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I am tired.
June 1, 2005
9:56 am
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Sol
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My husband of six years, has lied to me again. He is an addict, his addiction has caused me a lot of pain and currently it has caused a financial hit that will be hard to recover from. I am so tired. I love him but don't think I can take one more deception. He is sober 1 week and going to groups and begging for one more chance. He swears he will not faulter again, I don't know. All I know is I am so tired. Can anyone share some wisdom?

June 1, 2005
10:04 am
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Deena
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I dated someone who drank a lot. He never wanted to admit there was a problem of course. Yeah, he would "slow" down for a couple of days then- wham, it started all oer again. The funny thing is he left me. I stayed because like you I loved him. Honsestly, my life is a lot better without him. Im still struggling financially with all the debt he put us into, but I do what I can. I can't really offer that great of advice, but sometimes the grass IS greener on the other side. Noone deserves to put up with that and not have a happy life. It seems like this has been like a yo yo effect for you. He needs a reality check. You are enabling him to do this to you. Keep posting...let me know how u r!!!

Deena

June 1, 2005
10:08 am
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lollipop3
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Hi Sol,

I'm sorry that you are going through this and I understand completely, as I've been there.

My suggestion to you is that you attend Al-Anon. It is a free support group for friends and families of alcoholics. They are located in most communities (you can find it in the phone book) and they are a wonderful support system of strength, hope and encouragement for people affected by other's drinking.
Also, keep in mind, it is not for the drinker...it is for you. They will not teach you how to stop somenone from drinking but they can help you learn to cope with your situation.

Also, may I suggest learning all you can about alcoholism and about codendency (as alot of us dealing with alcoholism are also codependent). Perhaps you could get some books from the library or attend an open AA meeting to give you some insight into the problem.

This is also a wonderful site to come for encouragement and support.

I hope this helped and my thoughts are with you.

good luck

Lollipop

June 1, 2005
10:33 am
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Sol
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Thank you Deena and lollipop 3 for your feedback. I am going to go to a group, I know that I need support and strength to make a decision to stay or go. I definetely need to understand the roles I play in this cycle. This website and your feedback is a godsent at this time.

June 4, 2005
5:52 pm
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LouWho
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I have had a number of drunks in my life, some romantic, some at work, some in the family, etc.

There is one thing I see in every drunk and it is this: SELFISHNESS. They are so absorbed in themselves, that they are completely toxic to anyone else who is not involved in them or their drinking.

Do the two of you have children? That makes a difference, but sometimes it really should not.

Here it is--he's sober now because if he isn't, he will lose you. He will fall off the wagon, though, that's inevitable, and it will be your fault. He will have that first drink, damning your name, and when he wakes the next day, he will tell you it is him and not you. But the truth of the matter is that it is him, but he believes it is you since you are the only thing keeping him sober most of the time--his fear of you. (In essence, the bitch stands between me and the bottle) So in essence, you are part of the enemy AND his savior. (Neither enviable positions.)

This is a complete no win situation. You will never win in this game so long as you play. Like the saying goes, the only way to win is not to play.

Personally, if you can leave, you should while you can still feel something about him that doesn't involve gun play. Chances are, he's not going to change. He has chose the bottle over you every chance there was, and he will always go this route, until something huge happens, if it happens. You need to get out while you can, before he gets you into a financial hole you may not be able to recover. I know that which I speak...I am trapped here and have been working diligently for the past 3 years to get out of here, and very soon I will be outta here. You don't want to live like this, trust me.

Look at it this way, even if he stays in the program, good luck. Recovery is a very selfish and indulgent thing to go through as the one on the "outside". Recovery can kill a marriage just as easily as using. In recovery the addict is told about a million times a day to focus on himself, take this time to explore himself, and not worry about anything else, just get through the day, the program, the month, whatever. Most people really don't have the cucarachas to hang tight through this time, yet another time that they take 2nd seat to something else. Remember, this is the same person that has been through the emotional ringer of a lifetime putting up with the addict, now they have to relive all of the crap in microscopic minute-by-minute replays. As if it were not bad enough the first time, here it is to slap you in the face again. Oh, and what luck, from this view point, you may get blamed a few times more than they will truthfully admit. That happens, and suck it up, arguing is something they want you to do, another reason to drink, so you suck it up and move on, more baggage added to your load. Toughen up.

In recovery, there comes this inevitable point when the weaker addict will blame the partner, no matter how ideal the partner has been. I've seen it a hundred times, some folks just don't make it past this point, if they do terrific. I've not witnessed a lot of successes here.

With AA & other methods, recovery stats stand somewhere around 5%. That's it--5%. There are re-lapses and all kinds of problems that trickle down from their first sober breaths. Oh, and you get to join the "Spin-the-sobriety-wheel,Vanna-lets-see-how-we-get-to-start-over" AGAIN and AGAIN and AGAIN! It just seems to go on and on like your Aunt Edna's ass! And just like your Aunt Edna's ass, there seems to be no justification for it!

