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sorting out my feelings again, from orange
March 26, 2005
8:47 pm
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orangeboy
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i'm needing to process a bit right now, so i'm just going to type it out right here, i hope. i've been feeling the need to sit down and figure out what i'm hoping to get out of this break.

i know that i don't want to be with someone who's not in love with me.

i know that i can't control how someone else is feeling, or what they are doing.

but then again, i don't believe her when she says that she's not in love with me, and that's what makes this so hard. i have never been so in love with someone, ever. bonita, you remember when we were talking about being sorta fake with people 'cos we were scared of rejection? most of the time i haven't done that with her. i've let myself completely dork out with her and it hurts so much to feel like she shunned it. but then again, i feel like she's only saying that she's shunning it, i don't think in her heart she is shunning it. i know that she's terrified. i know that she loves me. when i told her that i think that she's just scared she said, so what if i am? it's so hard to relinquish control of this situation. i mean obviously, it's most of what i've talked about here for 3 months. i'm trying to figure out how to let it go, which is so hard because in all reality i really don't want to let it go. i don't want to let her go. but i can't stay like this either. i'm such a mess. to the point where i can't be friends with her, because i can't let up on the grief and sadness of wanting to get back together. how long will this take to stop hurting? what else can i do to make it stop? i'm trying real hard to work on myself, to focus just on my shit, to "let go and let god," to let her take care of her shit and me mine. but when i can't stop dreaming about her, awake and asleep, when i see her all the time, when everything around me is saturated with dreams of ours, gifts from her, etc., how am i supposed to let go? when i'm so in love with her? when i know that i will always love her? when we've said that we consider each other our family? when we've made plans to really start our own family, plans that she backed out on later? oh boy do i hate this...sometimes i feel like the space thing is helping, but it's definitely not a drastic help. especially when it hurts so bad to see her almost everyday and ignore each other, when we've been best friends for so long. i'm so ready to let go of the idea that how much you love someone is demonstrated by how much you're willing to suffer for them. i'm noticing it and kicking it out of my brain more and more, but i also am sincerely suffering from missing her. it's been since the end of december and still i wake up crying in my sleep...

March 26, 2005
8:51 pm
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orangeboy
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and i know that it's true that i deserve someone who's in love with me, who treats me right, who respects me. but at the same time i feel so loyal to her. i can see how many times she's been awfully hurt and i don't want to be the one to hurt her like that again. but maybe she's the one hurting herself this time and i'm trying to stop her, or think i am, but it's not my burden to bear and it hurts so bad because i can't change it? gawd this sucks.

March 26, 2005
9:07 pm
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bonita1
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Hey, hon,

I'm so sorry you are feeling such overwhelming grief. Honey, you've got to stop torturing yourself. You have to start loving you.

Bonita

March 26, 2005
9:10 pm
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bonita1
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In my own experience, it wasn't until I realized that I didn't love myself that I was able to see that I wanted his love so much because then I wouldn't have to love myself. 🙁

March 26, 2005
9:12 pm
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bonita1
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Also, hon, you have to believe what people tell you because that is the only way you have to know what they are thinking and feeling.

March 26, 2005
9:16 pm
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bonita1
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Oprah once said you have to believe what people tell you about themselves because it's usually the truth.

Much as it hurts, you have to believe her when she tells you she is not in love with you anymore. There is no way of knowing that she is lying, that she really does love you and wants you back after she is finished with whatever it is she's working through.

March 26, 2005
9:16 pm
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orangeboy
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gawd, what's up with me? why do i feel the need to fight so fiercely to be loyal to her, pretending that i'm some knight in shining armor from the karate kid II theme song...especially when she has just disproven her loyalty to me? when she has broken her promises and can't communicate clearly with me? why am i not more angry? why am i taking on everything that i could've ever possibly done wrong, and not holding her accountable or looking at her part? why am i so totally confused by all of this? i wish i could pull my heart out of it long enough to gain a clearer perspective...

but i am starting to feel better about being single. starting to feel stronger in it, and not embarrassed about it. trying to think of it as a choice, especially since i've been approached by 4 people recently. which i'm totally confused by because i'm walking around feeling miserable a lot, sure that i look miserable, and sure that people can sense my weakness and vulnerability and heartbreak from miles away.

