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Are most truly sexy women unfaithful?
October 4, 2005
7:20 am
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mj
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Tez,
Since everyone is an individual, my opinion of a sexy woman is Me! šŸ™‚

Sexy, sensual, confident, kind, loving, playful, errogenous, tantalizing, flirtatous, genuine, authentic, and loyal.

October 4, 2005
2:43 pm
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Tez, your friend sounds totally horrible to me. How can he / you claim he is monogomous when he has been superficially having sex with (on??!) over 100 women, and boasting about it ... even laughing (sounds like sneering)?! What an impoverished inner life, ruled by his basest urges.

How can he talk about his "relationships" when they are so brief & shallow, amounting to merely "screwing" women?

I would say that sort of behaviour shows no interest in or respect for himself as a whole human being or for the women as PEOPLE, with feelings & thoughts, hopes & fears, at all ... just his body-parts 'screwing' theirs. These are hardly true sexual relationships, which develop between WHOLE PEOPLE imho. Sex, like love, is in the head & empathetic imagination. Not just plumbing private parts for gratification. Eugh.

What of the old saying that the biggest & best sexual organ is the brain? Imagination - fired by longing, reaching out, desiring to reach a PERSON and not feel isolated & alone. How can this develop - even without genuine respect, care & Love - with so many bodies in quick, meaningless succession?

October 4, 2005
3:07 pm
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To topic: a truly sexy woman, in my view, is one who relates sincerely and passionately to a man she is genuinely attracted to, with her lively, confident

1)PERSONALITY (flirting, giving off 'vibes' etc);

2)with her MIND (intelligence is sexy, as is interest: talking engagingly, listening too, sharing wit & humour besides depth);

3)with her HEART (feeling & showing in myriad ways her genuine attraction, care & love for him )
and of course

4)her BODY (sharing her true desires & feelings & his in a creative, ever-changing symphony of physical self-expression; mutually responsive & satisfying unselfconscious sensual exploration, enjoyment, sense of fun, abandonment & even lust...)

In other words, what makes ANYONE truly sexy is, to me, the capacity to give & receive in many ways genuine, open, joyful, exciting, tension-releasing, healing, pleasure. Unabashed, joyful, fulfilling pleasure that is always something greater than mere physical gratification and opens the door to a deep sense of happy Bonding & Connectedness.

Total self-giving in fact.

For me, that includes trust & faithfulness too.

There, Tez! That's what does it for me & my friends!

All these attractive, sexy qualities have little to do with looks alone. More a look / spark in the eyes & in the soul.

Phew - writing that feels good! I've got myself all excited and want my lover NOW!

Blessings of what we truly NEED (rather than what we sometimes think we want) - gazelle.

PS Some of the most alluring & sexy women in history & literature are / were not 'good looking' at all. Think of George Elliot.

October 4, 2005
8:32 pm
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Thanks ladies for all your excellent responses. Reading between the lines further convinces me that, when it comes to women generally, having their sexual needs met comes a very poor second to having their security needs met.

On the 4-Oct-05 Gazelle said:

"... PS Some of the most alluring & sexy women in history & literature are / were not 'good looking' at all. Think of George Elliot."

However, on the 27-Sep-05, Exoticflower said:

"I'm told a lot of times that I'm sexier because I am smart and funny, and because i get a lot of guy stuff which takes men by surprise. ANd because I am blunt with men. And I've heard it's sexy that I drinl scotch. I don't get any of it, I really don't. That stuff to me seems interesting, but if you saw a very unatractive girl with these traits you would call her Rosanne or one of the girls from ab fab. I think it's just what men say to excuse their own pettiness while thinking "so hot, never expected her to have a personality too...". And it's only likable on a pretty gal. Saying it isn't about looks is BS! "

Here we have two of the above ladies seemingly disagreeing with each other and that's OK too! We are all entitled to differences of opinion.

But... is sexiness in women partially about looks or is it not about looks but about much more as I have mentioned above on 28-Sep-05?

Is it mainly about what we see in potential or actual sexual partners that pander to our individual security needs; very subjective needs that seem to me to have been preconditioned in our early years?

For example, there are guys who become orgasmic sucking a woman's toes - toe jam and all! Others are really turned on by women amputees. I even saw a documentary about a woman morgue attendant who was arrested when the police found a genuine hearse rocking very violently and suspiciously in a secluded place. The woman was taking the bodies of attractive(to her) men who died with a 'stiffy' for a last ride as it were. Pun intended. šŸ™‚ However, there doesn't seem to me to be any security needs being met in this woman here. What is her 'pay off'? It looks like raw sex for sexual gratification alone. Are there many woman like that? Would many men and women really like such uncomplicated sex on a long term basis?

