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Ah the bible.
August 16, 2005
12:54 am
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Anonymous
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StronginHim, I agree whole heartedly with all your eloquent post here.

Unfortunately, I still don't feel like my understanding was contributed to on this subject.

No disrespect to the veterans who may have who may not want to talk about it but I'm still looking for clarity.

if this site has taught me anything, it's that even the most sensitive subjects can be debated calmly and rationally here.

There IS a clear line between quoting a source and proselytizing. One is clearly against the rules here (as it should be) the other is encouraged. This means, using the bible to bring about you point is expressedly forbiddne. But, citing something: historical, passionate, thought provoking or motivational is encouraged...without conditions.

August 16, 2005
1:07 am
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mamacinnamon
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Y&R:

If you'd like to talk more on this then come upstairs to the thread w/ my name and I'll discuss it w/ you for clarity sake. 🙂

August 16, 2005
7:12 am
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CODA_Mom
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Young & Restless,

I smiled when I read your post and appreciate your zeal...please don't take this as being patronizing, you've reminded me of fundamental differences between us older folks and you "young-uns". That is, you guys have more passion and zeal.

I've cut this from your post:

"if this site has taught me anything, it's that even the most sensitive subjects can be debated calmly and rationally here".

Yes, this is so true, but Support Threads are for just that, support in matters of physical, mental or emotional matters. This is a common ground that we all share and can give one another support. However, not everyone is spiritually inclined, not everyone can relate to having been awakened spiritually and it is a huge area of contention ("You-know-who" said it would be, initials JC)...that is why we use Lib Brew Threads, to address spiritual issues. We take care with our liberties and respect others' rights to protest. We don't simply clam up with what is important to us, though, we simply take it where we can talk and if others are seeking spiritual answers they come over to ask.

Out of respect for the guidelines and the SC, I'm not going to post anymore in this thread but would be glad to pick up in Lib Brew.

I don't know if this gives a little bit more clarity, I'd be glad to talk about it more if it doesn't.

Blessings to all,

CM

August 16, 2005
9:13 am
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kathygy
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Stronginhim,

You are right the bible can be viewed as different things but when it was mentioned here it was mentioned as a reglious document. No one here refered to it as a literary book. Lets put an end to this as it no pointless and painful to try to discuss it again. If you want more understanding of this guideline send and email to the site coordinator. she is the one who made the guideline and therefore is the best source for understanding the ins and outs of the guideline. I feel that some people here are trying to open up the discussion again, which only brings up our wounds from that time. Please do yourself and others here a favor and address the site coordinator if you want more understanding.

love,
kathy

August 16, 2005
10:22 am
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angel4U
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Y&R - If you go to Lib Brews, you can find a great deal of posts on the controversy that happened here by doing a search on either the word guideline or religion.

The one in particilar that put a final close on the discussions in the Support Threads is:

New Guideline: Separation of Religion & This Site

All - Great points! Love that spirit that lies within you all ... =))

SVL - It sounds like you are seaking answers to bring you peace with your situation. If we can help, please reach out. If it is a spiritual answer you are in need of, as the others shared, feel free to post up in Libs.

Blessings to all,

angel4u

August 16, 2005
10:32 am
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angel4U
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added note - While up in Libs, if you click on the link to show threads for the Timeframe = 1.5 years, you will find many threads on this topic from the beginning to the end of May.

Will also give you an idea why people are now "tip-toeing" a little about any religious discussions and strong on redirecting everyone to Libs.

August 19, 2005
1:46 am
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Thanks to all of you.

Thanks to Angel4U for pointing me in the right direction. After searching the threads you recommended I found my arguments, passionately argued by many.

I also vividly saw the counter arguments for the first time.

They helped.

August 19, 2005
11:26 pm
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mamacinnamon
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When someone gets offended at something that was said to them they are instructed by many to ignore the post or just don’t read it. When someone gets offended at what someone has said as has happened to them they are instructed by many to ignore the post and just don’t read it. I have seen this said to folks, old and new, to the point of the person wanting to leave the site and quite possibly some folks do leave.. If this being the case that we tell the new person that... There are gonna be folks here that you like and dislike since we have such a wide range of values and beliefs in the folks we see here. So, if they say something offensive then just ignore it. You do not have to read what that person posted.

Yet some still complain every time anyone, new or old, mentions the Bible, God, Jesus Christ. I am at a loss as to why the instructions given to some are not practiced by the same ones giving the advice. If I felt as you do, and this subject bothered me, then I would not check threads that had anything in the title that bothered me…. In this case, “Bible”. This would only put me in a position to become uncomfortable and belittle people who behave differently.

Please take responsibility for yourself in this area and do not open up a can of worms for yourself… and you know… come to think of it, this could probably apply to any area of our lives in Support threads who are codependent. And…. THIS is in the guidelines… we offer positive advice for other codependents such as ourselves to be careful with ourselves and to not seek out situations that could harm us personally.

August 20, 2005
12:23 pm
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angel4U
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(((((((((((((mamac)))))))))))))

August 20, 2005
1:06 pm
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lollipop3
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Very well said Mama.

Love,
Lolli

August 20, 2005
4:01 pm
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on my way
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MAMAC.....

