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Ma: What does Narcissitic Supply Mean
August 1, 2007
12:58 pm
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wasabi
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I love Arabians My father rasied Arabians when I was a teen I grow up with horses & went to school for horse training back in the day! I feel the same way about getting hurt! I don't want to get hurt ... no one does! but I want to live & enjoy some part of this life!I need something to look forward too!
Good for you about school & re uping your nursing! I'm thinking about doing some on line classes to up grade my brain! learn more about buisness mang & acct. (that I have to do for my husband)I'm thinking about doing a landcape design coures on line too . Like whatever! This weeks gig!
Well I got to run an errand
Talk to ya
WASABI

August 1, 2007
1:10 pm
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horsefly
this is off....be on this forum for years....not just since last year..we can email each other Now? that Nappy is long gone....
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Wasabi, It is a pleasure to meet another horse person on this site. I read somewhere that you were expecting a paint and it colt . I use to have a paint too. We have that in common a Narcissist and a paint horse. Destiny with Narcissist and Arabian and welsh pony......Aren't we something ? horsefly

August 1, 2007
1:14 pm
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_anonymous
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Horsefly- Wasabi- We need to start a horse club thread. Which do you get more enjoyment from being around horses or men???

My answer is horses. SAD.

August 1, 2007
1:22 pm
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horsefly
this is off....be on this forum for years....not just since last year..we can email each other Now? that Nappy is long gone....
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Destiny, I think you already know my answer.....or wait, maybe I could get a two for one and find me a Narcissist Horse.......horsefly

August 1, 2007
1:29 pm
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_anonymous
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Horsefly- OMG you have opened up a new field in horse psychology. I think horses are narcissitc by nature. All they think about is eatting. They could care a less if we go broke feeding them. And running they could care a less if we fall off while riding, then they take the opportunity to run back to the barn where they are safe and warm and well fed while we sit in a field somewhere.

August 1, 2007
2:25 pm
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wasabi
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You naughty girl!
JK! Men or horses....
Well I love men ... but since I've been married for 20+ years & faithly .(Darn).. I must pour all my passtion & desire into horse's it's safer this way!
Narcisstic..... Horses... HMMMMM
I guess !
Men & horses I've never comparred the two! They are both strong yet needey but if you are savy you can control this powerful beast....
But becarefull not to get thrown into the rocks it hurts!!!!!
I was on a horse site for a horse rescue in my area & it was boring... We just mix it up here....

Not Boring!
My husband just informed me he is spending more money on my barn..So I must give him awsome sex later!!!! Oh OK .....
No Problem babe!
At least a horse won't expext any of that thanks goodness!
You ladies are fun!
I've been so bored.... ok the workers are maken a ton of noise in the basement I better go check it out
Take too ya later!
WASABI

August 1, 2007
2:34 pm
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horsefly
this is off....be on this forum for years....not just since last year..we can email each other Now? that Nappy is long gone....
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Destiny and Wasabi, Now that the topic is brought up.....It's true, horses are narcissist. Give me break...........!!!!!!!!! EEK horsefly

August 1, 2007
2:35 pm
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I found a good article about personality disorders, including the Cluster B types.

It's at
http://www.merck.com/mmhe/sec0.....h105a.html

August 1, 2007
2:36 pm
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horsefly
this is off....be on this forum for years....not just since last year..we can email each other Now? that Nappy is long gone....
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Which leads to the title of this thread , I am also the horse's narsissict supplier too..........OMG OMG OMG horsefly

August 1, 2007
9:54 pm
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Worried_Dad
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HI StronginHim77 and Matteo

"Blurring the differences between those two personality disorders doesn't benefit anyone, WD."

Well, the "dark triad" personality disorders have pretty much been my area of most-focused study for the last five years. RE Psychopathy (which is not even considered to be a distinct disorder according to the APA) I give Hare nominal authority over me because he has pretty good methodology. He is real thorough. And he is not dogmatic, but instead critical. Like me.

Best I can tell, I am right there at the leading, bleeding cutting edge of the state-of-the-art with regards to synthesis of understanding of those disorders. I believe I am perfectly competent and well-prepared to engage in well-informed reasoned discourse or even argument with any and every expert on the subject, including Robert Hare.

Part of my work is to advance the state-of-the-art of understanding of those disorders. So yes, I believe my discussions of this topic can be helpful to anyone, layman or expert.

Psychiatry is an infant discipline and Psychology is an infant science. Incredibly complex infants.

I regret if my descriptions remind you of unhelpful "blurring."

I offer reasoned and well-informed discourse, to the level that co-participants want to and are able to work with.

In *this* forum, it is necessary to do a lot of simplification--to cut to the very essence of things.

I welcome deeper conversations with anyone who wishes to go into more detail.

August 1, 2007
10:23 pm
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_anonymous
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Worried Dad- Thank you for the info. It seems like quite a few people on this site believe that their partners or X partners are narcisistic. Are you saying that a narcisist is vain? The type of person who is concerned about making themselves look good? So they can elicit praise? Do lack of empathy and lack of conscience go hand in hand?

Can empathy be selective? Can one only have it for those they care about and feel & have none for those they dont? Or does it have to be universal?

Can haveing a conscience be slective as well? Or is it an either you have one or you dont?

August 1, 2007
10:24 pm
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_anonymous
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Kroika- Thanks for the link.

August 1, 2007
10:46 pm
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Honolulugal
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Hi all!

Love, love, LOVE Arabs!

H-gal

August 1, 2007
11:33 pm
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Love Arabs? Did I miss something???

August 1, 2007
11:34 pm
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Oh wait - you mean Arabian horses?

