator. You express yourself very well. You would be an asset to any employer who values this attribute."

Yesterday, I went to the lake, took the dog, and floated on a mattress, flipped off the mattress, sucked lake water, and had a great time. That is so therapeutic to me. It is about the only activity I do that can suspend time for me. No clocks, cellphones, beepers. Just boats, air mattresses, and perch biting my toes.

I am still wading through all the scientific discussion. It has been such a long time since I had to understand this. I have forgotten big chunks of it. I am keeping at it, because, like I said, it has been easier not to think. Sometimes I have to reread stuff 2 or 3 times. It is stretching my mind.

You know, I was thinking about my "core" confessional. While I was humbled by being fired, and unemployed for too long, it was a good lesson. Because even though that lesson was - I ain't all that - (in respect to my job), I have found, in other ways, that I am more than I thought I was.

One breakthrough for me is the way I am handling expectations and disappointments. In the past I would place the blame on another person for "letting me down", for not fulfilling the expectations I had of them. Recently I felt a similar disappointment. This time, instead of lashing out at, or confronting my friend, like I might have done a year ago, I asked myself some questions about WHY I was disappointed. That person had not changed from the day I met her. All I had done was build her up in my mind, as someone who was stronger than I am. Instead of looking to myself for strength, I looked to my friend. I leaned on her. How unfair to her!! And when she did not meet my "unspoken" expectations, I was disappointed and angry at HER. Unfair of me again!! How often do I do this, to people, situations, jobs, or anything else external? Instead of relying on myself, I rely on an external concept to give me strength, when the strength is within me? And, in writing this, I think this would apply to love and intimacy issues I have, too. I had to look at myself, and that weakness in me, that causes me to be disappointed.
I guess it is scary to think about being responsible for myself, and my own emotions. It sure was alot easier to blame everyone else for my drawbacks. Assessing myself as a victim, I got stuck for several years in anger. Anger at my parents, for the abuse I suffered at my mother's hands, and the passivity of my father.

I wallowed in self-pity. It was hard to let go of that because I must have known, at some level, that when I did, I would have to move forward. Teeny tiny steps!!

Thanks again for your post,
Bevdee

June 6, 2006
8:06 pm
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guest_guest

6-Jun-06

The following capitalizations indicate important keywords - not me shouting at you.

This is post not off topic because the ideas in it are crucial to understanding D'Adamo's book.

You asked:

"Ummm.. so, the empty feeling you felt - why did you feel it?"

Because COGNITIVELY I experientially KNEW that deep down there was no INDEPENDENT, PERMANENT, NON-DIVISIBLE 'self' to be found.

At the time it was just the start of my realization that everything was a process - physical, psychological, mental, emotional; all dependent upon something else lower down right down to the energy underpinning subatomic particles.

The ego fights this 'COGNITION' for all its worth. EMOTIONAL MEMORIES of fear are triggered off by the ego's response to this COGNITION.

Many times I've asked you to define the borders of yourself. You have never done so because no one can in any substantive way. If you say "my skin is my border" I will say get an electron microscope and then define the border more precisely.

Then in your mind's eye, I would tell you to go still further into the subatomic level at your skin/air interface and tell me which electron has your name on it; which electron has oxygen's, nitrogen's CO2's name on it. Hmmm

All is in just one huge process - energy moving in patterns and seemingly coming into and out of existence at the most minute level.(See Hiesenberg's Uncertainty principle in regard to the electron)

All DEMARCATIONS and DIFFERENTIATIONS(DUALITY) are mental constructs and delusional.

Look into the subject of 'DUALITY' and you might get a glimpse of what I am saying. It isn't an easy concept to grasp as many might think.

June 6, 2006
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bevdee

On the 6-Jun-06 you talked of your internal journey of introspection into how your mind works for and against you. This is so typical of all of us humans. Collectively, we are 'carpenters of our own crosses'- analogously speaking. We can also make our own 'heaven' as well.

That is why the mystic William Blake said: "The mind is its own place and in it can create a heaven of hell and a hell of heaven."

Meditation is a very misunderstood word because it has many meanings to many people. D'Adamo makes this point well.

However, I have found meditation to be a very powerful electron microscope into 'my own' mind. Getting past the veil to the unconscious mind isn't easy and it often results in emotional twinges; but it is rewarding and enlightening.

