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Christian and Lesbian
April 8, 2006
3:04 pm
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4me
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I am a lesbian and am trying to help a friend cope with the fact that she's very religious (Christian) and now at age 30 realizes she's always had homosexual desires. She really thinks it would be a sin to live as her true self and that God doesn't accept that.

Any suggestions??

April 8, 2006
3:40 pm
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mamacinnamon
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Hi 4me, nice to meet you....

I think that your friend should be allowed her belief w/o someone trying to sway her. Maybe it would be a good idea for her to talk to her pastor if she is confused.

Just my opinion.

April 8, 2006
6:01 pm
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Hi 4me and welcome to the site.

When I first read the title of your thread, I thought "now there's an oxymoron".

All kidding aside, I think perhaps your friend should talk to someone that is not biased one way or the other. Meaning that because you are gay, your opinion may sway her in that direction. And her pastor, may very well sway her in the other direction...which combined could leave her even more confused then before.

Maybe a therapist would be able to help her work through her conflicting feelings and help her to make a decision that is right for her.

I hope this helped.

Lolli

April 8, 2006
9:59 pm
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4me
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Thanks for the suggestions...I am trying to convince her to seek counseling and to speak to a "pastor" that preaches at a non-denominational church that accepts everyone...

April 8, 2006
10:07 pm
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free2choose
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"When I first read the title of your thread, I thought 'now there's an oxymoron'."

ROFLMAO @ Lolli!!!

I agree with Lolli...When MammaC said you would sway her, let her talk to the pastor, I thought, "Well what do you think the Pastor is gonna do!!!!" Believe me, I know from experience, talking to a priest/pastor when you are already feeling extreemly ashamed and like a sinner for being who you are is not always a good idea. They tend to just reinforce the shame and self-hatred. At least mine did!

As a young uneducated indoctrinated Catholic girl, coming to grips with my sexuality and "The Lord/The Word", has been a very slow, very personal, and very painfull process!

Since then, I have come across many an other such as myself, lost children, cast out form the love of "Our Father".

I do only what I know how. I share my experience, my stregnth and my hope. I share my journey, where I have been, what it felt like for me, where I am now.

I offer understanding. I offer comfort. And still I try very hard not to let my judgements and bias out, so as not to try and "convert" someone.

Coming to grips with our sexuality and our spirituality is HARD!!! It hurts, IT HURTS!!!!!

For a very LONGGGG time, I felt as if I was damned. I felt so very alone, so lost. I felt as if God had abandoned me. I felt as if I was unworthy.

Still, at times, in certain situations, regarding certain things, I still feel alone, lost.

But I hold fast to the belief that above all, God is Love, and a genuine, heartfelt expression of that love, such as what I have with my partner, can never be wrong.

Gay and lesbian people can act immorally, the same as straights. We can sleep around, we can missuse sex, we can hurt ourselves and others sexually...but no more than any other straight person. But I truly believe that actually BEING gay is not wrong, or immoral.

But your friend has to come to what ever decision she makes, what ever her truth is, all on her own...because what is true for me or you may not be what is true for her.

All I can say is listen. Share your truth, offer it up to her, not as advice or in an attempt to change her, but simply to tell her, "This is my truth, this is my struggle....You are not alone."

Good luck, I wish things were different and we were not forced to feel the way that we are made to feel simply because of who we are...But I am learning, this particular struggle has been and still is an ESSENTIAL part of my journey. Everything happens for a reason, and the harder the hurt, the larger the lesson. And the greater the growth...

With heartfelt comapassion,

Free2Choose

Erica

April 8, 2006
11:51 pm
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Hi, I am not an expert on the subject since I have been learning about gay and lesbian lifestyle just recently. I feel in my heart that God loves anyone and everyone. I believe that if someone is gay or lesbian that there is a church out there for them and they have to keep looking until they are accepted and comfortable with a church.

If she has always had these desires then what is the problem? Who cares what the next person is thinking. She needs your support. If her church doesn't accept what is deep down inside of her then she needs to go to a church that will. God made her the way that she is. Tell her not to feel guilty or shameful. She needs your support.

Dave

April 9, 2006
3:16 am
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There are definitely churches that minister to predominantly gay congregations. Depending on where your friend lives, she might be able to attend one and find a gay-friendly Christian perspective that would welcome her.

I haven't tried it, but a google search for "gay + churches" might be a good way to start.

Also, is there a PFLAG (Parents, Friends and Family of Lesbians and Gays) chapter nearby? They might be helpful too.

