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Why can't I let go
July 5, 2002
1:34 am
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tripleshy
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I'm a 43 yr old woman who has lost her mind. 4years ago I met what I thought was the perfect man for me. We dated only 4 months and got married. Everyone keep telling me before the wedding that there was something that just wasnt right about him. He is a musician and well no disrespect but they are strange creatures anyway. Sex was not an issue before we got married. I soon became one. He would only touch me if he had to. Thats what he actually stated to me. 12 times a year maybe. They were only attempts. He couldn't maintain an errection. We just didn't even think about it. Three months after we got married is when it seemed all the trouble started. He would stay up late at night while I went to bed. He said he was playing vido games later I found out what he was really doing. Going to the bondage sites on the computer and oh yeah f'ing the girl that lived next door. I came in the house one day to find him tied up in the middle of the living room floor. I was scared to death. I noticed he had an errection. I took the ropes and tape off him and he got mad at me. I also noticed he was drinking 3-6 six packs of home brewed a night and functioning better than I was as a non drinker. I talked him into going to counciling with me. He went and lied the entire time about everything. The councilor got down on one knee took my hand and asked me to leave him stating that Mike(my suposed to be husband) was a social path alcoholic, sex addict with the mentality of about a 17 yr old boy. It was if we were living in two different worlds. I found a house for us to buy thinking that it would get him away from his other woman and give us a chance. The lies continued I cought them together at his work and hers. He even started seeing two other women during that time. All the lies, he would watch me cry me eyes out and laugh and go to bed. He would tell me I'm crazy or why dont I do like his mother and close my eyes and everything would be just fine. All the problems were my fault. I ended up leaving for a year. Financially I couldnt make it be cause I had put his name on everything(credit cards-bank-car etc.) He had gone through 10,000.00 in my savings charged up all my credit cards to the max , sold my car. All of it was in my name. I have no family (deceased). I have wonderful friends whom had distanced themselves from me because of mike. I went home. It was wonderful! I could for the first time see how he managed to do the things he did and how I had let him. I now have NO blinders on I see him completely.(so I thought). He told me he want to try again. He has shown me that he is trying to be open and honest. We began fighting over the smell of purfume on his body when he came home from work on day, then the phone calls from what sounded like little girl asking for michael which NO body calls him unless he is intimate with them. Then the computer yes oh yes the computer. The bondage sites. This man spends from the time he gets up to the time he goes to bed on the computer. He's a checker with the ILA - like a long shoreman counts frieght as it is load or taken off a ship. He works maybe one to three days a week. Gives him plenty of time for his love (himself). Anyway I found my self back under his control once again. I checked his computer the other day when he was at work and was suprised to find along with the bondage pictures of woman a picture of a man from the chest up with no shirt. I confronted him with what I had found and as usual he got mad at me calling me all kinds of name. And as usuall he stated it wasnt there then he stated he had no idea how it got there. This time during the arguement he drew back to hit me and stated it wasn't beyond him to slap the.... out of me. I didn't show him any fear. I simply told him to go ahead. That he wouldn't get away with it like he manages to do with everything else. Its like he gives me a break and then something else comes up. I am so tired of tring. It is now taking a toll on my health I have started having heart problems. Not major ones but stress related problems. Help Me Someone Why Cant I just let go? I would have let go in the begining if he had been anyone else. What is it that keeps me chained to this man? I truely love him on the right hand and completely HATE him on the left. How can one person be so messed up? I'm refering to me? Has anyone in here ever gone through this? Am I the only one?

July 5, 2002
3:36 am
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silence
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Lucky for you that you are not alone... especially on this site. I'm a guy with completely different problems, so you probably won't hear much from me. But the others should be here tomorrow morning with mounds of advice. Welcome aboard.

