Avatar
Please consider registering
guest
sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register
Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search
Forum Scope


Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
sp_TopicIcon
I must be losing my mind
November 11, 1999
7:51 pm
Avatar
jwt
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I don't have anyone to talk to about this and I need some outside viewpoints. I have been married for 25 years to a woman who believes she loves me. We just don't seem to connect. I'm not sure that we ever did. We seem to live in different worlds...she is an optimist with a quick answer to all of life's poblems...unfortunately she has never seemed to understand how I feel about things. No amount of explaing or discussion helps her see how I feel most of the time. After years of this, I'm so depressed that I don't want to go on. There is just no spark for me anymore either emotionally or physically.
I met a woman at work who brightens my whole world and turns me on like no one ever has. She says that she loves me and the physical attraction is more than mutual. I told her that I loved her 2 years ago. I knew that we probably had no future becuase she was already involved with a man for 5+ years who was divorcing his wife for her. I know she loves this man and will wait for him. Unfortunately, I'm still in love with her. I expect them to be "going public" with their relationship within the next few months. Even though I know it is there, I'm not sure that I can stand it in my face everyday. For the sake of my sanity, my marrage and her relationship, I want to change relocate to a job in another state. My assistant still says she loves me and is begging me not to leave her. All I see ahead is pain if I stay. I posted a previous message "I know I'm a Fool" and was told that people just don't put enough effort in their marrages anymore. I was told to go to counseling. Well, I know me and I'm not going to go to marrage counseling. I'm also not going to go to a doctor for my depression. I know that cognative tharapy and some drugs would just fix this all up. Not going to happen. I'm going to have to solve this on my own. I'm miserable in my marrage, have no future with my assistant and need to get out of here. Help me......what do I do?

November 12, 1999
10:49 am
Avatar
Cici
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

You have presented possibly the only solution to your problem, as you have said, you want to leave. Consider for a moment, though, what leaving would entail. Often, (as I have fallen prey to in the past) we run away from our problems, but since the problems are internal, stemming from our own attitude and how we interact with our world around us, we find that even after we run away, we eventually have the same problems or worse.

Counseling is often helpful, whatever your source of trauma or conflict is. But it's interesting to note that even the most severe Mood and Personality disorders cannot be treated without cooperation from the patient.

There is a stigma attatched to receiving counseling, to this day. It helps to have an objective person to relay your problems to, sometimes, because when we are entrenched in a conflict (interpersonal or personal) it can be difficult to see and think clearly. The whole "forest for the trees" analogy.

My question to you is a challenge. You ask for help, but you give no options for suggestions other than the option you have already decided to take: leaving. Why? Are you seeking validation for your decision? In the end, you are responsible for you and no decision you make for yourself needs to be justified externally.

So here's the clincher...often a person who is internally conflicted reflects this through his or her interpersonal relationships, which are often either stormy or completely detattched. It harkens back to the idea that internal balance leads to external balance. Upon reflection and honest work, the conflicted person can begin to see things clearly and resolve the associated problems. That's where a counselor can help, by guiding you through that process of internal reflection and eventual self-acceptance (they did spend five to eight years getting a degree so they can know how to do this).

I always think about the process like this:

Accurate Perception-->Self-examination-->Self-Acceptance

Often it takes an objective, informed observer to lead you through the hardest step, the first one.

Good luck.

November 12, 1999
4:07 pm
Avatar
daizy
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 29, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Exeptional words Cici. I was also going to ask, why do you post if you only leave one option for yourself. You have already ruled out counseling or a doctors help and you seem to have chosen self healing. Could or would you tell us why you choose not to seek a helping hand?

November 12, 1999
7:14 pm
Avatar
jwt
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Well daizy, I'm not sure why I posted the message except that I don't have anyone else to talk to about this...no one. I too must agree with what Cici had to say. Still, I know me and there is just no way I can dump my whole life on the table for someone. I know I'm screwed up with A LOT of internal conflicts about sex, love, self esteem and probably a lot of other things. I'm not very proud of myself and know I can't sit there, look someone in the eye and tell them about it all. I'm sure that Cici is right and these problems will follow me. I guess I will just have to deal with them one at a time. Maybe keep changing things until something works. My assistant just left my arms and I know I am desperately in love with her even though it is wrong and hopeless. I don't think counseling is going to make me stop loving and wanting her. What else can I do but leave? I don't know what will happen to my marrage if I leave. But, I know I don't want to live without the connection and passion that I've found but didn't know existed for the past 25 years.

