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Anxiety & Grief: ADULTS ONLY,
January 14, 2006
6:46 pm
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zinnia
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The first part is a request. The second part is the original post that I have to keep reposting and I hope that the ones who understand will follow, rather than let the hi-jackers control. I will repost the replies of some if I have to repost again, but I will not repost the hijackers.

Adults are people who have enough life experience and COMMON COURTESY (sorry, no html for bold or italics, so caps are necessary for emphasis) to know that conversation about painful subjects is NOT A THERAPIST-CLIENT relationship.

Those who UNDERSTAND AND ACCEPT emotions like grief over the loss of children and other loved ones and who have EXPERIENCED this, please post. You are not likely to assume that these emotions require "therapy" and that such losses must never be discussed except with therapists.

I DO NOT WANT ANYONE WHO HAS NOT LOST A CHILD TO POST HERE AND ANYONE WHO HAS LOST A CHILD TWHO POSTS HERE, YOU ARE NOT DOING SO AS A THERAPIST!!!!! If you do not know how to have a conversation without pretending you are a therapist, DO NOT POST HERE!!!!

================================

I woke up this morning with a dream about being stopped in a grocery store for not having any money. It is the 14th of the month and I have spent my budget, but I have no reason for anxiety about food because I have a fully stocked pantry. I shop by the month.

Normally after the 15th of the month if I have money left, I allow myself to buy more "extras" but this month I can't.

I do need to lose weight and so I can use this opportunity to eat more healthy food instead of buying pastries. I have those little snack boxes of raisins and I have put them in the cookie jar, and it has been a week since I have had a chocolate chip cookie.

I am ashamed of myself for feeling so bound up with the ability to buy chocolate pastries!

I am beginning to find the raisins satisfying, but the anxiety is still there.

If I think of my daughter the tears well up and I have to turn my attention away.

She is dying of anorexia and she has been taken into the cult that is killing her. I was anoraxic as a young woman and now I am fat.

I was told I was fat over and over again, when I was thin, and I was forced by my monther to wear these awful "girdles" as a young teen. I never weighed more than 130 lbs at 5'7".

I freed myself when I went to college and joined all the rebellious behavior of the early seventies. I still thought I was fat but I did not care.

After my daughter was born I went to about 160lbs during nursing, but soon lost it.

When I had to move back to my family when divorcing, I was at a party at my siter's house, a friend of hers was doing a home fashion line and so they needed me to fill out their guest list.

I always dressed "loosely", like people who are taught to hide their ugly bodies do.

My sisters both started telling their friend to help me choose clothing to help my "fat hips" and so she gave me some things to put on. I had a 26" waist.

This friend of theirs had been there so many times she was part of the family. She did not think twice about the way they were treating me like a "fat" object.

But when I came out dressed in the clothes they picked, and she laughed and helped me pick some that fir, being in the "sales woman" role and not the "friend" role, her eyes were opened and she looked at me in the eyes, and I remember she was the one when I was a teenager who noticed that I wore sttrange girdles and freaked out, and she had believed them that I was "weird", never understood how I was punished if I didn't wear those things, but in that moment I think she understood.

She turned to my sister and said "*** is NOT fat! Why do you say she is?" then everyone laughed.

I was jogging every day. I had discovered in college that I am athletic, and I also had learned how important large-muscle exercise is for mental health. I also learned I do not have sugar cravings if I exercise.

My sister treated that as a horrible "habit", like I was sneaking out to bars or something. She managed to isolate the family from everyone who laughed at her and she joined my husband in abusing and interfering and stalking.

They were trying to kill me. Society does not want us to acknowledge that anorexic young women are women being killed by hostility to any strong woman, they do not start out wanting to be anorexic.

I was not a wanted child, my mother often joked that she thought I was menopause, and my sister had to look after me as a small child. I know that if abortion had been an option I would not have been born because my mother told me so, in spite of our Catholic faith.

I was young when she said that, and I am sure if she said it to me, she must have said worse to my teen-age sisters who saw me as that damn diaper burden they had to lug around.

They are killing my daughter out of revenge.

During that time I stayed there, going through my divorce, my sister's son was with some other high-school boys and they killed two other young men. These people came out of the wood-work to "help" her son avoid charges.

She insisted that I work with them. I had a good start in my career, thinking the divorce and family craziness was only a temporary derailment, like so many others. So many people survive crazy families, and joke about it, I saw myself as one who could do the same.

I broke free of them.

My daughter and I built a good life.

Then we were recontacted when an aunt died, and my sister used it as an excuse to destroy my life. She was still heavily involved with those people who showed up to "help" so many years ago.

We split off again and again, each time she found another way to get back.

The last time, two years ago, I thought my daughter as an adult was stronger and I encouraged her to get to know her grandfather. My father in his 90's pulled me aside and told me he understood. He promised to help my daughter. He sent me a birthday card that says "May your next 50 be better than your first 50 were."

