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I hate men.
April 14, 2004
9:40 am
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artist 2
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April 14, 2004
9:42 am
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Zinnie
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Whats going on?

April 14, 2004
9:47 am
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artist 2
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I'm sorry I just do. They are jerks. The most important thing to men is sex. Anything about caring and respect for another comes second. I hate myself even more for still being attracted to men. It's a part of me I wish I could have surgically removed. And not like unwanted hair either, which tends to come back.

April 14, 2004
9:52 am
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Zinnie
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Has something happened?

April 14, 2004
9:53 am
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nancee
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What's going on? I wondered why I didn't see you around the past couple of days...need to talk?

April 14, 2004
10:07 am
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artist 2
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Just crappy behavior from the online dating scene. I hate them.

One guy I thought was really nice. We chatted back and forth and had some great conversations. Then he says he's going out of town and will call/write when he gets back. Nothing. What a jerk.

April 14, 2004
10:17 am
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nancee
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This is just my opinion, but you can't expect too much from the online dating thing. I've tried it too and I think it's just one of those things where you have to go through a lot of losers before you find someone worthwhile. How long has it been since you heard from the guy?

April 14, 2004
10:20 am
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artist 2
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I have found nothing but jerks and losers and just keep going back for more. Can't understand myself and why I keep doing this. Maybe just a bandaid for the lonliness. Anyway, still hate men.

April 14, 2004
10:30 am
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nancee
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You sound like you are going through the same thing as me. I've noticed over the past few weeks that you and I both seem to be having lots of ups and downs. Not quite over the ones who hurt us yet.

I'll tell you what I think of my own reaction to things lately and you can decide if you relate or not. I've met a couple of presumably nice guys lately. I spent quite a bit of time talking to one of them last week, but he isn't available this week. I don't know if he's working different hours or if he is just busy or if he simply doesn't want to talk to me anymore. Anyway, I had a stressful day yesterday because of my ex and last night I could not go to sleep because the other guy hadn't called me. I think I am desperate for someone new to be around to take my mind off things. Do you find yourself putting too much stock in some new guy just because you want a distraction from thinking about the old guy?

I know and you know that we have to heal ourselves without a man before we will have a healthy relationship with a new man. I'm not at all trying to second guess what you're feeling, just want you to know that I relate, whether we are having these feelings for the same reasons or not. I know I rambled on too much, I hope this makes sense to someone besides me.

April 14, 2004
10:40 am
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Anonymous
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Ladies, it is not that we are all jerks... It is that some of us like you are codependent and do not know how to have healthy relationships with healthy people. We seek out the losers.

MILO

April 14, 2004
10:55 am
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artist 2
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Nancee, here's my response:

Are we looking for afirmation from men, is that's what's happening? Or, are we simply, like any NORMAL human being, looking to be loved?

Put too much stock in a new guy?.... don't know. Maybe because I want a "nice" guy, like I remember the old Bf to be (on a good day), that I expect to much out of the new guy. Maybe, like Mile says, the new "nice" guy is just another loser who is codependent and unable to have a healthy relationship. Maybe the new guy senses in us, Nancee, "healthy" and don't feel up to the task? Or, do they sense unhealthy, codependent, and desperate, and drop us like a hot potato? Perspectively, I don't seem to come off as desperate, so I don't get it.

April 14, 2004
11:11 am
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nancee
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You've made some good points. I know I can certainly pick the loser out of a crowd. Here's something for you to advise me about. I had an ad on yahoo personals last summer when I was trying to break away from my ex. (ironic, isn't it, that I tried to break it off with him and he convinced me to stay with him and then he dumped me) Anyway, this guy who lives in my town started corresponding with me. We emailed a few times and basically didn't talk about anything important. He just wanted to meet up with me right away. I told him that I would be more comfortable talking on the phone for a while more before we met in person but he insisted that we go ahead and get together. I just stopped returning his calls.

A couple of months ago, I tried yahoo personals again, and again, he was the first person to respond to my ad. It's the same as last time, he doesn't want to email or talk, just wants to meet for a drink. He claims to be a nice guy just looking for a friend but something about his behavior gives me a bad feeling. And this time, he only calls during the day when I'm at work and leaves messages for me to call him if I want to get together. I just think there is something odd about the whole thing. I can't make myself meet him. If he really wanted to know me wouldn't he be willing to talk to me a little more?

I think it's great that you are out there trying to meet someone. I also don't think it's a bad thing to be looking for a guy to spend time with and who will be nice to you. I just don't think I should be looking for Prince Charming in one of these guys. If it happens, great, but I need to try not to be so disappointed when the guy turns out to just be a toad.... I keep imagining that I will meet someone who 'gets' me, who can make me laugh till I pee my pants, who makes me want to be the best person I can be. I really think it's gonna happen, I just don't know where or when.

April 14, 2004
11:19 am
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artist 2
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A BIG RED FLAG. Certainly if the guy respected your boundaries he would not continue to ignore your requests. I would not meet with him, and even block his calls if he continues when you've asked him not to call you.

I'm being open-minded in my looking. Not having expectations and open to accepting a few quirks. I do have my bottom line with what he is and is about too. The thing that bugs me is his saying he'll call or write and not do it. It's just disappointing when I thought at first what a nice person he is. Guess maybe I'm just feeling let down. I'm not asking for much, and maybe that's the problem. I let too much go by because it's a stupid online personal ad and I know my chances of finding someone workable is very slim.

April 14, 2004
1:39 pm
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silence
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Well. This all works out since I still hate women.

April 14, 2004
1:50 pm
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artist 2
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I always knew we'd get along Silence.

April 14, 2004
2:22 pm
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Wanttobewell
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Silence you're funny!!

