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I cracked...I broke no contact
July 23, 2005
8:50 am
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donna25
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I couldn't stand it...he was on msn which he alwayas is I'm suprised it took me this long. I ran into one of his soccer buddies last night and he obviously didn't know me and **** had ended it and he asked me what "he" was up to last night....anyway it made me sad so I sent "him" an im message, we talked for about 10 mins it was very "how are you?, I am fine?" kinda stuff...I don't know...I didn't feel better, I didn't feel worse..I felt kinda calmer I guess...I don't feel so much like he's dead..I guess part of me was afraid he would replace what emotional need I was filling for him over the last two months with somone else and I was afraid he would forget about me...I didn't tell him I missed him or anything like that, I ended it said I had to go I was heading out with some friends for a drink, so he would at least know I was sitting around.

July 23, 2005
8:54 am
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SexySadie
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It's okay...at least speaking for me I've had my moment of weakness. But now I've learned how NC works for me and I see it all in a different light. It's not about hurting one another, game playing and emotional manipulation. You just let him know that you still care. You're in the grey area honey just like me. AND IT'S OKAY. It really is. I learned from my Therapist you don't always have to be in the black or white, sometimes the grey area is where we do our most healing.

July 23, 2005
9:04 am
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frayedknot
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Hello Donna

Just beware of the contact "hangover". The contact can be like a little "fix" for the addiction. You feel ok... even better after the contact. Then, a day goes by... maybe 2 days and you haven't heard from him.. Then, you look for him again on IM, etc. bedcause you have an "anxious" feeling in your stomache, etc.

Or, the other scenario.... He now makes contact with you in a day or two and strings you on... Nothing has changed, but you get your hopes up.. Begin reading things into his contact or no contact.. Running the conversation over and over and over in your head. What did this really mean? Should I do this? Maybe if I do this?

I don't know your situation.. so, I'm giving very general statements regarding the down side of contact..

If this is the pattern that takes place, just remember how you feel waiting for his contact.. or, wanting to contact him again.. Only you can decide when the pain/reward trade-off makes true no contact a must for yourself..

Frayed

July 23, 2005
9:04 am
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donna25
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Oh really? Thats good to hear...that makes me feel better. cause thats kinda how I felt, Was I trying to prove something to me or him by not contacting him? I wasn't sure if I was blurring my own boundries...I know my contact with him needs to be limited, the sad part is we get along really well, he responded to something I said last night about me being so easy to get along with. that was never the issue he just can't give me a relationship which is what he knows I was after and because of that it was causeing us to butt heads over things (like him putting his profile back up on lava)..and I still don't know if its because hes scared..or if he knew he was just nvever going to fall in love with me or is he just too busy, which he actually is at the moment with this knew venture he's ben working on....I guess i'm hoping if I keep contact limited..I'm still there in his mind and maybe he will rmember the reasons why he wanted to take me out so badly in the beginning

July 23, 2005
9:12 am
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donna25
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frayedknot,

You know what I discussed it with my roommate before hand actually , these exact things...I could of felt worse...he may not of responded but then maybe that would of been good maybe then I would know for sure...or maybe I would of become obsessive I don't know...I do know what you mean though, I have played out the different scenerios in my head and the truth is I don't know, I know my contact does need to be limited, I can't risk getting close to him again and talking about personal things which is what bonds people together and then find out he's dating someone else. The thing is I was already anylizing his online activity. Before I contacted him he had it set to away and I was afraid maybe he was talking on the phone to someone he met online..would he feel like doing that this soon, I don't know...I just don't have enough information.

July 23, 2005
9:26 am
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Hi Donna,

I'm not sure if you know my story or not... but I was with a commitmentphobe for over a year, we had an exclusive relationship and he told me that he loved me. BUT, when things got too intense for him...he pulled away. He's been giving me incredibly hurtful mixed messages for about 4 months...

Right now, I am in the midst of no contact (It's been 11 days for me)... but last night I went to the bookstore and picked up a copy of "He's just not that into you". Ouch!!!!!

It really hit home for me. There were so many statements in there that rang true. If he wanted me, there would be NOTHING that could keep him away. I wouldn't HAVE to keep reminding him that I am still around and how wonderful I am, because he would already know it... and if he didn't???? Well, then he was just not that into me!!! AND do I want to chase someone that is just not that into me??? NO!!

Yes, he's insecure, he's weak and he's afraid to get too close to me... BUT that is not my problem to solve! Because I never will and if I continue to try (which I have for 4 months now)... I will drive myself crazy!

I suggest you pick up the book. You may not see yourself in it, but you might and it might begin to help you see things more clearly.

You need to worry about YOU, not him. That's his job... and if I may quote the book, "Don't waste the pretty!"