It made up for all the times he didn't step in.

My sister pulled my daughter back in by inviting her to some private dinner after that and she is dying now.

My sister had threatened me at my dad's funeral, fearing that I might move back because my daughter chose to live in her region, and I think she feared my daughter's natural adult curiousity that would result in her recognizing who some of the locally prominent citizens are in our lives.

All we ever wanted was to be left alone. We did not intend to go after her and her friends, because we were not responsible for them. I had left, and I blocked them out of my life over and over.

I have to spend the day doing some artwork, even if it is junk, it is the only way to get past this because I will stop thinking while I work with color and shape.

Thank you for having a place I could post this.

January 14, 2006
6:56 pm
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zinnia
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bump

January 14, 2006
7:10 pm
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mj
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What kind of art are you doing? I love to be creative especially when I am trying to distract myself from the painful realities of life.

I am so sorry to read your post and hear your pain. I too know grief and wanted you to know that I care.

January 14, 2006
9:01 pm
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zinnia
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mj thank you.

Right now I am reworking a website. I took some photos and played with them in photoshop and made elements, and I am working on the pages and navigation.

I used to do oil paintings but I can't handle ti physically anmore. I want to do watercolours but I am still buying supplies when I can.

I still have pastels and charcoal. I have been talking with a friend about making small "artist trading cards".

What kind to you do?

January 14, 2006
9:03 pm
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zinnia
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was your grief from a child? do you want to talk, too?

January 14, 2006
10:33 pm
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zinnia
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bump

January 14, 2006
11:38 pm
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mamacinnamon
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Zinnia:

Just wanted you to know you are welcome here. (((((( HUGS )))))) to you. Just wanted you to know I care also.

January 15, 2006
2:06 am
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zinnia
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thank you, mamma.

For what it is worth, a few weeks ago when I first posted in this board I was clueless about where to turn. Since then I have found out where she is and how much help will cost: about $5,000. I am going through contacts with different kinds of help agencies & firms to find the right one and as far as the money is concerned, it will have to be a miracle.

But at least I have a "number" that I can aim for.

January 15, 2006
2:14 am
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depressionsucks78
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Zinnia, I read your first post, and I'm truly sorry for what you are going through.

I almost didn't post here, because I don't know what it's like to lose a child.

But my anxiety and grief are VERY real, and I wanted to tell you that I understand those feelings and what they mean. And I am SOOOO very sorry for your pain. No one deserves to be treated that way, as a child, or as an adult.

I continue to cry tonight, but now I will think of you, and the others here, and remember that, even though I am all alone physically, you guys know pain and suffering, just like I do.

Thank you, Zinnia, for helping me realize this!

January 15, 2006
11:03 am
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mj
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Good Morning,

I have a bachelor of science degree in Art emphasis in Photography. I use to have a Commercial Photography Studio. Now I just take photos with my digital camera and enjoy the art that is forever present in nature.
I like to decorate. Its instinctive. Color combinations, textures, and patterns are so numerous to combine and explore. I recently started to explore quilting as a creative outlet. My husband got involved and my desire is kind of fizzeling because it feels like a Have to instead of Want to. I like making floral arrangements.

Photo shop is way over my head. I don't really understand the concept of layering. I have never designed a web page. Is it difficult? I started a calendar and the software programs photos looked so much better than all my waterfall photos that I gave up on using my own.

I live in a picturesque area of ocean and trees. I have lots of photos on my computer and hanging in my home. My drive makes me want to do better than the last one.

A little history about myself. I was raised in a LDS family being the last of 6 children, 2 died shortly after birth. My mother was extremely violent and could be very loving. She always treated my siblings as one. If one got in trouble, we all did. She raged and beat us. I was continually on guard. My father was a workaholic. He was emotionally absent. My sister and I were sexually abused by my brothers. My parents divorced when I was 12. My father married his first cousin and my mom married an alcoholic immediately upon their divorce. My stepmother was an abuser as well. I lived 2 years with them because the abuse escalated in my mom's home and then changed to mental, verbal abuse in my fathers. I was thrown out at 16. I married at 5 months preg. at 17. My husband had his first affair within 6 mos. I had another daughter at age 19 and I divorced. During this time, my husband was a professional skier and did not financially provide and was gone most of the time. We divorced after 4 years. He got in a ski accident that nearly ended his life and I had to deal with a husband with a head injury, and two daughters. I could go on and on because my life has been filled with grief and anxiety as many others have experienced including yourself. I have learned many lessons in life. I am still learning. I am so sorry for your suffering. I understand your pain. It is real. Love to YOU

January 15, 2006
11:45 am
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mamacinnamon
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Zinnia:

Miracles DO happen every day. Keep your faith and hope. Always look at everything around you. Sometimes a miracle is just an arm's reach away, but it gets missed coz a person's eyes are not open and watching. I'll say a prayer for your miracle to happen. 🙂

January 15, 2006
12:01 pm
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zinnia
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You know, I can just go day by day.

