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Help Me Please x 6 the new beginning
November 14, 2001
10:42 pm
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ranmar
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Terre, great web site thanks. Molly is right, a lot of great stuff here. Ladeska, I have adopted your philosophy of trying to keep my conversations with wacko as short and simple as possilbe. I basically cut off the conversation by ending it with a "see ya", and hang up, not waiting for any reply. Today is Wednesday, and luckily, no more calls from her. I don't have any desire to engage in any conversation with her. I am still so pissed at her, but also realize she is really mentally unstable and doesn't know any better. I treat it as an infection, wanting to stay away. Today, I'm in Seattle, until Friday. Here is a suprise. It's raining here. Traffic is a mess, but it's good to see my accounts, like visiting friends. Tomorrow I go to downtown Seattle to call on my accts there. I really like the travelling for now, it keeps me preoccupied, without having a chance to think about all the hurt and deciet. I'm back on Sunday, have the kids then for the week, including Thanksgiving. That should be interesting, since I will have them with me, going to my folks with a big family get together, without the wacko for the first time.
I don't think it will bother me, since I have the girls this year, and she won't. Then, when it is her turn to have them, I'm off to Arizona, Omaha and Salt Lake City. One of my companies asked if they could send me down to Texas to work with a new rep for a couple of days, in December, and then off to Florida to work with another new rep for a couple of days, of course all expenses paid, and some kind of compensation on top of it. I jumped at the opportunity and said yes. They have been so great in assisting during my trying times, as has my other companies. I consider myself very fortunate. Anyways, I'm going to watch a little tv in my lovely hotel room (not) and then turn in. Hope everyone is doing okay, and looking forward to spending some time with there family this Thanksgiving. I think this year, it will definately have some special meaning for all of us.......Take care for now..Randy

November 15, 2001
1:03 pm
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gingerleigh
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Glad that you are keeping your head about you these days Randy. The weather in Seattle has been pretty intense the last few days. Most of the rain we usually see up here is just sort of depressing drizzle, but the downpours we got the last few days have made for some flooding.

Hm, don't suppose that the rest of the crew could hop on a plane to Seattle this afternoon, I now have 2 canisters of wine corks. Very few tourists these days, but there are always a plethora of dot com employees to throw corks at... they're so darn cute... 🙂

Have a good weekend, all.

November 15, 2001
7:27 pm
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ranmar
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Hi Gingerleigh, haven't heard from you lately. Now I know why. You've probably been preoccupied building the ark. I was in downtown today, and thought I saw a flying cork coming my way, turned out to be the wind and rain. Anyways, interestingly, the account I called on asked what I was doing for Thanksgiving, and when I told them I was taking my girls up to my folks house in L.A., he said "you mean your whole family is going up?" I responded that my two girls and I now make up my whole family. He, along with everyone there were shocked, understanding what I was telling them. He responds, " we all thought you were happily married, a strong valued family man, who is really well balanced." I thanked him, and said most of it was correct, and told him my future ex doesn't see it that way, and is off in La La land, trying to figure out how to live in her fantasy world. He countered, "what a loss on her part." This coming from some people I have been calling on for about a year and half. I was so complimented by the statement, but at the same time, it just brought up my anger and resentment at wacko again for what she is doing. I guess this is something I have to get use to and deal with. I can't believe it's been almost a year since she made it known to me that she didn't want to be married anymore. However, it was in June when I found out about Earl, which to this day she still denies anything wrong, other than just a "good male friend". I know, time is a great healer. Any I am starting to accept the fact that I am in the single world again. I just don't want to participate in all the games right now. ...........Stay dry and safe.....off to Portland tomorrow afternoon...........Randy

November 15, 2001
9:15 pm
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janes
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WEll...good company would make the trip worth while but do we have to stand still til you run outa corks?

Hey Randy....ya gotta do something about the pissededness. ..I know it'll take some time..

Just hate to hear that weekly just the thought of her ignorance can make you upset.

