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Help Me Please x 6 the new beginning
November 6, 2001
10:12 pm
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ranmar1
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Hi everyone. Help Me Please x 5 was getting a little too long, so here we are. Hope everyone is having a safe and relaxing week. Best to all........Randy

November 7, 2001
11:07 am
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Ladeska
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Hey Dude! Yeah, you need a new thread anyways because - it's a new life, Charlie Brown. I hear ya, on what you said on the last thread. You really do need to just "balance out". Is necessary. We don't realize sometimes how much we are ripped up inside. We can't see that damage, the blood, the injuries, but just like we have to take it easy after a physical injury - the same is true of an emotional one.

Sometimes, in working with abuse victims - they get sooo frustrated because they want to and expect themselves to - just bounce back really quick. Let's find the answers, Ladeska and patch it up real quick, okay? Um...no...no quickies here... What has taken years to input into our lives, will take at least that long to undo. However, the road out - is a sight better than - the road in because you know you are making progress little by little. We are just such microwave, nano-second people - WE WANT IT NOW mentality that we don't realize - the journey - is where everything is. The destination is often without much of a climax because we think that.....we have arrived.....when in all reality it is in the "arriving" that the abundance to life is truly found. Having a "destination" means that we are finite and that isn't true of life, right? It is infinite in nature. Death of anything - has it's rebirth and another shedding of layers, scales off the eyes and a blooming takes place.

So, if we correct that mindset - it makes learning balance a bit easier. We learn to position ourselves - within the moment, not trying to catch the destination by the coattails - which will always - move out of reach....and so it should...

Life teaches us, if we allow it. It will gently nudge us back onto the path...if we will listen. You're in your cocoon right now....processing, refining those wings of yours - you're not ready to fly yet in some respects. Time to take care of what is closest to you and then work outward.

This is the path of gracefulness...learning to breathe, to pace ourselves, to stop running, being frantic, being busy, being buzzy, (smile).... I think we really don't realize how much we "spin" and try to make things happen, when in all reality things will happen very nicely on their own if we will just stop trying to push buttons and be in control. Kind of like - when you jump into the river - you don't always need to fight against it. There is a flow there and we can go with it and experience a harmony that we never knew was there because we wouldn't listen to it....

I can see that....you are "listening" more intently now.....(smile) and this is good....

Consideration for Holidays....go up to the Redwoods and rent yourself a little cabin. They aren't that expensive and are all over the place going up there and around there. Check it out on the web. Go hiking, be with nature. It's a magical place up there. Grab a buddy that has nothing going on and take off.

November 7, 2001
1:09 pm
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Molly
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Ladeska's suggestions are great, nature is such a good cure. You have your parents for the holidays, that can help some, I personally like Big Sur my self, or Mexico, can't believe the price of some of the airfares, and you must have a load of frequent flyer miles!!!

November 8, 2001
6:10 pm
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Tonite, my youngest is having a school sponsored Pizza Party at a local restaurant, which we planned to go to. Well, lo and behold, wacko just called asking if she can come too. Unfortunately, the youngest said sure, so wacko is going to be there tonite. Why does she have to stick her nose into it, since she was so busy before with her own schedule. It just seems like she keeps putting her face in front of me. We have another mediation session on the 19th of Nov., another $350 each. I can afford it, so I guess I should just grin and bare it, watching wacko having to write a check for the same amount.
Best to all........I guess I'm irritated today........sorry.
Randy

November 8, 2001
6:28 pm
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Ladeska
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Typical for a narcissist actually. She wants to still try and squeeze as much her way in the mediations as possible, IF possible - AND.....they just can't stand to be "dismissed". Really pisses them off to be treated with apathy. Like - and who are you?

They HATE that! They want to see people grovel in their wake, to freak out that they aren't in their life, to see if they can do their pinky and get you back or get that flirty glance their way. It's all so sickening. I saw my ex-friend do that here at the last of things. She would talk about how she could bat her eyes and get so and so back - just like that. Was real proud of herself in that regard. It's just that sick, sick ego of theirs that can't stand for the world to NOT be about - them. Whether it's about them creating havoc and disaster or a facade of being a good girl - it doesn't matter. They just want the press and you to "want" them or be devastated because they are gone. Miserable little representations of life, aren't they? Rather malignant. And I would never, ever say that about anyone....except for....the people that Know the hell what they are doing and smirk and do it anyways... Those people - I have nothing but contempt for. They aren't sick - they are twisted - by choice.

