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Trapped - by myself! (caught between 2 lovers)
August 17, 2000
8:05 am
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blueeyes
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I have an ex-husband (whom I still love) and a boyfriend who I love. I crave to be alone though. I have got to the stage where I don't want my b/f to touch me even. Everything he says to me is annoying. All the things that I fell in love with about him, irritate me. I feel that he undermines me all the time. Back in February he rang me from his mobile phone and left a message on my ansafone. The message was just that he was still out delivering in his van and would call me later.

He didn't switch his mobile off properly and it was still online, on my ansafone. At the end of his (known) message he said goodbye and then all you got was the noise of traffice for about 30 seconds. Then IT started. A torrent of abuse. I thought he was swearing at other drivers but then he was talking like it was a conversation. He was talking to me in his head. (but out aloud). He was very abusive towards me. He said I was just like my mother, selfish etc. etc. I couldn't believe it. It suddenly went dead. I phoned my ansafone again and it was still there so I taped it to play back to him.

Later on that day he came round to see me. He had no idea that I had heard this diatribe about me. I went into a blind rage. He went home crying/confused. I played him the tape and he said that he didn't mean any of it. That it was just his way of venting his feelings. Out aloud, to himself.

We managed to get back into a relationship after that but I've never been the same with him since. I don't trust him and have no confidence in our relationship. I don't have much self confidence at the moment either. Which I did before.

What to do, what to think, I don't know.
I feel like saying it's the end and goodbye. Just to have some time alone. Does anyone else get afraid of saying, it's over?

August 17, 2000
4:16 pm
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Jaskid
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blueeyes,
It does not seem like it's over with your ex-husband. If there is a part of you who is still holding on to him, maybe that is telling you something, I think first you have to work out those feelings. Is there a chance for reconciliation with your ex?
๐Ÿ™‚ Jaskid

August 17, 2000
6:53 pm
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Molly
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yea you get scared to end things, but this sounds like a good thing to end. I would spend some time alone, write, write write, your thoughts, goals, who you think you are, what you want out of life, and then I would consider the ex, if you figure out what you want, why did you divorce? do you have children? But I would not approach him, or anyone else until you discover what you want, and a good counselor might be in order. It usually takes about 2 years to go through the process. Women with low self esteem usually seek a man for validation, some of us learn the hard way. If that is the case perhaps for you, then if you do work on your self, and do some growing, and glowing, your ex-might not be up to the new improved you.

August 18, 2000
8:55 am
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blueeyes
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I am seeing a counsellor and have been for quite a few years. My ex does want us to get back together. The thing that molly mentioned does frighten me. Will he be up to the new improved me?
I see things in him that I want to change. But we shouldn't spend all our time trying to change eachother should we.

If I sleep with my boyfriend in the same bed, I don't like it when he moves next to me or tries to touch me.

The thing is, I don't get passionate feelings when I'm in the same room as my ex. I'm not sure if this is because I'm still involved with my boyfriend and somewhere inside i'd feel like i was betraying him. Or do I really not feel passionate about my ex?

I understand that male validation thing. I think that is why I so desperately need to be alone. I'd like that time to work out if I do want to be with my ex. I'm just soooo scared of finding out that I don't want my ex and that what I am going through with my b/f is just a bad patch.

It's so confusing. My ex knows how I feel and is putting pressure on me to make a move. Ever since we seperated 5 years ago, he's wanted me back and hasn't been with anyone else.

Also, many of my close friends are having babies at the moment, I'm 31 and I feel my biological clock ticking. I want a baby too. My little boy is 6 now. I conceived 3.5 years ago with my b/f but I had a termination because it didn't feel like the right time. I wasn't yet fully divorced and I was confused. It was tragic for me, bacuase I'm so maternal yet it felt so wrong. I feel strongly that I want to have a child with my ex as he's the father of my son. My therapist thinks that when I think of the love I feel for my son, I also think of my ex and mix them up together. As in, my son and my husband are one in my emotions. She feels that if I can seperate the two I'll have a clearer picture of whether I want to be with my ex or not. He is a very caring person. His love for me feels so non judgemental whereas my b/f constantly judges me.