Lying on your lake surface you undoubtedly did some form of meditating and saw what you mentioned in your posting. Focussing the mind as you did produced the results that you mentioned. Good stuff.

You have done very well indeed.

PS I ain't naturally a sweet guy - but I sometimes tell it as I see it. 🙂

You are a very good communicator indeed.

June 6, 2006
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Tez, thanks for the hightlight. I couldnt understand that stuff before but I did somewhat now.

>> Because COGNITIVELY I experientially KNEW that deep down there was no INDEPENDENT, PERMANENT, NON-DIVISIBLE 'self' to be found.

The ego fights this 'COGNITION' for all its worth. EMOTIONAL MEMORIES of fear are triggered off by the ego's response to this COGNITION. < < My question naturally: Why does the ego of happy people parented nicely, with calm centered selves - not fight off this cognition? If they dont experience the empty core, why not? Why are they able to maintain their calm positive state about themselves when asked repeatedly who they are? Good question, yea?

June 6, 2006
8:29 pm
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Oh he talks about meditation eh, I might check that out.

June 7, 2006
7:37 pm
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Guest_guest

On 6-Jun-06 you asked:

"Why does the ego of happy people parented nicely, with calm centered selves - not fight off this cognition? If they dont experience the empty core, why not?"

I would have thought the answer to that question was obvious.

The type of people of which you speak are not suffering from 'existential angst', as I was at that time.

So why would the cognitions of such well adjusted person even bother to seek answers to the 'why' underpinning human suffering let alone look at what makes their imagined 'self', their ego, tick. Their ego is content - they have nothing to "fight off" as you put it. Since they probably never have them, their ego is not challenged by such insights. My partner, Joy, is one such person. She's happy most of the time and feels no need to look within at her own mental processes.

Your self-esteem is the JUDGEMENT that your EGO passes upon its own SELF-WORTH at any given instant in any particular circumstance that it is conscious of its imaginary 'self'.

Get rid of the delusions of the existence of an INDEPENDENT, PERMANENT, NON-DIVISIBLE 'SELF' and the EGO(cognitions based upon the existence of a separate 'I') evaporates leaving no SELF-JUDGING to do whatsoever. SELF-ESTIMATIONS of ones own worth(SELF-ESTEEM) then stop altogether. Emotions then settle and peace and contentment reigns within.

Christ said "Judge not lest ye be judged." Contrary to what most Christians seem to believe, I believe that Christ was saying: "If you want to stop JUDGING yourSELF then stop JUDGING others"; that is, judge not others harshly lest you be judged harshly(low self-estimations of worth) by your own ego(cognitive process based upon conscious and unconconscious sense of selfhood).

Of course the bad feelings associated with low self-worth are our awareness of our emotional responses to our cognitions associated with this judgement made upon our 'self'.

Getting rid of this wrong view of the 'self' gets rid of the problem. Having the RIGHT VIEW of 'self' and the 'world' is one of items in the Buddha's Eightfold path that leads to 'gnosis'.

June 7, 2006
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WD.

Where are you, bro?

Take a break of that bloody porn thread and sink your teeth into D'Adamo's book.

I'd like to hear your honest criticism of it whether it be negative or positive.

June 8, 2006
2:53 pm
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Tez,
June 06-06 you said,
"PS I ain't naturally a sweet guy - but I sometimes tell it as I see it. :-)" I respectfully disagree. You ARE very sweet, and you are very patient, with people. I have also seen you step in when you feel someone is getting slaughtered out there.
Anyway, I am still working the book. I am very happy that he is explaining the different religions. It is nice to have them all listed, and explained. I was stressing out about the physics, and atomic theory, until I remembered there will be no test!! So, I am readng a little faster now, and the thoughts are coming alot faster for me.

You said this to Guest_Guest on June 7th -

< >
Even if you leave Christ out of it ( no commentary, please) this made me think about critical people. I think those super-critical people are probably hardest on themselves. Also those guilt-placers, the shame-on-you-ers! Maybe that is why we get hung up on the forgiveness part? How can we apply to others what we can't apply to ourselves, such as love or forgiveness? So I'm thinking the way we treat others is the way we actually treat ourselves? The old cliche "misery loves company" comes to mind.

Also from June 7!!!
< >

Cracked me up!! Sweet and funny, Mr Tez, but I promise I won't tell anyone, OK?