Remember

Better to pissed off than pissed on.

You are doing well tho'....
PEACE to you.

November 15, 2001
11:46 pm
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ranmar
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Thanks Janes.
I guess as my counselor has said, I feel cheated since I had so much invested in the relationship, and then the payoff is this. I too, want to get beyond the pissed off feeling. I now I have to in order to move forward and start to meet others. In the meantime, I just surround myself with my kids and the responsibilities, as well as my work. For now, it gets me through it, and allows me to spend less amount of time being pissed. It seems that every week, I start to feel almost grateful that she did what she did, so I didn't have to keep compromising.
Thank you again.
Randy

November 16, 2001
10:34 am
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Molly
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Randy, I really don't think you ever get over it. I think you just don't give it as much signifigance over time. Hell its been since 1986, and there are still things especially over the holidays that can push my button. It's the family thing, like we had too much TV when we were little, and the fantasy is not our reality.

November 17, 2001
6:15 pm
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ranmar
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Molly, The Ozzie and Harriet or The Cleaver family never showed the husband and wife having a real life crisis or major difficulty in the relationhship, therefore, we grew up expecting everything to be just lovely, no major issues, dad goes off to work to bring home the bacon, mom stays home to bake cookies and make dinner for the kids and family. Yeah, right, in our dreams. Actually, my wacko soon to be ex had the opportunity to do whatever she wanted, since she didn't have to work. So she chose to go out, play and have fun, so much so, that now she can do it whenever she wants, and not have any responsibilities, other than every other week when she has the kids, and she still is buying fast food for dinners for them. What a pathetic, lazy looser. I guess this is part of the compromising I did. THen, according to her, she got bored. And now, here she is, new "just a good male friend" and all. My fault for now "demanding" more from her I guess. Who knows. Never again will I allow myself to be sucked in to such a position.....Never.......Portland is beautiful today. Did my appts today, finished at 2, went out and bought myself a new shirt and am doing a little homework in my hotel room before taking myself out for dinner. Home tomorrow.......Best to everyone.
Randy

November 17, 2001
7:23 pm
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Molly
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I don't think you got sucked into a position, by being the husband, and expecting her to be a wife and mother. She remember is the one with a screw loose. Demanding? I have heard that one before, I don't think it is so much as demanding, as expecting. You know that love honor cherish, and trust stuff. She has her time comming, its going to be real hard for her to maintain the lifestyle she had, the freedom that she had, the social circle that she had, once earl dumps her, she is in for a very rude awaking, and you know its comming. Once upon a time I told some one that heck, I can wait tables, I am not afraid, but the truth is, your not the same person, waiting tables, and your social status changes, and shucks and all she only has 4k to live on. Practically a bag woman. So celebrate that your not in her energy field any more, and free to be you, do for you and yours, and not much is going to change for you except your joy level.

November 17, 2001
10:38 pm
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ranmar
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Molly, tonight I found exactly what you just said. I walked from my hotel in downtown Portland, along the waterfront, out to a great dinner along the waterfront, and then walked around while smoking a cigar. Even though the area was filled with couples strolling, I just sat on a park bench, watching. I really enjoyed myself just kicking back and watching everyone, after enjoying a great dinner at McCormick and Schmidts. Glass of wine, salmon with stuffed dungess crab and shrimp, and just a quiet candle light dinner on my own in a beautiful setting. Yes, it would have been great to be sharing this evening with someone, but, I did the next best thing. I enjoyed it on my own. When I came back into this room, which is a mini suite they gave me at $69 (Marriott Residence Inn) since the place is empty, I called the girls to say hi. Wacko answered and said they were babysitting at a neighbors house. She sounded all bubbly and so forth. I just asked when they would be home, asked that she have them call me, and hung up. I know this probably pissed her off, because I know she wanted to have a little conversation. Too bad though, I have no desire to talk with her, about anything other than my kids. I looked back at this week, and realized I had a pretty sucessful trip in business, and enjoyed moving around from Spokane, to Lewiston, Idaho, to Seattle, having dinner with a friend (male) and then driving down to Portland. Tomorrow morning is flight home. With all my frequent flying and status with the airlines, I am almost always being upgraded to First Class, as is the case tomorrow. I guess I am really living a pretty good life, and am just starting to realize it, with your help and everyone elses as well. This life isn't too bad right now. Sure, as I said, I would love to share it with someone, having them travel with me, as I offered wacko when we were together. But for now, this life of mine is okay. I'm wondering if I am going to go through a role reversal, and be the one not wanting to be with wacko anymore, while she contemplates wanting to become part of this life. Wouldn't that be a hoot. I'm home next week with my girls, including Thanksgiving, and then off to Arizona, Omaha and Salt Lake City the following week. Again, I'm going to take an extra day, and spend the Sunday in Salt Lake with a friend of mine and his wife, seeing the sights. I've really become accustomed to this, and it's not bad at all. I hope you and everyone else have a great weekend (what's left of it). Look up in the sky tomorrow, you may see me kicked back, relaxing on my flight home, sipping coffee and reading the newspaper......a nice life I must say...Best to all.......Randy