am i doing the right thing? should i be able to "just be friends" with her? should that just be enough? i feel that that's just giving her whatever she wants, as i'm so used to doing. she said on our trip that she wants to "just be friends" 'cos then she gets all the good parts of our relationship, without all the bad. which i'm realizing right now as i write this, isn't about me. or things that i'm doing that are the "bad stuff" which is always how i've interpretted that statement. it's about her. she's said that she can't deal with being in a relationship because it means she has to work on her shit, has to deal with stuff that she doesn't want to. she cries at the mention of the word therapy, chain smokes, and feels stressed out and anxious and bad about herself and what she's doing all the time. i hate it that she's so sad. but do i really want to spend my life trying to show her that if she'd only quit staring the bad stuff down she'd see how many other great things there are? i do want to stop getting sucked into her depression. i have enough of a propensity towards it on my own.

oh boy, maybe all of this is part of the breakthrough i've been waiting for huh? i can see the little gem off in the distance that knows that i should insist upon being treated well, on being loved and adored, but it's like a mirage right now, sometimes i see it, and then i lose it, but once it's gone i can hardly even remember what it was...

so i'll let go of "doing whatever it takes if she'd only come back." let it go let it go let it go (or is that a christmas song?)...that's not fair to me. i deserve more. right? i feel so corny and yet it makes me feel better.

and i'll let go of taking all the blame for everything that ever went wrong in our relationship. even she says that she wishes i'd quit blaming myself, that i didn't do anything wrong.

she showed me a cute little exercise once when i was really angry about something that happened at school, where she made me take some deep breaths and then blow the anger up one long breath at a time into an imaginary balloon, and then take it over to the window or outside and let it go. it works. or maybe that's just the kind of guy i am...

so why does it still hurt? how do you let go of hurt and dreams and resentment and anger and love. i read that let it go thing, it's helpful, i printed it out and will carry it around with me for awhile, but how the hell do you let go of love? and of dreams? and of other things that are so good? that you want?

March 26, 2005
9:19 pm
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orangeboy
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((((((bonita))))))) i'm glad you're here. it's so hard to believe when she sure doesn't act like it. i called her on it once, more than once, said i think that she is in love with me and is just scared and she said, so what if i am? or another time i said that i felt like she was trying to force herself out of love with me, to wean herself off of me for some reason, and she said, that is what i'm doing.

perhaps i need to make myself another corny exercise of sewing an imaginary pocket into my chest where i can put my love for her, and my hopes that we'll get back together, and then they'll just be there if it happens. or is that a bad idea? 'cos that means that i'm still not letting go of it? I CAN'T LET HER GO!!

March 26, 2005
9:24 pm
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orangeboy
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man, i've dealt with so much pain in my life, so so much, but this is the worst. it just doesn't go away. and i really feel like if i don't figure out how to make it go away soon, it's going to really make me sick. not like the once a week sick that i've been having every single week, but like pneumonia or something. i just still feel like it's a nightmare that one day i'll wake up from...some days-like right now, it hurts every bit as much as it did the first second. why can't i just be mad at her??? i have no problem getting mad other times, but i am only feeling sorrow now...ugh, i hate this.

March 26, 2005
9:32 pm
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bonita1
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Honey, stop all criticism of yourself! You are a wonderful, caring human being and you have to tell yourself that! But use that same caring personality and take care of you. Be gentle with yourself. Be kind to yourself, be patient with yourself as you learn new ways of thinking. Treat yourself the way you have always treated your girl, as you would treat someone you really loved.

Be kind to your mind, hon, because self-hatred is only hating your own thoughts. Don't hate yourself for having the thoughts, gently change the thoughts.

Hon, there are so many resources out there for us to learn how to love yourself. Try doing a search for Louise Hay website, she has these excellent tips that I just shared with you and more that I haven't mentioned.

Love yourself, honey ob-wan, do it now.

Bonita

March 26, 2005
9:37 pm
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bonita1
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Stop thinking that she loes you still. I find that this thought is the killer. Just keep telling yourself that her actions to you have not always been those of a loving woman. What loving woman would want to see her man hurt the way you do??

Its a terrible way to live, living on false hope. Instead of obsessing about her try to gently distract yourself with another mental image that gives you pleasure, maybe a particularly awesome wave you surfed while at sunny Mexico?