July 5, 2002
10:04 am
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Cici
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If your husband's therapists got on one knee and begged you to leave your husband, that would set off big, red flashing lights in my head. I disagree with Blondie, though - Antisocial Personality Disorder is much more serious than Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

http://www.flash.net/~sculwell.....hology.htm

http://www.geocities.com/ptype.....ialpd.html

http://www.psyweb.com/Mdisord/anpd.html

I worked with violent male criminals in a forensic mental hospital (that means, all the men there were sentanced to treatment by the courts). Most psychologists and psychiatrists agree that Antisocial personality disorder is nearly IMPOSSIBLE TO TREAT. No medication, talk therapy, behavioristic aversion therapy, has been shown to put a dent in this disorder.

No one, not a licensed mental health counselor or a psychiatrist, will be able to tell you why you can't leave. That is in your own mind and it is your own choice.

In some ways I think I was lucky to be raped when I was very young. It has made me hypersensitive to these kinds of men, and extremely protective of myself. I can spot these types sometimes by even looking at them, and defiantely after speaking with them.

So what's up? Why do you think you stay with him? What benefit do you get? I always tell my husband that I have to have a reason to believe that he is working on personal growth because I refuse to stay with anyone who accepts the status quo. I have to have concrete proof. Where is your proof that he is doing anything but self-destructing and destroying you and your self-esteem in the process?

July 5, 2002
12:09 pm
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gingerleigh
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Hey Tripleshy, why can't you let go? I can understand it... I'm not saying that this man is good or that he deserves you or that you deserve him. Quite the opposite, I think this guy is one twisted f*ck. But I can understand... you're family is all gone, really gone. Your friends have distanced themselves from you, and you have no one. Most humans can't live isolated like that, and human instinct is to cling even to the sick and twisted rather than be alone. It's NATURAL.

That said, you are human, and conscious, and have the power to rise above programming, and this will be so hard. Others here have much sounder advice on exactly HOW to get out, and you should take it very very seriously. I just wanted to address the question on your thread title, "Why can't I let go?"

What are you thinking now?

July 5, 2002
1:06 pm
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tripleshy
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Thank you all for answering me.
Blondie, When I left him for that year I did close everything with his name on it. But it has ruined my credit now. I did open two card accounts in my name only for emergencies.
Blondie, I didn't mean any insults about the musicians coment. Mike is a true musician he write sings plays anytype of instrument. He has had three record contracts and he said it was his band being strung out on cocain that kept them from fullfilling their dreams. Now the only thing he does is goes to a friends house and they play and write music. He sounds naturally better than the artist that are out there now. He is now around here by everyone who likes music.
When I came back to the house. Mike said he felt bad about my car so he bought me a 95 Ford to replace the new car he sold.
I have paid off in this year over 20,000.00 in bills and still have two more not as much to pay before my paychecks are free to use.
I did not bring anything except my clothes back into the house because I was determined that I was leaving as soon as these bills were paid. I'm not sure if I serious or fooling myself. Everytime I start to walk out the door he starts the same old thing about how much he loves me and that I haven't given him a chance and worst of all how I have treated him. Always tracking him in everything he does. He has twice since we have been married told me I was right in the things I've accused him of. He was drunk and knew I was leaving. The next day it would go back into the denile stage. I have been controlling with him this I know. I told him that a felt like his mother if I didn't watch him he would get into something just like a little kid.