I had a Psychology book, written by an esteemed academic, in my library devoted to deviant sex. Boyo, the scope of sexual preferences is indeed wide, to which the present porn variety atests. So ... is there such a thing as a global definition of what the general characteristics of a truly sexy woman or man?

But why do women despise and hate sexy, flirtatious woman around their menfolk??? Why do women object to their man just 'looking' and not 'touching' - porn included? I doubt that men would care much if they found their woman doing the same as long as at the end of the day their men got more nookie not less. But I don't know for sure what men would generally say in this regard. Perhaps you girls could ask your men whether they would mind if you did perve on other men either in the flesh or in video formats. I saw plenty of women drooling over a well cut male dancer(with a sixpack) doing a raunchy samba, topless only last night. You should have seen and heard the female cat calls and animated gestures! Are male and females all that different? Or it all about 'keeping up appearances'?

October 5, 2005
2:22 am
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Just when I thought i have heard everything, I hear something even more degrading to women...yes, we are all insecure women. Our need for security it paramount. What is with the stereotypes? I take offense. You and your friends have much to learn regarding the diversity of human needs and behavior, as well as a healthy respect for all women.

I am sick of this thread and how it degrades women in general. If there were one sexy woman out there, I guess Nicole Kidman that chick on Desperate Housewives, among other beauties, wouldn't have trouble getting a date, as they claim. Grow up. What about a woman of substance? This comes from a woman who has had many men tell her she is beautiful. I am sick to death shallowness. Looks don't last. Pride in appearance may, but integrity is here to stay.

October 5, 2005
11:09 am
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Tez ~

Perhaps there is a difference in determining sexy and we need to put those into classifications.

There is 1) the instinctual animal magnatism that draws one to another. Something physical that each person finds incredibly sexy but this attraction is purely about the physical sexiness.

Then 2) we, both men and women I believe, also find sexiness in certain character traits of another. Their confidence, their humor, their morals.

If all someone is looking for is the long term or short term sexual encounter with no strings then perhaps the 1st scenerio works.

If someone is looking for a longterm relationship then perhaps we look for what they can offer emotionally and thus the 2nd scenerio applies.

The bonus, is if you can find a partner that satisfies both the physical attractivness as well as the personality we find most sexy.

I once had a male friend tell me he had a theory that for him there were 4 different type of relationships with women.

#1 - the girl that is his buddy. They can go to games, go to movies, sit and drink beer, play pool or darts and just have fun hanging out.

#2 - the booty call girl. This is the one that he knows he can count on for sex. This is the girl that he'll try anything with - get kinky - get nutty and just have mindblowing sex.

#3 - this is the cuddler. The girl he can curl up with on the couch and watch a movie. Hold hands with and take a long walk. Share deep emotional feelings and they love and care for each other deeply and they make passionate love to one and other.

And so comes #4 - any guesses here?

He says that #4 is his dream girl - do you know who she is.

She is #1, 2 & 3 combined.

t

October 5, 2005
7:53 pm
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Tracylyn.

You said:

"He says that #4 is his dream girl - do you know who she is.

She is #1, 2 & 3 combined. "

Very interesting ... ... ... ...

Do you think that men look for #4s but will settle for less perhaps in the descending order #3, #2, #1; perhaps with #1 holding out the most promise to meet another woman of a higher order.

In talking about sexy attributes, You said: "... Their confidence, their humor, their morals."

The attractiveness of "confidence" in a man has been mentioned often above in this and other postings on this thread. If a man is confident then he would seem to hold the promise of being a good 'provider'. Adding morals to this suggests that the man will not cheat and thus be around to give support in taking care of the woman and rearing a family. Is this evolution derived? Have women and men with these characteristics been the most effective caregivers - thus ensuring the survival of their own gene pool?

Is sexual attractiveness very much a part of the process of Darwinian natural selection; whereas, Hollywood promoted concepts of romantic love mere fiction?

Was Humphrey Bogart sexy because he projected to his femme fatales and his female theatregoers images of male strength, protection, social competence and confidence - all attributes guaranteeing survival needs being met?

Are men on the other hand unconsciously driven by the forces of nature to spread their 'seed' as widely as possible to maximize their chances of propagating their offsprings? Is this why they see sexually available women who advertize this as sexy?