November 18, 2001
2:22 pm
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ranmar
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Sitting here in the Phoenix airport, waiting for my connection home, Sunday, 11:20 am.. My little one called asking me to meet her at a pizza party when I get home, for the wrap up of her softball league with her team. Wacko didn't even know where it was being held, even though she was told by the parents. I had to ask the little one where, and she had to remind her mother. Last week, wacko was to take the kids to our timeshare in Palm Springs on Friday, returning today. She calls me laughing, telling me she goofed, the timeshare goes from Sunday to Sunday. My oldest one was really disappointed, since they were all packed and leaving after school. I told her not to be, since I would have them this week, I'll take them out after our Thanksgiving dinner with my folks, and stay until next Sunday. She loved it. She then calls her mother a total "space cadet>" I told her that wasn't proper, since she is her mother. (I covered up the fact that I agreed with her.) During the week, my younger one and I talked, and she says her mother has been upset with her all week, calling her ungrateful (look whose talking). She said she was picked up from her best friends' house, and asked what they were doing for dinner. When she responded, Taco Bell, and wished they could go there too, wacko responded that she was ungrateful, and had to settle with leftovers. Wacko conditioned them to expect frozen or fast foods for dinner, and now scolds them for it. Maybe it's the money factor. Who knows. I'm just going to be the one that is there for them, providing real dinners as much as possible, and taking them for a four day break into our timeshare. Again, my goal is to maintain a positive role model for them, when I have them, and even when I don't.
Hope everyone has a good weekend, what's left of it. Talk to all of you tomorrow most likely........Randy

November 19, 2001
11:33 pm
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Ahhhhhhhh, the joys of mediation today. Today, I was reminded why I should be so thankful that wacko did what she did, and ended the relationship. She cried her little sobs during mediation, when I said I would pay for the college tuition, unless I was physically unable to, then she would have to assist. I also pushed the issue of why, if she was complaining she couldn't live on 4K a month, she not get off her butt, and get a part time job, since she only has school two days a week, and only has the girls every other week. She says there is no job with the flexibility of hours needed or that pays what is needed. I said any job is better than just sitting back on the golf course, going to the malls or eating out with the "friends", and that if she needed to complain about having to adjust her lifestyle, that is no longer my concern. I also firmed up the time frame for spousal support, which she had me going for over 8 1/2 years. I got it to exactly 1/2 the term of the marriage, which equals 7 1/2 years, or until remarried or cohabitation on her part, starting from the date of my first installment to her, which was 9/20. That saved me potentially 18K.
She also is responsible now for maintaining my life insurance, in order to benefit from any payoff. Do the following math. Today, mediation went for three