November 8, 2001
7:40 pm
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Molly
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She is also most likely feeling really insecure, especially since she is not living with the girls. Your gone if I understand correctly when Wacko has them so its maybe a little different for you. She also may want to try to salvage the public opinion, make sure no one says anything to you about this or that in her absence. Now that you both are appart, she needs really bad to look like the involved mom. The father of my kids never went to one school function, for work related reasons, like the bar he went to ugh ugh because of traffic, and besides, isn't that what a mom is for? But as soon as we were divorced, he went over board, he called the school once a month, made sure all the hand outs, and PTA stuff got mailed to his house, and he never ever missed a teacher confrence, or pizza night again. It made me want to gag, just like you are, but at least for the girls she is there, where as before?????????? I just hope she covers the clevage, and doesn't hit on the principal.

November 8, 2001
10:08 pm
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Ladeska
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......Oh STOP!!! I doubling over here with sympathy for this woman!!! And to lose faith in the eye of public approval!!! EGADS!!! How will she continue to go on????? (sigh, weep, moan) Geez if she was a guy, she'd be impotent by now.

November 8, 2001
10:18 pm
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ranmar1
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Luckily, she didn't come tonite. We had a blast, met up with some friends, sat with them and just talked. The girls had a good time too. You know guys, this isn't that bad of a life. Like Ladeska says, if you just go with the flow of the river, and not fight the currents, it really is easier and you look at things in a different perspective. The wife of the friends I was with says, watch out, in four to six months she will probably be pressing to come back together in some form. I told her that as long as I continue to focus on my girls first, work second, I don't think I will be blindsided again.......The immersion into my work has been a God send. Since I am able to travel whenever and wherever within my territory, I don't have time to sit home and wallow in self pity, or wonder what happened. I think I played it right so far, in keeping myself so occupied. I'm looking into different options for the Xmas week, Mexico is looking good. Thanksgiving is coming up, and i'm taking the girls up to my folks house with all the family. Wacko is going to her parents house. This should be fun for me. Anyways, that's it for now......things, as I said, are okay for now.....one day at a time.....I'm just a little exhausted, but well worth it......Take care everyone........
Randy

November 9, 2001
4:51 pm
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ranmar1
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Off to the Pacific Northwest Sunday. Talk to everyone from there. Wacko seems to be showing some strain according to some mutual friends......too bad......her deal, live with it.......Randy

November 9, 2001
6:13 pm
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Ladeska
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Yeppers. And if you can just focus on "what strings" are pulled in you when you think you get weak - maybe you can discern them, as far as she's concerned. I hear that in what you wrote - that you are acknowledging - she could do that, if you don't stay focused, etc., etc. So.....let's just barrel right on into that dark little room and turn on all the lights.

What?

What is it that she could possible tempt you with? Let's gab about it. Then - it won't be a temptation anymore because you will have nailed it's skinny little ass right to the wall and it will look like - just what it is - a deception.

So, talk to me....how would she do it?
And what place would you be in when she would?

November 10, 2001
10:43 pm
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ranmar1
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Ladeska,
You are good..............To be totally honest with myself, if wacko said we should consider attempting getting together again for the sake of the kids, I would have a hard time not considering it. However, I also would remember all the times she took off without any of us, taking care of her childish behavior. I would also remember her not going to her own daughter's softball games today because she had "other plans". I would also be very skeptical of her true motivations, money, security, the fairy tale life she pushed away, and also the compromising I did to myself, rationalizing that her behavior was okay.........All of these would come into play. I would focus back on all the hurt and pain she caused, not only on me but my kids as well. I will never forget the night we told the kids we were separating, and they just held each other, like they had nobody else to watch over them, just each other, while the "three" of us cried. I'll remember how their mother was just numb, showing no emotion. Finally, I would remember all the deciet, lies and slanting of the truth she told me, when she said she was going out with "friends", when in fact, she was out with her "just male friend". These are all the sore points I would need to focus on, in order to head off any manipulation on her part. Does this sound like a fair assessment?
Off to the Northwest tomorrow, laptop and all. I look forward to checking in with you..........thank you.
Randy

November 11, 2001
1:17 am
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Ladeska
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Randy.....such are the snares that you need to be extremely mindful of and keep these things before you at all times. She's very capable of reeling you back in now that I have read this, so my advice to you is don't become complacent in your vigilance to always "REMEMBER". You have not come this far to sacrifice this whole journey only to fall victim once again. The fall would be deadly in the hands of such a spider queen. She would relish it and hurt you in ways that you can't even fathom yet. Not only you - but them.