Women supposedly unconsciously wear red lipstick, eye makeup and red rouge to feign sexual arousal and thus to look more sexually attractive. Is there a double standard here? Are women preying on men's abovementioned nature driven desires for the booty call by false advertizing hoping that he will see other attributes in her that will guarantee all #1, 2, 3, 4 of your male friend's theoretical motivations for wanting her. Is feigned sexual arousal the bait? Do women then resent men who only go for the "booty call"(#2) instead of all 4?

I once new a woman who consciously looked into a man's eyes to see if they were dilated. She figured that this dilation was an indication of her sexual attractiveness to him. Yet she wanted a lot more than sex from the man! Ask any father what he wants for his daughter in the way of a partner and I suspect that you will also see what a woman wants and what nature programmed. How many fathers want to be told that the man of his daughter's dreams is an unemployed dole bludger or that his daughter's dreamboat is a lesbian? Isn't is all about evolutional processes that guarantee survival of the species? Aberrations in this diverse process such as homosexuality, foot fetishes, corpse bonking, etc die out for obvious reasons. What goes on is what works in producing prodgeny.

October 6, 2005
3:28 am
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Neshema
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tracylyn-

Loved your post.

Tez- you need to reread it 100 times.

October 6, 2005
10:52 am
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bel
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Tracy I like your scenario and agree with it.

Bel

October 6, 2005
12:02 pm
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tracylyn
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Tez ~

Again I'll go back to 2 classifications here. I think these hold true for both men and women.

Depending on what we are looking for at that moment in our life, we may find different attributes as sexy.

As I said above - one may be more interested in the physical sexiness if all they are interested in is sex. Yet - if one is looking for a relationship the personality traits then apply as well.

I do believe that "confidence" and "morals" have been mentioned many times because they do imply security which, if one is looking for a life partner - the security is an attribute desired.

I believe too that at times we are just out for the "booty call", find someone we are physically attracted to but much to our surprise - they also have the personality that attracts the thought of a long term relationship and something more than the booty developes.

Also I believe there may be someone that we are completely physically attracted to but once the personaility is revealed - it's appalling and the physical attractedness isn't viewed the same.

We could use Brad Pitt as an example. He's viewed as a sexy man and he was adored by women when he was seen as a true and faithful man. Now, given his recent adventures, do we see him the same way. I don't think so - we don't see him as sexy as we once did. Because his personality became tarnished in the eyes of the beholder - as did his physical attractiveness. He's not seen the same.

This can happen in reverse as well. We may not find someone physically attractive but in getting to know them and see what a strong beautiful person they are whose personality meets our liking - then we start to see them physically in a different light as well and can become physically attracted to their appearance as well.

I don't see a double standard as you ask above. I think men as well as women will work on the physical attributes - I mean come on - everyone wants to look their best right. And yes, our instinct is to notice the physical appearance of someone that appeals to us. This doesn't mean that what I think is sexy you will think as sexy. I know for me - I think my bf is damn hot and sexy but my best friend just doesn't see it. It's all an individual preference that you or your friends perhaps are trying to define and lump into one category. The same goes for the fetishes you mention - I do believe the woman who choose to "bonk" a corpes has some many mental issues - this is far from the average women yet you want to lump her in with women in general.

You also need to look at the many different types of women as well. Of course there are those out to catch a man and use their sexuality to do it but just as there are women that don't and never would. Some women are shallow and only with a man for the money - some men like that - some men don't. You have men that are only in a relationship to have the pretty girl on his arm - some women are fine with that - some aren't. It all depends individually what someone is looking for in a relationship.

I also don't think that women resent men for only wanting a booty call - at times that's all we want too. However, it's when that man represents himself to want more as to gain access to the "booty call" that women resent and vice versa as well I would imagine.

t

October 6, 2005
12:51 pm
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On one hand, in this post, men and women are being referred to as animal in nature, with sexual attraction being equaled to an animal being in heat...very wrong, very distasteful.

When descriptions of sexuality are added such as morals, confidence, security, responsible...etc., the picture changes.

We did not evolve from apes, we are no animals,....but we do evolve into more perfect human beings depending upon which ideas, beliefs we follow. We attract who we are, we become what we follow. Everyone is unique and becomes and follows who or what they want.

October 6, 2005
10:09 pm
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Tracylyn.

Thank you for a highly intelligent, balanced and well written posting of 6-Oct-2005.

I concur 100%.