Cici, I don't get anything from him at all. Even on holidays its always I'm going to moms. No cards no gifts no anything. He pays all the house bills right now about time I paid everything for the first 3 years. I truely don't know why I stay. Sometimes when I look at him I see a little boy hurting inside. Other times I look at him I see Satin's son himself. The first time I saw the bondage (Him on the livenroom floor tied up ) I cried. It honestly broke my heart. The look on his face and his eyes. Pain - his eyes were saying help. (Yet he had an errection as hard as the floor. Which even according to his old girlfriends he couldn't get with them.) After the arguement about me letting him go, He was drunk and came down the stairs with his hands behind his back. This was a face I had never seen before. His face (plz believe me) was not mikes. It was that of a 5 yr old little boy. He was trying to explain he was doing the best he could do. The whole time he was talking,I really felt threatened by what was behind his back. There wasn't anything except his hands but this was not the man I knew at all. One other time I saw a different person was when we went to dinner with his family 1st time in 4 years. Everyone was plastered and he met me out side the bathroom and treated me like a pick up in a bar. He was so very smooth. He made sure that his enabling family did not like me at all I dont know what he has told them. But I heard his mom one day tellling him, To be kind that I must have a mental problem. She knows he would never do any of the things I accuse him of. My birthday was in May. He asked what I wanted for it. I replied a pair of sandles. We went to target-his choice. As we walked in the door there was a young blonde(all his bondage is blondes by the way)about 24-25 nice looking pretty girl. He insisted we stop and look at some tops. It just happened to be at the same rack that she was standing at. When she walked away, We went to the shoe isle. She walked by looking on the next isle and guess what mike walked over there stating that he would check for sandles there for me. I walked around there and she was bent over putting on a high heal. Who was behind her rubbing his croutch, You got it. I took him by the hand and advised him the sandles were all on the other isle. He was pissed. He jerked my hand and said lets go. Doing the usual lets show the world I love you and I ll put my arm around you while we walk back to the car. Yes I do get something out of this! Heartache! Headache! and lots of Lessons!

Gingerleigh, Thank you so much for understanding the human side of this.

Thank you all for the suggestions for the book and for me.
Has anyone gone through this?

July 5, 2002
2:14 pm
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gingerleigh
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My experience fortunately for me was not as extreme as yours. My ex had some attractions to sexual practices that I found disgusting. Lots and lots of online porn, young girls, horses, bondage, you name it. He stopped sleeping with me, claiming he was depressed, would stay up all hours, never come to bed, just told me he didn't know what was wrong. The only time we even talked about sex was to surf the classifieds looking for swinger couples. He even posted an ad for "us", and posted as the female, me, saying that I was the one who wanted to reach out and experiment. I never said no, but never said yes either, if that makes any sense. Just sort of passively let it slide and hoped that nothing would come of it. I would ask him to come upstairs, and he would say "in a few minutes", and 2 hours later I would come back down and he would be jacking off to porn on TV. He insisted that I was the crazy one and that I needed counseling, not him, and so when I got it and started to see more clearly and realized that he was sick, crazy sick, he said that counseling was making me crazier, and then said that it was me who was making him crazy and sick. There was no way out of that trap for me, it took me to the point of wondering if the sky was really blue and if I was actually seeing what I thought I was, really questioning whether or not I was insane for me to know that something had to change. And I called a crisis line, and so began my crawl out of the hole. I had to leave him. He would not leave me. He forced *me* to end the relationship with his behavior. I hated myself when I was with him. I hated him when I was with him. I found myself wanting to physically harm him, maybe even kill him. And I couldn't get away on my own, I was so dependent, isolated from my family with no friends in a new city. I had to get outside help, and I was shocked with how quickly I was able to tap into my own strength. Once I tapped into the anger and figured out how to channel it, with every angry flood of feelings, I made another step. *WHOOSH OF ANGER* "Hello Apartment Complex? Do you have any one bedrooms coming available? I need one." *WHOOSH* "Hello Visa? I need to cancel my card." *WHOOSH* "Hello AT&T? I need to transfer my service to a new address." *WHOOSH* "Hello Attourney?" You get the idea. In retrospect, the actual leaving stuff was easy, time consuming, but not difficult. The hardest thing was accepting that he would never ever change and that it was up to me to make things better in my life, and that my life could not possibly include him.

Boy it hurt though, and it still hurts sometimes when I think about it, even though I am feeling healthier and more grounded than I ever have (despite my rants on other threads). I don't know if the shame and embarassment I feel for having allowed his filth into my life will ever go away completely, but it does lessen a little each day, and I am thankful for the lessons that I learned about people and about myself and about what I will and will not tolerate in my relationships.

