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My story - but graphic - I feel hopeless
October 7, 2006
2:50 pm
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doubleloss
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Armyleo, I hope you read the Abuser post by [strong]. I'll post later.

October 9, 2006
8:42 am
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gayle
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Armyleo- I saw this on another thread and wanted to post it here for you. These are YOUR rights!
The Personal Bill of Rights
1. Life should have choices beyond mere survival.

2. You have the right to say no to anything when you feel you are not ready or it is not safe.

3. Life should not be motivated by fear.

4. You have a right to all of your feelings.

5. You are probably not guilty.

6. You have a right to make mistakes.

7. There is no need to smile when you cry.

8. You have a right to terminate conversations with people who make you feel put down or humiliated.

9. You can be healthier than those around you.

10. It is OK to be relaxed, playful, and frivolous.

11. You have a right to change and grow.

12. It is important to set limits and be selfish.

13. You can be angry at someone you love.

14. You can take care of yourself, no matter what circumstances you are in.

Take care- be brave and get some help! A.

October 9, 2006
9:02 am
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hopeful for change
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It is rape, if you say no. It doesn't matter if you have a peice of paper saying your married or not. This maybe a subject people don't talk about alot, or you don't hear about alot..but it is what it is. It is abuse.

Abusers, Control and Manipulate, put you down and screw up your mind, your heart and your soul..to where you believe the shit they tell you.

My heart goes out to you. This is not love. You don't put bruises on the one you love. You don't hurt them. This guy has serious problems and you are his victim.

It's even a worse act, than raping a stranger in ways...because this is by someone who supposabily loves you. This is not love. This is someone with severe mental problems.

You have to get out of there, if its like this now, what will it escalate to next?

Ofcourse he doesn't want you to have friends, or work, he wants to isolate you as his prisoner. And I am sure he will get rid of the computer if he knows you maybe finding help, as he will destroy whatever may help you get out of his grip.

I hope you can find help to free this prison and abuse. You are not an object, your feelings do matter. Love is not abuse. Its far from it.

I will pray for you to find the way to free yourself of this pain. Talking here is a wonderful place, where we can tell all and not worry about it. Stay here, come here, we will support you. We maybe cyber friends, but...we are friends.

I hope you can find the comfort and insight to know that you have to get away.

hopeful

October 9, 2006
10:18 am
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mamacinnamon
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Armyleo:

Hi honey, glad to meed you; not glad for the circumstances tho.

I know this is all so overwhelming. It usually is the first time or so. I know you try so hard to be a good wife. That is apparent by your writings. I don't want to add to the confusion, but I do want to say a few things.

First, we are here for you. You are at a safe place. Keep your nickname secret. Don't even tell your friends of this place. IF you think he might be monitoring you, or even if he is not... delete your history, cookies, recycle bin each time you are here. It is a pain to type in the whole addy and your code, but keeping it deleted keeps you and your thoughts safe.

Next, I am sorry he hurt you. I take it you probably consented to some experimentation coz he's your hubby and you just want to please him, maybe even you want to please him so you won't be hit. I know what he tells you that other women do... some do yes, but for the norm, NO.

Yes honey, this was rape. I'm sorry to say it but yes it was rape. Nobody should have to feel the pain you felt.

Listen and please read and reread. This WILL happen again if you do not stand up to him and say NO. And it could possibly happen anyway. I take it you are not good at saying NO to your hubby. A lot of us are not. I will tell you tho, once it starts it usually does not stop coz they need something more to stimulate them. I'm not talking "getting it up" if ya know what I mean. I am talking mentally.

How old are your kids if I may ask? I have 3.. 24, 21, and 13. They are the sparkle in my eyes. Honey, does he hurt the kids? In any way is what I mean... does he belittle them, curse them, hit them, worse? You are there to protect your babies remember that. I can tell you must be a good mom. You seem to try to do the right thing according to what you believe it to be.

The folks here can be quite voicetrous but it's only because they care and many have been where you are. You don't have to leave until you are ready. In fact, I would not recommend you do so until you are not gonna cave at his big brown (or whatever color) sad eyes and his I love yous. Usually for those who leave and come back and leave and come bacck, etc. the abuse escalates. I don't want to see you hurt anymore, but I do want to see you gone. Very gone.

