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My depression and self hatred are consuming me and I can't stand living like this
September 26, 2007
6:49 am
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taj64
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I do hope you feel better soon Ella.

You asked me a question about what I sent, LOVE PEOPLE AND USE THINGS - NOT LOVE THINGS AND USE PEOPLE." I actually received that from an mass email about a story on a homeless man that was in McDonalds and a couple came in and bought him a coffee and his eyes lite up and mostly was a religious email, that statement was tacked on to the end of it I guess as the moral of the story. I thought it fit in with volunteering. and I did not post the story part of it because of its religious undertone and that is forbidden here. I just sent it because I thought it would cheer you up amd tie it in with volunteering. my suggestion about helping others was what a counselor mentioned to me to help me through my tough time. She said volunteering would fill up my time and make me feel good to give to others. Plus you sometimes meet people that have it a lot worse and then you see that you are not so bad off, But I can see that would not work for you. And it certainly was not meant to insituate that you were selfish in anyway. That was not what I meant in the suggestion. Besides volunteering does not always pertain to the poor or to children. It comes in all different ways. It does not make you a bad person not to volunteer. And to me it is not a tacky subject. The lady that suggested it was from my EEO counseling office when I went through my tough time. She is the warmest person I have ever talked to and that included the few paid therapists I started out to see. I figured it was good advice and I have read that in books about depression to actively get out there and do things. I was mere suggestion that is all to help with depression - all i meant was to help. good luck. I hope you feel better soon.

September 26, 2007
10:54 am
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Shaney
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Hey there ella... I had a feeling that this was you. I hate that you feel this way, I really do. Seeing what it does to M, I know this is rough for you - especially in light of your feeling that you're really doing all that you can to NOT feel this way. I can make suggestions to M all day long of things that I feel would make him feel better - but in the end, if he doesn't have the motivation, then he just ends up feeling worse about himself for not being able to do those things. I've almost adopted this lack of motivation for myself, just being around him. I don't know if that sounds odd or not, but it seems as though he feels more comfortable if I'm just as inactive as he is. As a result, I've gained a pound a month since we've gotten married and I feel like shit. So, I can relate to how you're feeling about your body, and the lack of motivation to do anything about it. I want to exercise, because I know I'll look better AND feel better - but hey. M is getting me a bike for my birthday, maybe that'll jumpstart my much needed fitness routine. Maybe you could kill two birds with one stone and join a hiking or bike riding club? That way you could meet some new people AND get fit?! Hey... maybe I should take my own advice?

September 26, 2007
10:55 am
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Dear Ella,

I apologize for sounding abstract.

I very much want what I DO think I understand to be used as a tool.

So, perhaps the tool lies in the questions -- not accepting anything as we assume it to be and asking the right "whys" and "hows".

I don't think it's enough to LISTEN to other people's opinions.

If we can only see something from our ONE angle, there are still 360 degrees or ways of looking at it, and if we can see that thing in a slighty different way, then it becomes a whole different viewpoint for us.

I want to understand why it upsets you so much to see or think about the homeless and the unfortunate that you can only cry...I actually give these people credit for their amazing survival skills. I doubt they think about their situations the same way you or I might.

We nearly stepped on a sleeping homeless person once while we were busy reading some billboards -- I was appalled at myself for being so unaware and blind. It really bothered me.

It did not drive me to serve in a soup kitchen nor adopt..... It DID make me try WAY harder to be understanding and not judgemental with EVERYONE who is struggling to feel good about themselves.

Ella, I'm a good person striving to become MORE that way. There are a lot of things I could and SHOULD be doing, but I am choosing to give myself a break and tackle the things where I KNOW I can make some positive impact. I'm pretty good at appreciating the good that people do.

My step-mother flat-out said she couldn't stand people who went around whining and complaining about how depressed they were!!! Wow. No tempering that opinion!

Now years later, I think I found one way I could see her point......that I really do believe a person can CHOOSE how they feel....

You're just too good to feel bad!!

September 26, 2007
7:50 pm
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Hi, Ella, so you´re urbanized, he? I feel that way sometimes. Im glad deep inside we still communicate heart to heart. I guess urb´s do that too; its just that they have less time. I hope youre finding the time you need to feel good. I have to throw myself at work right now but it´ll end. It can get pretty boring in my work. So I need even more concentration. And you know about short/long term memory and flashbacks. Meds seem to mess a bit with our shosrt term memory, dont you think? Anyway, as long as you take your meds and are followed by a doc, s/he will know when to change if symptoms arise. I loooved to hear we all made a difference here to you. You can truly believe you are important here and a reference for lots of us. Protect yourself. Imagine there is a very tall angel with open wings embracing you from behind to guard you. It should be a he if you want it to be Richard Gere or... he, he. Hugs to you, dear!!