Please please please take the advice of your therapist and start making your getaway plans. This man is dangerous, he could very well hurt you. YOu said you were scared of what he might have behind his back. Trust those instincts, they are very rarely wrong.

July 5, 2002
2:29 pm
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Cici
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Ginger - that's what boys do. It's funny uyou say he made you leave him because I always tell my friends this when they come to me with man troubles. Teenaged boys especially (or men with that mentality) don't break up with girls - they just make things so intolerable for the women that the women do the breaking up for them. I call them boys because that's what they are and how they act. A real man steps up to the plate and does his own dirty work.

Ginger is right. Blondie and another regular wisewoman (er) poster (ha ha) have experienced sexual violence, so they might be able to help me with this input. Once you've had it done to you, you are hypersensitive to men like that. It's a survival thing - so it doesn't happen again. I was raped twice, in incidents 7 years apart - and BOTH TIMES the alarm bells went off in my head long before they actually violated my body.

Your description of this man is making the alarm bells go off in my head. Most of the time I'm very straightforward and pro-active (hey, some call me bossy, ha ha). But when I meet men like that, I slink away and try not to attract their notice. If I met your man, I'd probably do the same thing.

A friend of mine had a husband like this and I would never even have a conversation with him. I rejected him completely on instinct alone, and I'm glad.

I can see from how you describe his music that you secretly care about him. Don't. It's a trap. Listen to ginger.

July 5, 2002
8:13 pm
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tripleshy
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I just got off his computer. I found stories of young girls having sex (bondage) sex with their stepfathers. No pictures. One that I cant get out of my head...I had to stop reading it. I couldn't see anymore anyway through the tears. It start with describing a boy bound face down. I just couldn't continue. My God WHAT IS HE? PICTURES OF MEN LITTLE KIDS BONDAGE AND THE FIRST ONE WAS OF A WOMAN BOUND BEING BEATEN. I HAVE TWO MORE SMALL BILLS TO PAY AND I AM OUT OF HERE. He just w

July 5, 2002
10:04 pm
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Cici
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Blondie that sounds like an old Aesops fable I remembered!

Once there was a turtle who wanted to swim across a river. By the side of the river was a scorpion, looking towards the other shore. The turtle stepped into the water and the scorpion called out, "Wait! May I ride across the river on your head? I cannot swim."

The turtle laughed, "Why would I let a poisonous creature like yourself onto my head! That would be madness!"

The scorpion replied, "But, if I sting you as you're swimming, we will both die! I promise not to sting you if you help me just this once."

The turtle was reluctant but finally agreed. When he was halfway through the river, the scorpion stung him on his head. As the turtle was drowning he cried, "Why did you sting me? You promised not to, and now we both will die!"

The scorpion replied, "It is my nature to kill." And they drowned together.

July 5, 2002
10:07 pm
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Cici
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Tripleshy, I was talking to my husband about your situation and he had an interesting take on it, one from a male perspective and different from ours.

He said that your husband chose to not include you in part of his life that obviously takes up much time (regardless of its morality). In a way, that must mean he uses you specifically to gratify one thing (obviously not sex).

My husband thought that maybe your husband was using you as a mother figure, a maternal caregiver that would tolerate his sexual fetish but not take part in it. He sees his objects of sexual desire as dirty and will only associate them with sex. He won't associate you with sex because you have become his enabler - his mommy.

But not only is this his view of you, you chose to be a silent partner in his bizarre game. Why do you subject yourself to this? A woman should be treated as, and feel, like a woman.

July 6, 2002
12:03 pm
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gingerleigh
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Run run run run run!!!

July 6, 2002
4:21 pm
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tripleshy
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I just got home from work and he's not here. Thank God. So I can talk.

I Thank You Ladies for your help and Cici I think your husbands right about that. I'm 5 years old than he is and the career I'm in.. How much safer can you get? The doctor stated that I was a cover for him...so he could seem normal to everyone.