Such narcissism doesn't care, Randy. It's not capable. She will turn into an angel of light if she has to because she needs to feed on someone and your the most vulnerable suspect because you remember so much of her charm and that is her best weapon against you. She doesn't like being exposed to the world because deep down she's a coward.

So, keep recounting, make a list if you have to and keep it handy. Time will help you as you move away from this more and more and make healthy tracks. But, the venom that is left within you has it's shiny parts to it because you never would have fallen victim in the first place if this was not true.

Believe me, I know and understand. I feel for such a person a few times and every time was more severe until I almost lost my sanity. They are the best charmers on earth. Stay away....like the plague. You have enough information. You don't need anymore. This is for your children more than anything. They don't need to learn anymore patterns from the spider queen and they need you to show them - how to disengage with such an evil force in someone. Otherwise, they will repeat this and this is a pain that will rip your heart out slowly over time.....

November 11, 2001
8:32 am
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janes
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Ditto ditto ditto...

getting back with "Spider woman" would never benefit the girls.

Living with you mostly certainly may give them a better handle on what to look for in a mate....

Keep your eyes OOPEN

November 12, 2001
11:04 am
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ranmar
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I read your post Ladeska, and I can't agree with you more. I'm sitting here in my hotel room in Spokane, watching another news report about an airplane crash in New York this morning, thinking how fragile and unpredictable life really is. It makes me think more about how evil and sick people can be, how unaffected and unfeeling some people are, versus those that cry, hurt and show emotion. Wacko fits the first description. I remember when the twin towers were hit, about two days later, they held a memorial service at a cathedral in NY, and it was broadcasted. I watched, and someone sang a song, America, starting out with OH Beautiful, for spacious skies, and I started to cry while watching. Meanwhile, wacko went out golfing with her "just male friend". I guess that told me what I already knew, no feelings, no emotion, just taking care of herself, as usual. This person, I think, is going to find themselves by themself in life, since as she admitted during one of our arguments previously, she is not capable of having or being in a comitted relationship. That was a warning to me not to try and fight to save the marriage, but I didn't catch it. There were so many signs going on, and statements made. Another one she made during a calm in the storm, was that she knew she had the worse (her first marriage) and has had the best, but needs to figure out what to do with it. I guess I should be sending her a thank you note for not wanting to continue a marriage, filled with deciet, manipulation, lies, adn having an intimate affair if not physical with someone else, unbeknown to me for over a year. A person like this is truly a sicko, not deserving of having a loving, trusting and morally correct relationship. I told her toward the end that I don't deserve this, and she didn't deserve me.......I don't think anything registers in her head. It's like talking to a child. Well, it's time to get dressed, go out, and do what I enjoy doing, selling to my existing accounts, seeing people I enjoy working with. It's cold here, about 40 degrees. Stay safe and well...
Randy

November 12, 2001
12:26 pm
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Ladeska
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Well, Dude - I got a website for ya, that if I haven't already given it to you - it's high time and I apologize for the oversight. Tons of reading here and will help you understand what you've been involved with...

http://www.geocities.com/Athen.....index.html

Yeah, you know....this ex-best friend of mine was the same way, just didn't have emotions about anything unless it was her rage about something. That was about the only emotion you saw from her. The rest of the time she was just stoic and trying to mimick whatever emotion you seemed to be having at the time. Now I realize how horrible that must have been for her to do this all the time..."poor baby". Always trying to look human, with the empathy thing...must have been wretched for her....knowing all along that she could really give a shit about whoever or whatever unless it behooved her to play along and look sympathetic for some reason.

Please read up here at this site, Randy. Will help you alot.

....horrible about that plane crashing...talk about insult to injury for those residents there... I still have periods in my day where I cry for all those people, just comes in waves...alot of us do that. Watching Private Ryan again last night didn't help matters either.....war is sooo brutal and cruel.

What cracks me up about the media is they immediately say - Oh, don't think it had anything to do with terrorism. Um...it just happened folks, so how can you even say - you don't think this or that UNTIL an investigation has gone on? What? Ya got your psyche working overtime here, or what? We're not children, we don't need the parenting thing of - it's okay now, don't get all upset, it's not what you think, there, there. Please.... Just do your job, investigate and then report the findings. We're smart people, treat us like it.