September 26, 2007
10:21 pm
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taj64-

Hi.

That's a nice story, but I already believe in doing things like that and do practice accordingly. It's awkward to say because I feel like it's tooting my own horn to do say "well, I did this nice thing" or "I always do this." Because, if yu have to tell someone, for some reason it's not about just doing something for someone else- it becomes about gratifying one's ego- and that's really not the point, is it?

Charity begins at home, it begins with people you know and see every day. The problem is not to get carried away and learning just what your limitations are. Also, I do not like to think of it as charity. A lot of people I have come across that fit under the lable "homeless" I just think of as my peers who have more challenges. Honestly, I identify more with them than most of the overpriveliged shiny happy yuppy crowd that populates my neighborhood. I have a serious mental illness, no family (besides my parents), I too could be homeless in the future. It's not too hard to imagine.

Um, also, my friends, my BF and many my acquaintances were homeless. It doesn't matter why. Is it a choice? I do not believe so. I know how they lived.

I work in a poor neighborhood now, but used to work in one of the poorest in the country. I do not believe I need an education about what problems people can have how awful things can be for other people. I know. I started meeting people in extroidenary circumstances from the time I was a child. I think that a lot of what I have been exposed to is what makes me sensitive to people today.

Believe me, thinking about how much worse off some other people are- well if that makes a person feel better- to me that makes them a sicker person. Why should that make you feel anything other than more sorrow?

I think one of the reasons I can seek solace at my job (as much as I bitch about the commute) is that I DO make a difference. I don't think most of Manhattan can say that about their corporate jobs. A lot of what I do simply has to do with being kind, being an adult presence that is consistant and offers guidance in some ways, and a lot of other things that ARE NOT IN MY JOB DESCRIPTION. I think a lot of teachers can relate, because my job is somewhat similar- though I see kids on their free time.

Another point I must make is, my therapist knows me better than anyone here. She is NOT telling me to go do volunteer work so that I can be a better person and see how difficult other people have them, and feel better about myself for helping. She wants me to go to meet OTHER PEOPLE who are kind. She already thinks I would be of "like mind." So it's not like I think she's off the wall for saying it, I just need to put my energy elsewhere.

My therapist does not put me in the position where I have to defend my self and say that I understand people and their pain. She already knows me well enough to know that I do. I can't speak for her, but remembering things she has said, this is a non-issue between us I think. If I told her I went to play sports, or joined any other type of club... well, she wouldn't have had to grasp at straws. It's the socialization I think she is concerned about. I am a little isolated.

I do appreciate you posting, I hope we are getting to know each other a little more.

BTW, how was the volunteering?

-ella

September 26, 2007
10:31 pm
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Brynnie-

"I don't think it's enough to LISTEN to other people's opinions."

Not sure what you mean by this, but I have been in counseling since childhood and have done a lot more than just LISTEN to opinions. I have tried many many things. Many of which DID work. Some did not. And others I simply knew just weren't for me. That's okay too. To go into therapy does not mean to surrender completely your individuality. A counselor makes suggestions, you may only meet them half way sometimes- but even then that is a remarkable thing.

Your mother may not really understand the true nature of biochemical depression. Maybe that's not even what she was referring to. I dont' know.

"......that I really do believe a person can CHOOSE how they feel...." hmmm. I do not agree. A person cannot help their feelings and emotions. What they CAN help is what they do to cope with them. And with depression, even effort is compromised. I don't go easy on myself dispite this, however. I DO come here as a safe place to vent and share feelings, bringing with me my problems and complaints as many do. Though I agree in many contexts, whining and complaining will get you nowhere.

I hope your mother showed you a little more compassion than that when you were younger if you were ever hurting.

Thank you for what you wrote, I know I deserve to feel better.

-ella

September 26, 2007
10:33 pm
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sininho-

Meds mess with my short term memory too. But not the one's I'm on. Depression also messes with your short term memory. It's scary.

Hope your day was better, city girl.

-ella

September 26, 2007
11:50 pm
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Matteo
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Brynnie ~ I am quite positive that there are different kinds of depression, and are caused by different factors.

I suspect that your mother was referring to people who are just overall pessimistic and cranky simply because they are unable - or refuse to acknowledge the positive sides of life, but that's not a depression.

I can talk for myself only, but when I was depressed it wasn't because any kind of chemical imbalance - if there was such a thing - it was a result not the cause of depression. I know very well what caused it and in a thousand years I wouldn't CHOSE to feel the way I did. In fact I would do anything to escape it. Most likely I would, if I didn't have obligations in life.

Trust me, getting out of that place wasn't a matter of a simple choice. I started posting here because I couldn't bear the pain. There was no choice. I just had to go through it. Period. Putting a smile on my face didn't help either. People knew. They told me later on "I see you are doing much better?"