Oh, and as to a comment above... (i cannot remember the exact wording).. but yes, there are a lot of us that stayed in marriages long term coz that's what good girls do, or coz we were afraid to leave or whatever reason. I was in a very abusive marriage the first time for 12 years. I've been married 14 years this time. (lol. some of us have very heard heads, just kidding).

Please do keep posting. Please do read around here. There are some very very good postings up right now. One is How to Become Prey to a Charmer/Abuser. I cannot remember the names of the others but I'll jot them down and come back. And will push them to the top for your reading. You may want to read little bits throughout the day. It's a lot of material to take in, but honey, all ALL worth reading and rereading.

Please take care and be safe as possible. I do agree tho that you need to go to the hospital and get this documented. I know embarrassing, but it is important. Also, don't worry what folks think about your quality of being a good wife. Everybody will have an opinion and yes, hospitals and shelters see this all the time. You won't tell them anything that will thro them into a tizzy or shock them. Honestly.

🙂

October 9, 2006
12:36 pm
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lovinglife
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Amryleo~

regardless of when you decide to leave (you will because eventually you'll get to the point that you just can't take it anymore or you'll have a nervous breakdown of sorts and then it will all be exposed-nobody can handle the type of abuse that is being inflicted on you). And many of us have been there in one way or another.

Anyways, here is one of those *need to know things*...while we THINK we can handle certain things inflicted on us by whatever justification are minds try to come up with like - "it's not as bad as I making it sound", "if I would do this different or more of that", "It's my fault, I deserve it, I provoked it..." "but it's my husband or it's my father (or my mother) need to protect them..." the thing is while we play the games in our minds (which really if you stop and listen-many of the thoughts are not yours - they've been placed there by your abuser and/or are a twisted version there of), I think that by nature we can only handle abuse for so long...

the way I see it and have experienced it is that our justifications or reasoning starts out as a defense/coping mechanism but eventually our minds just can not keep up with the processing of what is happening, it is like our brains run out of room- we’re being abused (we know something is not right) while at the same time trying to make it ok or acceptable in our minds. The human mind can only handle so much, a person can only handle so much.

A couple more things…first can’t wait for the day that marriage or relationships, and even family systems are not look at as *property ownership* - been like that for yrs. We’ve come along ways though…not too many yrs ago (like 20 yrs ago) martial rape was not criminalized as well as child abuse but today it is as it very well should be. People whether an adult or a child are not *owned* and others do not have a right to do whatever they want with another human being- regardless if it’s a parent or a spouse. And often abuser's are sly- they use malnipulation on the person to cover up the truth of the matter.

Also, I do have a concern Armyleo that since you’ve been traumatized (you can’t see it at this point for what it is because you’re living in it- many abused people know the feeling of the cloudiness- it’s once a person gets out that it’s fully realized what you went through) but you are going to need some help. Just remember are minds can only hold so much, can only process so much before it comes spilling out whether we want it to or not. By you being here (your first stop) and starting to talk about it you are on your way to healing and getting the nightmare to stop. Don’t try to cover up what you truly feel (which can be scary in itself) and don’t try to protect him - your children need you to be as healthiest as you can possibly be…you need to protect you for yourself as well as for your children. If you can find it within yourself - go to a shelter- make an appointment with a therapist and a medical doctor, and keep posting in here with as much as you feel comfortable with. Just start getting it out from within side of you. You nor anyone deserves to be abused, to be mistreated and as long as we allow it to continue the abuser won’t stop on their own. Unfortunately, it’s only when we take a stand for ourselves or someone intercepts for a child is the way abuse will stop.

And finally- WD posted/wrote something about the right to say NO… I’ll bump it up…it hit home for me in many aspects as well as made me realize that when others cross our boundaries/abuse us they don’t have respect for us (it's not love) and there is something seriously wrong with them (we're made to think it's us).

October 9, 2006
1:14 pm
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armyleo
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My kids are 23 (son), 16 and 11 (girls). No he doesn't hurt them.

It's me he hurts, he doesn't do it in front of them, and when he really wants me to feel, pain he'll get me in the bedroom when they are still awake, and he traps me against the wall, and starts twisting my wrist or doing subtle things that causae pain, because he knows, I'm not going to scream or yell.

Someone said don't cover up what I really feel. I have to somedays to keep going to stay sane. And yes, lately I've felt like on major melt down mode, and just want to end it all, like yesterday.