I hope I'm not looking for a father figure?

August 18, 2000
12:18 pm
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blueeyes,

I think you should try and work it out with your ex. For you and your son. God brought you two together for a reason. I know a lot has happened, but your husband seems like he genuinely loves and forgives you. If he does not judge you, he loves you for who you are. As far as passion, it can be found again...with effort!
Did the two of you ever go to couselling together before you split up? As far as your boyfriend, I am sure he is torn if he knows you still have feelings for your ex. He knows that he can't compete with him because you and your ex will always have a special bond, which is your son. Be honest with your boyfriend, but most of all be honest with yourself....what is your gutt telling you too do?
๐Ÿ™‚ Jaskid

August 18, 2000
12:37 pm
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Molly
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The boy friend is out of there!!!! Since you are confused. I agree that if the ex fathered the 6 year old, and because you made a committment, that should be where the focus is. Marriage is hard, the lust fades and comes back. When I decided to reconcille with my ex, there was no passion, in fact it was flat dead flat, but it was like putting on a pair of old favorite shoes. The passion returns, but it is different. Don't expect fire works for a while, that is what you get with a boyfriend, and why we usually get burned. Another child until you have your head straight, would be planned child abuse. How can you emotionally be there for the baby, or even your 6 year old if you are not there for you? Take some time ALONE, connect with the 6 year old, It sounds like he could be falling through the cracks through all of mom's confusion. I can guarentee, that when that boy reaches 13-16 he will act out in any way he can to get close to dad, so be prepared for that , and I would hope that it influences your direction. I have watched so many families struggle after divorce, the fantasy, so be burdened with way to many dynamics. So if the dad, the ex is not evil, take the easy way, the right way, keep the family together, you cannot possibly conceive of the problems that will show in your child, children in about 10 years. Get help, go together, and seperate, again, figure out what YOU want, not who you want. Figure out the picture of the life you hope to achieve.

August 21, 2000
7:19 am
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blueeyes
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Thanks everyone for your words. I feel that I must just say, to Molly, that the one thing that my ex and I made sure of is that our son comes first. We don't argue in front of him, he has been told what is going on all the way through. He gets love from everyone, we have a large support network of family and friends as well as the love that we both give him. I always put him first, which is why, when I divorced my husband and moved into a flat on our own, I refused to have my boyfriend stay over when my son was there. It caused friction between us but I wanted to bond with my son alone, before introducing anyone else into the equation. I stuck to my guns for 1.5 years and I think I did the right thing. He knows that he comes first. I had already been getting therapy at the time so I had help from my therapist as far as my son goes. I think that my son has come out of the situation very well. I'm sure he'll have some leftovers from the situation, what I don't want to do is to take him back into a situation with his father and myself and then out again. Also, he gets on very well with my b/f, they love eachother and it shows. I want them to be friends whatever happens. It's alot to expect, but when the dust settles, if we do break up, I'd like them to still see eachother. So far my son has seen that adults can still be friends after a breakup. It's been difficult but worth it for his sake. There's no way in which I'd say that he has fallen through any cracks!
I do understand about the leaning what I want and not who I want bit!
Thanks for that.
I'm still scared, but I think I'm in the right state of mind to do something about it now!

August 21, 2000
11:47 am
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Molly
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One of the mistakes that I made is that the girls thought they always came first. Life is not like that , not to say that your son won't be ok with this lesson, its just that in my own life, and observing others who divorced, listening to the children,many children, there is pain, confusion, and consequences no matter how hard you try to do the right thing, It just is not right to break up a family, then break up friendships, we always have said in general that children are so resiliant, I think it is a pile of excuse, that statement, work with the kids, and listen, look at America today, with the angry children, the scape goats of a decade of divorce. My therapist, confessed that she had done all her therapist had advised while she went through her divorce, that was 18 years ago, recently she has discovered that her daughter has an eating disorder, and her son has been in and out of rehab for drugs.it didn't hit them till they were in the 30's so even with the best of support systems, and intentions, this divorce thing has lots of unseen and unexpected consequences, seems that no matter how hard we try to look out for the interests of the kids, there is damage when the primary foundation for their growth and development is undermined.