I don't know how an experience like that qualifies as a choice.

September 27, 2007
8:57 pm
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Anonymous
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Matteo, could you tell me on a thread by itself about the experience that wasn´t a choice? I have a dilema over leaving my xh but I too think most of the time it was not a choice... IF you can... tks

September 27, 2007
9:20 pm
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MsGuided
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Hi (((mzrella)))
I too have Major depression. I don't take anti-depressants or have a therapist now. After struggling with depression for 30 yrs of and on I realized a few things that are scientifically backed up.
SELF AFFIRMATION_ write down all of your good qualities. Focus on this seriously and don't allow negative thoughts. You have good qualities, write them down.Then read that when you feel down, or just repeat it in your head. Look up the Master Key series and try the affirmation tapes and perhaps try meditation.
EXERCISE_ It is proven that vigorous exercise lifts depression better than any anti-depressant. The side effects are beneficial too (beats anti_D's baggage) Find some form of activity that suits YOU.swimming, cycling, the gym, pilates, treadmill....just do it, every day, every 2nd day...or just go for a rigourous walk. If you can afford it hire a personal trainer to motivate you.
When you feel bad find a distraction that is healthy: Comedy, exercise, meditation, AFFIRMATION...!!!(Don't watch violence on TV, or engage in addictive behaviour)
You don't have to be all made up and superficial. Just be clean and make sure you shower, groom and wear clean clothes. A secure woman can go "naked" (no makeup) and that is very empowering! also defensive and offensive comments from others are their problem, not yours.
This group can help too since it is annon' and not risky to forming unhealthy relationships (follow rules)
when you feel better about yourself slowly, you can reach out to a more social setting.
Good luck

September 27, 2007
9:38 pm
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tenderheart
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Wow, When I read your opening thread, I had to re-read because just to make sure that I wasn't the one who wrote it.
I feel the same way sometimes, especially when I go out with a few friends of mine who recently had work done on their bodies. I have always been really insecure and have hated everything about me growing up. However like you I was ok with myself as a teenager and very sad, too.
What keeps me from totally tormenting myself is the fact that I have two kids who don't see an ugly worthless person but see a beautiful loving Mom who they adore.
With all my thoughts and concern I hope that you can learn to love yourself. You are special and I am pretty sure you have qualities about yourself that you like. Please don't give up on yourself and please don't let others validate your worth. You are a gift and a gift worth keeping. Do not give up hope. Love yourself You are Great !!
Tenderheart 🙂

September 27, 2007
10:10 pm
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MsGuided-

Hi. I like your suggestion. It is very adept because that is what my therapist does with me verbally. She makes me talk about things I like about myself, things I'm proud of, etc.

I do more social things in a different way than I used to. You don't know me at all, but I had some really unhealthy relationships/friendships. This site helped me break away from a dangerous relationship. There was actually more than one tie I had to sever, a lot more than one. I am still building a new life and started from scratch. I have discovered I have healthier associations at work, I go to school (on the side) and am less shy there. It's babysteps for me. I think it will happen someday.

Thank you for your thoughtful reply.

hugs,
ella

September 27, 2007
10:14 pm
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tenderheart-

You are sweet to write what you wrote. At first when I hear someone identifies with me I feel less alone, but then immediately I think- oh no- I wouldn't wish this on anyone!!!

What you say of exercise is definitely true. I made an attempt this weekend, but didnt' get home until 8 tonight and had to take my dog out, etc. My commute has been extended 20 minutes because of heightened security in my area lately. No buses are running, so at least I walked a little. Not the same as the stairmaster or weights, but it's something.

Thanks for writing,
hugs,
ella

September 29, 2007
11:09 am
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Anonymous
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(((Ella))) Thinking of you on my busy weekend. Wrote on Shae´s thread... hugs,

April 16, 2009
12:55 am
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sunbird90
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i know what you are going through so any ideas or advice you get please pass it on it might be very helpful to others

good luck and i hope it gets better for u

April 16, 2009
2:04 am
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your past does not equal your future. Ask yourself better questions. Awaken the Giant within by Anthony Robbins.

April 16, 2009
8:03 pm
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buckaroo
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I'm not sure if you're on medication but that may help if you aren't...Even if it's just to get through the rough stuff.

Going to the gym will help because exercise will enhance your mood. I personally think a walk with your dog outside would get things rolling in the right direction but you'd have to really force yourself to take the actions to get out.

I've been there. I think I have the same sister, the one that seems to thrive when I'm drowning.

April 16, 2009
11:01 pm
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Wow, how did anyone remember this thread to resurrect it? Unfortunately, I am not out of the hole... thought I function okay.

I am on meds and working out often enough.

Thanks for remembering me.

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