October 9, 2006
1:23 pm
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mamacinnamon
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Armyleo... Your kids are older now. Believe me when I tell you this.. .they may not know to what extent things are goin on, but they do know something. I was totally shocked at what my kids knew.

I was equally shocked when I found a video tape of my daughter (6-7 then) W/ her hands tied and duct tape on her mouth and he was video taping her coaxing her to try to get loose and she was crying so hard. Damn if I'd found that when we were married I'd be writing from jail. I am not saying your guy is hurting your kids. I am just telling you I didn't think mine was but he did.

Honey do this. next time he gets you in the bedroom and starts twisting on your wrists or whatever.. SCREAM and I mean SCREAM LOUD. The kids will come and he'll have to stop or let them know he is an evil jerk.

Your kids are old enough to testify in court, when you get to that point. I thought I was sheltering my kids. They were young. I was wrong. So very wrong.

Time to bring things out of the closet honey. I am totally serious here. Please before the meltdown occurs get help, get witnessse, let the kids see. Don't tell them all he's done, just let them see by you screaming out.

Please

Oh, and if he hits one of the kids for trying to protect you then you call the cops and you press charges. DO NOT ever let him off of that.

October 9, 2006
1:45 pm
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armyleo
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mamacinnamon,

I've got to get this out in the open, I've probably, closed my eyes and heart to it.

He doesn't physically abuse them, he teases them, and sometimes it makes them sad, like he will tell the 16 year old that she is fat, but has a way of saying it jokenly. I keep telling her dad is just joking, because I don't want her hurt,but it hurts her, it makes her cry at times.

He gets mad when I say something to him about that. He says I don't want him having a relationship with them, he says I can't take teasing. He says I'm making the girls too sensative.

Damn, this is too much to be taking in. Is he subtly being mean to them too?

I don't scream etc, and hold alot back to protect them. Have I been doing the wrong thing all these years?

October 9, 2006
1:52 pm
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risingfromtheashes
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If their feelings are hurt and they are SAYING their feelings are hurt, then it doesn't matter what his intention is - the outcome is still hurt feelings.

Once in a while, misunderstandings happen - but if it's ongoing, then it has to change.

I had a dad that always told me nobody would love me, I was fat, I was ugly, whatever....said he was only joking....but it sunk in, and to this day, I still feel bad about my weight, and it hurts....and it will take professional therapy to undo the damage he has caused.

Have you been doing wrong all these years by not screaming? I don't think so - only in that, when they were smaller - they would be too helpless to help you - to do anything....so if you screamed, they would be scared, but you wouldn't be in a position to protect them, nor could they protect you.

Your children are older, and they know what to do - they can call for help.

and yes, teasing hurts - look at all the school shootings - kids who were hurt from the teasing - something snaps and they lose control - teasing is as painful as hitting sometimes.

October 9, 2006
1:54 pm
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Matteo
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armyleo ~ how long have you been married to him, are you children his biological children?

October 9, 2006
2:17 pm
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armyleo
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I have been married to him for 17 years. Yes all 3 are his children. Although I think my son if he compares his life to the girls has had it different. The first 5-6 years he grew up with me and my mom alot. He's been out of the house for 3 years now.

I think the first 7 years of our marriage were good. somewhere I'm not sure where, but if I'm honest with myself, the verbal and emotional abuse started. Isolating me from my friends, saying they were a bad influence etc. I've always gone along with whatever he wants to keep him happy. He would ask for my opinion than ignore it. When we were with family at holidays he would make joking but hurtful comments about me.

He was always involved in his career, so it helped that he wasn't home that much.

He's had an affair, every week he would be gone for 1 night, said it was time for him and the boys. I put up with it. I was too embarassed by what others, would say if I left him.

After that the subtle, bruises started, the making me feel crazy, the name calling the your wothless, then slowly the abuse escalated, and I still didn't see it for what it was. I excused it, he was stressed I did something wrong.

this is crazy I see it yet I don't see if. Why can't It just get through my thick head what he's done, been doing? Ugh I don't know if this site is helping or if I'm just making myself crazy, going back and thinking about everything.

Sorry now I'm venting, when you guys are helping!!

October 9, 2006
2:25 pm
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risingfromtheashes
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armyleo,

when I first started going to my coda meetings - I had the same overwhelming feelings - tho not to the degree you have.

