Avatar
Please consider registering
guest
sp_LogInOut Log In sp_Registration Register
Register | Lost password?
Advanced Search
Forum Scope


Match



Forum Options



Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters
sp_TopicIcon
I have a bad counselor
September 8, 2005
9:48 pm
Avatar
kaju
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

I have a bad counselor. My insuarance will only cover one counselor in my area so it seems Im stuck with him. I dont have time to go into too many details as to why I feel he is a bad counselor. But instance he says it is wrong for me to teach my kids the proper names for there body parts. (9 & 11) he says its wrong for me to teach my children about sex or have "the talk" when my children are comming home from school telling me things they have learned from there friends which is bad information or wrong info about sex. I could go no but I wont because of time and space restraints. WHAT DO I DO?

September 8, 2005
10:02 pm
Avatar
HOLLY BERRY
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 29, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

GET RID OF THE COUNSELOR!

Your children need honest answers so they will not become obsessed by the things they hear at school.

My grandmother once told me, when I was 12 years old, and joking about sex, that sex was one of the most beautiful experiences two people could have, if they love each other. She didn't love my grandfather, but she did not want to disillusion me. I remember her words now, some 39 years later. This was my first real conversation about sex with someone who knew what they were talking about.

Your children will gain much more intelligence if you are honest with them. What counselor would tell you it is wrong to use anatomical names for sexual body parts? Is this counselor really reputable? I doubt it, but why does your insurance cover only this person?

Can you go somewhere else, like a clinic that basis fees on salary?

Can you call the Customer Service department of your insurance company and complain?

GOOD LUCK - HB

September 8, 2005
11:17 pm
Avatar
kaju
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

thank you for answering so quick! It is because Im on medicade. its not just the questions about sex that has me questioning his copetancy.Im ready to just drop the counseling all together. I just got a devorcetwo years ago and am raising these kids the best I can but they have anger issues from the divorce, so I felt they needed the counseling. I feel this is making maters worse. I dont even know how to ask the question for the answer Im looking for. Lets see....Where can I look to give me definitive answers as to do you have a good or bad counseler? or is there some kind of litmus test. I dont know enough to even ask the right questions. this is where I need the help.

September 8, 2005
11:25 pm
Avatar
cpt1212
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 27, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Kaju--

There are things that are universally considered unethical and you can find that info on a lot of different websites. Choosing a counselor is a very individual thing. One that is right for me, may not be the best fit for you. You don't need a litmus test, just trust your instinct. Time in therapy can be very helpful, but a poor experience can make an already difficult situation worse. My sister is also on medicaid and she had a counselor for her and her children that was inappropriate and unprofessional. There were other options for her although she had to drive farther. She has since started taking her kids to a very reputable therapist who does not take medicaid but does offer a GREATLY reduced fee.

September 9, 2005
7:32 am
Avatar
Worried_Dad
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 43
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Well, a really bad counselor can leave you crazier than when you started, so you do need to get your head around what this counselor's strong and weak points really are. If you don't like or trust your counselor, it will be hard to have a therapeutic relationship.

There are some things you can do short of firing your counselor. Like taking what he/she says with a grain or two of salt. LEt your counselor just be an educated person who can offer you insight.

I would like to hear more about what makes you worry about your counselor.

September 9, 2005
7:34 am
Avatar
Worried_Dad
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 43
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

http://www.ric.edu/jriolo/stayaway.htm

“THERAPISTS TO STAY AWAY FROM WITH A 10 FT. POLE”

