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OVERCOME PLEASE READ THIS
December 24, 2005
4:56 pm
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bonita1
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mamac!!!

((((((hugs))))) Where have you been, girlfriend???? I've missed you!!

You know there are a lot of yous on that post but right towards the end of her post thats when mimi said I statements...

I don't think you do.

I think that you're a predator.

I think that you have no use for society.

I pray that your children will not have any involvement with you."

This is where I believe she was expressing HER OPINION harsh as it was. I think if you just put the words "I" in front of a sentence you can pretty much get away with being rude and judgemental towards others.

Of course, this is MY OPINION. I am NOT JUDGING!!!

Love to see you around mamac!!

~~bonbon

December 24, 2005
6:05 pm
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kathygy
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momma and bontia,

I understand what you are saying and you both make some very good points.

However, for some reason right now I am feeling a lot of compassion for mimi.

It seems to me that she has been very hurt and feels angry about that. I can relate to those feelings.

I am not saying it is O.K. to judge or criticize anyone here and that includes mimi.

That's all I'm really trying to say.

Everyone deserves to be treated with respect.

Sometimes I feel that someone really needs to say what they feel. Somehow I felt that with mimi. What she said does not have to be taken literally.

Saying 'if you can't say anything nice, don't say anything at all' is abuse from childhood. In this case a child is robbed of her truth.

Yes, it does make a difference on how that truth is expressed. Yes, it doesn't make it O.K. to be abusive to someone else.

My approach to mimi is trying to read the feelings, the needs, the wounds below the words.

love and peace,
kathy

December 24, 2005
6:17 pm
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mamacinnamon
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OK Kathy.

MIMI: I apologize if I hurt your feelings.

Kathy: I undertand not wanting to hurt Mimi's feelings. But she ripped Overcome apart. You can see that in the quotes in my last post. Anyone would feel devastated to be told someone prays their kids will have nothing to do w/ them. SO, if Mimi is to be given compassion... what about what she said. She is allowed to tell me off, but what about what she said to Overcome... it is excused? I think we are running a double set of rules here.

I am not against Mimi in any way. I just don't think bashing Overcome was proper. So, maybe Mimi should apologize to Overcome...

MIMI are you willing to apologize and say you were to harsh?

Kathy... I don't think the actions of one should be excused unless the actions of all are excused. I didn't intend to hurt Mimi's feelings and I'm woman enough to apologize. But what about Mimi bashing Overcome... you've not said a word to her about that. The actions ripple on up the line as you know.

December 24, 2005
10:29 pm
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kasie919
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What about the fact that Overcome hasnt even a chance to defend himself,
I think those words of mimi were very harsh, and i dont beleive MamaC should have to apologise for anything, its getting to ridiculous here, people judging, critizisine, demeaning, im sick of it, I came here for solice and help, not to see people do this.

Over come ,is not here to defend his words and should not be talked about unless he can do so..

This site is to help people not hurt them......
MamaC said nothing wrong, and should not have to defend herself either.

For gods sake its CHRISTMAS and people have got to reap havic!!!!

Mamac:
I dont think what you have said was wrong,

this was something between me and OVERCOME!!!!
No one else, so if you have anyhting more to say take it up when both parties can defend themselves, this man is trying to enjoy what he has left of his family this weekend, and i sure have had my holiday blown to hell..

I have had enough of this site, you have got to realize that the hurtfull things that you say chase people and make them feel like i do.

Have a mery freakin cristmas
mimi and kathy.

December 24, 2005
10:51 pm
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mamacinnamon
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Kasie:

I understand you upsettedness. I definitely do. I think the site has "gone to the dogs" w/ folks just wanting to rip apart others, make fun of, chastise, etc.

I apologized because.... even tho I do not feel I said anything hurtful.... It takes a bigger woman to apologize than for a person to act like a child to throw a temper tantrum. Obviously kathy and mimi felt I hurt mimi's feelings. For hurting mimi's feelings I do apologize.

Let's stop the pettiness and have a Merry Christmas.

Kasie.... So Sweet a girl you can be. Thank you for the moral support.

December 25, 2005
3:17 am
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bonita1
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"However, for some reason right now I am feeling a lot of compassion for mimi.

It seems to me that she has been very hurt and feels angry about that. I can relate to those feelings."

Yes, I agree that compassion for others is called for. However, posting another thread might work better for mimi. I am NOT speaking for her. I am merely stating an opinion.

Also, in my opinion, we cannot hold a double standard of behavior simply because we feel more compassionate towards one person but not to another.

I think it is grossly unfair to ignore communication that is plain hurtful, rude and judgemental.

I think that most of us posting on these threads have suffered pain & heartache at one time or another.

In my humble opinion, a better approach to mimi or to anyone else that is hurting and lashes out towards others is to ask them if they mind sharing their feelings & needs instead of trying to read the feelings, the needs, the wounds below the words.

Assertive communication is not aggressive communication IMHO.

I understand you feeling compassionate, kathyg. But we must stick to the guidelines.

