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This one is for Cracker
August 12, 2001
1:37 pm
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freebird
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I'm with you, gingerleigh.

August 13, 2001
9:19 am
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janes
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Also...while some women DO like large penis' I NEVER have....

IT really depends on the person the penis is attached too.

August 13, 2001
4:40 pm
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Cici
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HEY, guess what, read the GUIDELINES:

1) Talk About Yourself: talking about others usually recycles problems

2) Respect Everyone's Opinions, especially if they're different from yours

3)Avoid Preaching or Judging: others might not agree with you

I'm not making these up, they are clearly posted on the top right of the discussion thread list.

Calling someone a "freaking whiner" is not helpful input, nor is it really insightful being that you don't know anyone on this site, except through their emotional turmoil. That's kind of cruel, actually.

This isn't a site for people to post their opinions on other people's pain exclusively, it's supposed to be a give and take.

PS - different therapeutic styles are indicated for different types of trauma or emotional pain, and although being up-front and bluntly honest is helpful in some situations, it can sometimes be terrible detrimental. There is always a more diplomatic way of phrasing an opinion.

August 13, 2001
7:58 pm
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gingerleigh
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Dog breeder?

5pm, my quick wit has checked out for the day apparently. Mind like a steel, um, sieve...

August 14, 2001
12:05 am
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silence
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who would've thunk it? a flame war starting in here... < >

August 14, 2001
12:18 am
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malaikau
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Regardless of how offensive we find someone to be, I have concerns around someone using professional expertise to strip a person of their defenses. Especially when it's done in such a way as to insight shame and degradation. What if Cracker was in some way horribly abused by his mother? What if there was a woman in his life who raped him when he was 2 years old? We don't know what happened in his life, and perhaps that's an area where we should wait to be invited in before tossing out hypotheses. We all might have our opinions about people in here and what makes them tick. But as professionals, I believe we are and should be held to a higher standard than the average site visitor.

August 14, 2001
5:12 pm
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gypsygirl
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my apologies to cracker for trying to provoke you

August 14, 2001
7:19 pm
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Molly
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Gee Mal, the posting has been removed, thus, I am unable to review exactly what I did post. I felt safe in my somewhat direct, and perhaps confrontational approach, due to the posted confrontational approach of the individual I was communicating with. His response, was also deleted, yet, I did not get a sense of anything but the continued banter that he had posed prior. Am I a dog trainor?
Not many on these threads are professionals, nor is it a requirement to post. I qualified my questions, and was direct in my questions, not to be confused with insinuations. Had the individual been offended, surely I would have apologized. You have called me, specifically on my approach again, and are aware of the population that I have my experience with, and very well know my style,as well as attitude, with respect to the majority of the people that I post to, and certainly cannot be confused with my intent. I wonder why, you continue to comment on others, vs, simply comment. Often in a theraputic situation, the veil is infront of the client, they dance around the issue, never asking, never really telling but simply drop hints.
I read enough of the postings on the various threads, and went for it, just as I have , and would have in a theraputic setting. Had he really had issues, and was open to the possibility, if I recall, stated, most who seek this site are seekers, he had the door opened for him. He could have said, yea, I guess I do hate my mom, or my girl friend used me and left me high and dry, or said yea, I guess I use sex as an escape, or na, I am just a horn dog getting while the getting is good, I'm young, and using what I was blessed with and don't want it to go to waste. I would respond, just use condoms. I do appreciate your style of sensitivity, however, not all respond to that style, some need the confrontation. Are you transfering, or projecting? Some people even get on these threads just to mind, pardon the expressing, F**k. A term I learned in school, where the professor was really good at it. The guide lines are loose, the majority of people who post here are sincere, how ever sometimes it does make you wonder. The truth of the matter is, if you take the risk of posting your stuff in public, then you take the risk of what ever you get. if you are not into risk taking, then go to the HMO, get who is assigned, and deal with what that person, the HMO gives you. Again, this is a from the gut place, with people of all cultures, all sociological backgrouds, nothing here is consistant. I don't get where you insinuated stripped of defenses, or even professional expertise.I don't get the shame or degredation, again that YOU, insinuated, nor do you really know who is a professional, or who isn't. My license is not posted her, nor is yours, so are you enabeling, are you co-dependent, are you out to simply attack me???????????
This is not the first time, and I do grow weary, I ignored so much of it in the past, however, I am aware of some of the damage that you did do, when you so boldly confronted another who, was abscent for a while, got some therapy, and has come back due to the support that she has been given. So, practice what you preach, and damn, if I wern't so thick skinned, I might be concearned with your comments, I might question my ability as a counselor, but, its a choice and I know it, your just another name on the threads entitled to your opinion, just as I am mine, and all else here, but it amazes me that you are always complaining about the posters, and so what is that all about, or is that to confrontational?

