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“MN to Michigan... Do you read me?!”
October 17, 2006
2:35 pm
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ggfred4
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mich, I have to go, I always do what my parents say, don't want to make dad angry or upset (still after all these years) I don't think he knows that I remember or it is not to be spoken of; I don't want to deal with it;

Everything will be okay when tonight is over...It had been my secret for a long time and just told a few "friends" in the last few years and No, they couldn't even handle it. One told me, that you shouldn't think about the past, you should just move on...yea! Another asked me if I developed early and what type of clothes did I wear??? Damn, I was 8 years old...

Yet, when my brother started trying stuff (still a total secret)in jr. high, I didn't know what was wrong with me that they did this stuff.

Gosh, look what I am doing, sorry. gotta go, too hard...sorry...

October 17, 2006
2:38 pm
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lovinglife
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(((((( GG ))))))

October 17, 2006
2:40 pm
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ScaredinMichigan
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I really think that we are ALL guilty of this. We have been abused and feel that we are no good for so long, that we have let ourselves believe it. We are NOT bad people. We REALLY need to all quit second guessing EVERY move we make. Or EVERY thing we say. I believe that the intent of our hearts are to be helpful, and to recieve help here. I don't believe that anyone is here to TRULY bash each other. Does it happen? Do we get offended? Do we wish we could take some things that we say back? YES. But that is reality. We are all human. I believe that every person I know has some codep behaviors, but they don't all live the codep life. We can get beyond this, and I truly believe in my heart that TOGETHER is the best way. But a lot of honesty is needed. I saw GG's self destructive attitude, and pointed it out, as I want someone to do for me. Maybe, after it is pointed out to us enough, we will start to see it before it happens. We all have a ways to go, and even healthy people have bad days. We are all from bad relationships, or multitudes of them. But together we can change. I don't think that we need each other to change our life. I think we NEED each other because we all understand and we all care, and we are here to change our OWN lives. We can, if we give and receive information. We need to be helped. Yes, I think that counseling with a professional, reading, and all of that will point us in the right direction, however, I think that if we surround ourselves with people who we can help and can help us we are better for it. I do hope that makes sense.

October 17, 2006
2:46 pm
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ScaredinMichigan
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GG,

Please don't apologize to me. I don't care if you ran around your house naked at 8, or at 13, that doesn't give anyone the right to violate your body. EVER. I wish that I could just come keep you away for the night. Just hug you, and make you feel safe. I am sorry that you feel like you "HAVE" to go. I do hope that one day you will realize that you don't. Have you ever told anyone the details of what you went through? I know that you say you don't remember them all, but is it that you don't remember them, or that you don't want to talk about them? I am not going to beg you to share what happened to you, just know that I am here if you want to tell someone who WILL care, and WILL believe you, and WILL encourage you that it was NOT your fault. Honey, you are holding yourself hostage to a bad situation. You can't change what happened to you, but I am sorry that you too were abused. I care a lot about you, and I will be here to listen. Have you read my diary in libs? I am NOT asking you to, but if you knew what I went through, it might make it easier to talk. You are NOT alone, especially here. You ARE a good person, you have helped me, and several others around here. Don't lose sight of that. Keep looking forward, even if that means you have to face your past to do it.

Love you,

Scared

October 17, 2006
2:51 pm
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ggfred4
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Scared, that was absolutely beautiful!!! You and LL are so wonderful. Between you two and P&L, you make me really dig deep and think and also become aware of things.

Don't know why I second guess myself; just know I don't want to screw up anyone else's life...I just don't know, but I do know that I care and see the human side in people through their pain and suffering.

I sure wish I knew people in real life like the people on this site...we could meet once a week or month and have our own girl's club where we could give real hugs...that would be nice...Now that I am thinking, there doesn't seem to be many from way down south here...

It is beautiful today and I am wearing my capris and sandals...had to give you that nudge scared!!! We did have two days of rain storms though. You TWO sure made me feel better and have calmed down once again.