August 21, 2000
6:14 pm
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blueeyes
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Sounds like you're being pretty down on me, although i'm sure it's not personal. i feel the same way generally, I'm apalled that more people don't seem to `try' at their relationships. I can only do my `best' and that has to be good enough. I can only trust that i will do my level best for my son. If I don't even trust that I am doing my best, what hope is there for me. I have to believe in that surely! I can't go through this whole thing thinking, whatever happens I've ruined my sons life. I know that I'm better than that. I'm not a loser and I don't give up that easily. I strived and strived to save my marriage. I think there has to come a point where you ask yourself, how much longer do I go on being treated like this, am I worth more? Of course my answer was yes, I am worth more and I did something about it. I think that during the last 5/6 years I've done that much growing that i can see the pitfalls and I've learnt from it. I think if I hadn't, my son would have a big problem because hismother would keep going through the same old crap. Well my son has seen me grow and change for the better and he's seen me striving at my job and to learn a new career. I'm always there for him and i think he's doing very well. This may sound defense, I guess I am being. It's hard on the pc, you don't know me and I don't know in what tone of voice you are speaking when you reply. You sounded pretty much like you're preaching to me though. Forgive me please if I'm wrong.
I have, just this evening, broken up with my boyfriend. It's a tense time for me. My son is at his father's house so he has not been caught up in it. I'm sure he'll sense something, and when it's all been sorted out I'll tell him about it.
sorry, I'm rambling.
x

August 21, 2000
10:19 pm
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blueeyes,

You will work through it...you sound like you love your son very much. I have four girls and am due with my fifth, I hope it's a boy. Anyway, how did your boyfriend take it? I think you definitely need some time alone to sort out everything. My prayers are with you,

:)Jaskid

August 22, 2000
5:09 am
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blueeyes
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We started out with a planned discussion. I asked him to write his Needs down on paper and i would do the same. For a couple of days he didn't do it, then when he did do it, he left the piece of paper at home! He sat down and wrote a few things down when he got to me. (he was obviously very dubious that it would help.) I'm afraid it turned into a bit of a witch hunt. He said that he was feeling very criticised. The thing is that he may not have known it but he was talking to me (hounding me) in the manner of a father talking to a child. My defenses were high and I probably reacted the way a child would. (I didn't shout or cry) I know that what I was saying was real.

We got to the point where he said something that I feel is untrue and unfair. I told him that and told him my version of events. He then started with the shouting and talking over the top of me. When I'm being spoken to like that I shut up and stare into space. I glaze over and just shut off completely.

He charged out and just said it's over. We both know it.
I feel like I'm drowning today. I get glimpses of the sun and bits of fresh air, but generally, i'm drowning.

I'm at work believe it or not. There's hardly anything to do here. God help me make it through the day.
Keep praying Jaskid and thanks.

August 22, 2000
12:10 pm
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Jaskid
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blueeyes,

I get the same exact way when my husband treats me like one of his kids...I start acting like one of his kids....We have struggled with this issue for years and years, I knew what I was marrying...a very strong willed man who needs to be in control. I think he feels like, since I never really had a strong father figure He has to be my father....I tell him get over it Baby!
I need a Husband, Lover, and especially Friend....not Daddy! Sometimes I let him just feel good by taking control(Boost his ego)But when he crosses the line he definitely knows it and backs off. See men need to feel appreciated and needed, they love thinking that somehow they have a part in holding us together. I am learning that the more secure I feel about myself the more the little crap does not bother me. When your inner being is at peace and feels joy...Who can touch you?
๐Ÿ™‚ Jaskid