November 12, 1999
7:23 pm
Avatar
Cici
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Counseling isn't about dumping your whole life on the table, J. It's about working through concrete problems that you have RIGHT NOW. A good therapist will encourage those who want to talk about their past to talk, or help those who don't do what they need to do.

As for love, as adults, we are faced with a lot of choices. Each choice is the doorway to a different path. A good decision maker is able to see at least partially what kind of path each decision leads to. Surely you cannot stop loving someone, but it's about control. I must ask you here to think about someone other than yourself: your assistant. Dragging her into your life at this point would drag her into your problems. Do you want that for her?

At some point we all must realize that in order to have anything other than fleeting happiness, we MUST understand and accept ourselves. If you don't take steps to figure out what's wrong with you, no external crutch, even the most devoted love, can help you.

I'm asking you now to do something...write whatever comes to mind. A letter to someone, anything. This is a completely anonymous message board. We don't know who you are, where you live, what you look like, even how old you are. Just sit here, for at least 20 minutes, and write something, anything. Then we'll see where we can go from there.

November 12, 1999
8:28 pm
Avatar
J. C.
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Hi, jwt. I know why you posted. Same reason why everyone else finds this board and writes on it. You need to talk to someone who isn't going to be personally affected by what you have to say. By coming here you won't hurt your wife and you can start sorting out your feelings. Writing is theraputic in itself. I found it quite relieving to come here and just release all these emotions that I feel obligated to hide from the people around me. By coming here, I think you are already getting some of the help you need...no matter what our response is.

~JC

November 12, 1999
8:40 pm
Avatar
Anonymous
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

jwt, I get the strong impression that you are non commital to your wife, mistress and yourself.
You choose your mistress because she is unable to truly commit to you and you to her, your wife ( you cheat on her and have no real emotional closeness to speak of, or so it seems)
yourself- you refuse analysis, afraid of facing yourself.
INTIMACY...KEY WORD-CORE ISSUE FOR YOU MY MAN!

November 13, 1999
12:17 am
Avatar
jwt
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Wow, thank all of you for taking the time to help. In a way, all of you are right. Cici, love involves choices. My assistant says that we cannot be together. She doesn't want to break up another marrage. I don't want to hurt my wife. She knows she would have to move from the small community where her kids are still in school and where she has many friends. She has loved and cared for this man for a long time. By marrying him, she hopes she can continue the life she has had there for 17 years. Unfortunately, his attitudes are very much like her former husband who made her miserable. There also appears to be a problem in bed. Nevertheless, she is tired of being alone and has made a choice to stay with the relationship for the foreseeable future. Probably a good choice on her part. Also, Cici, you are absolutely right about not wanting to drag her into all of my problems. I love her too much. Funny though, this woman seems to bring out the best in me where my wife never could. We are very much alike and I have learned a lot about myself from her. We click in so many ways that it breaks my heart to never have the chance to be together. She knows that I am working on a move and cries when she thinks about it. We want to stay in each other's life. Both of us feel guilty about cheating and have tried to stop. Unfortunately, the physical attraction is very strong and we can't seem to keep our hands off each other. Everyone involved deserves a marrage were husband and wife are committed to each other. Something has to give. I just don't know what else to do but leave. Maybe tears is right too...maybe I am afraid of intimacy. I fear that my marrage will not long survive even if I move...I will just be more alone.

November 15, 1999
10:54 am
Avatar
Cici
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

You can't have intimacy or mutual respect, affection and communication if you don't communicate with your partner.

We live in a society that has a 50% divorce rate. Why is this? Why is this is in America? It's so easy for us to give in. I had a discussion with my father about this. He's 70, my mother is 48. They have a very interesting relationship. I asked him if he still loved my mom, he said he didn't know, but since he made a commitment to her 30 years ago he will uphold his commitment. He said life is about choices, and dealing with teh choices you've made, not running away form them.