Very eloquent, loving, beautifully said, kind, as always....same spirit we all share. Glad for you, as I know you love, and care for everyone on this site. And I do not remember you ever being rude to anyone, always kind.

Will post to you later dear friend.
Smiles, and hugs. Hope you are recovering, and hope that heat continues........more smiles. 🙂

Love ya,
omw

August 20, 2005
8:29 pm
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white dove
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Ditto, your the best mama, your the most caring person i know. thats God in you. be blessed my friend.and thankyou for your caring words and support
love white dove

August 21, 2005
12:51 am
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OK here goes...

MamaC, I appreciate your sentiments.

In my opinion, the only thing that would have made it a more healthy expression of communication would have been to say it directly to the person you had in mind when you wrote it. We're all adults here learning to communicate with each other in a healthy manner. Not necessarily to in an agreeable manner, but a definately in a healthy manner.

The freedom to actually talk to a person (as opposed to about them) is becomming a very useful tool in my recovery.

August 21, 2005
1:03 am
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While we're on the subject of communicating I'd like to say this.

I've had a very pleasant exchange with the SC and therefore know that she is a lovely woman. I also realize that I'm a guest in her house and am very grateful for the privilege in that.

But, I felt very...embarrased and disgruntled when this thread just magically "poofed" over to the Lib threads without even a noted explination.

With that being said, Oh wise SC, thank you for giving me a voice and a place to own my feelings this way.

August 21, 2005
1:08 pm
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Worried_Dad
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I think we just need to be careful to post threads with strong religious or political content over here in Lib Brew. And we need to be careful not to get too preachy.

One way to do that with religious literature is to extract the wisdom being from the texts as quotes, and paraphrases, and apply them to real situations. That way everyone can feel comfortable if they want to bring ideas from the Koran or the Bhagavad Gita, for example.

I actually like the quote above and it is not a particularly "religious" idea--it is simply wisdom.

My favorite quote from the Bible, which I feel free to use without fear of being accused of being a bible-thumper is:

"Thou shalt not kill."

I really like that one.

August 21, 2005
2:16 pm
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lollipop3
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Hi Y&R,

I am curious why it is that you feel embarrassed by the thread being moved to Lib.brew.

I'm sure that it was nothing personal against you and certainly should not be taken that way.

I have seen that many times, when the SC feels that a topic is better suited for Lib.brew, she moves it over here.....I'm sure there are no bad intentions...just trying to keep things within the guidelines.

Love,
Lolli

August 21, 2005
6:56 pm
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mamacinnamon
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Y&R:

Thanks for your advice. I don't usualy elaborate on my posts, but you being new I'd like to.

I want to point out that my expression stands as is. Guideline #1, not judging; & #2 reduce attacks, defense, & passivness will cover my not naming any one specific person. Also, keeping posts to the generic or the I, instead of the you, is suggested in keeping posts from other parties perceiving your post as a personal attack, which my post is not intended in any way as such. Maybe there are more than one that needed to read this

Also, SC has taken the time to put out several threads on Effective Communication (or something like that) and I'm sure she'd like to see her efforts put to some use.

I respect each person on this site and have been helped myself by many. It is said... A gentle answer turns away wrath, but a harsh word stirs up anger. I choose peace and friendship.

August 21, 2005
7:40 pm
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Hey Y&R,

If it makes you feel any better, we all got "poofed" over here with ya 😉

Don't let it get you down, and please don't stop posting with your wonderful, sensitive insight.

mamac,

Good input, I'm still praying for you and your daughter, hope all is well with both of you.

WD,

Someone started a thread for you over in Supports. So sorry to learn that you've been going thru a difficult time and haven't felt too much support. I know that I haven't been much support lately at this site because of my work/family commitments, and I do apologize for that.

I did read that you have been having problems with your roommate (ugh!), and was wondering how things were going. If you don't want to tell your story again, I can certainly understand that.

I'll be careful not to get too preachy ;), but just wanted to tell you that I'll be praying for you, too.
You don't deserve the treatment that you've been getting, hopefully, you'll stay in touch with your woman friend who was nice and safe.

Blessings to all,

CM

August 21, 2005
9:21 pm
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Hey Loli,

I know the SC's goal wasn't to embarrass me...

One of my coda books summed up the way that many coda people see themselves: We're the piece of trash that the whole world revolves around. I understand that the "poof" wasn't about me. I also understand that my embarrasment WAS about me and my unresolved junk, not the SC.

MamaC, thanks for your explination. Looks like I was way off base. What you said in your fifth post felt a little to me like a passive-aggressive jab. I learned to communicate in passive-aggresive jabs before I even learned to read.

I also learned how ineffective they are, and how much they can make a person feel like an outsider.

Because I see so much of that in my everyday life and understand how unhealthy it can be. My goal was to encourage real discussion between you and the person I thought you were talking about. I wanted everyone to feel comfortable being here. But, as your post pointed out, I was off base. Thanks again for making the exception of explaining your post to me.

CODA_MOM, Thanks for the encouragement, I truly appreciate it.

August 21, 2005
9:28 pm
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Worried_Dad
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Hey, CM, good to hear from you.

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