August 22, 2000
12:44 pm
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Molly
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My comments were I guess fear based, seeing so much tragedy with the children today, I guess I have just seen so many people make choices and ignorate of the potential consequences, my self included, that I felt compelled to point it out. Not evil, not negligent, just unaware. Many of the adults that I have known, now have children in the 20's and 30's and for so long every one spoke of the resilliancy of children that we now know were not so resilliant. The problems caused by divorce that were never apparent while all were living through the process. Even one family that were only divorced for 5 years, then reconcilled, you would think that it had an Ozzie and Harriet ending, but the seperation happened while the kids were 7-9/12-14. My sis, divorced but the husband still lives at home, her kids are 17& 20 I guess due to the fact that they are not as one with the division of parenting the kids are in controll, and that is a mess. Just a couple of examples of no matter what we try to do, something goes ca--plunk.
Its true, on this line we only get a glimpse of the person, as well as the circumstances. For all I know Jeffery Dalhmer was a good person except for his eating habits, and your ex could be the same. Unfortunately there is nothing to go on but your intuition, and the only choices that you make are the only choices that you could make at the time. I am sure you are doing the very best that you can, and you sound committed. What else could any one ask for. It is hard, it is scarey, it is a lonely path. But I also know God never gives us more than we can handle.

August 23, 2000
1:24 am
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Molly,

Sometimes I feel like I can't breath, but you are right, Just when I think I'm sufficating, God gives me that breath that I need to hang on. My family has a history of mental illness and I have struggled with depression for many years. My worst times are when I sit around feeling sorry for myself, then I look at my beautiful children and joy fills my heart. I come from a divorced and very disfunctional family, and I look back on my life and I know that all of the pain that I have gone through in my life has made me a stronger person. Where there is pain, there's always comfort. The times when I say to myself, "This Life Sucks," usually something beautiful happens, and I realize how very selfish my thoughts can be.
:)Jaskid

August 23, 2000
12:07 pm
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Molly
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At least you are aware now, it took time for me to see it too, my back ground was not too bad, but I was weak after my divorce and allowed one person to be my mirror, and that one person was a depressed repressed individual, that constantly found me wrong or negative, and I allowed the information to confuse me.

August 23, 2000
12:37 pm
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My mother always told me that God never gives you a burden too heavy for you to bear. At times I didn't believe her, but I lived through those times, so guess who was right? As usual, Mom.

Blueeyes, I just wanted to ask why you would stay with someone if you don't like them to touch you? I suppose people are different, but that seems to be an essential component of a relationship.

Anyways, I hope that everything turns out well for you. Just remember that your life is a product of your own decisions and you are the one with ultimate control over your happiness.

July 19, 2005
9:37 pm
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Am I the only one seeing a serious issue about personal accountability here? Wow, didn't you folks make a commitment to anonymity when you signed up for this sight. I think the issue of disrespecting boundaries is in full gear here. I think you are also raising serious issues about integrity. This troubles me. I think perhaps if you are planning some sort of rendezvous you should make a trip to yahoo chats or elsewhere. This is like an alcoholic announcing a keg party at the AA meeting. Course no big deal itโ€™s just one beer. Right?

You each made a commitment to respect the rules of this site yet frayed, you are trying to arrange some meeting in Orlando? It seems to me that it is not that you do not care if people know who you are; it seems more about power and control. A powerless person thinks in terms of โ€œwell Iโ€™m an adult I can do what I damned well please. Screw what I said Iโ€™d so.โ€ Do you think you know so much more than the people who established this board and set down the rules of it that you just do whatever you wish regardless of what you agreed to do. It has to do with establishing and respecting boundaries and doing everything possible to keep this place safe for everyone.

I am very concerned by this discussion, because if you are all so ripe and ready to spit on the boundaries YOU CHOSE TO AGREE to as part of being welcome in this chat, then there is nothing I say in her that is truly private and to be kept confidential. You are violating this chat site and it pisses me off. Why should I, or anyone here, trust any of you who are running off to Orlando at Frayedโ€™s whim? How am I supposed to trust you when you are clearly refusing to be trustworthy and honor your word to everyone else here?

This chat site is NOT a safe place with people like you here and that is exactly what it is supposed to be.