August 15, 2001
1:26 am
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Gypsygirl.

My lady partner thought that your postings in response to Cracker on the .... Size Thread were just great. I had a good gut busting laugh unlike anything I've had for a while.

It's refreshing to see such candor coming from the opposite sex. Us guys don't often get such insights into women's views on the more 'earthy' aspects of sex.

August 15, 2001
1:28 am
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Molly.

Good on yah, mate!

August 15, 2001
1:35 am
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Cracker.
Tell us the truth. Didn't you just love puttin' the cat amongst the pigeons, like you did? 🙂 I bet the guys down your local pub had a big laugh. Confession is good for the soul... come clean and tell all. Are you and Hunt, the same guy? Did you set the whole thing up?

August 15, 2001
1:44 am
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gingerleigh
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Mal's post... frankly, it bugged me.

I'm no professional (duhhhh), but I could try to figure out what my annoyance actually means... any number of things, like...

(1) Cracker got me pretty riled up, and then when Mal defended him by chewing Molly out, I felt really angry that Mal would basically be saying that I was wrong. Pretty immature response on my part if you ask me.

(2) Implying that people who hold professional certs should hold themselves to higher standards than the "civilians"... bugged me. Like Molly says, there's no way to know who is who or what qualifications are held. And does that therefore mean that my opinions are less valid than those of someone who holds a degree? Again, my problem, not anyone else's.

(3) The holier-than-thou goody-two-shoes approach... I know I've been guilty of it, and it makes me feel inadequate when someone else does it if I'm not perfect too. Duh, again, that's all me.

Anyway, all that aside, I think what's really getting to me is I'm starting to doubt who's sincere and real and who is just out to mind-f*ck. I think that's why I reacted harshly to Cracker at first because I sensed "mind-f*ck" and didn't like it, because it was crashing into my glass bubble of perception of what I think this site is and is meant to be.

*sigh* whew! That was somewhat enjoyable actually, to follow that train of thought... thanks Mal, for the post, and thanks Molly, for the response, and for stretching my brain a little tonight. Night night.

August 15, 2001
1:51 am
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gingerleigh
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Tez, I had that thought too... wondering if Hunt and Cracker were the same dude.

*giggle*

August 15, 2001
2:26 am
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gypsygirl
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Tez, thanks, but it's to bad they got erased cause I dont even really remember what I said. I am very strong in my opinon because I took a very long road to get to where I stand now. I have played the game before and I have been with my share of partners to know what it it about. I am offended when people confuse sex and love. They are completely different things. I used to confuse the two, But now I know better. You can express love through sex, But there has to be love there to begin with. Having sex with a stranger for attention is just the worst. Sure you might enjoy it but you are going to feel like shit the next day because you didnt find what you were looking for. All you found was a few minutes of pleasure, when you were really looking for someone who cares. But mabye I am wrong? That is just how I see it.