Imagine what your wife feels...trapped in a loveless marriage with a man who doesn't love you and doesn't want to try to be with you. You would wonder why he bothered to marry you in the first place...

November 15, 1999
3:31 pm
Avatar
BROC
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 29, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Just a question from a silent observer.

Why would stay in a relationship, ANY relationship if you don't want to be in it anymore?

I am specifically speaking of the people out there who for one reason or another got married, but it wasn't "right". Meaning, they got married because they were depserate, got pregnant, did it to rebel, CODEPENDENCY issues, etc. Make sense?

I see you speak about "issues". I see you discuss the pro's and con's. I see all the advice, but sometimes it seems you all contradict yourselves.

You tell us about "issues", and how much they affect our lives. How unhealthy it is to be codependent, and to walk around with "issues" running/ruining our lives. But then you turn around and say "hang in there", committment, etc.

November 15, 1999
9:20 pm
Avatar
gal-ff
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

your assistant is breaking up one marriage to be with another man, yet she still wants you to not leave her? talk about wanting your cake and eating it too. she gets 2 devoted men, your getting the "sparks" that you claim you can't get from your wife, and your wife is getting shafted. by that i mean, you are devoting so much energy into a hopeless relationship. it takes 2 to make sparks. maybe your not living up to your part of that with your wife. it sounds like the girlfriend has some major issues of her own..maybe you should show her some of the co-dependency threads...does your wife even know that something is wrong in your marriage?

November 16, 1999
12:43 pm
Avatar
Cici
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

BROC -

Unfortunately, we live in a culture that condones everything disposable. From razors to relationships, in America it is considered acceptible to just throw it away if it doesn't please you immediately and completely.

Here's the thing: we all have issues. Psychological issues that range from anxiety to dependency to anger, all of which have a basis in our past experiences and models. Just because you didn't grow up in "Leave it to Beaver" doesn't mean you can throw away relationships left and right because you can't find a person with the same weird problems as you.

So we work on ourselves. Our partners work on themselves. We try to grow and change with each other, we try to make things healthy and good between us, because committed relationships are about COMMITMENT, mutual respect, affection. We try because we made that promise to ourselves. And if, after years of struggle, the other person cannot or will not meet you half way, only then can you really say it is necessary to break ties. If they are abusive, emotionally of physically, if they are subject to an untreatable personality disorder like Narcissitsic PD or Anitsocial PD, then no matter how you try and no matter what you promised, it's out of your hands and you have to let go to save yourself.

In America, almost 50% of marriages will fail. Because people won't try. My parents will have been married 32 years this March. I asked my dad if he stil loved my mom. He said, "I don't really know. I respect her. I admire her. I can't see living without her. And I made a promise years ago to stay with her. So I will."

November 16, 1999
8:22 pm
Avatar
jwt
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Again, thank all of you for trying to help. The one comment that seems most true to me is that my wife is getting shafted. She is the same sweet person I married 25 years ago. I guess I'm the one who changed. I feel emotions that I had either forgotten or, I believe, never felt before. I know I don't want to stop feeling again. Communication has always been an issue. My wife knows that I have been unhappy for years. She seems to cope with my day-to-day depression by telling herself that the problems come from my job or just about anything else outside our marrage. When I don't talk about what is bothering me and just act down, she just goes on being her cheerful self as if nothing is wrong. Whenever I try to talk about problems in our marrage, she gets upset or she will say it is too late to talk and will go to bed. Every single time, she will try to convince me that whatever it is, is really my fault. Since the problem lies elsewhere, she never changes her behavior and nothing ever improves. Making an effort to communicate is not my problem. This has been the pattern for 25 years. I am an only child and all of my close relatives are dead. The closest relatives I have are an aunt and some first cousins in another state. I don't really have any close friends to talk to about my problems. And, remember, I am NOT going to see a counselor. I think this is one of the things that drew me to my assistant. We have long talks about our lives and feelings. I came from a "Leave It to Beaver" childhood. She grew up with a series of stepfathers, one of whom abused her sexually. Inspite of our different backgrounds, we see life in much the same way and seem to understand how the other one feels about what is happening. I often see myself when she tells me how she feels. It makes me want to help her. Sometimes I can. Sometimes the problems are beyond my power to fix. Still, I think I know how she feels. I am not sure I ever have felt this way about my wife. Cici, you say I shouldn't run from my problems. With my assistant in my everyday life, I know that I have no chance of solving my marrage problems. The attraction is just too strong. Soon, I fear that the pain will also be too strong. Do I have a real alternative to leaving?

