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Red Flags- for the Emotional Predator
December 15, 2005
12:01 am
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From "How to Avaoid a Dangerous Man before you get involved" by Sandra L. Brown

____________________________________________

Red Alert Behavioral Checklist

The emotional predator:

has a natural instinct for sensing vulnarable or "sensitive" women

senses women with low self esteem

senses women who want or require relationships in order to feel needed or fulfilled

senses women who are bored, lonely, or needy

senses women who are on the rebound from having been recently dumped, divorced, emotionally ignored, or wounded

senses women's body and eye language

listens closely to what a woman says in order to pick up clues he can use in later conversations

senses unfulfilled physical intimacy needs and sexual needs

creates a sense of fun and mystique to draw you in

is smooth and seems to have all the right lines and insights into you

comes on fast and strong and sweeps you off your feet

is overly interested in every detail of your life

wants to move in together or get married quickly

implies that he "knows" you well before he has spent enough time to really get to know you

pushes you to quickly disclose a lot about yourself to him

tries to fulfill your physical, financial, or emotional needs

seeks to fill roles in your life, such as advisor, father figure, spiritual leader, mentor

is overly helpful, comforting and understanding

has the exact same interests, values, hobbies, etc that you do

is a chameleon who can be all things to all people

December 15, 2005
12:12 am
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Anonymous
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#1 warning sign:

When a man verbally, sexually or physically abuses you and later on apologises with:

I'm sorry for what I did but "you made me" mad or crazy or whatever...

He is apologizing but putting the blame on you for his actions and behavior. It's your fault that he abuses you. Do you see how sick that is? Run, don't walk to the nearest exit.

December 15, 2005
12:54 am
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hopeinhim
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Um, that is my last 2 husbands just described above. Wow!

December 15, 2005
12:59 am
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Hi hopeinhim: According to the book, of the eight persoanliry types described in the book, the emotional predator is the worst. As bad as it gets. And usually exhibits traits of some of the other dysfuctioanl personality types.

We should just be thankful that its a lesson learned, rather than a lesson yet to be learned.

December 15, 2005
1:51 am
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DoTheyNetwork
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Hm ! Right on ! Im a guy and learned young after trying to worn women about different guys and getting in trouble for doing it.

It is hard to put my finger on - It seems to me that some of these guys seem to ooze warmth,confedance and or just in the nik of time perseptivness. Body language says the rest. It is like they fill in the blanks with body language and that seems to be what makes the bells ring right off for the ladies. Watch one that you know work it on someone sometime. The body language is almost filling in the blanks to feel out and isolate his prey. Watch their face. Many years ago I read a book on salesmanship and cannot remember the title. What some people did a study of good sales people and discoved that touch was an important part of sales. Studing a good friendly sale person and this book actually called touching people, Anchoring. Try people watching and see how their tone of voice,glances ,frowns and body language tie in. Love at first sight makes movies and sells books but it is rare. Women can be that way to and when my Bells are ringing so loud that I cant hear myself THINK the next thing that happens is that I realize Im being toyed with or learn later that I should be very happy it didnt happen. Right now I am thinkng that predators wear a mask that makes them look like they always have a moment or it is that warmth. Does anyone know what I mean ? It almost sticks on you and when I catch on and see it for what it is the hair on the back of my neck almost goes up. It must be something with their behavior. I have noticed little skipps of seconds of lose of concentration on their part that allows my to spot a crack in the mask.

It is time for bed. That really suck me in and people like that disgust me so much that I had to try to put it in words. Hopefully this will trigger different perspectives to help people learn to spot them because I can almost smell them.

December 15, 2005
7:09 am
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gazelle
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But wait. Hang on a minute here. What are "these people" really looking for? Couldn't it be total acceptance, closeness, involvement, love - just like we all need?

Who are "these people" anyway? Do they really, deep down, want to abuse & hurt people? Does anyone? Couldn't it be that they haven't learned the skills & self-control to go about getting their human needs met, so they come on too strong? Aren't these behaviours born of human needs just like any others?

I always feel uncomfortable blanket-labelling large & unspecified groups of people who are not really a 'group' - just individuals. We ALL share many behaviour-patterns - not all healthy or perfect. In fact, thinking about it, I could apply some of that list of behaviours to myself in relation to men when I was very lonely, needy & immature. Does that make me a baddie? Or just a typical co-dependent, unhappy girl looking (probably in self-harming ways) for love?

Blessings of sympathy & understanding - gazelle.

December 15, 2005
7:17 am
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gazelle
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Yes. That list definitely describes the weak side of me to a tee. Should I fall on my sword?

It describes my codependent attitude of never feeling 'good enough' to go for men who present themselves as 100% 'normal', strong, healthy, confident, successful etc. Those types never attract me. Their egos are too huge, too self-serving, too rigidly intact. It's all about THEM. Keeping up their self-image, their facade. There is no 'way in'.