August 15, 2001
5:45 am
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Please accept the following note:

1)Helpers,I think, should keep in their minds that they are here to help not to call names or to attack ... even if someone attacks them or calls them names ...We are not here in a battle, but in a process of helping. Helpers, I think, should be less defensive than others. They also should diffirentiate between confrontation and attack.People who need help on this site can easily think that helpers are attacking them when helpers are really confronting them.So they (people who need help)might react agressively.If helpers became defensive, then this might look as a battle.This might end up for those people (a)to lose the opportunity to get helped and (b)to think that those who offer help are not really helpers.

2)Helpers,I think, more than any one else, should realize that other people do not make helpers mad or angry . Helpers make themselves angry or mad or whatever.If you call me a name,and I became angry;I am the one who is responsible for my anger not the one who called me a name.

Cracker (whose ideas do not fit with mine)was not responsible for what some of us experienced, it is our responsibility, and I am afraid that we couldn't help Cracker if Cracker really wanted help.

Good day and good luck to all.

August 15, 2001
9:55 am
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Hello All,

Cracker has helped many of us get in touch with issues we have, but wish we didn't. Including myself. Shall I list a few?

Frustration, lack of control, disrespect, anger, honesty?

We've had a few crackers on All About Counseling over the years, and each experience is a little different than the last. Cracker is more than welcome to post here, as all of you are, however, I urge all of you, including Cracker, to follow the intended guidelines.

Please read the thead "To Everyone: Review of Discussion Guidelines"

Please, continue to process, utilizing the Cardinal Guideline "Talk about yourself" rather than attacking, stripping, or backlashing at someone's views that don't fit our own...

Site Coordinator : )

August 15, 2001
10:14 am
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JenMc
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I found cracker to be interesting and controversial. He wasn't anywhere near as insulting as being told tht we civilian posters are not as smart as the Professionals. Aren't we all supposed to me helpers? If we're not supposed to talk about others, maybe that "profesional" should stop critizizing what someone else says. Makes me not want ot say anythign for fear she's going ot have osmething nasty to say. I've only beenhere a little while but I dont feel better, i fel worse. Immgoing to go look for some other counselingplace that at least lets us discus stuff, i think you, site coordinator, are deleting the wrong insulting persons words.
I didnt know that mal was the site profesioanl here, and we are just average visitors. kinda spooky.

August 15, 2001
10:18 am
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mel2
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Gypsygirl,

You are so right about sex and love. I feel the same way, even though I said if I had a one-night stand I'd want the big one. I did feel like crap afterward. But I don't know if men feel that way about it. In my experience most of them are out for the pleasure and then they're history.

August 15, 2001
10:22 am
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JenMc,

It's tough to sort through all the postings, therefore, all postings cannot be scrutinized, and that is not at all the intention. These boards go mostly unread, and it is only when a disturbance "Guideline #6" is reported to me through e-mail, that I take notice.

Everyone has their own valuable opinions, but as the board keepers, we reserve the right to make decisions, but certainly they are not all the correct ones.

There are no professionals, that I know of, posting here.

- Site Coordinator

August 15, 2001
12:28 pm
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Molly
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The one thing, that I believe would help all of this, and retain some additional credibility with this site, is if it were not so easy to log on with so many different names.

Considering how long the site has been established, never before has there been so much turmoil.
In general, this site has been extreamly resourceful, supportive, even with the confrontations that have allowed personal breakthroughs, be it clarity, confrontation, humor, or truth, which sometimes is hard to swallow. If it were not for the opportunity for all of the wounded healers to share their experience, and opinions openly, I doubt if the progress made by many individuals would have been as rapid, in traditional settings.

SC, you do a great job, I wouldn't want it, such a fine line, to allow the freedom of discovery, yet having to demonstrate controll at some point.

August 15, 2001
12:49 pm
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Thanks for the support Molly.

There actually is a huge amount of grey, but when the grey turns to what WE consider black and white, then, and only then, assistance is warranted for everyone's safety.