December 25, 2005
3:45 pm
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kathygy
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O.K.,
the reality with me re:overcome is that he trashed me totally, judged me based on nothing, made up a lot of things about me there were totally off base and abusive. so, i'm not feeling very kindly towards overcome.

where were you momma when he totalyt trashed me? no one, not one person thought that was wrong!!

but now all of the sudden what mimi said about Oc is very mild compared to what he said about me and to me!!!!

December 25, 2005
3:52 pm
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mamacinnamon
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Kathy.... on this thread or another?

December 26, 2005
1:57 am
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bonita1
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oh wow!

Sorry, kathy. Yes, I understand now, thank you.

I have noticed that some of overcome's past posts on different threads... tended to get quite harsh in stating his opinions.

However, I am so impressed by your honesty, kathy. It's not everyone who can admit or even be aware of the motivation behind their actions.

I was not aware of overcome's behavior towards you but by his own admission he can be something of a "smartazz."

I'm sorry you felt abused by overcome's words and attitude.
(overcome,don't mean to talk about you or over you, etc.) Ok, overcome... do you think kathy deserves an apology??

IMHO

~bon

December 26, 2005
5:29 pm
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overcome
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kathy,

What did I say about you? You stressing over the holidays? I did no such thing?

Anyway, if you feel to explain further, I will gladly discuss.

December 26, 2005
5:34 pm
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overcome
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Hey Mimi,

Thanks...that was hysterical...heheheheh. I laughed for like 10 minutes over that.

Mimi, lets see...you come on here and bash me for really no reason. It sounds to me like you suffer from a serious condition called NLS (or in layman terms- no life syndrone).

It is very obvious to me that you were not worth the sperm and egg your parents wasted to make you. Anyway, thanks for making me presence of mind for your holiday!

December 26, 2005
9:59 pm
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Anonymous
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overcome,

This is the first time I've visited this thread. I see there's been a lot of mud flung around, and I see you've received your share of it. I don't know anything about you; I understand you've been going through some tough times.

I'm really pretty easygoing and tend to overlook potentially offensive things that might be said. However, when you said, "It is very obvious to me that you were not worth the sperm and egg your parents wasted to make you." I had to speak up.

This sort of thing is beneath you, overcome. It's not just expressing your opinion; it appears to be calculated to hurt. It's not worthy of you. I want to challenge you to speak more civilly in the future, for everybody's sake.

Please, will you help put a stop to the mud flinging on this thread? If you won't, who will?

December 26, 2005
11:53 pm
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mamacinnamon
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Overcome:

My mouth dropped open when I read what you wrote to Mimi. I agree that she was heartless to you on the other thread, but I never thought you would or could be as heartless as I have just read.

I agree w/ seekerw.... this is way beneath you. I met a man that has compassion, care, someone I like, and then this? I'll admit we do have our bad days.... I've had them myself.

Let's have a cup of coffee and then we'll start over, ok?

December 27, 2005
2:08 am
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bonita1
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Overcome!!!! Duuuuude!!!!!!
Was that what one calls a knee jerk reaction????

In my opinion, and I'm pretty sure a lot will agree with me, mimi did bash you pretty good. I have no idea why? There probably is some other issue behind it but until mimi wants to clarify we won't know why.

On the other hand, kathyg did express that something she read in one of your posts hurt her feelings. If it WAS NOT your intention to hurt her, then it's not gonna kill you to apologize and say that was not your intention. It could be that she misunderstood you because you cannot remember writing anything that may have hurt her. Right? But, do not deny her feelings. Instead, ask her when and where? Then take it from there. Nobody will think less of you because of it. I think it would show the caliber of person one is.

The reality is that kathy's feelings are hurt. She has said so. When a person says, "What did I say about you? You stressing over the holidays? I did no such thing?....you....explain...I will discuss," its like rubbing salt in an open wound.

Overcome, these boards, in my humble opinion, are perfect for practice in healthy communication and self-control. Sometimes these two things will make or break a relationship.

Please know that I am not trying to judge you nor am I trying to tell you what to do. Truthfully, I think that mimi's tirade against you was despicable (IMHO). I think mimi's rudeness to mamac was totally out of line and mamac had no business apologizing to her, IN MY OPINION.

But, kathy was being honest and I admire her for her honesty. When someone is willing to become vulnerable and expose their feelings, shouldn't we as human beings, validate their feelings by listening to them and open a meaningful dialogue with them??

Wouldn't that be better in ANY relationship;rather than denying the other person's hurt and refusing to acknowledge that persons words??

Wouldn't this kind of communication go a long way in healing a troubled marriage? Or wouldn't this kind of communication ease the pain of a divorce and ease any snafus in visitation with children???

I am speaking from personal experience here, hon. My ex molested my adult daughter when she was a child. I have two minor children still with him and the court has ordered monitored visitation. With almost superhuman effort and by the grace of my HP, I am able to speak with him in a polite way regarding the children. It can BE DONE. It is not impossible.

With all due respect, please, please, please, overcome, use these boards to practice a better type of communication. It cannot hurt you and can only help you in the long run.