By John A. Riolo, PhD

Now this next piece probably going to upset some of my colleagues. I can almost hear them right now. However we all have a right to an opinion and these are my opinions. They are free to have theirs and I will give then fair coverage on Critic’s Corner or in any reasonable manner we can negotiate. Actually, I am indebted to a one psychiatrist and a psychoanalytic colleague for suggesting this topic and for helping me find the courage to write it.
First there are the obvious taboos. Some therapists will for whatever reason try to develop romantic or sexual relationship with their patients. It’s against the law in most states and against just about every professional code of ethics. Other boundary difficulties* such as getting into business relationships with patients etc. In addition, there are the more subtle, but , no less dangerous behaviors as the those therapists who prey on their patients. These include practicing based on “questionable ideas and propositions” which can be defined as quackery. The fact that in most cases the practitioner has no clue that what they are doing is potentially harmful is not the issue. As they say, the road to Hell is paved with good intentions.
Every therapists has a list of practitioners to whom that they would not want to see treat their worst enemy. After over thirty years of practice, my list grows longer. It is not personal nor should not be. I actually like some of the people on my "Stay away" list as people. , But, simply think they should be doing something else for a living. And, I will bet that I can be found on similar lists of others. Unlike the ideal list, no names here. It would be ungracious and who wants to defend yourself in a label suit even if you can win. But, here are the clues so you identify them yourself.
I will say it again for the record, this is not a condemnation on any one theory of human behavior, but rather the way some therapists choose to practice and implement valid theories in invalid ways.
What are the clues to look or listen for in a therapist to avoid?
"Out There" or " X-File" type comments meant in all seriousness are real Red Flags. Now give the therapist the benefit of doubt to see if a they were using metaphor, which they should explain clearly or they were joking. Sometimes we all say things that are only funny to us and is not taken as funny.
Examples of Red Flags: (Click on booked marked items for more details)
1. Lack of candor
2. Impossible claims
3. Disembodied unconscious
4. Fast and loose with facts
5. Transfer the Transference
6. "Two faced"
7. Protecting you From yourself
8. Shows disregard for abandonment concerns
9. Fails to keep up to date with the current research, standards of practice and laws
10. Indiscriminate use of aggressive debt collection methods such as collection agencies

Comments
John A. Riolo, PhD

• Candor, or the lack of it - Is it important to you? It is to me. What would you do if your therapist truly believes that to be candid with you would be to patronize you? I know at least one therapist who said just that and there are too many who seem to agree with that statement. I think they have things mixed up. So ask your therapist about how candid he/she will be with you. Now of course if they are not candid they will not tell you, but watch their eyes, body language and listen. Does it sound like psychobabble?

• Impossible Claims - Many therapists are generalists. That is we treat a variety of people and types of problems. However, beware of any therapist who claims that they can treat anyone and everyone with just about any problem. And if they claim that can treat everyone with only one theory or approach, that is another reason to get away fast. Such therapists are like a child who just received a toy hammer for their birthday. They need to nail everything. Don't get nailed.

• Disembodied Unconscious - If they say, "Your unconscious is telling me... etc. Or, your unconscious is speaking to my unconscious. That's" Out There". I mean that is really "Out There''. Hope that they meant it as lose metaphor. However, if so they should explain it that way. Your unconscious or anyone’s unconscious does not have its own vocal cords or sensory organs. It does not speak. That therapist's auditory part of their brain is hearing voices and it's not your voice. In addition, you have no way to refute what your therapist thinks your unconscious is saying. You cannot even get a second opinion. You cannot win. Stay away.

• Fast and Loose with Facts - If your therapists says something like, I interpret things, say whatever pops into my mind, and don't worry about facts. ..... I accept that I do interpret and judge. That is how I make sense of the world especially the people world, think about that statement. Think about it real hard. You will be judged, not on facts but by whatever pops into your therapist’s head? What more can I say? Except to consider the following example.

Therapists often make interpretations of our behavior and statements. If they make interpretations that fit us, it can be helpful. If they interpret in ways that have nothing to do with us, they can cause harm. Sometimes a great deal of harm! Some therapists can't seem to help themselves making interpretations. They do it to patients, colleagues. Its one of the reasons why therapists have such a poor track record in relationships themselves. They can't stop interpreting and they are wrong more often as not.
Suppose you told your therapist either in an individual session or in a joint or marital session that in your marriage relationship sexual fidelity is important but not as important as other types of fidelity. There are many people and cultures that hold that view. The therapist then says, based on little else, “It looks to me, like you're looking for an excuse to cheat”. Based on nothing more than that! You try to explain that that is not what you were saying, but this therapists adds, “..but I don't buy it”.
Some therapists will make interpretations about you but, it may have more to do with their fears and needs. Do they make any effort to understand you before they make such judgments? The sad part is it's like the joke that therapists are preoccupied with sex that everything you say in a therapy session is about sex. With some it seems that way. They are like that kid with the toy hammer. They have to nail everything. It’s no joke if you are in the receiving end of their hammer. Immature children should not play with hammers unsupervised. The danger of making interpretations about unconscious material is that you never know whoes unconscious is coming out. It could be theirs and not yours.
A useful interpretation in therapy is based on at least some facts. it's not concocted out of the air. It requires gathering facts, and the therapist’s skill, experience and feedback from you to see it it's on the money.. Most important, it requires your consent to have your thoughts interpreted. Otherwise, it is dangerous. Some therapists are like surgeons who will cut into anything close by when nothing is wrong or when their interpretation is not requested or needed.
Would you have any trust in such a therapist? If your therapist wrote that in a record about you, could others believe it, even if it were not true? Try to explain that to your spouse. The expert thinks your are looking for an excuse! When in fact it may be the expert desperately looking to sound knowledgeable or even funny. When you confront such therapists, they have ways of avoiding the issue. You are resisting some will say. You are in denial. When truly pushed they might back off and claim they were joking. That gets difficult. Suppose they were simply making a joke that, you did not get. How do you know for sure? Therapists often use humor to lighten up the mood. A good joke is hard to miss, a bad one needs advanced warning. Humor often comes in the context of a situation. What if however, you over heard them to say on the same subject:
‘Yes, I could forgive an extravagant purchase easily. even a bankruptcy...but sexual infidelity. never...relationship over. or, Whether they divorce or not is not the point. Many stay married even though they are miserable and the marriage is basically over. Most of the women I know are in marriages and are unhappy, but they don't want to go through all the trouble of divorce.”[1]
So, if someone takes a second mortgage on the house and buys a Mercedes sports car, drops a bundle at a casino or goes off for a month at a fancy fat farm, without mentioning it to their spouse that is just a minor extravagant purchase, no problem. But a ‘nooner’ in a motel is the end of a marriage? Fortunately, statistically people are not as down on marriage as some marriage therapists. Many people don't just see things as that black and white.
But whose needs are being met by therapists who make fast and lose interpretations. Odds are it’s not yours. However you be the judge.

