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July 27, 2000
3:19 pm
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Cici
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I wonder sometimes. I've noticed a cyclical nature to my mood swings. Psychiatrist I was seeing said she thought I may have bipolar mood disorder and tried to put me on an SSRI antidepressant. I told her other meds I'm taking, my other doctor yelled at me because I can't take any SSRIs while on this other med I HAVE to take. What a quack. I hate psychiatrits. They can all bite my bum.

Oh, wait. I'm studying psychology! Duh.

I've jsut been very pissed off lately. ever since I saw that stupid move, stupid stupid stupid movie. I have all this hostility inside me, screaming and roaring in my brain, just waiting to be let lose.

I've been taking it out on my fiancee and otherwise avoiding any contact with other people. I'm afraid I'll alienate everyone. Granted, I'm due to have my period in 1.5 weeks, but I'm on the pill. Isn't that supposed to stop PMS?

How terrible would that be, if I had PMS three out of four weeks ha ha ha. Terrible for my fiancee!

Tempted to go to the doctors. I'm just enraged right now. Any excuse wil push me over the edge. I feel so very very angry, and for what? For nothing. Nothing bad has happened.

Today I called my fiancee at work to yell at him about my cellphone, which he bought me, because it wasn't working right. Even though he told me he'd take it back and buy me a new one, I kept yelling. He was trying to talk about other things, trying to calm me down, and I was sitting at work yelling at the top of my lungs. My boss asked me if I was alright and I growled at her.

I've been posting here for almost a year now. I had trouble with this before, wehn I was in high school. I had cramps so bad I couldn't walk. Lactic acidosis, doctor said, because my body wasn't able to metabolize the acid while I was pre-mentrual. So she put me on the pill. Other than terrible nausea every morning, i've been ok. Now I'm disintegrating again.

I mean, how long can I expect to keep my job if I growl at my boss two weeks out of the month? Also, I can't sleep any more. No matter how exhausted I am, I can't go to sleep before 3am. I wake up at 7:30am! I was ok before. Ug ug ug ug ug ug.

Someone please take my ovaries away from me. Or maybe I should register them as a deadly weapon.

July 27, 2000
6:00 pm
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Frieda
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Cici--

I love you! You are great. For me, I have PMS for 2 weeks, MS for 1, and POST MS for another week!!! (It seems that way, anyhow.)

Have you talked to your psych, or counselor or fellow learned friend about what the movie brought out in you? Stuff like that can be a gift to reveal stuff you need to look at, and have avoided. Here is my new "mantra" : You never have to be afraid of the truth. I almost believe it, too!

I've so often wondered if my depression was really just PMS or poor nutrition, or lack of exercise, or, or, or, or... I really would like for it to be something simple I could control. When all the physical stuff is on, I am much better, but the heart hurt is still there. I can just cope with it better. So, I'm taking drugs-- I got promoted to anti-psychotic, plus an anti-anxiety, PLUS an anti-depressant. I feel the same as you about psychs and drugs. I want to get off of them (how could it be worse?) What do you think? Are your other drugs for physical stuff? How are you feeling, physically? Could your discomfort be something besides PMS?

I hope you are sleeping better, and giving yourself a break. It's OK to be doing well and then disintegrate some again. It's part of the interminable P R O C E S S!

You will get ovary it! Don't get to eggsasperated! Live in hormone-y with your fellow creatures. Become a wandering menstrual!

Alright. Hang on, Cici! You're doing well. You'll be OK. I have confidence in you.

Frieda

July 27, 2000
7:20 pm
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Yes, I understand some of what you are saying. I've been through episodes of thoroughly pissed-offdom and wonder what has been going on. My problem is that I am always on a different part of the spectrum regarding my moods. One day I can be high on life thinking of different ideas for the future and the next day I have thoughts of how to hurt myself in my head. I've been taking paxil for about 6 months now and it has been a great help. My moments of total helplessness and tears are over.
I go thourgh a week before my period and during my period when my boyfriend knows to stay clear of me. I recently went on the pill to try to stabilize my hormones and it has helped but i think for some people it works the other way around. My roommate had problems with being a complete bitch and really depressed when she went on the pill. After a few months, though-she got used to it but im sure people everywhere are different.
I think i hit a spot where Im starting to feel better and it had more to do with the direction i was taking my life. Im only 22 and started to have a midlife crisis. I wasnt sure where i was going and all of my friends and relatives are sucessful and even though I havent done too bad for myself, I always wanted more and to be perfect which everyone knows there is no such thing. But still I would try, and when i failed at being perfect, I would get more and more depressed. So you can see where the problem is. I realized, the way I was heading, wasnt what would make me happy-but impress others. I cant be happy with a 9-5 job, its just not in my free-spirited personality. So I tried to staple my wings down and I began to wither away and become angry and bitter like a caged lion. So I think part of what im trying to say is that im vention and the other part is that some of that anger is hidden somewhere deep down and it takes awhile to let it free. Sometimes more anger develops when you dont know what is wrong and your constantly searching, feeling like a victim. Good luck

July 28, 2000
10:01 am
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Cici
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There's so much debate about whether or not PMS actually exists that it even pisses me off more! Argh! Grrrrrrrrrr.