November 17, 1999
6:00 am
Avatar
gal-ff
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

jwt
Your wife and yourself won't stand a chance as long as you are near the assistant. I, in no way, believe that you should stay with someone that makes your life miserable, BUT if your assistant is no longer an issue, then you might have a chance. You need to be honest with yourself. Your assistant is in love with another man, why are you even still in that picture? Even if you got with your assistant, do you really think that you could ever trust her? It takes 2 to make passion. Have you really been trying with your wife or have you tied all your feelings up into your assistant? I wish you the very best. gal

November 17, 1999
5:23 pm
Avatar
VRJ
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 27, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Dear jwt

It appears that both of your relationships are unhealthy. That is just a sign that you need healing. Unhealthy people are drawn to unhealthy people. Work on becoming healthy yourself and all the rest will fall into place. Peace.

November 18, 1999
8:17 am
Avatar
everblue
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

jwt,

You said your wife is the same person you married 25 years ago, but then you said she never changes her behavior to adjust to you. What is it that you want her to do? Do you want her to become more like you assistant? If you really decide to work on your marriage, you need to set a date and time in advance with your wife, making her aware that you have some issues to talk about, and making sure she knows that she has to talk to you for the sake of the marriage. It sounds like she is either living in a state of denial or really has no idea what's going on. If you are too stubborn to talk to a counselor and she is too stubborn to talk to you, your problems will never improve until someone gets over that. Good luck.

November 18, 1999
11:16 am
Avatar
BROC
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 29, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Ci Ci,

Interesting reply. I am not really new to all this. I have been here a long time. Used to post alot, but then just faded into the background for awhile. So again, thanks for your response.

The divorce rate is actually much higher than fifty percent. I read an article somewhere ? that we (the U.S.) actually have a committe that is studying and keeping track of this stuff now. They estimate a rate of almost 55 - 60%. Now, how much WOULD that increase if all the people that wanted a divorce did so? I am talking about the ones who won't leave because they are scared to be alone, abused and afraid, can't because of finances, etc. 10% more? 20?

I look around at ALL the relationships I know and just shake my head. Take those in my office for example. There are 7 of us. I finally have a relatihip that is healthy....it took thousands of dollars in counseling as well as books, groups, this site, etc. to CHANGE. My girlfriend has had therapy before, and is doing more now. Thats how we met. We are on the same "page". Lorraine has been married 14 years, but does ALL the work at home while her husband comes home and plays games on the computer. She massages his feet, makes his lunch, etc. Happy, she says is.....ok. Other comments from her would indicate she wants better. Thats the good ones. Ann has been married for 10 years, hasn't had sex with him in the last eight years. She is in therapy, he is not. They are just roomates. She told me thats the best she will get and so she will justlearn to be happy. Ron, forget it. He is lost. Spencer, married, two kids. Timebomb waiting to go off. Karl, married forever. Wife is mean, control freak. He is scared of her. Admitted to me that he is scared she would leave him if he spoke up. He works till 9-10 pm so he can avoid her. Lynn, been married 5 times. Current boyfriend much the same as all the rest. Looks very sad. They are going to try counseling. Thats just the people I work with. My friends, relatives, and aquaaintances, much the same. Sick, unhealthy, miserable.

I have learned many things in my "recovery", and this I can tell you. I don't give a rats ass what promise you made to someone...yesteday, today, or 20 years ago. If you aren't happy you have the right to get happy. Ususally, probably 99% of the time it has to do with your issues you never resolved, as well as your mates. Now, once you realize this you must resolve these issues, as well as your mate MUST do the same. You work on you, they on them. Then you will succeed. DO NOT WORK ON THE RELATIONSHIP. That is the most common mistake. This only leads to conflict, power struggles, etc. IF you worry about you and resolve YOUR issues, and they theirs, the rest WILL take care of itself. The "us" will come together. This I have learned over and over.