TC

July 23, 2005
9:28 am
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frayedknot
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Donna

I can probably guess how you feel. You really want the relationship to continue. You think you are good for him. If only he would realize it... I will just wait him out.. Eventually, he will see the light, etc..

Again, I'm just guessing about your relationship with him.. But, what I'm describing is what's all over this board. We seem to be broken records that repeat ourselves...

There's nothing wrong with those feelings or holding out some hope. Just don't stop moving on yourself. Continue building a new life for you.. Move on and let him come to you if he wants. Don't try to figure out what he's doing or thinking. If he truly wants a relationship with you... He will let you know in a big way..

Frayed

July 23, 2005
9:33 am
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Bravo Frayed!!!

You have come such a long way! What excellent advice!!

I also bought the book "Co-dependent no more" last night that everyone raves about here. I read half of it already. It is very empowering.

You are doing so well! I'll miss you when you are gone 🙁

TC

July 23, 2005
9:41 am
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donna25
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Actually I bought that book awhile ago...and to be honest it's a little extream and a little insulting...i like to think I (or other women)are not that powerless in matters of the heart...do men have to have all the control? But yes I know what you mean but this guy wanted me in his life, it wasn't just for sex...at all he did ALL of the calling, the only time he wouldn't is if there was a conflict and like every male doesn't want to deal with it...so sometimes he would wait a little longer to call me..the funny thing is the week we broke up was the week felt like he was beginning to to try...he was calling me honey, baby more...more affectionate with his words and he was opening up more,After our 1st date, he lost his job 3 days later, and I think over the past 4 weeks he is starting to panic..I'm not making excuses for him and I was never asking him to wine and dine me,so I don't know if it's that cut and dry. my first instinct is maybe he was unsure if i was someone he was going to fall in love with...but maybe it's not me he just can't at the moment, and yes I want him to know what he lost or could lose completely and I know that can't happen us going back to the way it was especially if he started dating someone else...the truth is I don't know...would things of been different had he not lost his job? he said he couldn't be someones b/f right now...I just don't know

July 23, 2005
9:53 am
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Oh, Donna! I understand completely what you are going through!!!!

My ex had ISSUES galore! He was adopted, felt unloved by his family, misunderstood by his friends, lost 6 friends in a horrible fire and overall, did not trust anything or anyone!!! He doesn't feel worthy of love and does not feel "good enough" for me or that he has enough to offer me. I tried over and over to convince him that my love was pure and could endure anything. I would stand by him through thick and thin... I was going to break through his walls and be the ONE person in his life that he could count on!!!!

You know what? That's not what he wanted. Although he was too weak to tell me that. He said he needed to be "alone" to work on himself and figure out what he wants. Translation: Be alone so that he could persue other women that made him feel wonderful about himself. He didn't want someone that could get into his heart. He didn't want to feel vulnerable or have to face his insecurities. He wanted someone that did not want to "TALK". He is incapable of going to those depths. He wants to be adored and worshipped by women without all of the responsibility that comes along with a relationship when LOVE is involved.

I'm not saying that your guy feels that way. I'm just telling you not to waste too much time trying to figure him out. It is a real energy waster and in the end, a real waste of time.

If he wants you, he'll realize it... on his own. You won't have to convince him. He will come back for you and if he doesn't, he wasn't worth your time and concern.

I'm sorry Donna. I'm a bit bitter right now...

TC

July 23, 2005
9:53 am
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SexySadie
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Men's egos are quite frail and alot has to do with the way they were brought up. Having a job, supporting family, being the bread winner, these are all things that men have had programmed into them since the cave man days. When a man feels that he is not pulling his weight, most men do have a problem, they can fall into depression. Look at my guy, that's what all this stemmed from...he had his back against the wall and having me support him. However, in the end it was he who stopped trying to move forward with his life and let depression over take him until he sunk low. He just couldn't handle it and drank himself deeper and deeper to hide from it.

So, I move forward and hope that he will realize that it was really okay and that he can pull himself out of the gutter. But right now I don't see that happening. Especially when he's living with an alcoholic OW.

I wish you the best and a great deal of strength. You will find all the love and support you will need here.

July 23, 2005
10:17 am
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Just Lost
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What a morning......I am in the dumps. I can't remember waking up to a morning like this in a long time. I just feel like I cannot do anything. I want to break no contact so bad even though I know that doing so will only bring me a temporary fix. I know that if she even answers that the conversation will not be one that I am looking for. I know that he is there with her. I know I know I know. So why do I feel so bad about it? Why can't I just chalk it up and move forward without all this pain and hurt. I probably didn't help things last night by driving around looking to see where she was. Even though I didn't find her or make contact, isnt it really the same thing? I am a total mess right now. The days are not passing fast enough. The hours go by so slow. One day I know I will regret having said that.

July 23, 2005
11:52 am
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kathygy
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donna,

It sounds like you misunderstood what melodie beattie is saying in her book. Certainly men do not have all the power. They only have as much power as you give them. You can have all the power you want by taking care of yourself and setting boundaries and staying away from unavailable men.