August 1, 2007
11:39 pm
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healintime
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This is a great thread - for me, one of the hardest things to get my head around about NPD was that Narcissists will shoot for lavish praise, and expect it, but will also settle for "supply" in the form of being able to cause chaos and pain. Makes them feel omnipotent. So while you're thinking "how could you do these things if you're looking for positive feedback, or for people to think well of you?" In fact I finally cottoned on that sometimes devastation gives them as much of a trhill because it makes them feel like they're "superior to" the people they're manipulating.

Here's a question - can Narcissists be codependent? Sounds like a no at first glance but my ex-N employed some heavy-duty "caretaking" behaviors towards people he was looking for supply from. Not always welcome mind you - but hard to know whether he had codep tendencies too, or whether you can actually be a narcissist and codependent. His Mom was a recovering alcoholic so some of those behaviors were from childhood.

H x

August 2, 2007
12:04 am
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_anonymous
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Honolulu- Arabians are beautiful. You can join the horse club with Horsefly, Wasabi and I. Since we think horses are narcissitic (joke)

August 2, 2007
12:05 am
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_anonymous
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Kroika- We are referring to Arabian horses. sometimes called Arab horses.

August 2, 2007
12:12 am
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_anonymous
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Healintime- Thank your for your response. So that explaines why my husband who appears dishevled by any standard could still fit into the NPD category based on the fact that he causes nothing but chaos and pain. My husband sabatoged everything. To keep some kind of control a sick way of letting me know he was in charge. He always had to insult me. Gave me credit for nothing.

Yes the NPD will only do something for someone if there is something in it for them. Good observation. I think that the NPD is codependent on the people they suck in.

This issue is complicated. There are the theories, but we have provided case studies and are discussing how this all applies. Sick people can have more than one disorder.

August 2, 2007
1:20 am
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Worried_Dad
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Hi Destinystar.

I do believe that there is such a thing as an "average, normal, healthy, decent" Human Being.

And I believe that there are forms of sickness and disorder that describe (and sometimes explain) deviations from "mental health."

But when it comes to the topic of psychiatric diagnosis of personality disorder I am pragmatic and skeptical.

It is provable from first causes that the mind of every human being is

1) Vast, and intractably complex.

and

2) Basically unknowable.

We cannot read each other's minds. Therefore psychological models are basically just stuff that people make up in their heads to explain other people's behavior. DSM diagnostic criteria for named "disorders" are tools, and better than having no tools at all; but they are still...just one step away from being complete fantasy.

So with regard to axis 2 cluster B personality disorders, I suggest that for most of us (those of us not being paid by insurance) the DSM descriptions of "disorders" be used as a kind of sketch that gives useful hints about, but not a precise map or description of the minds of the people we are trying to understand.

In other words, most of the time, assigning a "diagnosis" of specific personality disorder to someone is unhelpful at best, and misleading or likely to be *just plain wrong* at worst.

It is okay for us to use DSM described symptoms and disorders to collect our observations, organize our thoughts, and give voice to our hunches, beliefs and opinions about a person, but unless you are a psychiatrist being paid to administer a specific battery of tests, it is wise to refrain from taking a strong stand in assigning a "diagnosis."

August 2, 2007
1:53 am
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Worried_Dad
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All that being said, you don't have to be a rocket scientist, or even a mere psychiatrist, to observe that a certain person has a history and pattern of behavior that is irresponsible, selfish, dishonest, unkind, or abusive. And those traits tend to go together.
'

And in the end what explains their behavior is that are severely deficient in what "normal" people think of as real "empathy" or "conscience."

August 2, 2007
5:22 am
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healintime
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Hi Destiny:

"the NPD will only do something for someone if there is something in it for them." Absolutely - to the point of ridiculousness - and they are legendary at keeping score of what they think they have "done" for you - things that normal people wouldn't consider any more than normal human interaction. Especially if they know they're about to lose you. My ex once called towards the end of our relationship to let me know he'd gotten his phone bill and I was "sure expensive to have around" ??? This was during a time when he had started calling four, five times a day to "check in on" (check up on) me, which made me intensely uncomfotable - something I told him. And yet he called to tell me how much I was costing him.

When I finally instigated no contact I got a searing email to say I had some nerve after all the time that he had spent "on" me - and I realised that was truly how he saw it. He had spent "his" time "on" me. The more I read about NPD the more sense this made and it sounds like it's par for the course.

H x

August 2, 2007
6:44 am
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_anonymous
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Worried Dad- Thanks for the feed back.
Irresponsible, selfish, dishonest, unkind, abusive as a pattern describe the lack of empathy or conscience. Now that would make it clearer to me if someone fell into that category or not. I agree Mental Health Professionals are limited by "approved diagnoses" and must use them in order to get paid or help a client get certain benefits like disability insurance. Then they have to spend a lot of time documenting evidence that the client fits into one of these diagnostic categories.

August 2, 2007
6:56 am
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_anonymous
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healintime- Funny you mentioned that. My husband lets me know right off the bat how much of his money his calling card was costing him to call me but doesnt mention how much his collect calls have cost me. Part of my getting better was to not allow him to make anymore collect calls and to pay for the calls himself. I am also going to use his money to pay for the collect calls he made on my bill.

And I did get a letter where he mentioned everything he thinks he did for me and listed everything he lost (when he took off for days on end and I gave his stuff away) and talked about how important his things were to him and what a waste of time it would have been to call me and what a waste of time it would have been to wait for me to meet him somewhere. Of course it didnt enter his mind that he did not pay the housepayment on my home and was not entitled to a free storage area when he made a unilateral decison to leave one day (the day before he got paid). It also did not enter his mind that if he would have called me to meet him I would have had to drive 3 hours in my car and paid $50 in gas. Just had to hear about how bad that would have made his ass hurt to sit and wait (literally). Doesnt think about the waste of time and money he has been to me. Same Brain. Different guy.

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