November 19, 2001
11:36 pm
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ranmar1
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Ahhhhhhhh, the joys of mediation today. Today, I was reminded why I should be so thankful that wacko did what she did, and ended the relationship. She cried her little sobs during mediation, when I said I would pay for the college tuition, unless I was physically unable to, then she would have to assist. I also pushed the issue of why, if she was complaining she couldn't live on 4K a month, she not get off her butt, and get a part time job, since she only has school two days a week, and only has the girls every other week. She says there is no job with the flexibility of hours needed or that pays what is needed. I said any job is better than just sitting back on the golf course, going to the malls or eating out with the "friends", and that if she needed to complain about having to adjust her lifestyle, that is no longer my concern. I also firmed up the time frame for spousal support, which she had me going for over 8 1/2 years. I got it to exactly 1/2 the term of the marriage, which equals 7 1/2 years, or until remarried or cohabitation on her part, starting from the date of my first installment to her, which was 9/20. That saved me potentially 18K.
She also is responsible now for maintaining my life insurance, in order to benefit from any payoff. Do the following math. Today, mediation went for three and one half hours. The mediator wants to draw up a rough draft of what we have accepted. The total bill today was $1137 each. I gave wacko her support installment today, equaling 2K. That leaves her with $870 until December 5th to live on. Her mouth almost fell off.Now she will have to take money out of the savings that she got half of when we split up the assets. Since she has no intentions of working, I guess her fantasy will continue until she runs through her share of the money. Again, not my problem anymore. I really looked at her today, and realized how fortunate I was to be getting away from this evil, manipulative and decietful person....It just reaffirms why I should be thankful for this split......It's nice to be home again..if just for the week..with my girls.........Best to all.....Randy

November 20, 2001
10:42 am
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ranmar1
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Hey, I have no idea why the last posting went twice, half way on the first one. Maybe I was just trying ot emphasize my posting, who knows.
Sorry!!!!!!!!!Randy

November 20, 2001
10:48 am
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Ladeska
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It's all good at this point....it really is. Taking that long, hard look is good for the soul. Life is a learning curve and we have to allow ourselves to always be....learning. When we get wiser, obtain more depth, more integrity with ourselves - there are just certain things and people that aren't okay with us anymore. Doesn't mean we were foolish necessarily in the beginning, it's just that we "grew" and allowed it.

People become sick and twisted and dark when they don't allow growth. I think you're seeing that one happen in front of your eyes with her. You guys "could have" grown together, but her choices led her elsewhere. That's her problem, not yours.

Takes awhile though for your skin to stop crawling when you really get a load of who they have become or maybe who they always were.... Repulsive.

I'm just glad you held the line with her. Time for her to wake up and smell - this is life and this is the consequences of your actions lady. Take a deep whiff.

I can remember sitting in all of 3 sessions of what we agreed to be 6...with my ex and he was nothing but a bully in all three. Was late to the third one, so not sure it even counted. Blamed everything on - well, she's going through early menopause and I will pay for her tests if she will get them. I laughed outloud.... I have still not even approached the symptoms of menopause and that was 7 yrs. ago. The therapist just looked at him real hard and said - you know, I'd move as far away from that one as the east is to the west if I were you. She's a big girl and quite capable of knowing what's going on with her body in that respect and if she says that's not happening - I'd respect that. He agreed and once on the elevator - said - like I said - I'll pay for the tests, you really need to do something. LOL! I just glared at him and said - shut the hell up and leave me alone. Long story short, he wwouldn't come back to the sessions, said that since I picked the therapist, he was on my side...whatever. We divorced real soon after that. And what was interesting was - he was so nice in the beginning, very caring, attentive, easy going, but once we got into that intimate circle of being married - he became a control freak from hell. And I'm probably the last person on earth to be okay with that one. I just suffered from shock for a few months before I really started fighting him on everything. The kicker was when he started trying to break my daughter's spirit. That pretty much did it. Over my dead body or yours buddy. She is an angel and I mean that most sincerely. Easy child to raise and my best friend to this day. Why people want to be so freaking evil is beyond me....and all the time profess to be the most loving people on earth. Amazes me... So, yes, feel very fortunate that you are away and just love up on those girls of yours!! Happy Holidays!!

