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Hmm, Prayer Taboo
December 19, 2006
7:19 pm
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gracenotes
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It was interesting that discussion of prayer is taboo on the other forum here. I can understand that, but, for me, I consider myself a spiritual person, not a relgious person tied to any specific dogma, and I think prayer is such a universal thing for all human beings at one time or another in their lives. In fact, my brand of spirituality embraces what I think is universal of all religions, the common threads, although they may be expressed differently. Prayer is certainly part of all religions and spiritual practices, as far as I know. There is even scientific research being done to validate that prayer makes a difference in the outcomes of situations.

Having a beloved missing kittie right now, one of the first things I did was write to my favorite prayer ministry. Instant email support. This put out the idea of my kittie being found safe and secure to hundreds of people who pray all day about situations, asking for the best outcomes. fd It took my emotionally charged topic of loss and elevated to include others, and thus helped me put my focus on what I can do about this situation and caused action to be taken.

Kittie has not shown up at my door...yet...but somehow I am fairly easily making it through this day, filling with optimism and knowing that I can deal with whatever outcome occurs in this situation.

December 19, 2006
11:03 pm
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Worried_Dad
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Well of course--didn't you read the guidelines?

It states very clearly in the All About Counseling Guidelines for Politically Correct Postings section IV, subsection B, sub-subsection iv:

"Any poster who uses the word "prayer" or who refers to the activity of "praying" shall be declared an traitor to the International Secular Atheist Lesbian Movement of Canada and shall be banned from posting in the support forum for all time."

I mean, you can't get much clearer than that. If we didn't enforce such simple, commonsense rules, the entire structure of Western Civilization could collapse--it's just not worth the risk.

That was a joke. You can actually say pretty much anything you want around here.

But on the Support side, there are lots of people of different faiths, and non-faiths, so it is considered courteous to not preach at folks.

I'm pretty sure that asking for prayers, especially for lost kitties, is still ok. Even on the support threads.

If I am mistaken, I'm sure someone will rise to the occasion and correct me.

December 19, 2006
11:39 pm
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"International Secular Atheist Lesbian Movement of Canada ... that was a joke"

hmmm, WD. Someone will rise to the occasion, or rise to the bait?

not me, of course.

December 20, 2006
1:48 am
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Hi Grace,

I hope your kitty is home soon. I'm glad that you found comfort and strength in receiving support from a prayer group. (((Grace & kitty)))

December 20, 2006
5:03 pm
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gayle
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Too Funny WD!

Grace, I am still praying for your kitty's safe return!

December 20, 2006
7:30 pm
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Rasputin
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Grace - Thanks for the update even tho I am upset that sweetie kitty still did not show up.

Still keeping (((U & kitty))) in my prayers!!!

December 21, 2006
3:49 pm
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gracenotes
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WD, you had me worried for a moment there. I appreciate the humor. The older I get, the more I understand rules are made to be broken under well-thought out circumstances.

I have been posting on the other side. Keeping the faith. Thanks for your support Rasputin, Gayle, and Kroika.

December 21, 2006
7:29 pm
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Gracenotes.

This is a very interesting thread theme for me.

Prayer, as I understand it, is conversing with some supreme being in order to obtain guidance, assistance, favors, or some other thing. Alternatively it might be to give thanks for some benefit thought to have been bestowed by this supreme being.

The problem that I have with conventional prayer is that it involves praying to an all knowing, all powerful and all loving God who for some unimaginable reason has not already met your need prior to the praying. If praying persuades this God to meet your need then is it that His meeting your your need is not in your best interests but He did so anyway? Or is it that meeting your need is in your best interests but this God needed your prayers to motivate Him to comply with your will? In such a case you would have a 'needy' God. Praying to such a God doesn't make sense either way.