• Transfers the transference - A therapist says, “Your objection to my raising my fees is symbolic of some deeper transference issue.” Right! Look, your therapist has every right to set any fee he or she chooses unless he/she voluntarily signed away that right such as to a managed care company by contract. You on the other hand, have every right to object, negotiate and/or not buy what your therapist is selling. It’s business. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise. Test it and see. Pay your therapist in “Monopoly” money and ask him or her to discuss its symbolism and what it means to him/her till the cows come home. See if he or she buys that. If they don’t, why should you? It will also check whether your therapists really worries about some facts. Bet they do.

• "Two Faced"- How consistent is your therapist in their statements and actions? Now, to be clear, I am talking about their professional life only here. I do not think your therapist’s personal life matters that much. Try not to pry. I know some cross-dressing therapist in their private life who are among the most respected I know professionally. I would send family members to them without hesitation. What I am referring to here is do they say or proclaim things that they don’t practice themselves? Do they ask you or others to behave one way but they are exempt ? Do they for example:

1. Do talk behind people’s backs such as gossiping about other patients or even other colleagues?
2. Do they say things to you about others that they would never say to that other’s face?
3. When they do, do they expect you to keep such gossip confidential?
Confidentiality covers what you say to a therapist in a therapeutic relationship. Or, what one colleague would share to another professional about you, a patient, as part of a conference. However, it does not prevent you from telling the world or compel you to general secrecy. If the therapist does not understand the principle of confidentiality i.e. what it is; when and where it applies, how can they keep confidences you share with them? Also, what could they possibly be saying about you when your back is turned? Odds are a lot and it will not usually be good. Run.
• Protecting you from yourself - This example needs a caveat. Sometimes a patient does need to be protected from him or herself. If you were going to harm yourself or someone else or expose a child to neglect or abuse your therapist must do what they can to protect. But, that should be the exception, not the rule. In general, you should not need protection. Or if a minor, the major responsibility rests with the parents except under extraordinary circumstances, as mentioned above. Therapists can be overprotective and encourage dependency rather than promote independence in several ways.

1. If you choose to end therapy or switch therapists, it is not always resistance or that you are not motivated. It may be you no longer need therapy or you want a change. Assuming resistance encourages unnecessary dependency. You will never be over with therapy with such a therapist until they say it is over. In addition, that may be years and years if ever.
2. If your therapist will not give you access to any part of your record, ask why. If you cannot get a straight answer without psychobabble or gobbledygook, RUN. If they keep “secret notes” sometimes called “psychotherapy or process notes” even from you, again ask why. If they tell you it’s necessary to keep them secret because if you were to see those notes you might feel judged and abused, tell them just knowing that you have such secret notes leads me to question if I have been abused. Tell them to fork them over and you will be the judge of that. Or, perhaps some time down the road, someone else will get access to those secret notes and they will assume that everything is true. Try to prove them wrong.
• Shows disregard or Ignorance for abandonment Concerns - Psychotherapy is a professional service and in that sense your therapist is a business person. They are selling you a service and have every right to make a living and charge and collect fair fees for services rendered. However the difference between psychotherapy, medical service, other professional health services is that a health care professional can not "abandon" you simply for financial considerations alone. Nor can your therapist provide you with less than they honestly think you need, or a service that is not designed to suit your needs simply because you can't afford what you do need. It's a serious dilemma, but one that goes with the territory. If you find your therapist abandoned you, you have rescores. Click here to See Anecdotal examples of Abandonment, Substandard Care and plain Greed . What recourses you have will be discussed soon.