At the end of your post, you said:

"I also don't think that women resent men for only wanting a booty call - at times that's all we want too. However, it's when that man represents himself to want more as to gain access to the "booty call" that women resent and vice versa as well I would imagine."

Yes, yes, yes. It is fundamentally a question of honesty; honesty with oneself and with those with whom one interacts.

In sexual game playing, dishonesty is , I suspect, the fundamental cause of resentments and difficulties. The problem with self-honesty is that the mind very often clouds what is going on in the unconscious processes. Dishonest people very often are in denial of their dishonesty - or worse don't even see anything wrong with it.

Ha! Down to the nitty gritty! So the problem goes back even one step further from a 'lack of honesty' to that of 'ignorance'; ignorance of both/either the inner workings of one's own mind and/or the ramifications of one's own thoughts, words, intentions and actions.

Playing the devil's advocate paid off!

October 7, 2005
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On my way.

On 6-Oct-05 you said:

"We did not evolve from apes, we are no animals,...."

I beg to differ.

We are animals who have developed a little higher cognitive abilities than that of most of our fellow animals on this earth - just enough to get ourselves into a hell of a lot of trouble. However some would debate our cognitive superiority with some very good arguments.

Unfortunately our fellow sentient beings on this planet seem to be paying the price of our lack of adequate cognitive development in advance of us. However, our turn to pay the piper is fast coming!!!

One biblical writing that I find amongst many others particularly abhorrent is Genesis 26 "And now we will make human beings; they will be like us and resemble us. They will have power over the fish, the birds, and all animals domestic and wild, large and small."

Hmmm!! Who are the "we" above who did the creating and how are we humans "like" these creators? Seeing how we behave doesn't project a good image of these creators of the human race. What kind of intelligent creators would create us knowing we would destroy the planet and our fellow sentient beings? Were the veracity of the bible above question, "sadistic creators", I would presume to be the answer.

And similarly abhorrent is Genesis 27: "So God created human beings, making them to be like himself ..."

Ditto, to above.

October 7, 2005
2:05 pm
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Dear NESHEMA - I too find many of the shallow, distasteful attitudes displayed in this thread depressingly demeaning and degrading to our humanity.

I would really appreciate your response to my 2 posts of the 4th Oct, if you can spare a few minutes.

Likewise Tracylyn and OMW.

Cheers, girls!

Blessings of the best we can be - not wallowing in the worst - gazelle.

October 7, 2005
2:13 pm
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Actually, I deliberately omitted the Big Word from my posts (to avoid Tez saying he was only discussing sex).

To be honest, for me,it is a vital, essential component:

LOVE!!!

Only within Love is sex truly sexy, erotic, wholesome, natural, blissful, ecstatic & fulfilling ..... as for many millions of women AND men.

October 7, 2005
3:55 pm
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Gazelle ~

I think I responded to your post a bit in my post from Oct 5.

I understand your point in finding someone sexy has very much to do with being in love with that person. I agree however, as my post from the 5th describes, that there are many men and women alike that find other's sexy without even knowing them let alone being in love with them.

Thus, this gives light to my theory that it's difficult to determine sexy in that it is a very, very individual attraction depending upon each individual person and what they are looking for in the other person at that moment.

I agree that when you are in love with someone that they in turn become very sexy to you however, just as when one falls out of love - the other doesn't seem to have the same sexiness.

I don't think we can lump sexy into one category. It's too broad and too many people have too many opinions. Sexy for you is love, sexy for someone else may be lust and each is accurate and honest - they just have different places in the spectrum of defining sexy.

I don't think anyone's idea of sexy is a wrong one or should be judged. Again - it's each person's individual thoughts or attractions regarding what sexy is.

t

October 7, 2005
8:32 pm
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Tracylyn

You said:

"I don't think anyone's idea of sexy is a wrong one or should be judged. Again - it's each person's individual thoughts or attractions regarding what sexy is."

Ditto - to each his/her own lot in life. How many people get to choose the childhood preconditioning that underpins their sexual preferences and desires?

Petty-mindedness, bigotry, excessive fundamentalist religiosity and ignorance have wrecked havoc over the centuries.