This is my humble opinion,

~~bonita 🙂

December 27, 2005
8:06 am
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kasie919
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Overcome:

I am sorry all this happened, this is my fault and i do apologise, I was just trying to be a friend like you were to me and see what i have started?
I am very painfully sorry..

Ive decided i no longer want to be a part of this site...

Thank you ever so much for your harsh but awakening words, I will never forget you..

May you find the peace you so well deserve, I hope your christmas was wonderfull, and being with your kids great!!

All my love to you,
and again Im sorry for causing all this...

Kasie

December 27, 2005
11:37 am
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kathygy
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overcome,

my words to you have nothing to do with the holidays and stress.

I can't find the thread but I believe it was when you first came here.

you said A LOT of things about me that were completely untrue. I felt very abused and judged by you and I felt very angry at you for that.

One thing I remember you said something about me not 'stepping up to the plate'. I think the topic was standing up to the abuser. I repied to you and pointed out that I have zero tolerance for abuse.

That's all I can remember. If I can find that thread I'll point you to it.

December 27, 2005
12:19 pm
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bonita1
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Kasie, hon!!

No!! Please don't do that. This is NOT about you, this is NOT YOUR FAULT, please believe that.

Do not internalize fault and apologize for something that does not belong to you. You have no fault in this. Please do not claim that-- please do not leave the site. Your input is valuable here and you have just as much right to be here as anybody else.

Honey, I am NOT a psychotherapist, doctor, etc. But, in my opinion, it is wrong when you assume fault that is not yours. From my personal experience, I used to hear this, "It's your fault," from my ex all the time. Pretty soon I started to believe him and accepted that everything wrong in the household or with the children was somehow MY FAULT.

Imagine my surprise when I found out what he had truly been trying to hide (his molestation of my daughter) by throwing a smoke screen of unmerited blame in my direction.

All of us struggle with our issues. Please don't take somebody else's issues and make them your own. They don't belong to you, hon!!

This site is so much better because you are here. Internalize that, ok???

~~bonita

December 27, 2005
1:10 pm
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taj64
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Sorry Kasie that you feel you must leave the site. I hope you do not. I find Overcome to be rude and insensitive and demeaning to the women on this site. I don't have anything to add to this thread but so far, all the threads I have read by Overcome come across as an arrogant person who likes to stir up the pot and not really helping anyone that needs the help. That is my input. As far as Mimi said, she obviously said something on her mind as angry as it was, as some of us do, sometimes say things out of line. She probably took offense to Overcome in previous threads as I have but had guts to express herself. As far as Kathy, I have never found anything she said that was not true or demeaning to anyone on this site. This site is not meant for bashing but helping. Those who want to bash go to another site for that type of activity.

December 27, 2005
1:24 pm
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bonita1
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here, here, taj. very succint and to the point. An excellent post. I gotta learn to whittle mine down to the bare bones, too.

December 27, 2005
1:37 pm
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((((Kasie)))),

Please, PLEASE do not leave this site! I'll miss you if you do. We've had some good exchanges. I concur with bonita and taj, and beg you to reconsider.

As bonita said, I think you're taking on too much responsibility. You didn't cause anything. Write us back, okay?

December 27, 2005
6:52 pm
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Worried_Dad
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Well, I havent seen the threads supporting OC as a predator or a bad guy. The "dick extension" crack was pretty harsh, though. And OC snapped back. And now kasie is upset.

Come on, guys. Let's take some deep breaths and cool off here. It is ok to give each other feedback when they are being rude. But let's save the heavy ammo for the really nasty ones. (Actually those, we should probably just ignore, but you know what I mean.)

I think it would be a real accomplishment if we could do this the AAC way. Let's back off on all the "you suck" and "Im leaving messages' for a while and try to actually work with each other. It is so worthwhile to create a stable population of guideline-respecting folks here.

Come on...pretty please?

December 27, 2005
7:49 pm
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turnabout
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It's one thing to take offense at something a person has said or done and refute it. That is healthy communication. It is another thing to hurl insults at the person b/c of the offense. THAT is abusive language, and putting "I think" statements in front of it isn't going to change that.

It is also quite different to state one's opinion about something offensive that was said or done and to make generalized, condemning judgments about a person. And, in my opinion, the "I" statement is not a "get out of jail free card". They can be manipulated to be just as abusive as any statement ever heard.

And while any of us are probably justified in taking offense at being attacked by a person, it is never justified to counter attack. I think that's one of the things we are here to learn.... how to effectively communicate without resorting to the counterattack. This only fuels the fire we are trying to shield ourselves from.

And lastly, why are we taking so personally things said by people who don't know us, don't know our situations, aren't a "real" part of our lives, and can't have any influence in our lives except whatever manner we allow through this website? Can they move into your home and FORCE you to listen to their abuse? Can they convince all of your friends to leave you? Can they turn your kids against you? In other words, can any person here be a "real" threat to us? If a person speaks abusively here, it certainly isn't right and defies the guidelines, but whatever harm they do is the harm we choose to let them do. So, my question is, is it even worth a counter attack? Why do we allow the abusively stated opinions to even matter to us? And why do we choose to validate them by responding to them?

Just my 2 cents.

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