• Fails to keep up to date with the current research, standards and laws -
I think that is self explanatory. Anyone who does not keep current meets the definition of an impaired therapist.
10/20/03
Recently I appeared radio broadcast and mentioned the indiscriminate use of collection agencies as an example of bad practice. Some colleagues contacted me to say that they heard the broadcast and seen the power point presentation of it and asked why when the host of the radio show asked for an example of a "bad therapeutic practice", off all possibilities, I chose an example of a therapist turning debt over to a collection agency. Actually, they were complimentary of my presentation, However were curious as to why I chose that particular example among so many possibilities.

Those who know me or have read any of my writings, know this has been my position for some years. However, it's a fair question and I will give as honest and as kind an answer as possible.

Aggressive collection of patient debt is always risky and dangerous for the patient AND perhaps as much if not more so for the therapist. If done at all, it should only be done in the most extreme of cases and with very serious consideration of the negative consequences for the patient and yourself. I do not recommend it. I can't say that strongly enough. Usually it’s far better to write it off as bad debt. It's business don't let it get personal.

This is not a new position for me. I One of the examples often cite actually occurred in 1994. It is a matter of public record in the press and not a contrived or rhetorical situation in case that someone would wish to believe that. What I left out on the brief comment on my website was this. When I heard that one of my own kind would actually sue one of their own patients for chump change[1][1] it upset me beyond words. So with that patient’s consent ( not my patient at the time BTW) I went down to the therapist’s office ( actually an agency) and paid the dam $12.68 myself. It made the press and the 11 o'clock news or so I was told. You see when you use a collection agency most expect volume and often they often don't discriminate between a true deadbeat and some poor person down on their luck. such indiscriminate use of collection agencies are acts of incredible meanness or stupidity or both.

My views on the matter have not altered. I feel so strongly that turning a client over to a collection agency is bad for our clients and bad for our profession that I am updating my website to include this offer which may also be in a new article on fees that I have started. The offer is this.

IF anyone knows a patient of a mental health professional who:

a) has had their debt turned over to a collection agency,
b) sincerely believes that the therapist harmed them in some way; did not treat them properly or is taking unfair advantage of a power imbalance inherent in a therapist patient relationship, and
c) can present me some creditable independent evidence to support that view,

I will offer my services pro bono for a consultation and referral.

If they obtain a full copy of their records which they should be able to in most states preferably including “psychotherapy notes” which may be possible in many states, I will review the record for “irregularities” i.e. If irregularities seem apparent, I will assist in the patient obtaining legal council and refer to an independent practitioner for a second opinion or educate then on filing complaints with licensing boards, ethic committees etc. It's relative. the clinician may see this as retaliation but the patient may see it as the clinician retaliating for the patient's refusal to pay on poor service. Whose construct is closer to reality?

One thing providers need to keep in mind is that if patients bring a licensing board complaint or malpractice suit or go public it may not be simply because they are angry or have a transference problem or are acting out. It may be because they have actually been harmed by a provider who put their needs before their patients'. The complaint or suit is their way of seeking justice.

As with any product or service, consumers have the right to withhold payment if they received poor service, incompetent service or not what was promised. Obviously, opinions may differ but such differences should be resolved through negotiation or at least attempted. legal action against a patient should be the very last resort not the first.

There I stand by my statement that any therapist who see this as anything but the last resort is to be avoided and if the patient has cause should feel free to exercise legal remedies in self defense.

September 9, 2005
7:35 am
Avatar
Worried_Dad
Member
Members
Forum Posts: 43
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Darn, sorry about the bad formatting--just go to the website.

September 9, 2005
7:48 am
Avatar
Anonymous
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 24, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

there are options.

but they are hard to find.

don't waste your time with a bad counselor.

call your insurance company and ask if there is anyone in a one hour driving radius, the drive may suck, but it would be worth asking. I know my insurance is limited, so I know the frustration.

look for clinics or counseling centers that charge on a sliding fee scale. alot of counselors or therapists advertise sliding fee scale in the yellow pages. our area has a counseling center, and they charge only what you can afford to pay - and I live in the sticks - so I know they are out there. a local church or hospital should have support groups that are free - look into the hospital for anger management classes that might be relatively inexpensive.

call a social worker with your city or town and ask - they might know of options as well.

hope this helps.