Yeah, you can stand by your man, and for awhile you may be able to do the whole recovery thing. But you'll see that there will come a day when you say, I'm tired of making all these "fresh starts" for someone who has no idea what this is doing to me. Because trully, he will be trained to be oblivious to your needs. In essence, you will swap the bottle for the meetings and groups. Before he chose that over you, and now he will chose something else before you, and his friends will encourage him to do this, after all, we are taking care of the addict, not the caretaker. On the days that you are not treated as an "enabler", you become, at best, invisible.

If you can hack this, for the love of this man, than go head on and make all the sacrifices like a good little country western herione would.

But if there is any little part of you that says, enough is enough, then honey, you better hurry up an get Diva and get out. If you get out, make sure that you get to a lawyer and make certain that you can disolve your marriage fast enough so that you will not have to take on anymore of his liabilities. Cause his boozer buddies will clue him in on how to financially put the brakes on your ass, credit wise, in the case that he slips back into the "high" life again.

There is a time in your life when you will have to chose you over him. You deserve this. You need to take care of yourself, he's too worried about listening to the call of the wild bottle.

THIS IS MY OPINION--
The one thing that I could never then, and to this day, get past about the program is this: no where does it ever say that alcoholism is a choice, and it is a choice. Many of the program zombies will tell you that it is a disease and you wouldn't throw some one out because they had cancer, now would you? They are wrong, they are reciting "facts" from medicine that was popular science in the 1930-40's. Today we know that all this disease crap is nonsense. There is no medical facts supporting that argument. They will tell you that there are, but there is not. Make them show you evidence that is dated within the last 3 years and recognized by the AMA or even the FDA. It does not exist, because there is a plethera of research in the last few years which has proven all this to be goobidlly-gook. Alcoholism is not a disease, it is a choice.

For years, we have been programed by this crap, and it may have been true in the 40's, but in the 40s we also drank milk for ulcers, probably the worst thing you can do for the condition, so medical science has advanced a good deal. The one thing that has not changed since the 1940s is the fact that people continue to not stand up and own this problem--that they chose to drink. That they are completely aware of what drinking is doing to them, their lives and their families, and STILL THEY CHOSE TO DRINK. It is the ultimate FU act of selfishness. They are not powerless, they are powerful; they empowered the drink to get to the mouth, the drug to the arm, etc. This is where the program has failed, and until someone updates the program,in my opinion, it will continue with its low success rates.

Now little buddies out there, before I get about a zillion zaps about the negative words about THE PROGRAM, let me say that I believe in the good that the program does. I do, however, recognize the published success rates of all the various types of programs and facilities, and there are some harsh realities we all have to face. One of those is that some folks just don't have the "hang-in-there-ability" to make it with a spouse through the program, even if the spouse is one of the few and the proud who make it. Another is that caring for a drunk becomes a habit, sometimes we resent them for actaully getting sober, when that's what we wanted all along. (That's a biggee and a wierd one) And some just don't like the whole concept of starting fresh after so much has passed between the pair, many people just can't let go. I have sat through enough mettings in my life to watch marriages crumble to crap, some become sober, most just go back to the addiction again.

So my advice is for you and your sanity. If you think you can handle it, do it. If not, there's no points off for bailing out of a sick relationship. It's your life, too. Good Luck.

June 4, 2005
6:16 pm
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feelingused
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LouWho---

WOW-

You had alot to say about this situation, and I read every word!! It was a very insightful point of view!! I thankyou for NOT holding back your thoughts. It gave me even more reasons to say ENOUGH is ENOUGH!! I am sooooo tired of being the one that has to sacrifice MYself inorder for HIM to get a grip on what IS important to HIM!!! He HAS put me through hell and back a million times, you know, the, "I swear I won't drink no more" "I didn't realize I said that to you", Ohhhh so many other words that came on, I just want to believe this LAST time ears of mine!!!!

Again I say, thank you.... I too am trying to leave a very long relationship with nothing but lies, deceat, drinking, abuse-of all kinds, and just plan- BABYSITTING a DRUNK!!!. I don't want to play this losing game anymore!!!!

Don't worry about what others think of what you wrote, you wrote from your heart of experience.....

June 4, 2005
6:38 pm
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sdesigns
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Hi feelingused: Lou Who is on target w/ what she says. I just wanted to add: Everyone says go to AA, stop drinking. And if they do, then what? They ARE STILL addicts. They still are self centered and focused on themselves. The program will reinforce this. The program also doesn't change the character of the person although the 12 steps are to help improve character, there is no guarantee. As the saying goes" Once you sober up an asshole, you get a sober asshole." My ex is a recovering alcoholic, sober 18 years, and an asshole. He is also a sex addict and uses AA as a source for women. But what does AA tell him? That it is OK- whatever it takes to keep him from drinking. So he can use, manipulate and degrade women so that HE can stay sober. Go figure.