SO, sorry for going on and on. Sometimes I wish (only for split seconds) that I could go back to the old broc. Ignorance is/was bliss. But now I know to much. Now I know that 96% of the folks out there need help, and the other four percent are in denial.

So, thats my two cents Ci Ci.

Thanks for your "ear", or is it eyes?

Broc

PS - Bottom line: If you both don't see or realize their is a problem, and can BOTH admit 50% responsibility, and BOTH get some therapy, and BOTH work on resolving their OWN issues, then forget it. IT WILL NEVER EVER IN A MILLION YEARS WORK!

November 18, 1999
12:11 pm
Avatar
Cici
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

jwt -

Leave and go where? do what? with whom? not your wife, who is obviously in strong denial. Not your assistant, who has made it clear that she is committed to someone else and will stay that way.

What is it you want? to be happy? to be fulfilled? None of these things will happen until you work to be balanced yourself.

November 18, 1999
12:20 pm
Avatar
Cici
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Broc -

"What philosopher and lunatic had in common, Frankl went on to explain, is the certainty that happiness can be attained by furious pursuit and a consequent rage at the unsatisfying results. His useful word for this is "hyperintention," a tendency that only inflames what is usually the real problem, our own self-centeredness. 'Everything can be taken away from man but one thing - to choose one's attitude in a given set of circumstances, to choose one's own way.' The sane are those who accept this charge and do not expect happiness by right. "

- Viktor Frankl, in an interview with Matthew Scully.

There is an high rate of dysfunctional adult realtionships in America because they are built on dysfunctional people. A healthy relationship involves two independent people coming together out of free choice and staying together out of free choice.

No one signed a contact at birth that said we are all guaranteed happiness. People live in worlds of their own creation and preception, and in the end they choose to be unhappy, because it is easier to do that then actually think. They choose to define themselves through the relationships they have had and have now, rather than defining themselves on their own terms. No one wants to take responsibility for themselves any more. We have become adept at blaming other people and other things for our problems.

November 18, 1999
12:58 pm
Avatar
jwt
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

To all who have tried to help...THANK YOU...It is a little scary asking for advice from strangers but all of you seem to care about others who are having problems. Just a few thoughts about your comments:

gal-ff: Amen. You addressed a concern that have been in my head for some time. I think I have been honest with myself. No, I don't think I would be able to trust my assistant if we were together. I would allways be worried that there was someone else like me out there in her life. As for passion, during the past 25 years, I have NEVER felt the passion I have felt for the past 2 years with my assistant. Both women seem to really enjoy the sexual side of our relationship. However, their reactions to it are very different. My wife has always been very passive and within herself. My assisstant seems to be as involved and enthusiastic as I am. I don't want to go through the rest of my life without passion. I'm not sure that is something you can teach or learn.

VRJ: All three relationships involved here are between unhealthy people. All of us seem to have major problems with our lives. My wife may be the most healthy of the bunch. My origninal question remains...it appears that I must leave to have any chance of resolving any of my problems.

everblue: Where do I start to describe the behavior that I would like my wife to change? She seems to live in her own little world and has trouble accomplishing anything. She is not very domestic. She does the laundry and some yard work. The house is always dirty (I not talking about clutter...I mean filth)and I am so sick of fast food dinners I could scream. I don't think she has washed a window during our entire married life. I am a neat person and try to clean up my own messes. I tried for years to do the housecleaning so everything wouldn't look so nasty. My job demands have increased and most days are 12+ hours. I just don't have the time anymore. Plus, I think I may have just given up trying to fight the ocean of dirt. This is just an example. Very little else gets accomphished around here without my direct involvement. She would rather just sit and read, watch TV or play on the computer. Yes, my wife is in denial. She knows that I love my assistant and I think sees her as a threat. Nevertheless, she has not done anything to make herself more appealing or to interfere with that relationship. I know I wouldn't react that way. Do I want her to act like my assistant? Well, a sense of humor and a little ambition would help.