March 26, 2005
9:40 pm
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orangeboy
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i do love me. i love me a lot. i think i'm totally great. but maybe i still don't know how to give me what i deserve, or what it is i deserve. i've always had a hard time with self esteem, but these days i feel pretty darn good about myself. my sister who raised me used to give me such a hard time if i said anything that was anywhere near positive about myself, she'd say i was being cocky or conceited and that no one likes cocky or conceited people. or she'd say that my head was going to get so big that i wouldn't be able to fit through the kitchen door. i really really took that stuff on for a long time. and took on all the nasty shit my mom said about my being the worst piece of shit to ever walk the face of the earth, the worst kid she ever could have imagined, some sort of punishment to her from god, and ugly to top it off-my mom offered to take out a loan for me to get a nosejob in the 7th grade, and i said, but mom, i like my nose! so it's only been recently that i've been really not caring what people think. i mean of course occasionally i get self conscious and stuff, but generally i've embraced whatever sort of dork lives in me and i could care less if people see it. i think i'm hilarious and good-looking and smart. it definitely helps that i have friends around who tell me that all the time too. definitely helps, a lot. but i'm also really self conscious about how much space i'm taking up, which not enough guys are aware of, but i think i go overboard. sometimes, like on these boards i feel like i talk too much and don't give enough support, i feel guilty for taking too much. also, i don't know how to give myself what i need, nor do i trust myself to meet my needs. something i'm working on now by living by myself. not asking for help in any way. and that feels pretty good too. just to know that i can do it, not to stop asking for help when i need it, that's not my intention...

i'm glad that you realized that you were wanting his love so much 'cos then you wouldn't have to love yourself. that's a pretty profound insight into yourself, huh? and damn i love oprah. heh heh! i feel slightly embarrassed to admit it, but she's a badass, there's no denying. her and dolly parton. if only dolly had her own talk show! now that i'd never miss!

March 26, 2005
9:43 pm
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orangeboy
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maybe a particularly awesome wave you surfed while at sunny Mexico?

you are so friggin' cute and sweet bonita, and i am so very grateful for your friendship and support. i love you! and no, i'm not getting all codependent on your ass!! i'm going to look at that website for a second while you're typing-assuming that you are...

March 26, 2005
9:45 pm
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bonita1
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"So why does it still hurt? how do you let go of hurt and dreams and resentment and anger and love....how the hell do you let go of love?"

OB-wan, I think that you gently and immediately switch to a different brain synapse by finding something different to think about that gives you pleasure, by finding ways to support yourself-- reaching out to friends (real & cyber ones:D!), and allowing your friends to help you.

Louise Hay even offers this suggestion of mirror work. She says to look into your own eyes often, Express this growing sense of love you have for yourself. Forgive yourself looking into a mirror. Talk to your parents looking into the mirror. Forgive them, too. At least once a day, say "I love you, I really love you!"

March 26, 2005
9:45 pm
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orangeboy
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that's a real good point about

Just keep telling yourself that her actions to you have not always been those of a loving woman. What loving woman would want to see her man hurt the way you do?

but i'm also so quick to defend her. her saying that it kills her to see me hurt so bad, especially pain that she feels is her making...

that's another part of why she broke it off, 'cos she didn't like the way she was treating me...

March 26, 2005
9:49 pm
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orangeboy
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ok, so i just looked at the website and that part of me that i was talking about before that sometimes gets self conscious just popped out. i'm sitting in a computer lab at school and got totally embarrassed to have the screen fill up with little flitting pastel charcoal birds and hearts with my affirmation for the day. heh heh. maybe that's where my macho lives!! LOL!!!

March 26, 2005
9:51 pm
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orangeboy
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goddammit, it's just that i spent so long trying to convince myself that she truly loved me, and now i have to convince myself otherwise. just as i was settled into the idea of, "okay, this is the relationship i am going to have for the rest of my life. for the next 80 years. i'm into it. and she loves me and i know it." and now i have to say, oh, she didn't really love me? that sucks!!!

March 26, 2005
9:53 pm
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bonita1
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Aw, shucks, ob-wan! (((((Orangie)))))
I love you too, you are awesome cyber-boyfriend!! 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

Your words just gave me such a smile, I can't stop smiling!

Bonita ;0

March 26, 2005
9:59 pm
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bonita1
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LOL I forgot about all those pastel birds and hearts and don't forget the angels, there are lots of angels there, too!!!! heh heh heh heh 😀 😀

March 26, 2005
10:05 pm
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orangeboy
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yeah, that made me chuckle a lot too!

March 26, 2005
10:07 pm
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bonita1
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orangie,

Your point about defending her because "...it kills her to see me hurt so bad, especially pain that she feels is her making..." really made me mad.

Honey, with all the respect and love in the world, and don't take this the wrong way, but that is the heaviest load of [email protected]#! I have ever had the misfortune of reading! This is the way that she breaks up with you? So, this makes her coming out smelling like a rose when she just got through dumping you!! She's just way too kind to hurt you? Puhleeezee!!!