Love ya, GG

October 17, 2006
2:57 pm
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ggfred4
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Scared, I don't know the answer to your question. I just have so many large areas in my childhood that I don't remember. Then things will just pop in over smallest details. And then I see things and know it relates to something bad and I quickly leave that place in my mind. I feel like my life is an incomplete puzzle and a lot of pieces are just lost.
I am pretty sure I don't remember everything and no, I don't want to talk about it now, has been a mistake so far to do it. I know I am safe with you guys, never felt so safe in my life than the last few months here. Gosh, you both have been so nice to me...thanks...

October 17, 2006
3:00 pm
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ScaredinMichigan
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You second guess yourself for the same reason that a LOT of us do. You have been abused, and always made to feel like you were wrong. If you tell about the abuse will it help or hurt. You are trying to protect others, and the point I am trying to make is that it is time we start to protect ourselves instead of always worrying about what we say that might hurt someone else. We have the right to feel safe, validated, believed, and believed in, just like everyone that we are trying to shelter. Truth is truth GG. You were abused, and it hurts. And how sad it is to me, that we struggle to find people that will do just that, believe us, believe in us, let us talk, make us feel validated, and all of that. I guess it is a blessing for so many reasons, that we have this site. I believe you, and I believe in you. I will always be here, and I will always be willing to listen to what is on your heart.

Scared

October 17, 2006
3:03 pm
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ggfred4
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thank you scared...love you

October 17, 2006
3:20 pm
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ScaredinMichigan
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Should probably listen to what I myself am saying, huh? lol It isn't easy, but TOGETHER I think we can. That is all I am saying. I think that we can help each other and ourselves at the same time. Sometimes I think it is easier to go through things holding hands with someone who understands our pain. And I think that we can.

Scared

October 17, 2006
3:25 pm
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lovinglife
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ok group hug here!! That was wonderful Mich...been typing while you two have been chatting...

and capris and sandals??? yeah well I have a sweathshirt on and wore my sandals to the store (even though my toes were a little cold)!!!

and ya know GG I agree it would be great if we knew people like this in real life but I wonder how often that really happens...and I also wonder if I would even be able to be comfortable with sharing face to face with someone as I do in here. One of reasons why its easier for me to share in here is because I feel completely safe in doing so... no one here knows me in real life so when I pour out my heart I don't have to worry about facing someone the next day and wondering what they think of me and so on. I have shared things on this website I would never think of sharing in *real life* with others nor would I want to.

Now this- what we are doing here is real life- we are real people - with real stories - and real friendships get formed (sounds like a show of sorts!) and as we help each other grow through our honest sharing of our fears, our issues that in *our real-real life* we can hold our heads high and know that we now matter AND with what we learn about ourselves in the process it helps us in our relationships with those we face on a daily basis.

October 17, 2006
4:08 pm
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ggfred4
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Yea, group hug!!! You both are so wise. Gosh I have never met so many caring and smart people in my life. Just think, in our travels, we may have even walked by each other!!!

October 17, 2006
4:09 pm
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ScaredinMichigan
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I don't think that I would share all of this face to face with anyone either. But, it sure would be nice sometimes to be able to talk and be comforted and held and let cry. You can't ask that of someone who does not understand. I wish that I could hold you guys when your crying, and i wish that you could hold me when I am doing the same. But we can't. Not physically. And I find a lot of comfort in being held. I believe whole heartedly that we cross alot of people EVERY DAY that live our lives. You will just never know. We are scared, ashamed, and all of those other things, and it isn't something I want tatooed across my forehead. I am trying to find comfort here, where even though I can't be held, I can be comforted, and I do get a lot of hugs.

Scared

October 17, 2006
4:18 pm
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ggfred4
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Scared, mich, or whoever!!!, we have so many thoughts in common...I too long to be held and let these stored tears fall. You see, I seldom cry, but boy, I sure do inside. I hate the buildup, but can't let go.