I'm not going to stay in this relationship,But I just cant leave until the two bills are paid.

I'm totally numb right now. It is a calm feeling and hard to explain. I have not had calm in 4 years. I feel some how relieved. Like, for the first time it really isn't me. He always told me it was because I wasn't woman enough.

Will he continue to go down the same path until he bottoms out? With someone like this what ends up happening to them?

July 7, 2002
12:15 pm
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tripleshy
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He has trashed the inside of his computer stating that he is going to get another one. He has swore to me that he will never go back on those sites again. We never eat together and he knows that it means alot to me and now he stated he was waiting for me to get home before he eats. "I dont want to eat with out you" is what he told me. He is putting his arms around me and telling me how much he loves me and doesn't want to lose me. I know hes f......with my mind trying to draw me back. we have not discussed any of the things that have been found since the argument. He has said NOTHING at all. Why wont he at least try to explain some of it. I dont want to be drown back to him. I'm sick of being lied too all the time about everything. I would give anything if these bills were paid so I couldleave and never talk to him again. Not talking to him is the only way to keep from being sucked back in.

Blondie, You scared me. I am so glad you are ok. You seem like the nicest person and the wisest one. I wish I had your strength.

I dont know much about the issues on this chat so please excuse me from not giving advise. I dont feel that I'm in any shape right now to give advise when I cant help me. I'm emotionally and phsyically drained. But none the less , I know in my heart and soul that you are one of Gods children that has been bless with the gift to help others. And you act as such for everyone here on this line, We all love you for who and what you are.

As for me I'll either do as I said I would in a few months after the bills are paid or I'll just give up all together because the life of work come home go to bed and do it all over again with out talking to or being with any other human is not worth living. He controls the tv the computer, shower, eat and even when I go to bed. So you see it truely isn't worth it.

July 7, 2002
1:18 pm
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Ladeska
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I'm reading this, shaking my head....two bills, huh? Two bills are worth all this? I don't think so and I think it is an excuse you are using. You are allowing this man to do what he is doing, thus you are apart of this darkness. If you really want to be gone, then you need to be gone and let the chips fall where they may. You see, when someone is really done, they don't wait for bills to be paid, they don't allow another person of this vile caliber to dictate jack shit to them, they just leave, right then, right there. But, you're not doing that and now you're talking of suicide? Um no, this isn't about you being the victim here as much as it's about your willingness to stay in this torture. You've got a good mind, use it.

You've been dancing way too long with this man, have way too much information about exactly who he is and yet - you stay. No one is tying your hands here and yet - you profess to be the one in the most bondage. I don't think so, it is a willing choice on your part. What do you get out of this whole thing, what nasty little things go off in your own head that tells you - you deserve this kind of treatment? You can find that out in time, but right now - you don't stand around and play games with the viper, you get the hell away from it and then - you can work on yourself as to why you do this and that.

You're going down the tube here and the only one that can save you - is yourself and you have got to get away from the trance and the spell that this man casts over you. He just sucks more and more of your energy away from you. If you have any pissy stuff left inside of you - you'd better use it as one big gust of wind - to blow this popsicle stand and everything and everyone in it and never look back.

The longer you stay in this and the more you find this and that reason to stay - the more it is apparent that - you are in this "with him" and what you hate and despise - you are becoming. Dare to have a different picture of yourself because as long as you stay in close proximity to this freak - he will do nothing but steal your life away. Pack a bag, get your purse and your keys and get the hell away from this man. The only help that anyone on this site can give you is a big sign that says - You Have a Choice.

No gray areas here and no time for one more dance....make your decision and move on it.