It sounds delusional to think he's going to realize that you are the one and fall in love with you if you keep making contact and reminding him of what you had. That's very unlikely to happen if you keep making contact. You are giving your power away. He knows that. You are giving him an ego boost. Based on what he's said to you about not being able to give you what you want its a waste of your time to hold on to false hope. Your best bet is to let him go completely. Get your power back and stop contacting him.

You deserve someonme who is available to you now, who loves you now not in some imaginary future.

love,
kath

July 23, 2005
1:52 pm
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donna25
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tc66

Hmmm that might be it...he did say something about recieveing smiles from women on lava as flattering...I know everyone likes to be flattered and they want to be with people who make them feel good about themselves which I did do..I would flatter him but not constantly..I don't know...maybe thats it, he doesn't understand that eventually it comes with a resposibility...maybe he was starting to feel vulnerable which made him feel uncomfortable. Especially after the e-mail I sent him last week in which I called him out on some of his behavior..in a respctable way of course...feeling vulnerable is part of the process of bonding...I don't know maybe he realized slthough we spoke everyday, maybe he feels less pressure now, not that I put a lot on him..maybe sometimes...

kathygy-

Actually I was referring to the book "He's just not that into you" I think its a little too cut and dry and in fact I have heard men say the same, a womean herself could very well be to blame for a relationship or a date not working out...meaning if you went for a dinner and you picked your nose, your date probably wont call you back, sure he's not into you...but it's because you picked your nose...I've simplified that but you know what I mean.

July 24, 2005
2:22 am
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donna25
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alright...so I made my return to the dating website...not up there 5 minutes guess who send me an Im? we talked for a bit...felt a little awkward like he wa courting me again..told him I was going out, he says "call if you like" its the power struggle isn't it? becuse he was online for awhile after that...I know he will one up me...he will actually make the date with someone...

July 24, 2005
4:23 pm
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Donna25, I feel your pain, I really do. It's so hard to make them understand that WE are the best one for them:) I am exactly as you are. I have my weak moments also, where I give in to seeing him online, and just trying to break the ice. I hope you won't spend your time wondering if he is flirting online with another...that will drive you batty! I know, cuz I've been there, done that. Stay strong, my friend! We can do this together:)

July 24, 2005
4:27 pm
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SexySadie
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I am on day 3 of NC. It's getting tough because we are supposed to go to my HS reunion mid August. He had indicated when he left that he was still thinking about it...time to get tickets soon.

I have another appointment with my Therapist on Thurs. I'm going to go further with her on this NC issue. I'd like to see if he would be up for a lunch "date" It's been a week now since the wall came down and we started talking and he started playing nice.
Not sure if it is still too early..it has been 1 month today that he has been gone.

July 24, 2005
4:56 pm
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hi donna,

they are so right! no contact gives you power.. i did tell my ex that i loved her and miss her and it is too painful for me for her to be in my life and me in hers, since she's dating this other person. it was very powerful... i told her she made her choice, which she didn't see it as that way... and the truth is that the more i do not contact her, the more powerful my message is and the more responsibility she's taking for her decisions. she cannot give me mixed messages that she wants to be with me and not end this relationship, regardless of what the circumstances are...i'm better than that... it's very painful, but i do know what i want in the long run, and this is what i am doing to get there-- just being honest! and that's it...what happens, happens...but i told her i know this-- I don't want this!

hang in there!

star-eyed

July 24, 2005
7:17 pm
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donna25
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plzdon'tsayuneedme, you went thru I similar experience? omg it drives me nuts! he told me that when we first met, he was only on a week, he siad he was a lot like my froommate who talks to anyone and spends hours on msn....he said he had someing like 30 people from lava...now my roomate does meet some of the guys but mostly she is just talking howeve that is how relationships are formed and that was my fear..is I didn't want to risk that not to mention I just simply had a huge problem with it...but it drives me bonkers! when he is online I think he is tlaking to someome, when he away I think he's on the phone with someone...when he is offline OMG he must be out on a date!! arghhhh

star eyed, I know no contact is powerful..but I know men deal differently than women...men just want to get over it as quickly as possible...I know he is not stewing in it as much as I am...I was mostly scared he would find somone else to talk with for hours if I didn't try and message him..I just didn't want him to forget about me.

July 25, 2005
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kc30
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Donna
Am I confusing you with someone else, or were you guys together for only 2 months?

The reason I ask is that 2 months isn't a lot of time to get as attached as you appear to be to him? I hope you don't think I am discounting your feelings...not at all! I think the way you are feeling is very very valid, but perhaps is misdirected and funnelled towards this man, when it may serve a better purpose if you stopped thinking about HIM and started thinking about you?