I am attracted to fellow-humans, warts & all, who are sensitive, seeking more ... more depth, more understanding, more growth, more spirituality, more love ...

I do fantasise about inspiring them & being inspired by them. About mutual openness & honesty, sharing our weaknesses in depth ... true emotional intimacy. Is that so wrong?

Or am I some kind of 'abuser' simply by having those desires for more openness & depth in relationships, rather than playing endless socially-conditioned ego-flaunting games as portrayed in the media? But perhaps despite my best intentions, my longing for a deeper-than-surface Connectedness does make me a baddie 🙁

Sadly - gazelle.

December 15, 2005
7:22 am
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gazelle
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Gazelle is needy, lonely and not ashamed. She is a human being with a lot to give. And with needs too. Beware! She must be an Emotional Predator. Run for your lives!

December 15, 2005
8:53 am
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kasie919
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Gazelle:
GuessThat makes me one to,
we all have needs and wants, but i think its how we percieve them and go about getting them that makes us different.
You are coda, for different reasons,
Its not wrong to want compassion and love.. Its wrong to allow somone to take advantage of our wants to get what they need to control..
Does that make sence?
I to have been married to a few of those listed above, and yes when i see what i have allowed to happen, it makes me angry, he turns it into a "its all your fault thing"
But im learning, that if you can see it coming before it happens, you can cathc yourself, and cut it off.
Im not saying cut your feelings, im saying back off and look at the big picture.
Think about it? a car salesman? they are able to convince you the sky is purple right??
some people be it man or women can convinve us we need them, we have to love them, or we cant leave them..
they are freakin salesman!!
Im seeing it better now..
I hope you understand,
your not a bad person,
YOU are a person that desires a true and compassionate love..
YOU are not bad for that....
whats bad is the person who takes advantage of you for that...

December 15, 2005
10:12 am
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173piper
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Gazelle-

You describe the relationship I have with my gf exactly.

"It describes my codependent attitude of never feeling 'good enough' to go for men who present themselves as 100% 'normal', strong, healthy, confident, successful etc. Those types never attract me. Their egos are too huge, too self-serving, too rigidly intact. It's all about THEM. Keeping up their self-image, their facade. There is no 'way in'.

I am attracted to fellow-humans, warts & all, who are sensitive, seeking more ... more depth, more understanding, more growth, more spirituality, more love ...

I do fantasise about inspiring them & being inspired by them. About mutual openness & honesty, sharing our weaknesses in depth ... true emotional intimacy. Is that so wrong? "

I am confident, stable, "normal" and don't show my weaknesses much. I have learned to open up and talk about things with her that I struggle with, that I think about, etc. But I dono't have some huge thing in my past like alcoholism, sexual abuse, divorce.

Can it ever work? Is the openness and communication enough? Is just being human and having "normal" issues ok? Do you need someone in need or do you just need someone who is self-aware and can share themselves, even if there aren't "big" issues?

December 15, 2005
10:39 am
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Some of these are true, but some maybe arent worded correctly, e.g.:
"senses women's body and eye language"
Even a good man would sense a woman's body language. We all sense body language. Lets say the emotional predator wants to control the other person so they cant escape and maybe doesnt hesitate to hurt them.

Others are true and some even apply to me :o, well. I sensed them and I see its wrong of me. I can relax when I want to. I realize yes, I need to spend to know her. Its wrong of me to deduce I know all I need to know after spending not enough time.

What would also be interesting is how the guy actually abuses the girl emotional. What are some of those behaviors?

December 15, 2005
11:09 am
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crap, typo errors in the above post. Oh well.

So, I think the emotional predator adjusts quickly to maintain control over the situation. Its like catching someone with a bait and setting the traps and once the victim is in, they dont mind torturing it if it makes them feel better.