I felt like someone had opened the closet door and all the skeletons had fallen out at my feet, and now I had to figure out what to do with them.

I didn't like what came out of that deep dark closet - and every day I worried I would find more in there.

but eventually it got better - I found people I could trust and I talked, talked, talked and talked, to whomever would listen.

And things got better.

That deep dark closet is scary, and what lies within is very frightening.

Maybe it would be best if you figure out how to get out, leave - and then, with the help of a professional, open up that closet door and face the other stuff that hides in there.

I think you know enough to know you need to get out. Maybe that's all you need - leave the rest in the closet, until you are better equipped to let it all out.

October 9, 2006
2:31 pm
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mamacinnamon
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Armyleo:

Did you do wrong? NO, you didn't. I did the same thing. I thought I was protecting my kids, and at the time my kids were 7 and 5. I couldn't have screamed out and done anything but hurt them more. Your kids are older. They see; they know already. I could almost promise you that. Did you do wrong? NO, you did what you knew to do; you did the best you could for your circumstances.

As for the teasing. Honey my dad always told me I was fat. He said it all my life and guess what...mmm. The last time he told me I was fat.. No, this is what he would say... "Is this the biggest you've ever been"? To which I said NO. The last time he said this was right after I gained 80 lbs in less than a month from edema. The we got the news I was ill. He's never said it to me again. But he says it to my sister still. He said it to my daughter and I told him knock it off and told her she's not fat. She really isn't. But he'll say it again. He used to always bop us each upside the head each night when he got home. Go around the table and smack each of us coz he was sure we needed it. He did that to my son one time when he was 3 and after I finished he never did it again. I saw him smack my 7 yr old nephew last month and I gave him a look and he said sorry. Ticks me off. Sorry I got off on a tangent there.

It needs to be your daughter that says "Dad it's not funny, don't say that to me again please" the second time drop the please, the third time let her tell him off and be there to back her. Armyleo.. you have to make your kids stand up to him themselves. It's that way in real life at school, everywhere. They must learn to stand up for what they will and will not accept. This is to benefit all thru their lives.

You, Armyleo, I think are a great mom. You protect and love your kids. That I am so proud of you for. Now they are growin up and they need mom to teach them to stand, and mom to let them see.

Armyleo... if you are getting overwhelmed take a break. It's hard to deal w/ all this al once. I truly is. Realizations can hurt almost as bad as the abuse. Take a break and come back to this later. A few hours, tonight.. Don't let this drown you. Small bites are better than choking to death. 🙂

October 9, 2006
2:33 pm
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jastypes
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Another way to think about this: You are raising girls who will take abuse; and boys who will abuse. If you cannot take a stand for yourself, take a stand for them, so that they do not get the idea that whatever a husband wants or does is perfectly okay, even if it is at a wife's expense.

October 9, 2006
2:57 pm
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lovinglife
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vent, vent, vent...one of the great things about this site is being able to vent and no one knows ya, no one will ever know you, AND many here have walked a similar road before or are on the same road as we type. And we all vent : ) it's good for the soul they say...

you also must realize that yrs of abuse, yrs of being in denial of it (neither your fault) that coming to acceptance of it is what it is, will not be like a light bulb just switching on with ..."Ok, now I can see this clearly...this is enough of that mister!" You've been in a fog for how long now...it takes a bit for the fog to lift sad to say. It’s like it has to come off in layers- another way I think nature has a way of protecting us.

AND you know what else is interesting (something that I experienced)...while at times I was coming out of the fog (talking about it, getting it out in the open, starting to feel a little better- not confronting him yet), I'd get to the point that I got comfortable in my mind, comfortable enough that I could tolerate another round of the abuse - go figure. Suppose I was just making more room in the old mind...

and another OH...you say that you feel like your making yourself crazy going back and thinking about everything...this is actually good as it means your bringing things to the surface- it has to start somewhere. Recently I been digging into stuff that I’ve kept blinders on for years – one of the things I said, I’ve felt, I’ve questioned is… “Is it better to just stay in denial because this reality crude hurts too much…” Though life sucked before, at least it was a comfortable fimiliar type of sucking. Its hell facing the reality of a sitz when staying in denial truly is easier to cope with – but we get to a point that *just coping* isn’t going to work anymore and we have no choice but to deal with it. It's like our minds take over and tell us - it's time...