October 17, 2006
6:21 pm
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ggfred4
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LL, and scared, parents just dropped in for visit, then going to meet the brother, then we will meet up for dinner in 30 min. I am shaking so much on the inside...just wanted to touch base...it will pass

October 17, 2006
7:10 pm
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ScaredinMichigan
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GG,

You are in my thoughts...please write when you return home...Best of luck..

Scared

October 17, 2006
8:19 pm
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lovinglife
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dern I'm just chilled here - very damp out...this type of weather is for someone other than me. At this moment I can now see why we have those who head out of the state for the next 6 months…ready to hit the beach here myself.

Ok I have a question and then some thoughts: First, did either of you end up having a real down moment or two after our mornings-afternoon convo’s ended? The reason why I ask is because I felt really, really good afterwards–convo was great, uplifting etc…btw you two are awesome and so glad that we have had the last day here chatting together. I felt like I’ve grown just a little bit more. Thank you both. Anyhow, before I left the computer I skimmed through a few threads and landed on the “”Share one good thing about yourself thread”. As I started to read through the thread it put a smile on my face and I felt the positive energy of what people where writing about themselves however by the time I got done reading I was crying…I honestly felt/feel that I could not share one good thing about myself. I wanted so bad to write something- anything but every thought that went through my mind I shot down. The only thing that I can honestly say about myself that I feel is that I am a survivor, I’m a fighter. But thought it sounded stupid so I didn’t write anything. Ended up shedding a few tears then took a nap. How I hate this feeling, and even though I’ve said in the last few days (GG has heard me say this) that though this is the first time in my life that I actual can say that I like me- quite haven’t found that love for me yet and still getting to know me and believe in me. It’s all good though, and I'm getting there, so after I write this out, I’ll go back to that thread and type in… “I’m a survivor…I am a fighter… ” Just found it interesting that I went from feeling good to feeling bad (shouldn't be a surprise though as I know I do this often). Just looking forward to the day that the good feelings hangs around - forever : )

Ok now for my thoughts of the night: GG and Mich I found it interesting that both of you have this feeling of needing to be held - now that is something I can not relate to, at all. Infact when I read what you both wrote, my thought was, “Gosh girls I am the cold b*tch from hell as I hate to be touched…" very uncomfortable with someone touching me. But I can relate GG about the not showing of tears – holding it in. Now the strange thing here is that it’s not that I CAN’T give and not that I DON’T give real-real life hugs, infact I love to do that and am actually a very huggy affectionate person, but am really uncomfortable if someone gives me one. Now I’m trying to figure out why I am not comfortable receiving a hug or being held, but yet feel comfortable hugging and/or holding others….is it because it makes me feel vulnerable being on the receiving end???? Don’t know what it is but won’t stop until I figure it out now! So if either of you are willing to share, I’m curious to know where you feel your need for comfort (?) in the way of being held stems from. I want to feel comfortable with being held or comfortable when someone gives me a hug, darn it!

I’ll check back in later- uplifting you GG and thinking about you - and you're right- this too shall pass.

October 17, 2006
10:06 pm
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ScaredinMichigan
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I have SOOOO much to say in response but it might not happen until tomorrow. I can give you a list of things that are good about you....maybe that will help you out. Plus, I have a response to the rest as well. It is just hard when my husband is home. But I will try in a while. Are you even around tonight, LL? Just checking, I hope you are doing ok. I miss you...Hope you are good. Check back in, ina little bit.

October 17, 2006
11:44 pm
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ggfred4
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hey girls, survived the night, everything ok; had to go lay down, but sleep evades me...

LL, until about a year or two ago, I couldn't stand to be touched except by my children and husband. I never hugged and when affectionate people would reach out and hug, I would freeze like a statue. Right now, can't think what caused this to change after so many years. I do want to be held and hugged but only after I feel a lot of trust in that person and there aren't too many like that. I have students who reach up and hug me, and yes,it makes me uncomfortable, but I do it for them.
can't explain it though...