BROC: I see the same relationships around me that you do. I spent the past 25 years focused on my career, our daughter and day-to-day problems. I am at the top of my career in terms of money, success and future opportunities. Our daughter is away at college. I had never questioned my marrage. I guess I just accepted that it was the way it was. Then my assistant came into my life and I realized that it didn't have to be that way. Maybe I do have a chance to be really happy with someone somewhere. It may not turn out to be with my assistant but I know now that it is possible. Knowledge can be a dangerous thing. What do I do now?

November 18, 1999
2:14 pm
Avatar
Jaskid
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

jwt,

Let me tell you passion can be taught. Your wife might feel uncomfortable with letting herself go with sex.There could be a self esteem issue or she just has never explored her passionate side.....everyone has one but not everyone finds it.....help her!... the first thing to do to start talking about it. Tell her exactly what you are feeling!! My husband and I have been together for 17yrs(Dated 8 married 9) and it was not until about 3 yrs ago I started opening up and enjoying sex. You see I thought our sex was fine until I found out he was calling 900# and going to all of the sex sites on the internet. I was crushed! And so will your wife be if you do not start opening up to her about your feelings! My husband said he wanted a little more passion. See for a women sex with her husband is usually just an intimate way to show the love between them but I have found out it is much more with a husband. Sometimes they just want plain sweaty, mad passionate sex. Believe me there is a horny side to most women.... find it.... You might be surprised what your wife has in her, and you might even fall in love with her all over again. I am usually not this forward about my sex life but in your case I feel this could make or break your marriage. And there is no doubt that for your marriage to survive this other women must get out of the picture and stay out. Did you tell you wife about this other women?

Jaskid

November 18, 1999
3:01 pm
Avatar
BROC
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 29, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Jaskid, JWT, etc.

I am curious? Are you saying that if his wife "opens" up sexually that that will solve the problem?

Depending on your definition of passion, it may be possible to teach it. CiCi was right on when she/he said that a relationship, a healthy fulfilling one is one where two INDEPENDENT people come together and form a union not as "one", but as two working toward a common goal. Passion is a part of that effort. It is passion that drives that effort. Passion isn't in your pants. Its within the heart. It is what gives you the zest for life; your family, your job, your mate, etc.

If passion can be taught as your saying, I am assuming you mean on the part of the individual in need of passion, not the person on the other end. Make sense?

In other words, JWT cannot teach his wife passion. Passion comes within, and to think otherwise is codependent thinking. She must look within HERSELF for anything she wants, WITHIN HER! He could stand on his head, do anything he can think of to get her to "see" her, and it won't make a hill of beans. Its within her, not him.

Now, this isn't to say its all her. Quite the contrary. he has a train load of issues himself or he wouldn't be where he is right now.

Now, Jaskid. This passion and sex thing you have going on. So you found the 900 #'s laying around and decided to put on some leather and smack him with a buggy whip. Did that REALLY change, I mean CHANGE your relationship. I would bet not. Maybe short term, but I can tell you as a guy that used to do that shit too the change is short term at best.

There is a reason you weren't open to that before, and there is a reason he went elsewhere for excitement. Sex may be great now, but if you don't look deeper, the problem will arise again. Its just like alcoholism....drinking isn't the problem, but only a symptom of the problem. Know what I mean?????

My prediction on JWT based on hundreds of hours of therapy, this site, a mountain of books, lectures, group meetings, etc. You know it too, but since he isn't privy to all this info. and lingo (since he wont go to counseling I am assuming this) I will write out his future.

His wife is who she is, and he is who he is. Without a serious look within each of them, they will die exactly as they are today. this is a universal truth we ALL live by. The old saying goes, "If nothing changes, nothing changes!" This is sad but true. And since JWT doesn't want any therapy, his issues will continue to wreck havoc on his life. He will continue his codependency by moving away, changing jobs, buying a new car, etc. etc. etc. in an effort to "make" himself happy.....looking OUTSIDE of himself for the happiness he is longing for. And eventually he will realize once again that he is no happier than he was in the first place. He will then blame it on his ex wife, his assistant, his new locattion, his new girlfriend, etc. And the saddest part of all? His children, relatives, and even himself will pay the price of HIM NOT LOOKING IN THE MIRROR, TAKING RESPONSBILITY FOR 50% OF WHERE HE IS AT IN LIFE, FINDING OUT WHAT IN THE HELL IS WRONG WITH HIS INNER CHILD, AND FIXING IT. BECAUSE ONLY HE CAN DO IT.