October 8, 2005
2:59 am
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Gazelle-

Sorry for the delayed response. I had a huge deadline for work and it is done! YAYAY! I also am basically not talking to my guy friend...that is another story on the support threads..come into my NIGHT CREWS anytime...we love awesome people like you...well, we include everyone, even if we disagree. That said, YOU ROCK! I completely agreed with what you wrote. Too bad you aren't a man, I would ask you to marry me. In fact, the day I find a man with those values, I will be in Las Vegas getting hitched. Whatever happened to manners and old-fashioned courtship? I completely agree about men respecting women. There seems to be a pervasive disrespect in our culture. Now, I am not a fundamentalist in terms of religion. I have dated A LOT in my lifetime. I am a hot, did I say HOT, woman, who is so sick and tired of dating, I could write a book. I don't date much anymore. I used to date as a sport. I don't believe in cheating and I dont believe in the "three-date rule." So, Tez, some truly sexy women say NO to them all and await for a truly outstanding human being to emerge. Some truly sexy women don't sleep around and some of us don't settle even for one. Some of us respect ourselves. Do you get that? That is what makes us so sexy! We respect ourselves because our bodies are temples. Some of us actually like and protect our bodies and don't share them with every creep that comes along. What do you think of that, Gazelle?

October 10, 2005
11:13 am
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Neshema ~

If two mature adults, both respecting themselves and each other explore a sexual encounter without expecting more - why is this wrong? If both parties are honest with what they want, are respectful of each other, and enjoy a sexual relationship why is this wrong?

Also, you say "We respect ourselves because our bodies are temples. Some of us actually like and protect our bodies and don't share them with every creep that comes along."

Aren't there many women who respect themselves and consider their bodies temples but would still partake in a purely sexual relationship? If so, does this make them less respectful of themselves in some way?

Also, what brings the thought that giving of oneself to a man for that reason makes him a creek? I believe a self respecting women doesn't jump to sex with every "creep" either but she can enjoy sexual relations out of the relm of a love relationship.

I'm not defending a view different than yours - I'm merely asking why you feel this way.

t

October 10, 2005
8:21 pm
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Why buy the cow when you can have the milk for free? I just feel that free sex has led to the demise of the institution of marriage. That is my opinion. Feel free to think differently. If you don't put out, then he will find it elsewhere. It used to be that men had to court women and get to know them before physical intimacy. Now, you can be with someone and look down and say "who the heck are you?" So, a woman who wants more than that has a hard time getting it these days.

October 11, 2005
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Ahhh I totally agree but I would think that once a man is truly looking to settle down he'll be willing to wait for the milk and not stray to other pastures. Same with women.

That's why I've discussed here to two classifications of sexy. It really depends on what you are looking for at that time in your life.

A man (or women) just looking for a booty call might think the physical matters more and they don't really care about much else. Then, when one is ready to settle down one goes for the a different type of person or maybe not a different type - but different characteristics become more important. I don't think this is a conscience occurrence, I think it's something we instinctly do.

I most definitely agree that once love is in the picture - that's when true sexiness in the partner is revealed. Once there is love - the whole world looks sexier.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

t

October 11, 2005
4:57 pm
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It isn't about appearances for everyone. It is about perspective, boundaries, and WHO is in the perspective and WHO is in the boundaries. All of the division, confusion does not come from 2 people who are committed to the same beliefs but comes when there are no ground rules. Even in sex, there has to be ground rules, which goes back to respecting one's self, and respecting another. It's true. May sound corny, but corny survives.

Tez, you are the most disagreeable person I have ever encountered regarding God. You p me off, but there is humor there as well. No more biblical debates, at least for me....no time. šŸ™‚

October 11, 2005
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On my way.

You said:

"Tez, you are the most disagreeable person I have ever encountered regarding God. You p me off, but there is humor ..."

Thank you for the nicest compliment that I have received in this regard for a very long time. I have tried very hard to deserve it. šŸ™‚

I might have to go and suck a lemon to get rid of this smile on my face.

Will you marry me?

October 14, 2005
3:30 pm
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Tez,
LOL! You sound exactly like my ex-husband, which is a kicker. We are very good friends now, but he thrives on stress, keeping the pot stirred up, and his sense of humor lends to him being thankful for every negative comment that comes his way. My boys have adopted this "thankful" attitude as well!!...which is great, makes them tough and kind at the same time. Living in a household of men while married, my ex, three boys, even the dogs were male, has been an experience to say the least for me, coming from a family of all girls.

Will I marry you? You flirt too much.
All in good fun,
it has been interesting chatting with you I will admit.

October 14, 2005
7:41 pm
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on my way
14-Oct-05

Oh well ... I guess my partner would have objected to me starting aharem anyway. šŸ™‚ She's funny like that.

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