November 20, 2001
8:06 pm
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ranmar1
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Ladeska, why do these people "perform" in front of others, friends, counselors, etc., and then when nobody is looking, come back to their real self? In your case, it sounds like the responsibility of not being capable was projected on to you, and that you rebuffed any attempt to do so. My wacko projected her sense of me "belittling" her on to me, when in fact, she has belittled herself. It truly is amazing that these people become so consumed in themselves, and try to protect their instability by covering up and projecting. Our job is to realize it, move as far away from it as possible, and as you previously said, which I have copied and carry around with me, seal up the door so their infection can't seep under on to us.........I am so deeply grateful for your input and feedback, as well as to Molly, Alena, Gingerleigh, Janes and all my friends here. This is what I have to be thankful for this year, as well as my health and the goodness of my daughters.......
Randy

November 20, 2001
11:39 pm
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ranmar1
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hey, I just remembered a line that wacko said to me in mediation yesterday. When things weren't going her way, she says I was just trying to punish her because she initiated the breakup. I said I didn't have to punish her, she was doing a great job of it on herself, with so much more to come.......She also told the mediator I was travelling a lot more than before, and I responded that it was none of her business what I was doing, when I didn't have the girls. The mediator said she initmated that she was taking care of the girls while I was gone, during my time, and I jumped out of my seat and responded that she hasn't had to fill in one time for me, never. And I wouldn't give her that satisfaction either. I told the mediator, I leave on a Sunday, and am back on the following Sunday, in time to get my kids when I'm suppose to. The mediator then said maybe she misinterpreted what was said. I said maybe she did, because it wasn't what was going on......More to come........Randy

November 21, 2001
1:38 pm
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Good for you Randy, I'd head every comment off at the pass that wasn't right on the nose with her in there. Um no, ain't flying, so fast - your head will spin! This is what I said and this is what I mean.

Why do they do it - the charm thing in front of others? Get "People of the Lie" by Dr. Scott Peck this weekend and you'll see why. It's all in the book. Can get it anywhere in the psychology section. Awesome book and quite eye-popping. The first chapter is about excessive compulsive, I usually tell people to skip it unless it applies to them. Bobby's parents is next and that's when it starts getting good because you start seeing the webwork...

Then the book just gets down to it. So, pick it up. Rather amazing what he nails to the wall.

Basically Peck says in the book that they have to project this image of "looking good" in order to hide the evil beneath. And it's for their own sake as much as for anyone else. They "won't" look at themselves so the biggest lie - is lying to themselves about who they are. They spend a great deal of energy doing this and keeping the facade going or at least a tape running all the time of how wonderful they are so they can't hear the real noise behind it that's very contrary to all that.

It's a narcissist doing what they do best - lying. There whole life is just one big lie.

When you really nail these people down in their m.o.'s - they are quite boring people. They do the same things - all the time, for pretty much the same reasons. They feel guilt - they project. They see truth coming - they lie. They almost get pinned - they charm and deflect so they can escape. They hurt - they turn around and hurt you worse. On and on it goes.

She cracks me up with the comment about her initiating the breakup...poor baby, is she getting upset that the lime light on her is now fading.....ohhhhh, so sorry to hear that... Guess the button you pinned to her chest for being "the one" is not giving her the satisfaction it once did, the shine is OFF the apple! Guess she'll have to go stick her voodoo doll pins in someone else now, huh? Happy Trails and all that....b'bye.

YOU, my friend - Have a Happy Turkey Day! Get silly, go crazy and have fun with those girls! The best times I ever had was with my daughter and her friends, cooking, watching movies, making my house a wreck, toilet papering people's yards that night and running around town in the car doing chinese fire drills! food fights were cool, too....