July 19, 2005
10:53 pm
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Littlebutterfly,
Glad I popped in on this thread, yet the thread title doesn't match this post!!!?????
I was going back and forth on responding, and I have to say that I agree with you 100%. It makes me wonder what the motivation behind this one is, since no one involved in that trip seems to notice or care about the guidelines put in place to protect all of us and give those of us a safe place to lay out our most inner thoughts and feelings. I'm really bummed out that these boards are taking on a "internet chat room" kind of quality, and the total disrespect for the rest of here that believe this to be innappropriate.

Thanks for the post!!

Starshine

July 19, 2005
11:28 pm
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22haha
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I started a post that stated I would like to know people here because everyone understands my issues, yet - It was more of a hypothetical. We are annon. for our protection. I wouldn't break that. I just hope nothing bad happens to/for anyone on that trip.

July 19, 2005
11:35 pm
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I really do think it is their decision to make and SC's decision to decide what she will regarding the trip. If there where a problem, I am sure she would tell them in private or here. I also really feel like no-one is in danger, though I know that you can never be too careful in this day and age. It isn't something I would feel comfortable with, but it also isn't my decision to make.

I absolutley understand what you are trying to say, and I wonder if it won't change the tone of this board in general, let me say that first. However, life takes its turns, and so many of them are not for us to decide. However, many of us are not going, and I don't feel like our safety or annon. here is compromised by the people taking the trips decision. I still feel like it is a safe place, I have the choice to not take part in activities that would lessen the effectiveness for me that I find here. Just the other side to the coin here to concider if you wish.

July 20, 2005
11:03 am
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site coordinator
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Hi folks.

Did you see the date of this thread?

It was begun 5 years ago. Molly & Cici are very old timers. The anonymity wasn't strict when these boards began.

Times have changed since then.

๐Ÿ™‚

Have a GREAT DAY everyone! Thanks for being here. Also, if you see something like this in the future that concerns you, just drop me a line and I'll take a look. Thanks!

July 20, 2005
11:38 am
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First, this thread confuses me. Why has such an old thread been brought up to the forefront? It seems unrelated to littlebutterfly's post (or did I miss something)

I have been biting my tongue since this whole Florida thing started....I don't know what is appropriate or not...but I'm just going to say it because it troubles me and I'm a bit worried about people.

Personally, I don't like this "rendezvous" idea at all. I love all the posters involved in it, but it seems rather dangerous to me. We only know what people WANT us to know on this board...and not everyone may be what they seem. That is how predators and stalkers often find their victims...

I just hope everyone has their heads on straight. I'm going to stay out of it...I'm not comfortable with it at all, and I'm staying off the thread devoted to it.

But I know Tracy actually did meet someone from the board before annonymity was stricter, and she said it was a great experience, so I'll hope for the same for all of you ๐Ÿ™‚

Just play smart and stay safe. It is possible that not all here are what they pretend to be. It's easy to take people at face value annonymously, but you're actually putting yourself out there physically in this case. It just makes me nervous...so much so that I've actually thought about it in the evenings when I'm at home.

Lots of love

kc

July 20, 2005
11:43 am
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revelation
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What what what??? I'm lost KC....whats the florida thing?

Second...this post started back in 2000????

July 20, 2005
11:46 am
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Ha! I'm a little lost too rev. LOL

The Florida thing I am familiar with- A number of posters here are planning to actually meet in person in Florida next month and have been making the plans on one of the active threads.

I don't know why this post from 2000 was pulled up either?! It doesn't seem related to the "meeting" that is being planned, but the new posts are about people expressing the fact that they are concerned about the annonymity rule not being adhered to (I think this is an accurate summary)

I'm waiting for someone to clarify ๐Ÿ™‚

July 20, 2005
12:34 pm
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revelation
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Ohhhh....I didn't know about that.
I suppose if they wanna meet then we can't stop them, but yeh, I dunno how it effects the integrity of the boards...will it turn into a "those who were in florida" V "those who were not" thing? Hope not...

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