Bevdee

June 8, 2006
2:57 pm
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Well, that didn't come through! What cracked me up was this -

"WD.

Where are you, bro?

Take a break of that bloody porn thread and sink your teeth into D'Adamo's book. "

June 8, 2006
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hi Tez

>> The type of people of which you speak are not suffering from 'existential angst', as I was at that time. < < How can we be like them, so we dont suffer from this E angst ? One way you say is get rid of the concept of self: >> Get rid of the delusions of the existence of an INDEPENDENT, PERMANENT, NON-DIVISIBLE 'SELF' and the EGO(cognitions based upon the existence of a separate 'I') evaporates leaving no SELF-JUDGING to do whatsoever. SELF-ESTIMATIONS of ones own worth(SELF-ESTEEM) then stop altogether. Emotions then settle and peace and contentment reigns within. < < It seems impossible. Why not try to go for a place, where we're not having the E Angst? So we can be like the healthy people. The eight fold path looks like the 6 pillars of self-esteem. Right View, kind of mean "living conciously", etc.

June 8, 2006
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Tez,

You posted something to guest_guest a few days ago, about using Buddhism as a shortcut to gnosis? And you said something about moving on from Buddhism. Well, I got to thinking again...

(here is where you get to peek into my mind, the conundrum, and the little journeys my thoughts take). I have always thought that most religions were similar, probably the same religion. For instance, if a different culture has a different language, wouldn't that language have a different word for shoe? Or egg? Or goddess/god?

Also, all cultures would hand down their traditions and teachings, orally, then in writing, and probably some of it would get changed slightly with each translation.

Would a creatress/creator want us to use the brains she/he created to seek enlightenment, strive to be the best and happiest we can be with the tools this creator/creatress gave us? Wouldn't Allah/God/Yahweh , any of those guys, want that for us?
If a creatress/creator gave us the brains to research/develop science and technology, why would that creator/creatress NOT want us to develop spiritually, as well? The creatress/creator has allowed us, by means of the brains we are born with, tools of discovery and science to raise questions, and prove or disprove claims of that bible, or any claims holy writings have made.

If this 3omni god (omnipresent, omniscient, omnipotent) did not want us to do just that - wouldn't that jealous vengeful god have been able to stop us? With a flood, destruction such as Sodom and Gomorrah, turning us into salt? Burning our bushes? Striking us dead? If we were not meant to know, wouldn't we have been kept in some dark secluded ignorance?

But we weren't.

If I hypothesize that these religions are all really the same, why would I not look at each one, and strive to reach enlightenment in the way that works best for me? I think meditation and prayer are basically the same thing, an opportunity to slow down, be quiet and get some focus. I think the teachings of Christ and Buddha are sound rules for good living. They were cool guys. What I do not agree with are what those other guys afterward did to that bible, and I don't like what has happened to the churches. Not gonna go into it, or get into it with anyone, that is my opinion.

So back to Buddhism as a shortcut - this lead me to think of this - It seems a shame to me not to integrate the positive aspects of all religions, and their prophets' messages, discard the dogma, and take those lessons to make us all happier, more spiritual people. To use what I need, to heal or grow spiritually, as I need it. You know, things always come to me in its own time, not when I want it to!!

I still think that a loving creatress/creator would want us to achieve the highest spirituality possible.

And in a perfect world, because we are spiritual and not dogmatic, we would all be tolerant of the individual spiritual journey. I think the biggest oral tradition we humans have is the need to be right.

June 8, 2006
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bevdee

On 8-Jun-06 above you posed the question:

"Would a creatress/creator want us to use the brains she/he created to seek enlightenment, strive to be the best and happiest we can be with the tools this creator/creatress gave us? Wouldn't Allah/God/Yahweh , any of those guys, want that for us? If a creatress/creator gave us the brains to research/develop science and technology, why would that creator/creatress NOT want us to develop spiritually, as well? The creatress/creator has allowed us, by means of the brains we are born with, tools of discovery and science to raise questions, and prove or disprove claims of that bible, or any claims holy writings have made."

If there existed a God who is a Person who thinks and feels as we do then I would certainly think that what He/She would want is for us to clearly know how best to live. This would include how to use our intellect to the fullest to discover actual 'Reality' as opposed to what we perceive to be real.

One and only one clear unequivocal 'User's Handbook' would have come with Adam and Eve - assuming that they actually existed - instead of the profusion of contradictory scriptures claiming to be the inspired word of God.