You bless my heart with the willingness to be real and fight the good fight here. It really isn't about if we win or lose - it truly is about - how we walk the journey and what the present moment consists of and can we really, really be IN the present? That is quite the task, but once we accomplish that art - life becomes astoundingly more beautiful and complete. Whatever you do this holiday - Be ALL there. (smile)

November 21, 2001
1:53 pm
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Randy, read those faq's on the healthplace.com page, I swear it is what you and I are living with. I got last night the ritual holiday dump, and stopped him after a few seconds, got side tracked with insinuations, of why I had my hair and nails done before Turkey day, just whose house was I going to and by the way, how can I show property when its dark? He demanded I change the color of my toe nail polish?????????????????????????????
I suggested that he tell his little boy that he was a man now, and that when his little boy feels small he doesn't have to try to rip his wife to shreads. And to shut up and leave me alone. That his brain is not working correctly, and that he cannot keep his lies straight, and that his paranoia is totally uncalled for. I shut the door, and went to bed. I also told him that there was absolutely no excuse for not taking the time or effort to have at least picked me a posy for my birthday, that it was just another example of how selfish and self centered he really is. He left for work at 730 this morning a new record. The resumes are out there and the clock is ticking. In the meantime, despite the accused games I am playing I am going to bake pies with daughters and grandmother today, and going to the beach for their holiday dinner. Where the sane people gather. Well most of them any how. have a great day and we must all remember to be greatful for the little things. By the way the color I have is not going to change, hahaha. If you know where I can sign him up for the taliban, please share. I refuse to do jihad here, ANYMORE

November 21, 2001
2:34 pm
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God, Molly - this guy is whacked. Get out as soon as you possibly can. What a nut. Have a very Happy and halfway SANE Thanksgiving, okay? ((Hugs))

P.S. - he's just jealous because his nails and toes aren't that pretty. Maybe you should offer the color to him to try.

November 21, 2001
9:14 pm
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ranmar1
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Hey guys, I just realized, we should be sending these people to Afganistahn, because with so much destruction, wreckage and brain washing the Taliban's have done, these people we know would fit right in, with all their destruction, brain washing, etc.. Of course, we know what is now happening with the Taliban, and the real world starting to take back control. See any analogy here with the people we know? May God bless all of you, and have a wonderful, happy and terrific turkey day. I'll be in the desert with my girls starting tomorrow night, lap top and all......talk to all of you over fed, turkey stuffed friends then.......Take care......and thank you again Ladeska........Randy

November 24, 2001
5:41 pm
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Hey everyone, I hope everyone had a great Thanksgiving. We had a ball, going with my girls to my folks house in L.A., and then driving out here to Palm Springs. On Thanksgiving, wacko called the girls from her sister's house, crying. That started my girls crying........real nice!
When we got out here, we stayed out at the pool all day yesterday, went out to dinner last night, and walked the town. My oldest one started talking about her mother and I, and says to me that I took too good care of her mom, and spoiled her. She says her mother told her I treated her like a child. I responded that she was right in that I did spoil her, and that when she (my daughter) got older, I hoped she would find someone that would spoil her too, but that she would show and express how much she appreciated it too. I told her also that her mother felt like she was being treated like a child, because she probably was acting like a child at the time as well. Then, my daughter says that her mother mentioned to her, that she behaved the way she did because of possibly being from another country (coming here from Chile at age 9). I responded that it was no excuse for inappropriate behavior, no matter what country you are from, and that these are matters your mother should not really be discussing with you, since it was a matter between their mother and I, as husband and wife. Then, wacko calls in the morning to talk with the girls, and says to me that for the last three days, she has been crying and doing a lot of soul searching, and wanted to talk when I got back. I responded that I didn't want to talk about anything but my girls right now, and I was too busy to talk abouth anything other than about them. I'm prepared to reject any attempts on her part to try and reconcile. As my counselor said, I have to treat her as an addict, capable of declaring sobriety, without really showing or proving it. I am prepared, if that is the case. I would rather take the time away, to really keep myself propelled on this track I have set out on, with my daughters. It is not a bad life, for now. Yes, I would like to share this with someone, but since I don't have anyone right now, I have my girls and my work for now...........Off to Arizona, Omaha and Salt Lake City next week. Best to all.......
Randy

November 24, 2001
9:40 pm
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Hi Randy, glad to hear you and the girls had a good holiday, all of you deserve some happy R&R.