You are far more important in all of this than this man. I have been blinded by "love"/obsession in the past, and it's a very very painful place to end up in. I wish I had known then what I know now...it never had anything to do with him, or how I felt about him. It was about the relationship I had with myself, and I used him and his on-off affection to distract me from myself, my life and my issues.

I can only draw from my experiences...and I know we aren't all the same. I just see huge warning signs all over this for you, and hope you will be ok and not end up where I did.

peace
kc

July 25, 2005
12:39 pm
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donna25
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Yes it was two months...an intense two months..we both agreed it felt like we know each other much longer..I actually spoke to him on the phone last night, after a bit of a tiff on msn...

July 25, 2005
12:44 pm
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Thanks for clarifying!

I was head over heels in love with my husband within weeks of meeting, so I can really relate to how intense a relationship can be in such a short time.

So you guys are talking again? Are you getting back together?

July 25, 2005
1:38 pm
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donna,

You sound obsessed with this man based on the past you had with him. You are focused on him but you need to be focused on yourself if you want to heal from codependency. If you put the focus on you you will stop obsessing about him. You are inflicting pain on yourself my obsessing and wondering if he is talking to or with a woman. Right now it sounds like he is offering you nothing. You don't have to call him to remind him about you. He already knows. If you really made a impact on him he won't forget you that easily. He may even think about you more if you stop calling him.

love,
kathy

July 25, 2005
5:56 pm
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donna25
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kathygy:

Well it's been only been a week, and yes I was very hopeful and it is hard to let go...how does the saying go "You can choose to fall in love but, you can't choose to fall out of love" Yes I am focused on him, I can't help it I'm afraid.

kc30-yes we are talking no were fnot going back to the way it was...basically how started, my roommate was on lava I told her to smile at him..I figured he would know it was her..it was more of a aaahaaaa!!! don't spend much time on here huh? shortly there after he messages me and first askes what her "msn" name was...I'm sure as to not have to admit he was on and then asked for her lava name, I think he though my roomate was hitting on him and I told him I told her to do it and he asked if I was trying to see if he would smile back at her...and I said no I figured you would know it was her...and then I said I don't need to know what you are doing on lava...its obvious and he says "its not obvious" and I said "John, your hunting" and well he got real defensive...he says "you think it's one thing and it's totally the opposite" whatever! believe what you want! BYE DONNA!" and then I said whoa! why so defensive...of course it bothers me why would it not?" and then he "ignored me" on msn and then I said "all John all I did was like you" and then he said I know, I'm sorry if I ever hurt you it wasn't my intention" and then long story short said it isn't that I'm not the girl for him it's he's not the right guy for me' and I said "what does that mean" and he said "you deserve much more then I can offer you at this time" and then he explained he needed to get his life in order before he could share it with somone else" anyway..I told him I understood I was in that place before but I said "If I find out your in a relationship in two months I'm going to be pissed" and he said he isn't looking for a relationship...he's not looking at all. I talked a bit more after that then his computer crashed and he came back online and said call me so I did..we didn't talk about it on the phone just talked about what has been going on the last week...So I don't know I've never been in this posititon before (such a grey area) but I have had friends go thru this..I know I don't NOT want to have him in my life, but I can't figure out where to put him...and as I said before I know I have to keep my contact with him limited, I can't go to his soccer games and things it's to weird sitting there with the g/f's

July 26, 2005
7:44 am
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kc30
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Hi Donna
From the outside looking in, it appears that you've attached yourself to man who isn't interested in a relationship with you (which by the way, doesn't have ANYTHING to do with you- you are great just the way you are!!) This is bad news for your heart. What you are creating is an unreality with this man. He has made himself painfully clear...he doesn't want a relationship.

What you need to decide is what YOU want. You can't have a healthy relationship with this man. He isn't the one and he's told you that. Are you looking for a partner...someone to love and be loved by? Or are you content to direct all your focus onto a man who is unable to reciprocate your feelings. Either way, the choice is yours.

I would only suggest, very humbly, that you work hard at seeing this situation for exactly what it is. That way, you can make informed decisions. Denial is a KILLER...coming from the Queen of Denial, kc herself!

You don't need to sell yourself short in life or love. You deserve a man who wants to be with you, and wants the same things you want. It's not a reflection of you...the way he feels and what he wants is about HIM, not you. And the hardest thing for me to understand when I was in the middle of a giant mess was that I had no RIGHT to try and change my husband into what I wanted him to be. He has a right to be who he is. I had to learn to accept that, and accept that who he is and what he wants doesn't line up for me. And it TOTALLLY sucks. But that is reality.

You are in the early stages here...it's not too late to get out and spare yourself the unbelievable pain of a codependant attachment to an unavailable man.

Do you know what it is you want? Maybe just making a list stating all the things you want in a partner...what YOUR needs are, would be a good place to start?

lots of love
kc

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