December 15, 2005
7:01 pm
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DoTheyNetwork
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I did not mean to offend gazelle. When I used These, I was thinking of a few people in my life that created some real problems for friends and myself. I was trying to put allot of different thoughts together in a limited time and I am not the best writer in the world. 🙁 Actually much of what you said crossed my mind durring my day at work. About people needing love and being lonely and so are predators. It is a complex subject and is hard for me to write about because talking to someone face to face and going back and forth in the conversation is easier then putting it in xxx amount of words. Sure, we are all guilty of some things on the list at one time or another but it crossed my mind that it was a given and I forgot to write it down. 🙂 Predators feelings do get hurt and all people have needs... Many times the Hmmm !!! Alpha females turn me off for the same reason you mentioned about 100% normal people being wrapped up in other things and not paying attention to me because big boys get brused to. I can relate. Im am a Crappy writer. The point I was try to make was to try and get afew comments on warning signs at the moment the fisherman is dangling the bait. My thinking was along the lines of being helpful about what warning signs do you or I or anyone else notice durring the inital moments WE got Sucked in by a Predator ? What did we learn after any of us got more advanced in any particular relationship. The cues that make US go OH OH , here it comes. What did we see right from the first second we said Hi! to the Predator that we did not recognize until it was to late and we were days weeks months into a relationship with them and later came to recognize them as a precusrer to abuse or the beginning of games? Sure all relationships have up and downs. cues to Oh Oh's. 🙂 Also I was talking about the Predators body Language. Sure everyone uses body language and I was thinking about indiviuals that I Learned the hard way from.
Who knows ? Im sure there are some people that learned the hard way from me, but Network has Worts too. I get to Confussed if I try to scroll up and down this $^^@#^#% screen and remember who said what and add that to my answer. This board gets me upset when I read about bad things happening to people and I dont spend to much time on here because the last few times it triggered a one man war on any verbally or emotionally abusive people In my life. Oh Oh Im a Predator. :0 Some people at work straightened out their acts and the abusys were grinning from ear to ear. LOL While the company crob was hidding from me for a week. 🙂
Please take me with a grain of salt. It is hard enough for me to express myself face to face sometime let alone write it. Yikes ! Im Pooped out and it is time to go for now.

December 15, 2005
7:18 pm
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DoTheyNetwork
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P.S. Typing is not a strong point with me so that is Company Crab not crob 🙂

Love this place on the web - you folks are great.:)

December 15, 2005
7:26 pm
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gazelle
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Thanks for your kindly post, D.T.Network. I'm so sorry if I upset you in turn. I didn't mean to sound harsh either. I was (am) feeling depressed and a failure at relationships after my recent breakup. Therefore, I get hyper-sensitive to what I see as harsh criticisms of my own faults - even in other people. I am bereft and love-sick.

I feel I behave exactly as that first list describes - though with the best will in the world, and absolutely NO desire to play games or manipulate anyone. Just to Connect deeply and to feel safe & comfortable, wanted & appreciated ... to understand & be understood, to share mutual encouragement & nurture.

But sometimes I get impatient and want too much, too soon, without giving things a chance to develop naturally, at their own pace. I long to feel secure and to inspire a partner to fresh interests & energies, to develop our best potentials together, to share our very souls, etc, etc.

No offence meant, or taken, Network! I'm just needy, missing my ex bf (but knowing I mustn't go back) ... feeling sympathy for all the world. Identifying with others who have lost out, and so excusing them. What is so wrong with openly expressing one's love & longings, anyway? Isn't understanding & interest in people a Good Thing?

Remember that old Beatles song: "All the lonely people"? I'm low & lonely, needy & greedy, sometimes wise but v emotionally immature. As are many, many people. We are not all 'bad' or 'predators!

Blessings to you - Gazelle.

December 15, 2005
7:31 pm
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gazelle
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Sorry to ignore you, Kasie, Piper & Guest. Thanks SO much for the responses, which all made me feel a lot better. I really appreciate it. It's nearly 1am here now, & I suffer from insomnia & have to get up early & drive 200 miles tomorrow for the weekend ... but I'll write to you all when I return on Monday eve.

Kasie, you reassured me heaps with your explanation - thanks! I'm looking forward to some deeper exchanges with Piper next week.

Blessings of peace & empathy - Gazelle.

December 15, 2005
8:33 pm
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DoTheyNetwork
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Blessing to you to Gazelle

December 15, 2005
9:06 pm
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Hi Gazelle: I think this has to be taken in context. In reference to a predator- "having a disposition to injure or exploit other's for one's own gain."

Quote from the book- "Predator's motives vary. But you can be sure a predator wants something from you. That is the entire reason for the relationship. He isn't merely interested in a date. A predator, by definition, hunts and uses for his own gain".

This could be for money, for sex from you or your children!), for what your image may bring him, maybe wants to move in and sponge off of you, wants a business deal in his favor,etc. Whatever his motives are, they are not what you think they are.

December 15, 2005
11:33 pm
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gazelle, you have a nice trip! I'm started to know insomnia too but I hope I improve.

December 15, 2005
11:50 pm
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prettyinpink
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I appreciate this thread. I am wondering if a N/BP is considered an emotional predator, cause most(not all) of these characteristics describe my H.

It's rough being with someone who has to control everything, and can't share you. We just separated a little over a month ago, but my H couldn't handle me 'talking on the phone with a gf', visiting my sons (around the corner).....yet, he was allowed to talk on the phone all the time (ah! but it was work, as he'd say). Very double-standard. We'd be invited to weddings, ...he wouldn't go (cause they weren't HIS people), yet he'd 'expect' me to go to HIS work social (a gala twice a year).