Your friend certainly deserves to be part of a church community that accepts her sexuality and identity.

all the best, kroika

April 9, 2006
8:01 am
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4me
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nice guy--

If she was single and without children I think things would be easier...but we live in a society where her children could be taken from her since homosexuality is associated with "deviant behavior"--there are still people who believe that most homosexuals are child molesters anyway.

I will encourage her to attend my church (Unity) which accepts everyone...hopefully she will one day discover that God does love everyone even though she has spent the last 30 years hearing that same-sex relationships are a sin and she will go to hell.

April 9, 2006
8:04 am
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4me
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free2choose--

I am trying to be a good listener without trying to just come up with answers for her...you're right, she has to deal with this herself and all I can do is listen and offer her support...it's so hard sometimes...she's been trapped in a marriage for 12 years and has 2 children whom she loves dearly. Just the thought alone of losing them makes her want to stay in the closet...she's miserable...

April 9, 2006
8:38 pm
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free2choose
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4ME,

It is so hard to stop listning to all those tapes that play in our head that tell us, "You are wrong! It's a sin! God dispises you! You are going to hell!!" Growing up in religion, more often than not it all gets drilled into your head so young...

As for your friends kids, where do you guys live?? I think that things have gotten somewhat more liberal, especially the courts. She needs to find a GOOD family lawyer, one with experience with gay and lesbian parents and custody battles. It dosen't have to be that way, she dosen't have to loose the kids.

Yes, you are right about some of society viewing gays as child molesters. Unfortunately for them, I think that unsubstantiated belief rests more heavily on the shoulders of our gay brothers. I do not believe that as a lesbian she would have to really deal with that particularly cruel steriotype.

Even my father! We were talking about the difference between the way that Pope John Paul viewed homosexuals and the way the new Pope has attacked us from the start of his reign. He thinks there is no difference. I reminded him not only of the Catholic Charities pulling their adoption services from Mass. but also of the new Pope's campaign to rid the Catholic Church of all Gay priests. My father actually said, "well I understand that, I mean with all the things going on with the alter boys."

OMG...I felt smoke coming out of my ears. I said, "Daddy, homosexuality and pedophilia are two entirely DIFFERENT things, how can you even believe that. Staight men rape and molest little girls all the time. You think that girls are not involved with the priest scandals! So should we ban straight priests too, to protect the little girls!"

That is just REDICULOUS! I am so sick of hearing that bullshit.

The beliefs people hold in thier heart...beliefs that are so illogical and so biased. It breaks my heart.

Free

April 9, 2006
9:21 pm
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4me
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free--

We live in Florida...at this point, she doesn't even know where to begin to tell her husband she doesn't want to be with him, let alone why.

Her biggest battle is within herself...she always viewed homosexuality as a sin and I guess she has tried all these married years (12) to convince herself that it is a sin...but feelings can only be repressed for so long.

I hope she finds a way to sort out everything instead of just remaining in an unhappy closet...

Thanks for all the good advice.

April 9, 2006
11:09 pm
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I am still learning. I don't have all the answers. I just would like her to know that she will still be loved by god no matter what society thinks.
I feel so bad that people are treated that way. I am sorry.
Dave

April 10, 2006
5:46 pm
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May I suggest that your friend read the recorded words of Jesus? This can easily be done by using a Bible that has His words in red. (I use an older translation).

If she comes upon a passage that concerns her, tell her to pray for wisdom.

Something else to think about....has your friend given much thought to all those hundreds and hundreds of sins before pondering over homosexuality?

Homosexuality has been personified. One needs to look at the "whole picture" and commune with God.

Hope this will make a difference.

April 10, 2006
6:21 pm
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4me
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Thanks for all the advice--I'll be seeing my friend tomorrow and discuss things with her...I know that she wants to make changes now but we'll see what has transpired since I last saw her. I hate seeing her so hopeless/sad but I can only listen and offer support.

I'll keep you all informed and I'll ask for more advice 😉

April 11, 2006
10:53 pm
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4me
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Sad news about my friend--she decided she can't risk losing her children and is moving/running to another state where her husband bought her a house. Unfortunately, he sees her vulnerability now and decided that "moving" was a good idea. He'll have even more control over her--I fear for her.

I wish I could have done more but I couldn't calm her fears and her church definitely didn't help--telling her how "wrong" it is for her to have such feelings and how she will go to hell forever. How very, very, sad...

April 12, 2006
9:45 pm
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You know what the good news is though? She's a mother that loves her children. She is to be commended for that fact. She is a Christian. The Lord will never stop loving her - regardless.

Regretfully, many organized religions/churches do not reach out with love as Christ taught. That is the saddest aspect of this situation.

And you? Remember these simple words: When dealing with other people, you didn't cause it, you can't control and you can't cure it.

take care.