It's funny. A lot of old, white MALE doctors sitting around a table going, "well, my wife gets bitchy sometimes, but all women are bitchy. It must just be a natural feamle trait to be bitchy."

Bite my bum, scientists. Ha ha ha ha.

Now the DSM has declared a disease called PMDD (Pre-menstrual dysphoric disorder) Sylvia Plath apparently had it (she kept an obsessive record of her menstrual periods for about 6 years).

I really think it exists. I feel perfectly normal for a while and then, once a month, boom, off to bitchy land again.

Frieda, I don't know if they could be something else. I take a drug called propulsid before dinner everyday to make my stomach work. The only side-effect is sleepiness, and I've been taking it for two years now.

I jsut get tired every once in a while because I can't go to sleep. Once I lay down (at 3am) I'll fall asleep immediately but if I lay down before then, I'll toss and turn.

I'm on the fence about meds. Some people definatley need it. Others, I dunno. It depends on what you want. And what you get for the trouble of taking those meds. If the return is greater than the investment, you should stick with the meds. Maybe not so many....

July 31, 2000
5:28 am
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hazza
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Hi Cici,
SO PMS eh?
does it exist?
PAH! course it does! don't need no scientist to tell me that!

Well, as you know I have always had loads of anxiety problems - now I am learning better coping methods and things are getting brighter. Never taken any meds for that at all so, cannot say on that.
All I can say, is that I have been VERY VERY bad with anxiety and agoraphobia, and I know that you CAN get throught it without meds, just it is bloody hard work. anxiety is not the same as other psychiatric conditions that NEED medication (IMO)

Well, I get bad PMS for maybe a few days before my period. what has helped me is.
Taking HIGH B6 vitamin doses around that time. that really helps. contraceptive pill depleats B vitamins, so makes sense to put em back in.

Also, I just bite my tongue for a few days! I FEEL like getting mad at everyone, but I just tell myself, if I still feel like that next week then I will shout at them, but that gives me the time to see if it was PMS feelings or real!

regarding anxiety - I have noticed that I am much worse if I have artificial sweetners in my diet. I have cut out all diet drinks and sugar free stuff, and if I go back and consume sweetners, I always get this floating anxiety back.
I have noticed the effects of giving sweetners up even more than giving up caffeine!

oh, if youa re on the pill - steer clear of St Johns wort also - they don't mix too well.

the other good thing to do is drink LOADS of water - cleanses all the nasties from your system - always a good idea.

anothergood tip, go and get yourself a basball bat and a dozen eggs.
Go somewhere you are allowed to make a mess (ie outdoors!)
and hurl and whack!
that is just good fun really, but you can become a bit spiritual about it if you want and assign each egg a part of you that you want rid of. EG egg number 1 equals anxiety - whack - smack the shit out of the anxiety that holds you back, egg number 2 equals whatever...and so on!

so I bet your bum is sore with all these scientists and psychiatrists biting it!
you really would think they had better things to do than go around denying PMS!

looking back, my PMS was MUCh worse before the pill, but at the time I didn't realise what it was - just thought I was permanently mad and angry!

SO don't fall victim to what most academics fall victim to - cant see the woods for the trees syndrome.
Studies are one thing, but your common sense can always tell you a lot, if people keep saying over and over that this is happening to them - chances are they are right. Too many doctors forget that their patients know themselves better than anyone.
trust youself where it comes to your health. deep down, you will know if you need meds or not, you will know what parts of your mind to work on and you will know when the PMS monster strikes - just keep listening to yourself.
Best of luck
Hazza

July 31, 2000
10:42 am
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Cici
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Thanks Hazza.

As usual, you have teh ability to clarify things that my horomone-clouded mind can only naw at angrily.

I saw this cartoon last nigth called "Duckman". I don't know if youv'e seen it before. He got a mail order bride who turned out to be a feral woman raised in the wilderness by wolves who ate human flesh and in the end she ahd to be taken back out into the wild. It was pretty funny. Why do I feel like that woman?