My H still doesn't realize he has a problem......and maybe never will. I am having a hard time lettting to, as I suffer terrible 'separation anxiety', .... it all doesn't make sense, and I wonder if I really knew whom I've been with for the last 12 years.

December 16, 2005
6:47 pm
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173piper
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Any advice on what to do when you suspect that a friend is "involved" with a predator, but may not know it or know what one is and their method of operation?

Her: low-self esteem, family of origin issues, suffered from depression, never confronts anyone, keeps secrets, doesn't always trust her decisions, been in theraphy, etc.

Him: intelligent, poured all his emotions out immediately, connected quickly, bad divorce which he blames solely on ex-wife and everything she did to him, comes into my friends life when he wants and then disappears, "scared" about a relationship, not emotionally available, says things like "I know there are feelings, I know that's why you respond to my emails, calls, etc."

Them: this weird relationship has been going on for about 4 years, but they have never "dated" and never been physically intimate together. She dates other men, but keeps in touch with him behind their backs.

Just let her figure it out on her own when the pain gets big enough? Say something?

Maybe she knows and just uses the relationship to suit her needs -- he is not emotionally available so she never has be worried about it turning into something, while she avoids true intimacy in her other relatinships.

December 17, 2005
1:11 am
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hopeinhim
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The predator does not want "love" - he wants to use the other person and is incapable of fullfilling that person for the long-term.

December 17, 2005
1:17 am
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Bingo!

December 17, 2005
1:21 am
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Philmore Bowles
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Gazelle - I know I'm coming in a bit late here.

Thanks for what you wrote about "those people" . . .I was one of "those people", once.

Anyone who is willing to change, is capable of change. I am proof that those changes can be profound.

There's hope for us all.

December 17, 2005
2:32 pm
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Philmore B Bravo !!!!!!!! I Just had a shocking revelation. 🙂 A lifetime ago while running with different packs of young Alph males ranging from Type A personality college kids and Scooter People all in one night or mixed together. I was " One of those people to" that is probably what ( probably?) what gets me so pissed of when I read about people getting played. Fortunately most people would cross the street when they seen me coming and nice young ladys would get stuck in a doorway trying to exit a room if I walked into a party. So I didnt get a chance to do to much damage. LOL I never did like seeing people get sucked in to bad situations.
Prettyinpink and Piper I hope I can say this here , Pray ! While I never set out to prey on people or use them because that behavor in others is part of what sent me into a 3 or 4 year trip to the land of a Quart of alcohol in one night or more, warm up drinking for party night was a 12 pack of beer and putting water from the fish tank in a bong was a good joke to play on the town clown. Being direct with me did not help most of the time and trying to talk others out of this behavior helped at times but it is up to the person themselves , to sit down and try. Even if it hurts. To be totally honest with themselves and say , Hey things are not changing, the people that are driving me nuts are not changing, something has to change. Can it be me ? I hate my self, But hey last night I patted the worst of a trio of bully brothers on the back and said " Thats not the way to deal with things and the guy didnt mean it" so he took his hands of the poor guys throat and let him off the floor. I just cant be as bad as I think I am. It started little by little. An INCH, ok a half inch sometimes at a time in my case. Little things that some people didnt even notice. They smiled at me and said hi. I would think " that was a great looking Normal chic and what did she say Hi to me for ? I took up a hobby or two that drew my attention from other ways of killing the pain. Some how some way , even if it seems like you just planted an acorn little things get through to people in the strangest ways wether they are prey or look like your worst nightmare. I would sit there late at night grinding my teeth not noticing that my fists where clenched mad enough to kill because once again I watched some woman in a bar take off with some guy that I knew was just going to use her until he found something more interesting to do and throw her away like a broken toy. I would beat on the table in Rage and wonder why things are like this. A Christian radio program would come on the had skits about other peoples lives and what they went through and there I was the Drunken Scarry Monster so full of hate for for the world and smoking a bowl and listening to a sissy radio program. Once I made up my mind that the world is not going to change and it Might just be less painful to be honest with myself then what I,I,I put myself through and to stop wearing myself out and getting in trouble in some cases for getting between Predators and prey and just planting little seeds when someone cannot be reasoned with. The World did not change but I did. Now I hear comments like someone asking who is that guy or man you have really changed. To anyone out there. Ground covered and progress made , 1 inch gained may not seem like much but HANG ONTO IT. That one little inch may be the one that puts you over the hurdle. Hanging onto that inch when you are swimming in a flood my just save your life or someone elses.

I hope this comes out right. 🙂 The Big condensed version above started almost 30 years ago and within a year of that start I was feeling like a totally different person. We all see and feel that even after a brief bout of Self Honesty we feel different and at times much better. Hang onto it. It my not last but dont forget it. Put it in a Journal or something to remember that Inch. Please Please Please. It may be the one thing that lets the Fog Blow off and you can see the bigger picture even if for a moment and once you see you will never ever forget.

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