One religion that I know of doesn't have a supreme being, a God of any kind. That religion is Buddhism. The nearest that religion comes to having a God is their belief in the existence of the Pure Mind with a capital 'M'. The 'impure' Mind is our 'normal' consciousness, our normal state of awareness. The 'impurity' is the distractedness, the attachments, the aversions, and the delusions that this lower case 'm' mind wallows in.

Prayer seems to concentrate and focus the 'ordinary' mind onto a single issue. This is where the power of the mind is evoked, I believe.

Since I believe that all minds, including animal minds of other species besides us humans, are intrinsically one Mind and that Mind is underpinning all, then it stands to reason that concentrating hard enough invokes 'telepathic' powers that can bring about collusions between minds of all kinds that produce unbelievable results.

If Mind encompasses Gaia, the 'earth mind', then praying for rain might bring results that seem to be the consequences of some Divine intervention where there was really none.

Miraculous cures, PSI mysteries, hypnotic regression to 'past lives' etc including the power of prayer all make sense and are rationally explainable under this model of reality, IMHO.

December 21, 2006
9:21 pm
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bevdee
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"Since I believe that all minds, including animal minds of other species besides us humans, are intrinsically one Mind and that Mind is underpinning all, then it stands to reason that concentrating hard enough invokes 'telepathic' powers that can bring about collusions between minds of all kinds that produce unbelievable results."

Yes, this always perplexed me - the seeming power of the "prayer circles." My daddy is a preacher, I call him and his wife the "prayer warriors". There IS something to it.
Thank you for this explanation of your belief.

December 23, 2006
4:55 pm
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Bevdee.

Thanks for your thanks. Have a peaceful, trouble free Christmas. I hope it can be a time of great compassion and love shared with your sister and your mom. I guess that your sister may not be around. But if she is, may you share something special with her and your mom.

That's my prayer for today.

December 23, 2006
5:30 pm
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gracenotes
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Tez,

You have made some very good points. Its always like supreme being is set up as the doler out of good if you ask hard enough. I've had all of these kinds of questions in the past. For me, that's now realy my truth anymore.

For me, prayer is more a affirmation of the truth. The truth is good, love, health, wholeness, etc. That means believing that the universe is essentially good. By praying, we are reminding ourselves of this truth, we are not only thinking it, we are feeling it,hopefully we are living it and seeing the best in others, and some good begets more good.

When I ask people to pray for my lost kittie, and I think about her and am praying, I am praying for the best possible good for her, that she is protected, that she is healthy, not in pain, not freezing to death, and also if it is not her will to be on this planet anymore, that she is dancing around in heaven now. Maybe she was sick or horribly injured and I couldn't have known this and that would be her best choice. There's only so much I can know about another person's or animal's agenda. By praying, I have been able to stay focused on positive thoughts, to allow my mind to give me ideas that support the possibilities of her return (what I want, but maybe not the best outcome for all), to do things that might support this. Also, if there is something in my kittie's mind that is thinking of wanting to come home, come out of hiding, whatever the situation is, then perhaps my joining with this thought with her will realize this manisfestation. Prayer framework indeed keeps my spirits up.

I think part of the problem with a lot of prayer thinking is that we see supreme being up there and far away, when supreme being is very close, within in, and we all can claim our own divinity.

December 23, 2006
5:33 pm
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gracenotes
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Here we go with typos again. The last sentence of the first paragraph should have read: For me, that's not really my truth anymore.

December 24, 2006
5:01 pm
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Gracenotes.

I hope your kitten finds its way home too. Failing that, I hope it has found a good home with a good family. If the unthinkable has happened, then I know it is in a better place beyond all harm.

I hope you give and receive a lot of love with lots of warm, loving feelings on this Christmas day 2006.

All the best for you and yours.

December 29, 2006
1:51 pm
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gracenotes
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Taz, haven't been her in awhile. Thanks for your good thoughts. I am giving updates on the other board. Happy New Year!

December 29, 2006
5:46 pm
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Gracenotes.

Thanks for your thanks too. Have a great New Year 2007 too.

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