Honey, she should have been more honest and told you that even though you are a great guy, she realizes that she doesn't love you and that she doesn't want to keep hurting you by keeping in contact with you. She should have made it a clean kill, so to speak, so that you wouldn't still be bleeding all over the road here, metaphorically speaking, waiting to see if she'll come back and love you. That sucks!

March 26, 2005
10:11 pm
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orangeboy
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i'm so hell bent on figuring her out! sheesh. it's like she's committed to punishing herself for something. she told me once that sometimes she's really mean to people so that they'll go away and then she can prove that no one really loves her. and she was feeling so weak in general that if/when i asked her for something she felt overwhelmed. she sometimes has tried to take back parts of what she's said. i think she's even more terrified of opening herself up to people than you and i are. like when she told me all this stuff about her past, about her abuse and sexual abuse stuff, then she said right afterwards that she felt like i had just won some nugget of information from her and that that gave me some sort of power...and she said once that the very first thing that she ever sent to me, a cute card/comic that had all these drawings of her, one of her grumpy sitting alone on the couch next to an empty spot, an empty spot next to her coffee cup, next to her toothbrush, and then her empty hand. on the front it said dear diary, i've had the strangest feeling today, and at the end it said, almost as if something were missing. she said that she felt awful after she sent that, that she didn't want a boyfriend, but that she couldn't stop herself. but then she also has kept saying since we broke up that we shared something very real and magical and that she doesn't want me to ever forget it. what the hell? it just seems that she wants me to be exactly where she wants me, but she's unsure of where that is...

March 26, 2005
10:18 pm
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orangeboy
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it kills her to see me hurt so bad, especially pain that she feels is her making

she said that in reference to something else. a long time ago, i don't remember what.

she broke up with me by crying hysterically and saying that she feels like we're just friends right now. then she left. with me hysterical and puking. it was right after we went for a walk to the thrift store, holding hands and looking at pretty things outside at sunset and talking about going on a photography date. we got back to my house and i asked if we could cuddle momentarily-she had said a week or two before that she couldn't deal with any sort of physical affection, and i asked if she thought she'd ever want to be physical again. not in a frustrated way, just sensing that something was up. i had a feeling when she came over that we were going to break up, and i almost didn't hang out with her then because of it. but i also didn't want to have any dishonesty between us, so i said that. feeling like i just wanted to know. and i guess hoping it wasn't true. i still kinda wish i would've just taken some space then, that we'd probably still be together now...

March 26, 2005
10:19 pm
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bonita1
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The point is, that you can't be friends. It's only hurting you and prolonging the agony. Also, with all due respet, I think that her hanging on to you like a boyfriend but not really is just as bad as my husband, the STBX (soon to be ex), marrying me and then refusing to live with me because he is all F#@#ed up and needs to be alone (hah! with a floozy in bed with him, he calls that alone!!!??)

He is wanting to hang on to me, just friends, but acting like he is my husband but not really, (I love you, sweetheart, I always have and I always will!" Baaloneeee & Cheese

So why the hell do I want to be with someone who doesn't love me and want to be with me???

March 26, 2005
10:27 pm
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orangeboy
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so even though i feel pretty damn certain that she still loves me and is just committed to punishing herself for something, i should let it go? even though she says that it's just that she can't deal with being in a relationship right now but if she could she'd want it to be with me? even though she says she wants to try it again in the future if we can figure out how to better relate to each other? i don't know what of what she says to believe and what not to...it wasn't that long ago that we had a list of baby names, in december actually. and she took it down when we broke up. even though she said a few times that "i don't want to have a baby with you right now," or other times when she'd say "no baby, no wedding, no house" but then also point out certain dishes or something and say "let's have that in our house, okay pumpkin?" i'd get in trouble when i'd say such things, she'd complain that i was only paying attention to the times that she'd say that she wanted those things and not the times she said she didn't. and i said, of course i listen to all of them, but i give more weight to the positive ones 'cos that's what i want too. and in mexico when we were talking about our two friends and their partners that are having babies she started crying. she said something about her being an auntie, and i said, "yeah, and i'm gonna be an uncle" and got upset for a second saying, "you're not going to be my nephew's uncle!" and i reminded her that my close close friend is having a baby too and we're calling me "uncle" and she cried a bit, hoping i wouldn't notice. it's like i feel like i'm reading into things too much, but then sometimes she reassures me that those things are real and then takes them back...

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