Nancee,,,that guy does sound weird. When can I meet him,,sounds just my type..I'm kidding of course but I swear there was a time in my life when I would've fell for that hook, line, and sinker. When I think about the chances I took, all the losers I've dated, I cringe. I don't know about now since I'm married but when I dated, I always attracted the psychos!!! If I were back "out there," I really don't know if I would even think about dating again.

When I was alone, it was good, but it does get old after awhile, so I suppose I'd stick a toe out. It's just the on-line thing,,,you just never know!!! Of course that's true for meeting anyone you don't know, so what do you do? I guess just listen to your gut and don't take any chances. I don't blame you a bit Nancee,,,good radar!!!

Sometimes I hate all men too, just despise them, except my dad..

I saw on TV, I believe it was Harmony.com, something like that, that supposedly gave good results. After all,,if it's on TV it's true, right? Right. W.

April 14, 2004
2:48 pm
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Don't remember... but I don't feel sorry now! serves them right....

but all kidding aside, I want to try and not be hateful in my heart. It is my heart after all...

April 14, 2004
3:22 pm
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Good call Twinks. I think you're very close to 99% correct on what men are doing online opposed to what women are looking for.

April 14, 2004
3:53 pm
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orchid
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AMEN! I hate men most of the time too!!!! Can't trust most of them as far as I can throw them. I had a guy friend tell me the other day that almost every guy he knows is just out for sex. He said that some guys do care about their girlfriends etc, but really, it all comes down to sex. I think the next guy I date is going to have a wait a long time for sex so I know that's not what he's after!!! At least a couple of months in a relationship anyways....I am known as the resident man-hater to all my friends, which is why i'm concentrating on myself and being independent so I don't need one. Then I can be really really picky. Might take awhile, but I don't want to marry the wrong one.

April 14, 2004
4:16 pm
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Wanttobewell
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Good for you Orchid!!! As one who has married two wrong ones, I feel qualified to tell you that you are indeed making the correct life choices. That may be all I'm qualified to tell you, but I'm damned sure about that!!!

April 14, 2004
4:30 pm
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Kessie
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Hi Artist, (and Nan) I just looked in and read this - Artist, I can understand where you're coming from, but take it from me - there's nice guys out there as well as the dross. This may not go down too well at the moment, but try to remember that you are only a hair's breadth away from an unsuccessful relationship. It takes time to get yourself together after something like that, and your expectations, - well, maybe, are a bit clouded. If you are desperate it shows, in all sorts of little, subtle ways, and then it's too easy to attract opportunists.
Now I know nothing about online dating, but it seems to me that on the net is far too easy to falsify your 'requirements' and 'attributes' , shall we say. So men that only really require sex are going to present themselves rather differently to the way they really are.
It's also easy to feel (for you) that you must have 'someone' - but Artist, being desperate means your judgement is distorted. You surely have friends - real life friends, girlfriends - to whom you can talk these issues with - and you have a social life where you can meet people apart from the net?

When I was dumped by my first husband, and alone, I remember feeling like you do - I had a fling with a guy, but it was so 'wrong' - I didnt even fancy him, and I felt awful about it. He didnt care about me either, and I felt a complete prat because everyone knew about it.
Eventually (and I'm afraid I mean years) things straightened themselves out, and I realised that there are good guys as well as the bad. So try to get things in perspective, remember, friend, it really IS early days! -
and Silence, if I may say so - it's your own distorted vision which clouds your perspective on life, not who is out there. I for one am not a 'bitch'

K

April 14, 2004
4:47 pm
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Hi Kessie.

I have friends and support systems outside the internet. I don't feel like i "have" to have - I just "want" to have - someone in my life. It's what feels "normal" to me. My parents had each other. A truly good person...

and I'm willing to be open and honest and try meeting some. It's just that I'm my best, then these creeps just disappear and not follow through. I'm tired of wasting myself on these losers.

Growing up it was natural to have a boyfriend, it was a good thing. Now what has happened to everybody? Why do these jerks have to spoil my view of men? Why can't they just answer an ad, say yes I like you, no I don't like you... whatever. I'm not so fragile that some face on the computer is going to make my world come crashing down. Just say so, but don't just disappear without ever saying. It's rude and really stupid.

Thanks for the optimism - it's welcomed! One day - faith in God - things will happen.

April 14, 2004
4:49 pm
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nancee
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Good post, Kessie. I do feel my judgment is clouded right now. I'm either coming off as desperate or too stand-offish. I can't seem to find a happy medium. I do feel like there will come a time when I will meet the right guy for me.

On another note, I made the mistake of emailing Oompa yesterday to tell him I passed my coding exam and it got me all rattled when he responded. I got all calmed down today and was minding my own business when he emailed me again. He just forwarded a cute picture he knew I'd like but still....It's so hard to make myself stay away from him. Thank goodness it's almost time to go home.

Zinnie, if you're reading this, I've already slapped myself on the wrist. LOL, I have my rubber band too!

April 14, 2004
4:56 pm
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Kessie
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As a matter of fact - I have to laugh at myself here folks - what have I just done? but AGREED TO HAVE LUNCH WITH YOU-KNOW-WHO! well I wasn't going to admit it but there you go! Mind you - it IS only lunch, and I asked my husband if he thought it was OK. He said - "well darling - go and see him - he IS dying and he needs all the friends he can get".
So it is with detachment, and I do mean that, I shall go. I really dont have THOSE feelings anymore though, So I'll report back after Saturday, and you can slap my wrists if you wnat.
Cheers, K

April 14, 2004
5:08 pm
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Zinnie
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Kessie,

When I come to Oxford to visit my son - can I meet your husband? He always sounds so adorable!

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