Whew! Sorry folks, its frustation. My own codepency coming out. Its just that I know how this story ends. I wish to God more people would take responsbility for their place and life and take steps to fix it. Life my friends is predictable. We are creatures of habit. We ALL repeat our lifes patterns. ALL OF US. It doesn't matter who you are, how rich you are, anything!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Until YOU change YOU, your life WILL, positively, guranteed, without a doubt remain the same pile of shit that it is today. That is if it is a pile of shit, and by the statistics, it would indicate so.

Think of how different our society would be if we solved our issues......OUR OWN ISSUES!

Its so easy, but impossible for most to do. It involves looking in the mirror, and admitting our faults, and taking steps to fix them. Couseling a MUST folks. We aren't smart enough to realize what it is within us that causes us to act out.

Anyway, thats my two cents.

Broc

November 18, 1999
3:14 pm
Avatar
BROC
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 29, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Cici,

Your last post was right on. Here is a question for the ages.

My old group, girlfriend, etc. Man, were we really screwed up. That is what i NOW see. Back then, it was fun, but chaotic. We were "happy" by our own definition. But there was ALWAYS a struggle. Friction, you name it. Then I got out of that group, and got some help. Boy, what a different view I have now.

Backstabbing, cheating, lieing were everyday. Everyone of us did it. It was terrible. I still hear of the old group. Same shit going on.

This is what still stumps me.

Why didn't I see the right way sooner? Why can't we that have seen the light, and all those that are still blind, see the light and make the change so that we can all experience true happiness?

Make sense?

Why isn't the word out? Why isn't the issue of issues more well known? Why can't we see that there is a better way?

Why do they stay stuck? Even when some of them KNOW there is a better way?

Broc

November 18, 1999
3:40 pm
Avatar
eve
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Broc, you are quite harsh with a lot of people at once.
I think jaskid is not wrong in saying that the sex life can change for a woman, especially the fact that passion or at least sexual feelings CAN be "in your pants" is somthing that can be qite new to a woman, because of the way we are educated and trained not to be "bitchy". And this certainly does change sex life :-). It must be different for men?

And I think to refuse counseling is not a major failing like you put it, but rather something that has to do with fears, uncertainty and so on. So, JWT, can you tell us why you dont't want to? Fear? Too expensive? Have you tried it before and it didn't help? Why not give it a try?

And, this is to Broc again: i share your desperation when I see how a lot of people seem to make their lifes miserable on purpose. But I'm not in their shoes, so I try not to judge.
Eve

November 18, 1999
3:43 pm
Avatar
Jaskid
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

BROC,

I hear exactly what you are saying and you are probably right. No, adding a little excitement to our sex life did not change our relationship. I think our relationship has always been a passionate one. Yes I do agree passion is in the heart. And definitely, until you change you, you will live that same pile of crap. Thanks broc, you made me realize a lot of things I forgot.
Jaskid

Forum Timezone: UTC -8
Most Users Ever Online: 247
Currently Online:
45
Guest(s)
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
onedaythiswillpass: 1134
zarathustra: 562
StronginHim77: 453
free: 433
2013ways: 431
curious64: 408
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 49
Members: 110924
Moderators: 5
Admins: 3
Forum Stats:
Groups: 8
Forums: 74
Topics: 38537
Posts: 714209
Newest Members:
delight1080, laticia1, Corties, patrickstayes, kevinkovalsky, izzy39
Moderators: arochaIB: 1, devadmin: 9, Tincho: 0, Donn Gruta: 0, Germain Palacios: 0
Administrators: admin: 21, ShiningLight: 572, emily430: 29

Copyright © 2019 MH Sub I, LLC. All rights reserved. Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Cookie Policy | Health Disclaimer