September 9, 2005
8:14 am
Avatar
kaju
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

well I really do not believe this counselor is or will do anything unethical. Nor do I believe he will do anything to lead me and my children to harm. I just feel he is incompetant. for many reasons; for insatnce I came to him to help my childrens anger, but my ex-husband got angry because I sent them to counseling and demanded to sit in. the councelor allowed my ex-husband to sit in and take over the session. it has now become a marriage counseling session and my ex-husband is now married and has a baby on the way. I now dread these sessions because they have become bashing sessions againt me from the thearopist nad my ex-husband. my children are not getting the counseling they are supposed to be getting. I know I am giving you very little information to go on but this is because of time and space. I could give you more on him and what the sessions have become and I know I have made mistakes, but I know in my heart this is not right for the kids and me.

September 9, 2005
9:24 am
Avatar
taj64
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

This counselor is biased. He isn't a good therapist. He sounds like he is practicing from another century. Today's kids are growing up much earlier than in the past. They need to be aware of sex, not just for the physical aspects of it, but also prepared on the emotional level. Talking to your kids about these issues especially from the parent because your kids trust you and you know them better than anyone including that counselor. Your kids value your communication and deserve respect. Schools cannot teach everything and also be expected to. It is the parent's role. I would suggest you report him to medicare. As far as anger management, the children have a right to be angry but need to deal with it effectively. Read a book from library on teaching kids to deal with anger. My son has had problems with anger. He has short temper and explodes easily. I have become aware how to deal with him more effectively. We take a break from it, walk away, sometimes I send him outside to take a quick walk and he always comes back and forgets the blow up and we are back to normal. Saying things when they are angry in calm gentle manner, say I know you are angry, is there anything I can do and it will be ok. In my county, they have counseling sessions for children/teens and while they charge per session, they have a sliding scale for people that qualify. They will work with you if you cannot afford it. There is something out there, you just have to do a little checking around. Check with your local county govt (mental health or social services type office). Good luck.

September 9, 2005
9:59 am
Avatar
columbia
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

It sounds like you feel that to quit this counselor would be worse than continuing to see a counselor that isn't helping. I think you have valid concerns. All the above suggestions are good ones. A bad counselling situiation is worse than no counseling at all in my opinion. Remember you were trying to help your kids. Is that happening? I changed counselors when it was evident I was getting worse not better. Also things she would say didn't even have any connection to me or what I was having problems with. Something wasn't right and I could sense it. I still struggle with the problems created there. I was lucky enough to have other alternatives.. Just a suggestion -How about Divorce support group for just you. You may find they have info on helping your kids.

September 9, 2005
2:44 pm
Avatar
kathygy
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

For me the most important thing in a therapist for me is that I feel safe and trust his/her judgement. I need to be able to say anything to my therapist including things I don't like in therapy. I also need to hear things that are helpful to me in my life and that cause me to stretch and grow. I need a therapist that is honest with me and helps me see where I am hurting myself with certain behaviors so that I can change them. I need to feel that my therapist cares about me and supports me. I like to do experiencial work and look for that too.

Have you told your therapist everything you don't like about the therapy? They should be willing to talk it through with you until you feel comfortable.

September 9, 2005
7:23 pm
Avatar
kaju
New Member
Members
Forum Posts: -1
Member Since:
September 30, 2010
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline

Thank you for some of the suggestions. At least now I have some where to look and options to look at. this web sight seems to be even more helpful than the counselor.

Forum Timezone: UTC -8
Most Users Ever Online: 349
Currently Online:
29
Guest(s)
Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)
Top Posters:
onedaythiswillpass: 1134
zarathustra: 562
StronginHim77: 453
free: 433
2013ways: 431
curious64: 408
Member Stats:
Guest Posters: 49
Members: 110960
Moderators: 5
Admins: 3
Forum Stats:
Groups: 8
Forums: 74
Topics: 38560
Posts: 714252
Newest Members:
Cannabeme, charli55, SeaG1ant, shawncanwe, lianot, dagaf
Moderators: arochaIB: 1, devadmin: 9, Tincho: 0, Donn Gruta: 0, Germain Palacios: 0
Administrators: admin: 21, ShiningLight: 572, emily430: 29

Copyright © 2020 MH Sub I, LLC. All rights reserved.
Terms of Use | Privacy Policy | Cookie Policy | Health Disclaimer | Do Not Sell My Personal Information