Argh. Grr grr grr. Woof.

July 31, 2000
1:16 pm
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seems to me you are beginning to feel as opposed to intellectualise and drug, I feel this is all part of your recovery. Be proud of your hormones, be proud of your femininity, you are a woman who runs with the wolves..obviously. Dont let docs or anyone make you afraid of your emotions, our feelings are our greatest indicators of our true selves. The immediate feelings are the best, before rationalisation or the shoulds or shouldnts...PRACTICAL PSYCHOLOGY COLUMN #942

SHARED FEELINGS

By Lloyd J. Thomas, Ph.D.
Writer for PRACTICAL PSYCHOLOGY magazine.

It is virtually impossible to understand yourself, or anybody else,
without knowing about feelings and clearly expressing them. When
we're very young children, it is critical to identify and label our
own emotional responses. Children need words to describe the
physiological changes they experience. Especially the strong feelings
of sadness, excitement, anger, and fear need to be acknowledged and
given names.

Some people find it difficult to identify their emotions, either
because they never learned the words that label them, or they believe
emotions should not be felt or expressed. However, feelings are the
building blocks for close, intimate relationships. They are the
essential elements of any loving relationship. They also provide us
with energy and the motivation to grow and evolve. Emotions are our
bodies' signals to us that we want or need something we don't have at
the moment. They are critical to our health and happiness and
therefore are of vital importance. To trivialize your feelings is to
discount yourself. To ignore others' feelings is to say they are
unimportant...a psychologically abrasive action.

There are basically two types of feelings: those experienced as
pleasurable (positive), and those experienced as painful (negative).
Feelings occur quickly in response to something that is said, or to
events that occur. You usually do not think about a feeling response.
It just happens. And spontaneous feelings are usually your most
genuine reaction. Positive feelings like joy, excitement, delight,
sex, satisfaction, and love represent the fulfillment of genuine
needs. They are not usually a problem unless they are felt
inappropriately...like feeling sad when something positive happens to
you. Negative feelings like fear, hurt, anger, guilt, shame and
depression are all derived from the pain of loss or injury. And the
"age" of pain often determines the depth or intensity of your negative
feelings. Some can be felt for a lifetime, others just a moment or
two.

When feelings are not expressed the moment they first occur, they
must be hidden or repressed. We can hide them from either our own
consciousness, or from others especially if we fear their response to
them. Fear of sharing feelings, fear of rejection or abandonment,
"foolish pride", and delusions of strength or control, all are the
primary causes of holding your feelings inside (emotional "stuffing").
When we keep our feelings in, they immediately become more complex
and more difficult to understand or express. Withholding both
positive and negative feelings isolates us from others. It severs
emotional connection. It erodes a relationship. When we fail to
share our feelings, we feel lonely, not good enough, bored and
isolated.

When we are open with our feelings, we are willing to share them
with others. This means vulnerability. If we fear being vulnerable,
we tend to close down our emotional responsiveness, thereby increasing
the intensity of our emotions. When we withhold our feelings of
anger, fear, pain, or sadness, we usually begin to search for evidence
that justifies our keeping our emotions "inside." We become
prejudicial, believe the world to be against us, and distort the
responses of others or the events that happen to us. We would rather
be "right" than loved.

Although we hold feelings back in order to feel in control of them,
doing so makes us feel fragile or at risk of "losing control." Our
frustration increases along with the consequent anger.. We struggle
to keep from exploding. We "take it out" on innocent people (or
animals). When we become angry at ourselves, we create depression.
Minor frustrations trigger a loss of temper. Without the expression
of feelings, relationships deteriorate, sex becomes meaningless and
mechanical, hurt becomes grudges and breeds vengeance, giving becomes
a form of manipulation, and love dies or becomes loathing.

-Expressing both positive and negative feelings openly is the most
important aspect of any relationship. How receptive you and your
partner are to sharing of emotions determines the strength and value
of the relationship. Freely shared emotions create the trust and
contact necessary to fulfill personal needs and generate mutual
satisfaction and happiness. Without shared feelings, people
emotionally wither and relationships shrivel.

Share your feelings with others and you emotionally thrive and your
relationships become fulfilling. When you experience shared feelings,
you are building your life on a foundation of shared love as well as
generating a way of life that continues to grow.

Also your writing, cici, is beautiful and poetic. Your fears are normal considering you must have come from a chaotic, scary homelife. YOu are obviously repressing stuff and the fears are triggers...get some indepth psychotherapy cici, you are not mental your are just experiencing your mind trying to free up some repressed trauma for healing. This has to be done, dont run from it. God bless you.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

August 1, 2000
9:12 am
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Cici
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That was a wonderful article, Brenda. I actually had to print it out so that I could have it with me.