July 7, 2002
3:47 pm
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sicknsubtle
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Tripleshy, Hello There.
I understand the need to know if he will be okay. I know what it is like to have to let go. It is scarey because we don't know what will happen, not for us and not for him. Trust me, what happens to you is more important for you to be concerned with. You can't save him from himself. You can't make him see what he refuses to see. Don't even hope that he will see after you leave him, that will only keep you involved with what happens to him instead of involved in whats happening to you. I am right now in the midst of change, it has been two weeks since I told him to leave, and he did. I see now after 4 years that he is not going to change and nothing I do or don't do is going to change him. The only thing that helps me with what he is going through is I pray for him. That is all I can do. God is in charge of that man's life not me. I only have power over myself. Today I am worthy of good things and good people. I pray you feel worthy of goodness too! There is peace in making good decisions for ourselves. Trust you can and you will. Forget the bills they aren't going anywhere, save your sanity and self, that is more important than anything else, you are worth it! We all are!
Take care. Be Safe! SS

July 7, 2002
6:22 pm
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irishlass
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There are many reasons why a woman stays. Only she knows. Not until there is a clarifying moment for her to leave... will she. I understand. There is nothing I can say to you right now that will make any difference, although I raised my eyebrows more than a few times when I read you post. My inner moment was when I realized I kept putting my shoes by the door, so I could make a fast get-a-way with me and my daughter. That was it. I said three strikes and you are out. I want to take my baby home. He paid for my ticket. Of course, not without a heart wrenching scenario, please give me another chance. He didn't understand, I was cold. He was so controlling he didn't want me to work, the amazing part was I didn't for a while...but you know as long as the insanity is temporary...but if it goes on , you need more help than we can provide you on this thread as mere humans. Namaste.

July 7, 2002
6:49 pm
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Jadedragon
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Stop making excuses for him and YOURSELF. Been there. It works both ways. You justify to yourself why he does the crap he does, but then you stay. NO GOOD. It eats you alive.
I still care about him, BUT.... forget it. It hurts like hell. But it was 100X worse the other way. REMEMBER THAT!!! YOu feel lonely, but its not real. Its your heart playing tricks. It fogot how to feel real love, and will accept this Piss poor substitiute becasue your own self esteem is SOoooo LOW. Money can be a problem, but HIS problems are MUCH worse. Where there is a WILL there IS a WAY. Make your plan and STICK TO IT. Good luck.

July 8, 2002
11:29 am
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gingerleigh
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Two bills? What are they? Call the phone number, find out what the balance is (they will know), cancel the service immediately, and then work out the payment arrangements. Either send them a check or work out a payment plan.

Bill paying won't work as an excuse with this bunch, sweetie, because we've all been there and played this game. "I'll just stay until the least is up. I'll just stay until I get this month's bills cleared out so that he won't have to deal with them... since I'm leaving him already, I certainly don't want to add to his pain by leaving him financially and administratively strapped..." the list can go on and on.

You wish you could leave and never talk to him again. News flash... YOU CAN. You just need to make the choice. If you need a kick in the seat every once in a while, conjure up that image of him tied up on the living room floor with a hard on and pain in his eyes. You really want to be stuck and enmired in that??? You CAN leave. I don't care how big those 2 bills look. Is this worth $100? $1000? $10000? If you had a daughter, would you want her living with that? And if not, why would you allow yourself to live in that?

July 8, 2002
11:32 am
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Cici
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Bills? Cut your loses. We have to give a part of ourselves to be free.

Anyway, why wouldn't he try to preserve the relationship with his validating Mommy? Maybe he was abandoned or abused by his real mother so he values the mothering you do for him.

No woman should suffer in silence. Ever. If you are suffering in silence, you have the option of getting out!

Think about this - when you have a bandage on, it hurts to rip it off, but if you don't the wound underneath may get infected. Don't let your wounded soul become infected because you fear the pain of ripping off the bandage.

Stay strong!

July 8, 2002
2:20 pm
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silence
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She's right. No woman should suffer in me... Hey wait a sec.

July 8, 2002
7:03 pm
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Jadedragon
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Jade follows Blondie, with a bat. Just to make sure....
THEN unleashes the DOGS.
have a great morning silence....;-)

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