And the tears, God, what is it with us women and are use of the tears??
I know 2 other cases in my family where the mother is wacko but calls and cries to the kids every now and then to take advantage of their inexperience and immaturity and vulnerability. It's supposed to make them hang up and go, Wow, mommy loves me so much, she was crying, so she must be sorry and unhappy, let's try to make her happy. Such crap. Such manipulative crap. She has no business talking to the girls about her life with you and it's problems. She's dragging them into way too much. They are old enough to know what's goin on, but they only need to know the what's, not the why's.

Be careful Randy. You sound strong, and I think you'll be okay with all of this new found "light" that she's seen. Don't forget all the soul searching you did while she was on "vacation" every other week. She sounds as though she's ready to try her stuff on your vulnerability too. I had a feeling that the minute you stopped trying to get her back she'd do a 180 and try to get you back to where you were before you got so strong without her...
And now, Chili. Yeah, let's see, all of her other reasons for being what she is have all fallen through, so let's try the "I was born in Chili" routine....woe is me. Like, what does that mean, all immigrants come over here and treat their husbands and daughters like they're insignificant?

The desert sounds pretty good right about now. Ohio winter has been very gentle so far, but I know what's coming eventually and it isn't pretty.
The desert, the mountains, a pool....mmmmmmm sounds delicious.
Stay strong Amigo, you are doing so well.

November 25, 2001
12:54 pm
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Molly
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I knew the Holidays would bring her to her knees, and wait till the rest of them happen. The traditions, the absence of the familiar, the parties she is used to going to, the shopping, the decorating, the girls, the life that she no longer has.
It is just going to get worse for her.
I know I have lived it. Hubbys girlfriend was real open last night and in answer to comming over for Christmas Eve, she replied, ya know with divorced parents, and a boy friend with divorced parents, there just isn't enough time to visit everyone. Its true, so some one gets left out, due to the circumstances.
She is going to shed so many more tears, as her reality checks hit her like a ton of bricks. She wanted this don't forget it, and the girls will learn to draw their boundry lines. Which will cause even more tears. Its not always manipulation, its real hurt, real realization of the cost of the choices made, sure I am certain that there could be times of manipulation, but .... I am quite certain that there is real pain, which is hard to controll the response to, but ya know that is not your problem or the girls.

November 25, 2001
10:22 pm
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ranmar
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Ya know, I really had a blast with my daughters this weekend. Just dropped them off at the house with the wacko, and of course, as I expected, she didn't have anything to say, not that I stuck around long enough for her to initiate any conversation. I stayed just long enough to unload the girls things, got my things for the week, and left...real fast. My daughter then called me later, and said I rushed out, was I late for a date or something? Mother was laughing in the background..ha ha.....What an air head. Proof, there is nothing upstairs in the brains department. I'm glad I didn't give her a chance, I just wanted out. I get this tense feeling every time I have to run into her when dropping off the kids, but I guess I hide it well. I realized, there is no way she was doing "some deep soul searching" because there is no soul there, just a phoney person, pretending her way through life. I will continue on my way, with my girls. We had such a wonderful time, and I think they all know the difference. For my oldest one to tell me I took "too good a care, and spoiled her too much" is proof she knows the difference. I will continue my positive role modeling, and just keep doing what I have been doing with them. The hardest part, and my youngest mentioned it to me, is that I start to get quiet and almost choked up when I have to drop them off and leave. Off to Arizona tomorrow, back Tuesday night, and then back out Wednesday to Omaha, and Salt Lake City, back Sunday.
Best to all of you.......Randy

November 26, 2001
11:17 am
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Ladeska
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Well Randy...this is par for course with her. Typical, predictable behavior. I'm sure you know that. At the same time, I know something must go off in you, too, emotionally. However, I think it is a distant bell at this point...and that is good. She's just trying to play you. She was all in good spirits when the girls arrived because she had two lives to "play with" and try and get to you with. Typical spider queen.