October 9, 2006
3:51 pm
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armyleo
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Rising...

I think I'm going to take your suggestion you are so right. I feel like I opened the door to the closet,, there is too much to face, to much fear, to much shame, too much everything. I want to shut the door again and make everything go away.

October 9, 2006
4:07 pm
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nappy
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Armyleo, When I read your thread I started crying because it hit home with me just like it just happen yesterday. It wasn't with me but with my mother.
First of all don't think that your children don't know. You would be surprise with what they tell you that they already knows.
Second my mother died from what my father put her through over the years. It funny that back then, a woman never talked about it and had to keep quiet with what her husband was doing to her. As a child, the feeling of going home after school was very scary to me. This went on every night and every night I can hear my mother in pain because my father was doing something to her that he didn't have a business doing to her. Trying to cause her pain for things in his past that he was doing.
As a child that seen and heard, please get yourself help, you and your children. My mother had to finally leave my father but it was to late. She didn't live a full life the way god plan it to be. I seen my mother as a young girl trying to please my father and doing what he wanted and it just didn't help at all. That is why on some of these sites some peoples has gotten mad at me because I choose to leave in some situation and not stay and try to work it out. I just feel that if that person want to change then he or she would. They see what they have but if they can get away with what they are doing (evil things) then they will. why keep putting up with things that will hurt you or in my mother case it killed her. As a young girl, I didn't understand why my mother was still there, putting up with things that I could hear. My father drinks and now I know that for him wanting sex every night even when my mother was sick, sick and she looked every bit of it because he was wearing her down.
My father also did things to my mother that she didn't think that I knew about. But before she took her last breath, I can always remember what she ask. She ask if my father would reap what he sow and my grandmother told her yes. My grandmother didn't know why she said that but I did. My mother took to her grave somethings that she couldn't even tell her own mother. I wanted to tell her so bad that I knew what she went through and that I wish that I could have taken away her pain and even getting angry that she didn't leave my father sooner.
That is why doing my growing up as a woman, I just couldn't let a man hit on me or even to try and convince me that am not doing my part as being a woman. They tried but that is why I am not with them right as today. My last boyfriend made the mistake of telling me that he wouldn't be leaving me if only I would do what a woman should do to her man. Well he left and I was glad because I wasn't not going to do anything that I didn't feel that was right. He realize then that when that door closed behind him, it was closed for good.
You are not hopeless, just get you a plan and leave because the hurting will get worse just don't let it be to late.
may god bless you and your family.
Nappy

October 9, 2006
4:08 pm
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risingfromtheashes
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Take it a little at a time - sometimes that's all you can do.

they say that the right way to eat an elephant is one bite at a time - so don't choke yourself - leave the door closed until you have "recovered" from this first shock - until you are ready to face "what's next".

closing the door forever won't make it go away - or make him stop abusing you....but you can close it for now, until you are ready to confront what's in there.

October 9, 2006
4:19 pm
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doubleloss
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hi army. just take little bits at a time, you have a mountain to climb, so find your own pace. i wish you a calm day. hughs. double

October 16, 2006
4:14 pm
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October 17, 2006
11:44 am
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cyndra820
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Matteo,

Thanks for posting this. Knowing her story makes a difference in what I would say to her.

Army,

You and your children are forever in my prayers. I can't ever "know" what it was like for you.

I'm sorry it happened. It happened to me when I was 21 and every time I hear or read something like that happening to another woman, I hurt for her.

Take care,
Cyndra

October 17, 2006
3:40 pm
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Hi armyleo,

I am a male and feel for you deeply.

What he is doing is wrong; there is nothing worthless about you OR your feelings.

Yes, you have opened a closet. But that is okay.

Find yourself someone to talk to: a counsellor, a social worker, even a new friend who can listen to you and make suggestions or help you as you do what you you now need to do.

I suspect that your kids know that something is wrong. That doesn't matter. This is about you. The next time your husband attacks you (and that is what it is) resist, yell or whatever. If he becomes too physical have him charged.

I am sorry but I believe that the whole thing will only get worse and even more serious harm will occur to you.You do need to get out of this relationship but it may take some time for you to find the strength to do that. In the meantime you only need to find the strength to have him stop doing these unwanted things.

Good luck.

Hugs. Notsure.

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