Anyhow my lesson is that I will never have anything to do with anyone who is or was a drinker. I want someone who will actually consider how I fit into the equation and consider my feelings and do things with MY welfare in mind, not just theirs. SD

June 5, 2005
1:07 am
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InPainZHT
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My ex lied about her crystal methamphetamine use. She told me that she doesn't "hardly ever use any drugs, and the only thing she takes is somas [for her back injury], and they aren't addictive."

Okay.... #1) somas are psychologically and physically addictive, according to the DEA's website.

#2) she smokes marijuana. She says it's not a controlled substance because "it's an herb".

#3) she takes xanax with via a perscription that is less than honorable. She doesn't need them, she just likes the effects.

#4) she snorts or smokes cocaine at least once to twice a month.

Lies lies lies. The more I find out about her, the more I found out she was a LIAR. The tale-tell sign should have been the fact that she kept expounding her "hatred of liars" and would rave on and on endlessly about how dreadful and deplorable liars are. Guilty dogs bark the loudest.

InPain

June 6, 2005
1:19 pm
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Sol
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Thank you so much for all of your responses, I am still unsure of what I am going to do but all of this insight about "the program" has been very helpful (thanks Louwho). I myself have started separating. Separating bank accounts, starting to do things for me. I know that if I were to stay I would have to get over so much and I do not know if I can. The last thing I need right now is for him to be sober and selfish, even though for his sake it's better than using and being selfish.

June 6, 2005
1:34 pm
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lollipop3
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I'm going to play devil's advocate here and give to you what my experience with AA has been.

I loved sdesigns post "once you sober up an asshole, you get a sober asshole". That is so funny....and so true.

Having said that.....Sol, I would just like you hear the other side of the coin.

1. I am a recovering alcoholic. I have been sober for 10 months and I have worked very hard to have a healthy life. So far, I have no desire to drink and I'm very proud of myself.

2. My mother was also an alcoholic. She found AA and sobriety when I was 13 years old and remained sober until the day she died.(Even in the face of death....she still did not drink)

3. A very good friend of mine (a fellow Al-anon memeber) was in a alcohoic marriage for 10 years before her husband found AA. He has now been sober for 20 years and their marriage is better and stronger than ever.

Everyone has their own experiences and are entitled to their opinion, and I realize that these are "exceptions to the rule", however, I just wanted you to see that....sometimes it does work.

Good luck with whatever you decide.

Lolli

June 8, 2005
7:52 am
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LittleKel
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My husband is an alcoholic. I read very carefully what LouWho had to say and I agree with it.

But there is 1 point that was left out. Alcoholics are running from something...even if they stop drinking, they will find another way to escape from reality. You don't cure the drinking, you have to cure the problem CAUSING it.

My husband has supposedly been sober for about a year (following a DUI). Now all he does is work on our house, day and night, ignoring me and our 2 year old daughter. So what have I gained with his sobriety? NOTHING!!!

You will also have to look for signs of drug abuse. Eventually, with a lot of alcoholics (including my husband), the high from drinking isn't good enough anymore and they begin to use drugs along with the booze for a bigger high.

My advice to you: be very careful, get out if you can, I'm right behind you.

June 8, 2005
9:27 am
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lollipop3
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I agree with you LK, ....my boyfriend is also a "dry drunk" and you are absoultely right, if they don't get help for the reasons behind the drinking, chances are the behaviors will be the same...and in some cases worse.

Lolli

June 8, 2005
3:18 pm
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kathygy
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Lou, I disagree when you say alcoholism is not a disease. There is literature to support the fact that the brain chemistry changes in response to alcohol for alcoholics but not for people who do not become addicted. Also, there is literature to support he fact that alcoholism is inheritated in some of its forms. The tendency towards alcoholism is genetic. There are some people who become addicted from their first drink. Once an alcoholic is addicted they are trully powerless over alcohol. They are sick. You sound very bitter. In al-anon they say you can love the alcohlic but not the disease. That doesn't mean you have to stay with an alcoholic. When an alcoholic stops drinking and starts attending AA. They do need to focus on their recovery and program and yes that means a lot of meetings. But I think they deserve to be commended for working on becoming a better person and giving up alcohol. I know a lot about alcoholism because my faher was one.

June 8, 2005
3:43 pm
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lollipop3
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Kathy,

I agree with you on the "alcoholism is a disease" thing....I was afraid to touch the subject however, due to the fact that the idea seems to be very controversial 'round here.

Anyway, I think it's good that all sides are looked at.

Thanks,
Lolli

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