Part of what hurts is the idea that if we have a good day, we have betrayed our loved ones. In my case there is still hope because if I can get some help to her, she may recover and have a long life ahead of her. That makes it harder, because I feel that burden if I stop thinking about it, but I know that in order to maintain my own strength, I have to.

I cannot talk to anyone about this because if I then appear cheerful about anything after they know what I am going through, there is more than a 50-50 chance they will decide I was not "real" and then the hostility can create problems.

There are too many who ask religious questions and see a problem like this as a "witnessing" opportunity. There are more and more churches that teach that a problem like this is demon-related. If I find solace in a church, I have to watch out for that among the other faithful even if the preacher doesn't promote it, and if I find solace elsewhere, some other belief-agenda motivates people to treat me as an opportunity for their own little recruitment drive.

January 15, 2006
12:19 pm
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mj
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I am trying to learn how to not live my life for appearances. I lost an uncle yesterday to cancer caused by absestos exposure. My father and he tore down a church together and were both exposed to it. I am learning that grief is a part of life. I can't change some things but I can choose my attitude every moment and not worry about how others may judge me. Some days, I fall back on old behaviors but today I have hope.

It is okay to be hopeful. I hope that you are able to find your daughter and help her. I love my daughters and their families immensely and it hurts me when they are hurting too.

January 15, 2006
4:05 pm
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zinnia
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Thank you, mj.
That must have been hard, losing your uncle that way. Was he sick a long time?

January 15, 2006
4:20 pm
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zinnia
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bump

January 15, 2006
4:46 pm
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mj
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Thanks for asking Zinnia. He was diagnosed with it approximately 5 mos. ago. Why it struck me so strangely at first was that my cousin said that our families had all been exposed to it. At first I was very angry because my parents had allowed me to crawl around on hard wood floors that contained asbestos. After discussing it with my brother and mother I learned that the hazardness of asbestos is a recent discovery of about 15 years. My cousin and I have been very close since the later 90's. He is a lot older than I. His brother always got all the attention being a prof. quarterback. I know how it feels to be in the position in a family where nothing you do to earn the families respect and love is ever good enough. You are always starved for the love of the family by caretaking in a position that never gets any caretaking. What I have found interesting with this association with my cousin is that being raised in similar families we have similiar traits. I think the world of him and know that he is brilliant person! He is very intelligent, has a great sense of humor, and loving. So I have watched the dynamics in his family and how he is there for them. So I hear that he has been taking care of his mom (my Aunt) who suffers from dementia and his father. My heart goes out to him because of all the pain dealing with his loss. He has offered his mom to come and live with them though she seems to want to live in the new home they had just built. Life is strange. I have been rambling on and I guess I needed to just feel my feelings more. Thanks for caring and asking.

January 15, 2006
10:19 pm
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zinnia
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I lost my parents almost 2 years apart. They both lived long lives and went rather quickly, although my mother was in a lot of pain for a few weeks before dying in a surgery she knew had very little chance of succeeding.

I have a lot of mixed-up feelings about them. I was close to my dad, but he had looked the other way for a long time when my mother abused all of us, except my eldest sister.

I was only able to forgive her after she died. Sometimes I still feel angry over the damage her abuse did to all of us, and to our ability to relate. But I am not longer angry at her, I am angry at the helplessness of human beings. How can we possibly be what we think we are supposed to be when everything seems stacked against us?

My grief for my mother is really grief for helplessness. I did not love her. My dad seemed to spend a lot of time just thinking things over in his old age and he told me so much in our last visits.

My grief for him is really for him. I loved him. I was angry at him many times for not protecting us, but in his old age we talked and I could see that if he had understood what he was seeing, he would have done more. And he did try. He did take my brother and me with him whenever he was not at work, and we hung out with him and his buddies in all kinds of places other kids did not go.

Once he woke us up in the middle of the night because the Aurora Borealis was showing and he was coming in from his night shift. I will never forget us being in the middle of the street in our pajamas with all the houses dark and him pointing to the clear space between the buildings so we could see it. Huge curtains of shimmering lights!

January 16, 2006
1:25 am
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camra
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zinnia, yes I did sirvie anorixia, when I was a teen back in the late 70ties and earily 80ties I decided to go on a diet, so I stoped eating. Luckly for me I had friends who refused to accept what I was doing to myself. Back then I was a catholic and being good doing what GOD wanted me to do was very important to me, So my friends convinced me that not eating was a sin and purgering was sin because it was destroying my body and I didn't have a right to do that,,

They told me I would go to hell..

Well hey thats all I needed to hear so I quit doing that.

I have battled it a few other times in my younger life too, but managed to get control again.

I now know that my friends were telling me the truth of course because it is true, that your body is like a tempo and you can not destory it ...

Anyway thats what worked for me..

camra

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