October 18, 2006
1:40 am
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ggfred4
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anyone up?

October 18, 2006
2:00 am
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ggfred4
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guess not, going to try and go to bed, LL, this tune just came in my head as I was wishing calmness when I lay down..."Let there be peace on earth, and let it begin with me..."

Love that song...

Well, hope this is it for tonight.

Take care you two...tomorrow is another day...(Scared) (LL)

October 18, 2006
10:23 am
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lovinglife
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Hi GG~ I couldn't get online last night...glad to hear you made it through with seeing the folks. Are you finding that the Coda stuff is helping just a little bit already? You sound a touch stronger or something... And did you sleep last night?

I missed my Monday night Al-Anon meeting (cause I had the ex's little guy here)...interesting...wonder if there could be connection as to why I had a such doooowwwnnn moment yesterday (Tuesday) to missing a meeting. For me, attending meetings and daily reading has helped me greatly...really keeps me strong and healthy in thinking. Very thankful though that any down moments I have now don't last long and their not as intense as past ones. hmmmmmm... I suppose the crappy weather didn't help the sitz any and that possibly I had a carb overload from eating too many *Hot Fudge Sundae* pop tarts! Combination of it all I suppose.

So you used to be like me regarding someone touching you ..."I would freeze like a statue?" Got thinking about this more last night... I've gotten better over the years as before any type of hug, or loving affection would make me just cringed - total discomfort (of course this didn't apply to my sons). Now today (like in the last 5 yrs or so) I've gotten better but still there is this little bit of discomfort surrounding it...something I NEED to get comfortable with...anyhow it will be one of things I'll analyze to death about myself : )

Mich~ Your appt with hubby & Jim is today right? I'll be thinking about you and yours - please let know how it goes. And before you go and list out anything good about me...I think the teach and I should each write an essay about Mich - And with that I will be back!!

October 18, 2006
10:36 am
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ggfred4
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LL, slept a little more, but definitely not enough for my job...you brought up a good point about missing the meeting and the relationship with your day...I am going to have to be careful there...when I get down, tend to withdraw, quit reading, not attend church, etc.

Totally identify with the comfort in hugging. I feel so similar, just want to feel better and more comfortable. When Mich and I said we want to be held and let our tears fall, I want it...don't know if I really could handle it though.

please check mama's thread about about grieving; she seldom asks for help and I tried; but you know me, don't feel like my advice is good enough, helpful enough, etc. You are better at it!

will check back

October 18, 2006
10:37 am
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ggfred4
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LL, her thread is getting over guilt of a death...

October 18, 2006
10:55 am
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ScaredinMichigan
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I am in and out girls. My baby isn't feeling the greatest, and niether am I. Yes, my husbands appointment with Jim is today. I so hope it goes well. I go tomorrow at 1. I will let you guys know how his goes because he will be gone tonight for most of the night. But I will see him first. I do have a lot to say about the hugging issue, and I will be back with that. I am desperate for affection, but not from just anyone. I am huggy to my kids, for the most part, and I am affectionate to my husband, but not because I want to be. Because that is what he wants. Like I said, I will be back in a little bit. I am trying to comfort thumkin on her "missin babies" thread. She could use more encouragement than mine too of you guys get a chance. Talk to you soon. Love and miss you both.

Scared

October 18, 2006
11:03 am
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lovinglife
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GG! That’s it woman – QUIT IT! I can now see why I got called on it... Ok I’m thinking that you could have easily deleted the last sentence to what you wrote here…

“please check mama's thread about about grieving; she seldom asks for help and I tried; but you know me, don't feel like my advice is good enough, helpful enough, etc. You are better at it! “

Now how would the new and improved GG sound with this revision: “please check mama's thread about about grieving; she seldom asks for help.”

What do you say about that?!

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