It's scary to be so disjointed from yourself and the world. I went to three different psychologists or psychiatrists. All it did was cause major expense and little help. I supposed that's why I want to be a counselor. To help others in a way that I was never helped. I don't know what else to do. My distrust of psychologists has become almost pathological. One psychiatrist gave me sleeping pills and wellbutrin and doodled during our sessions.

A psychologist I saw for about a year listened, offered no suggestions except to say that "it's a hard road". Then, she foisted me off to another psychiatrist, a different one this time, who tried to put me on an SSRI anti-depressant. I can't take those because of another medicine I take for my stomach.

I even told her this and she just nodded and told me to see her if I wanted this medicine, otherwise she couldn't help me.

Isn't it ironic that the profession I'm trying to get into is the one that has failed me most? How many times are you supposed to invest your trust in a psychiatric doctor only for them to display their lack of interest so openly that you realize that you really are just a number and some dollar signs for them?

August 1, 2000
9:54 pm
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Frieda
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What about a counselor? A licensed social worker? They are way different than your psychs. I assume you will function more like they do, taking time, understanding, knowing your clients medical backgrounds, remembering them from session to session, you know, small things, like that. That has been my experience with counselors of varying educational backgrounds. There are counselors through churches and professional venues, LCSW, etc. You probably know a lot more about it than I do. Maybe God is allowing you to experience all this to build in you compassion so you can change the world! Use it, Cici! Make it work for you.

Janes used to say that you get out of counseling what you put in. But you also get a return on what your therapist puts in. (Wonder where janes is these days??) Whether good or bad.

Downloading, processing, and retraining the brain.-- These are my goals in counseling. Guide me, make me look closer at stuff I wanna gloss over, ask me hard questions, care about what I say, and how saying it makes me feel, show me my faulty beliefs that have led me to react inappropriately, and show me a healthier way to view my life, life in general.

That's all.

I don't ask for much.

Do I?

🙂

August 4, 2000
2:32 pm
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Brenda
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glad it was of help cici, too many people, esp abused women discount their feelings as WRONG feelings know more than our concious mind so do not negate them they are imp and are telling us truths...listen and act upon them,,asap
I am personally finding the experience of working with a lifecoach, beneficial. They focus on now and the future rather than the past and help direct you towards your personal goals...great stuff
As far as your feelings regarding u turn, I feel that they are more related you now healing and being able to experience the powerful feelings of anger at your past mistreatment and abuse (rape) this may be intefering in your life right now but anger is good, better felt than repressed and the movie may have triggered this stuff when you saw the female actress raped, mistreated and abused.....anger is good and healing, punch pillows, talk to people about it, feel it and write about it, write about your rage at being raped and controlled....the man who did it to you was feeling more out of control and helpless than you will ever know, he is the ultiamte victim god bless

August 7, 2000
10:30 am
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Cici
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I decided to go see my general practitioner. She's seen me since I was 8 years old and knows about all my other health problems.

I think about my life choices. What am I doing, trying ot be a counselor, when a movie can make me have flashbacks and I'm nothing more thana twisted, little tree that never grew right. How can I support the weight of another's problems?

Then again, Freud urinated on his mother's bed for sexual gratification. Jung liked to take long walks by himself and was convinced he could communicate with his unconscious, which he considered to be a separate entity.

Is it those who have suffered mental anguish who can understand the mentally ill themselves?

I'm going to try volunteering for a halfway house. There's an opportunity open. I'm afraid that i may be too twisted to bear teh burden of that responsibility, though.

August 7, 2000
1:36 pm
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I took a seminar several years ago a holistic approach to PMS, ladies it is real, I too have had male and female M.D.'s try to convince me that it is something else.
The seminar reminded us that in other times, the women were sequestered with their own kind during the PMS period, we were feared, and the tribes were smart enough to give the women their own cave, to be cared for by other women. I learned that at this time all our hormones peak! It is natures way of telling us our life is out of balance, stress, is unbarable, the problem you tried to ignore is in neon, noise, diet, and all else that we normally deal with go haywire during this peak hormone time of the month . The body is trying to tell you to go to your bed, or bath and chill. The more out of balance things are the worse the PMS is. I had a neighbor who would stay in bed for a week, she said that she really could do what ever, but this was the only time she could get her family to do for her, not a bad idea eh? While the rest of us silly gals try to continue to do it all. I don't think we are supposed to be super women all the time. Doesn't this make sense to you, it did to me, I just couldn't find the cave with all the other women in it!!! follow your intuition. good luck, now I have to figure out menopause!!! The next frontier

August 7, 2000
7:39 pm
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Child Abuse, Adult Stress Linked
August 3, 2000
ATLANTA (AP) - Abuse in early childhood dramatically changes the brain chemistry of women for life, making them more vulnerable to anxiety disorders and more easily frustrated by stress as adults, a study suggests.