Of course I don't believe that such a God who is a Person exists at all.

And you said:

"If this 3omni god (omnipresent, omniscient, omnipotent) did not want us to do just that - wouldn't that jealous vengeful god have been able to stop us?"

Yes - but more so such an omniscient God would have known prior to begining his creation design the outcomes of that design. Thus if we are 'sinful' by nature and warranting that divine, wrathful vengence that God knowingly built that propensity into us. Of course the Christians and others will argue that we have been given 'free will' to choose good or evil. But these people neglect the fact that we were not created omniscient. Therefore we cannot know all the choices both good and evil available to us. In addition we cannot even agree upon what is good and what is evil. Staunch WW2 Nazis believed that befriending and helping Jews was evil in the extreme. Headhunters in New Guinea consider lopping off the heads of their enemies and consuming their body parts very good indeed. But Christians would excuse them as being ignorant savages. But is not their Christian God responsible for their ignorance? Stem cell research is considered very good by many and evil by many others. Creationism versus evolution, pacifism versus justifiable homicide, ... the list of ambivalent good/evil dichotomies goes on and on. There are so many shades of grey that would not exist if this question of free will and good and evil was so clear cut as Christians would have us believe.

And you said:

"I still think that a loving creatress/creator would want us to achieve the highest spirituality possible."

One would think so if such a loving God who is a Person existed.

I think the predatory/predated upon nature of all life within the world arbitrates against the probability of the existence of such a loving God who is a Person.

D'Adamo's very balanced book argues for a scientific approach towards religion. Therein the 'spiritual baby' may not have to be thrown out with the 'bath water of religious doctrine' as humanity climbs laboriously out of the 'quagmire of superstition' that the 'ole time' religions have created.

June 8, 2006
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Hi guest_guest

On 8-Jun-06 you said:

"It seems impossible."

Yes - and I can understand why you think that. You obviously have not had the necessary insights yet.

"Why not try to go for a place, where we're not having the E Angst?"

That is precisely what I have done, am doing and suggesting. I still have a way to go yet. But I sure have come a long way by comparison.

And you said:

" So we can be like the healthy people."

YES and NO.

YES, we can get to the point wherein we can control our negative emotional responses by self-nurture to the point wherein we behave somewhat like "healthy people" - as you call them.

NO, we will experience different emotional reactions to those "healthy people" to life events, the like of which triggered off severe childhood trauma that will be remembered as emotional memories in our amygdala, our emotional centre, at least until the day we die.

For example, your girlfriend might have her periods and be out of sorts. You might feel rejected as your childhood programmed emotions - caused by childhood self-preservation needs - erupt.

However because of your understanding of why your emotions have been triggered you might sooth your feelings by saying to yourself: "Its OK. She has a good reason for behaving as she does. It is nothing to do with me. I am not being rejected. I will look after me no matter what happens, etc, etc". Then after a very short time you might feel peaceful and contented like "healthy people".

"Healthy people", as you call them, might not even feel the emotional arousal to such a situation AT ALL. Why? Because there is no traumatic emotional memory residing in their amygdala at all - it was most probably never programmed there in the first place in childhood.

Can you see how we can become like but not the exactly the same as "healthy people"? So the answer to your question is YES and NO.

The above SELF-NURTURING is all very fine and good. But there is an even higher, much more powerful way of being. It is advancing 'spiritually' to the point wherein one realizes that there is in fact no 'self' to nurture or protect anyway. Then boyo, watch the emotions settle quickly. No threat to any 'self' or any thing is then perceived. Thus nothing triggers off the latent emotional memories in the first place. In that sense we can become just like "healthy people". This is not to imply that we don't intellectually perceive actions that should be taken to bring about desirable outcomes. But a huge paradigm shift in thinking and believing is required in this instance.

If you don't know what is generally meant by the word 'gnosis', read and understand D'Adamo's book and John Wren Lewis's article. If you can't be bothered then that's your choice but don't have expectations of me in providing you with a 'shortcut' to 'gnosis'(non-duality) - I can't even if I had the copious quantities of time to attempt such a feat! The Buddha's teachings are the 'shortest cut' to 'gnosis' that I know of at this juncture. Take it or leave it the choice is yours.

June 9, 2006
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hi Tez ,

Bhudda's 8 fold path? It looks like the six pillars you know. Seems like his stuff leads to the right place too.