April 12, 2006
9:45 pm
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You know what the good news is though? She's a mother that loves her children. She is to be commended for that fact. She is a Christian. The Lord will never stop loving her - regardless.

Regretfully, many organized religions/churches do not reach out with love as Christ taught. That is the saddest aspect of this situation.

And you? Remember these simple words: When dealing with other people, you didn't cause it, you can't control and you can't cure it.

take care.

April 18, 2006
2:08 pm
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4me,

Just saw this and don't know the history, but you can be sure that your friend will come around. If this is truly part of who she is and not "experimentation" it will continue to surface until she embraces it.

I grew up in a Baptist church and still consider myself a believer; not in the same way that those hateful judgemental people did, but a believer in a loving and knowing CREATOR.

Give your friend all of the love and support that she needs and try to be understanding about the choices that she is making right now.

Cary

April 21, 2006
10:24 pm
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4me
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Caraway--

My friend did come around...2 days ago. She had been counseled by her priest that the feelings of homosexuality she was having were a terrible sin and that she should deny them, repent, etc. or she would not go to heaven, etc.

Of course, her lifelong repressed feelings kept surfacing and she is now dealing with them while still being at peace with her God. I let her know that God loves all of us and that homosexuality isn't a choice.

I, myself, had stopped going to Catholic church many years ago since I never felt like I belonged. I recently started attending a church that welcomes everyone without judgement and I am loving it. I can be myself there...among straights, gays, blacks, whites...and at every service it is empasized that we are ALL welcome...

April 21, 2006
10:44 pm
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4me...

What church is this??? I would love it if they had one where I live?

I am so sorry about your friends experience with the priest. I had the same thing happen to me...while I was in drug rehab, no less, LOL. Boy, way to enforce the shame, huh!!!

I can laugh about it now (sometimes...;( ) But back when it happened, I wanted to kill myself.

Spiritual abuse at the hands of ignorant, biggoted people all in the name of GOD.... "Father, forgive them...they know not what they do."

Free

April 22, 2006
12:37 am
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4me
I agree with you that you should go to a church that accepts everyone. It makes me very upset when anyone judges someone because they are gay or whatever. The church should always accept everyone with open arms. My dad is a lutheran pastor (retired) and I'm not sure where he stands on the subject but I personally believe that if a church will not accept someone, not matter what it is, that church is more in the wrong than the person that is trying to stay in the church. Tell your friend to get out of that church and accept the way that she feels. God does love everyone and there is no pastor or priest that should make anyone feel guilty because they have gay feelings. She won't be happy till she gets it out in the open. If she has to stay with her husband for financial reasons or the kids that makes it more complicated but as for her suppressing her feelings it will only get worse if she doesn't accept how she really feels. I hope she can at least find a church that will accept her and not ever have anyone make her feel guilty. And by the way, God is not going to send her to hell for being gay. God loves e v e r y o n e.

Nice Guy.

April 22, 2006
10:14 pm
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free2choose--

Look for any "Metropolitan Community Church" or "Unity Church" online...

It's a wonderful experience to be in a church with so many different people who all love God...

I live in South Florida and there are many of these churches...if there aren't any in your area, you can get info online...try http://www.unityonthebay.com

Good Luck...

April 22, 2006
10:24 pm
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Hey...

Yeah I heard abou the MCC...I think the closest is in Baton Rouge.. not sure though. There was one in Dallas.

Never heard of the Unity Church...time to do a little research.

Thanks for getting back to me!!!

((((HUGS))))

Free

April 24, 2006
4:36 pm
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Religious Science is also a great church of sorts. It is not a "pay for pray" type organization like the one Tom Cruise is a member of. Religious Science is more about thought being creative and that we can create our own experience.

Nice-guy, it is so true that a church should accept all people. If one believes in Jesus; he certainly accepted and sought everyone out. We are sinners and a church should be a classroom for ALL sinners. It wasn't so long ago that some people thought that black folks and women were not supposed to be in heavan and quoted scripture to back up their ignorant ideas. Homosexuals are just the next phase. I have a great relationship with GOD and none of these folks can hinder that!!

Cary

April 24, 2006
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Update on my friend...

Not only did she tell her husband recently that she no longer loved him...

Several days ago I suppose the repressed feelings (many, many years of it) caught up with her and as all her family was yelling at her for trying to leave her husband she just exploded and told them that not only was she a homosexual but that she was already in love with a woman and she wanted to be with this woman...

Her next "step" is making peace with her church and/or her God...

Wow!!! I wish her luck...she has so much on her plate now...

I've been "out" since age 21 and I've been gay ever since I can remember...I can't even imagine having to hide it and lead a "traditional" life in the name of religion or because of what others might think...

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