Researchers said the results could lead to profound advances in treatment for depression - for women and men. The study was published Wednesday in the Journal of the American Medical Association.

Dramatic differences in women based on whether they had been physically or sexually abused as children came to light when they were asked to speak in front of a poker-faced audience and to solve tricky math problems.

In women who had been abused, a key hormone that regulates the body's response to stress responded six times as strongly as in women with no abuse history. The early trauma makes the hormone hypersensitive, researchers said.

"We've known for a long time that if you enrich the environment during early development, you can get critical, positive long-term effects," said Dr. Charles Nemeroff of Emory University, one of the study's authors. "This is the other side of the coin, the dark side."

Anti-depressant medication available now indirectly targets the body's hormonal response to stress. But researchers said Wednesday the new information bolstered ongoing studies on whether anti-depressants can target specific stress-reaction hormones.

They also said it could help victims of abuse prevent falling into deep depression.

"This should be beneficial is seeing whether we can reduce that sensitivity," said Dr. Jeffrey Newport, a study author.

A professor from the University of Georgia disagreed with the conclusions from the Emory report.

"It's not always so," said Allie C. Kilpatrick, a professor of social work at the University of Georgia. "There are so many intervening factors. Who was the person providing the abuse, how long did the abuse continue, how much force and trauma occurred at the time? All those factor in to how someone reacts later in life."

Kilpatrick said she did a study of her own with 500 women, including some who had sexual relations with their fathers when they were children.

"The effects were all varied," she said. "There were some women who had no traumatic effects and there were women who had a lot. It all depends on those intervening variables and the resiliency of the individual."

The Emory study examined 49 women ages 18 to 45, dividing them into four groups by whether they had been abused as children and whether they suffered depression as adults.

They were told to speak before a panel of observers who had been told not to show any reaction, and they were asked to subtract 17 from 4,000 continually.

Blood tests measured the response of cortisol and adrenocorticotropic hormone, or ACTH, two hormones closely related to another hormone called CRF that controls the body's reaction to stress.

Cortisol and ACTH are much more easily measured in blood than CRF.

Researchers said they focused on women because both abuse and adult depression are more widely reported among women than men. But they said similar tests on animals have shown almost no difference in the responses of males and females.

"I have no doubt that this will be the case for both men and women," Nemeroff said Wednesday. "It just highlights the importance of public education about child abuse."

Copyright 2000 The Associated Press. All rights reserved

helping others will help yourself and only those who have suffered can truly understand another who suffers the same and give in wisdom, support, commpassion and guidance...the real healers...just dont need to be a wounded healer, one needs to close old wounds so they dont become infected and mess you up..
you can heal yourself while giving to others who suffer as you do cici...good for you girl, good for you.
Love the cave story Molly, our hormones, our cycles, our womanhood is so precious, we are the creators, we bring forth life and support it.

August 8, 2000
9:33 am
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Cici
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OI. I need a cave. Thanks for the info, Brenda. Good stuff!

I said this in another thread, but I'll say it again. (I feel like the wicked witch of the west lately) as the wicked witch of thewest said while she was melting "oh, what a world, what a world..... blrubbblrblop."

August 17, 2000
7:19 am
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Jasmine
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oh, I hate the PMS. I havent' read all the posting here, but one question: Can PMS really be completely removed? How?

August 17, 2000
7:59 am
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blueeyes
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I suffer with PMS every month and have done since I was 13. I am now 31. I didn't know what I was suffering from until the age of 17. I had been on the pill from 15 until I had my son at 25yrs. I suffered from it on the pill and off with different symptoms. The only advice I can give on this subject is practical I think. If you can Cici, pick up a book called `Beat PMT through Diet' by Maryon Stewart. Read the whole thing and then decide on what suits you the best. It's a great book. Also, as long as there are no contraindications, start taking Evening Primrose Oil straight away. Always just the recommended dose mind! I get enormous, sore, boobs mid month. So sore that I can't hug my little boy coz of the pain. The E.P.O. takes away the pain and helps to stop swelling. My PMS is reduced to ONE DAY ONLY!!
Honestly, take it girls. Let me know how you get on.
🙂

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