Ok I get it now what you said, about being in a place where our negative emotions are not triggered at all cause we have no self to protect.

This really sounds difficut though I mean, if you say you havent been able to do it fully then its gonna take me a long time too. I dont want to waste my life as its going now. No other stuff eh? I belive the 6 pillars can work, if we're willing to put the work in it. Likewise I'm sure 8 fold would work too. All these methods require us to work on ourself and where any of this self-work is involved and actually done, it brings positive results.

So you say now I read the Adam book? Thats 400 pages ahhhh. Any seciton you want me to read or all of it? I just want the stuff for the self-healing.

Whats the ummm. the John Wren Lewis article all about? Let me the title again, I'll look up on the internet.

June 9, 2006
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Guest,

for what it's worth if finding God works for some people, I won't belittle their achievements, rather I'll be happy for the improved outcome. If people lead better healthier lives through spirituality and believing in a God and not doing so to the detrement of others, then so be it.

I work in the field of science a great deal, and while I'm not a religious man by anyone's stretch i do recognize that for some people betterment has been achieved through spirituality and faith in a God.

June 9, 2006
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hi glittered,

You're right if it works for them, its good. Whether its not detrimental or not - I think it is. Religion makes people weaker, in my opnion.

So you believe in god yourself? This is my opnion only: Believing in God doesnt make someone significantly better. What improves their lives is improved self-esteem. There's not much difference in the happiness levels of athiests and believers. Its all the same. The variable that determines satisfaction in life is self-esteem. But I left that religious debate in this thread now, abandoned it cause I saw there's no purpose. I asked OMW to remind me to stop next time cause I've made the promise not to stir the debate again since it doesnt achieve anything. I keep forgetting that each time and then I hate seeing my own negativity which I had brought in originally. oh well.

So anyway.. what I mean is again and thats true, self-esteem determines our capacity for enjoyment in life, not belief or disbelief in God. And I really believe if people were able to somehow challenge their beliefs and be an agnostic or athiest, they could be better, stronger people - but thats debateable so I dont know. I guess yea, to each his own. I have no business convincing others, got enough on my own plate with personal issues already :(.

June 9, 2006
5:07 pm
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bevdee
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Tez,

Thank you. Thank you because in reading your response to my June 8 post, I am seeing how difficult it is for me to let go of my thought patterns, e.g. god as a male Person, bible stories. These thoughts have been a part of my earliest teachings, as well as self-esteem. Here's the tough part. Just because I have had the realisation (revelation?) does not mean those patterns are gone. They seem to be imbedded. This is gonna take some work.

I still work on not making excuses for myself, and not blaming others for my shortcomings. Accepting responsibility for my happiness. I went along for several years blaming every person who abused me or hurt my feelings for being a reason I could not be happy. "Because I was abused, because they won't apologise,, waa, waa" I say it like that because I did it for too long, and I even got sick of hearing myself whine. I slap wore myself out with all the anger and self-pity.

I got stuck in some anger about the religion that I felt had let me down.
I could make a long list, but I won't.

Even though I know something intellectually, it is difficult not to revert back to the old patterns.

Bevdee

June 9, 2006
6:19 pm
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evdee

On the 9-Jun-06 you said:

"I still work on not making excuses for myself, and not blaming others for my shortcomings. Accepting responsibility for my happiness. I went along for several years blaming every person who abused me or hurt my feelings for being a reason I could not be happy. "Because I was abused, because they won't apologise,, waa, waa" I say it like that because I did it for too long, and I even got sick of hearing myself whine. I slap wore myself out with all the anger and self-pity."

As you have realized, when we play the victim we are blaming others for our 'predicament'.

Since we accredit others with having such power over us as victims, we are therein effectively disempowering our own minds and empowering theirs.

How we perceive the world creates the world in which we live. If we perceive the world to be a hostile place then that is the kind of world in which we live.

I perceive the world to be full of both 'predators' and 'predated upons', each taking both parts at different times. Sometimes the little bird is the predator eating the worm; at another time the same little bird is the 'predated upon', by being stalked by a much larger bird or a cat.

Yet Prof. John Wren Lewis, thanks to his NDE, perceives that same world of the bird to be absolutely wonderful, as did the Buddha. Both recognize that suffering is created in the mind of the perceiver, just as beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

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