There have been several Crackers in the past, all of whom, eventually, had a productive effect on the discussions. As I hope to see here...it's the processing of our emotional reactions and behaviors that's important, and if Cracker wants to join, he is welcome.

In response to your observation "easy to log on with so many different names"

...this has been brought up and considered over the years. Our conclusion, each time, is that we don't want to ask folks for personal data (such as e-mail)...even an anymous e-mail account from hotmail or yahoo, we feel, discourages folks who are in dire need to feel safe and anonymous. Many people wouldn't have a problem, but it's that smaller% we look after.

But just using e-mail as a safeguard, someone who really wants two nicknames, will always be able to, as they can use multiple e-mails. There are other options, which I won't go into, but they invade privacy.

Keeping our site at risk, but keeping others safe and warm (complete anonymity), is the price and reward.

- Site Coordinator

August 15, 2001
2:19 pm
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gypsygirl
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Don't we sometimes have to be confrontational to heal?I was not trying to attack cracker, mearly trying to get him to see a point. It has been my experience with people like that, it is the only was they will open up and realize that what they said is hurting others. But then again I am not a professional, just an ordanairy person with problems also. I am offended that this is being made into such a big deal. It seems to me that the only person offended was the S.C. I realize that the boundaries might have been crossed. But don't we sometimes have to go out on a limb to learn anything? My posts might not help anyone at all. But I did learn something from cracker! I realized that I did know how I feel about the whole sex thing. If you remember I had a thread called "trouble with sex" a while back, If it wasnt for cracker posting on the "penis size" thread then I might still be struggling with my problem. Cracker might not conform to the rules but sometimes we all need someone like that to realize our own shortcomings. Am I making sense? or just venting? I was not offended by anything cracker said . If I offended anyone please let me know so that I may apoligise.

August 15, 2001
2:34 pm
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gypsygirl & listen...

I think the points are being missed here.

Sexual content is not at all the issue, it's merely a coincidence that it became an abusive thread. Confrontation isn't at all the issue here either. Amusement, isn't an issue, and being offended, isn't the issue either...I was not at all offended, nor is there a problem with talking about penis size.

Please re-read my comments and reasoning on this thread, and a few or the others, and hopefully, this will make more sense.

- SC

August 15, 2001
3:02 pm
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JenMc
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Someone passing themsleves off as better than everyone and being mean to a good person was the problem. And attacking another ones opinon was the problem. And where is he today and where is the attaker. So many feel upset and the upseters dont post.
I whish everyone will just go back to normal, be opinionated, but be nice and respectful. No more attacks please.we come here for feeling good.
I'm glad we can discus anything, just be polite, okay? If you disagree, do it politely, or don't do it at all.

August 15, 2001
3:52 pm
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malaikau
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I never said civilian posters are not as smart as professionals. What I said is that professional are and should be held to a higher standard than non-professionals who post. There are a set of ethical guidelines that certain licensed professionals agree to uphold in practice, and I believe a professional who posts here should hold her/himself to those standards irregardless of how "casual" our interactions might seem, or how abrasive we might find a person to be.

Gingerleigh, I never thought you were wrong. I admire the fact that you developed a thread to stand up for your beliefs and state clear boundaries for yourself. I merely had issues with Molly asking Cracker questions about his mother and hating women based on the possibility that he had suffered terrible trauma. I feel that such questions can be posed in a non-threatening way, or not at all. And that doesn't mean that I feel no empathy or sensitivity to the discomfort you felt as the result of Cracker's posts. I applaud you for handling yourself the way you did.

Molly, you have made no secret of your credentials when posting on this site, and in your interactions with me. If you doubt that, read your last post to me. And with regard to your guesses about whether or not I'm an enabler or co-dependent, I would simply state that you are going to have to get a lot more education before I'm going to allow you to "therapize" me. . . I for one, would feel highly traumatized, based on my own personal experiences, to have you throw out questions with an air of insensitivity with regard to my personal life and/or issues. So, please, don't go there with me again unless you are willing to endure the same. . .

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