That's reallllyyy low for her to use the girls and I know she is. Thank God, they have enough sense to know the difference. And that will depend largely on your consistency, too. They need that when they come back home because she will rattle their tree, no doubt about it. They are "women" and she will say female things to them about you, about men in general, just trying to find a weak place where she can draw blood from and start crap with. They have to be real strong in that dept., but you have to be "stronger" and realize what kind of mind manipulation they are in when they are there.

I went through that with my ex years ago when my daughter was small. It was tough. My daughter and I have always been close though, so even though his new wife tried real hard to mess with her brain and then later - really got nasty with her - it didn't do the damage one might think. Why? Because I was constant and my daughter and I talked about everything. She was pretty messed up when she would come home from being there in the summer, which she started doing at 5. (ripped my heart out for 3 mo.'s) He tried everything in the book, bribed her even - to come live with him. You can have this and you can have that...etc. The new wife was nice to her until they married and then it became obvious he would not have any kids by her. that royally pissed her off and she aimed all her anger at my daughter and me. She hated both of us with a passion and showed that to my daughter every chance she got, was such the evil queen when she was there. "Oh, I didn't do that, she's making that up!!"

My ex never took up for my daughter, said she exaggerated, blah, blah, blah. Can't tell you the number of times I almost hopped a plane just to re-arrange that woman's face. But...in the end - he lost. My daughter knew the difference bet. real love and false love. She told me one time that she wasn't where she was supposed to be when he came to pick her up and he had to wait for her. He didn't really question her about it and blew it off. My daughter thought - Wow! The things I can get away with now!!!

That was okay for a couple of hours until she really got to thinking about it and she thought....what if - something had happened to me - he wasn't even worried... My mom would have been asking me 20 questions and letting me know under no uncertain terms that - I'd better be where I said I would be or else. She then got scared and felt very "unsafe" and wondered about his level of love for her. That kind of stuff continued. They even tried to get her to live with them for awhile, but that didn't go over well with either of us. And to his surprise - all the bribing with material things didn't budge my daughter... We don't have much materially, but we have a whole lot of love and communication, something that neither one of them have by themselves or with each other.

Now, my daughter is a really savvy young lady and can stand on her own two feet and is very solid and "real" emotionally. She looks at him now and goes - how pathetic the both of them are, Mom. In the end, all I have to say to him is - I won the real prize here...."her". He could have been really close to her, too, but he chose not to.

So, doing what you're doing right now - is very important. I know you know that, but from someone who's been there - you have no idea "how important" it is. My daughter would come back home from a summer with him and she'd be angry at times and even lash out at me a little, not bad, but had an attitude. After awhile - I knew it was just the stress of everything coming out and I'd be real firm with her, wouldn't let her get away with it. She'd finally break down and go - Mom, I don't know why I'm like this when I come home...I miss you SOOO much, cry all the way there in the plane and hate being there, but it's like - I just feel angry when I come home.... I understood....too much for a child, way too much....

But, we were resilient and I'd let her just go through her feelings, let her talk when she felt like it and hold the boundaries firmly in place otherwise. She'd eventually get back to the daughter I knew. Life's a bitch when it comes to this stuff...tears your heart out to see how horrible a supposed parent can be to a child they are supposed to love. However, being biologically connected - doesn't give you the title "good parent" either.

So, keep your head up and keep doing what you are doing. Running the good race means being a good athlete, right? She will just spin in her own spit over there and be a lonely old lady. Oh well, was her choice. I used to feel sorry for people like that but I don't anymore. They choose to do all this, no one put a gun to their head. Everything is about "them". Well, news flash - some people don't take it forever and when it's over - it's over. Glad you guys had a good holiday!!!

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