November 12, 2001
12:36 pm
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Molly
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Let's just see how long it takes to find this black box??????????????
doesn't really matter, can you really trust what they tell us?
Randy, you sound great, keep on.

November 12, 2001
12:40 pm
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Ladeska
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I haven't trusted the media for a very long time....

November 12, 2001
2:24 pm
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Ladeska
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I'm becoming more and more aware, every day actually - at how easily we are manipulated. What I see going on is starting to look just a wee bit like highly evolved Psych-Ops and we are such good little mice....very trainable. There's quite the speculation with some that we've been "dumbed" out as a nation for quite a few years now. All one has to do for evidence of that one is to look at the really "high" quality of movies and programs on T.V.... I figure out the plots to most movies anymore in about the first ten minutes. But, hey, as long as our stock market is doing good and we've got our toys and we can numb out to the T.V. or whatever - why think for ourselves, right? Yeppers and that's just what any pied piper would prefer. But, if we do think for ourselves - all of a sudden we're a conspiracy freak, right? hm,m,m....

November 12, 2001
6:59 pm
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ranmar
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I got to tell you, it's really bizarre, but my last trip up here got cancelled. I was five minutes from stepping on an airplane in the morning, September 11th. The flight got cancelled and the airport shut down. Now, here I am again, in the Northwest, the first time back up since before 9/11, and once again, a downed airliner. Is this bizarre or what? Ladeska, I'm going to check out the web site you gave me. Coincidentally, wacko calls this morning and ask if I saw the news report. I replied yes, I was really feeling for these people, she asked if I was afraid. I responded NO< after what I have experienced and been through, I find it easier just to accept things they way they are, not fight upstream against the currents, but allow myself to now accept things and go with it. She sounded all bubbly like nothing was wrong between us, and didn't get the message I was putting out, not that I should have expected her to. Hey, Ladeska, going with the flow of the river, sounds familiar? In regards to our society, I think it has become easier for people to just sit back and not have to think too deeply anymore, just be entertained, no matter what, and at any cost. I think people are afraid to voice objection or reject anything that they don't feel comfortable with, because it's easier just to go along, compromise. Hey, I did it for over two years. It was easier just to not rock the boat, even though the boat was being washed over by tons and tons of deciet and manipulation. I guess when you close your eyes to the world, all you see is black, so you don't have to deal with anything. Boy, when the wake up call comes, it comes slamming against the side of your head. I'm still reeling from being slammmed as you can tell. But, like any hurt, eventually I'm sure, it will subside. For now, I'm in Lewiston, Idaho, 2 hour drive from Spokane. BAck to Spokane tomorrow night for a flight over to Seattle. Hope everyone is okay. It's a strange world we live in right now. We all need to just realize what our priorities are, and act on them. What's important to me are my girls, my job and income to support my girls, and our health. Everything else can come after that........Stay well and safe........Randy

November 12, 2001
7:15 pm
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ranmar
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Hey, Ladeska. I visited the site. Is there any discussions or is it all by book purchasing? Interesting site. Which book would you recommend?
Randy

November 12, 2001
9:31 pm
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Terre
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HealthyPlace.Com has some good info on Narcissism & Personality Disorders.
Go to http://WWW.Healthplace.com/to the personality disorders page.

November 12, 2001
9:32 pm
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Terre
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November 13, 2001
10:44 am
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Ladeska
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Randy....actually I was just saying that the site itself has information and reading on it... Haven't bought any of the books, but there is tons of info there - online.

November 13, 2001
1:50 pm
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Molly
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Terre-------------- oh my God. What a web site. Reading those faq's gave such clairity, down to the hyprochrondria!!!! Thank you.

November 13, 2001
2:03 pm
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Ladeska
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Randy...as you will see after reading some of this site about narcissists - whacko is just pulling your string because she can't stand not to have her "supply" anymore and is trying to get it activated again. And, they can't stand not having everything "about them". Really pisses them off that - you reject them and they try desperately to get back on top where they can reel you back in and then - they slam You....even harder than last time. That.....is her deal.

If I were you - I wouldn't even give her long replies or explanations about anything when she called to ask a question like that. Just say - nope. Not sure if you did say more than that - but her bubbly stuff is just her being glad that she got you to engage with her - that far. Score!in her book. That's one thing I started doing with people in my life - who I identified as being this - just stopped short with my answers and let the silence hang. Then I would be the one that broke it off. Gotta run, b'bye. Pisses them off that they would be "dismissed!!!" and they couldn't be the one that did that to me! Oh bummer.

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