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having some conflicting thoughts--loverbee
October 27, 2006
4:26 pm
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loverbee
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Ok, so I am 24 years old and the only things that my mother has ever contributed to my life were the times she beat me till I was in the hospital or the times she disappeared (for my own good she claims) or then when she came back into my life and now for the last five months have had to pay her rent. I am a loving daughter so I do it every time but recently I have been thinking some horrible thoughts. She has been telling me that her hair is falling out and she can't afford medical care at all right now and I found myself happily wondering, is she going to die soon? I know I would be sad if she did but I am also just so sick of having her in my life and I don't know any other way to be free of her and the terrible burdens she puts on me. Am I a bad person?

October 27, 2006
5:05 pm
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needtoheal
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no i do not think that having these thoughts makes you a BAD person, loverbee..
-- you mentioned things that made you feel powerless (being a child and your mother beating you )
--I think that, in my opinion, you are feeling very angry
It is healthy that you are expressing your anger in a positive way
--writing your thoughts down can really help
You have been through a lot, loverbee

October 27, 2006
5:55 pm
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loverbee
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I Know that I have been through a lot and there are times that I feel like it will never fully heal. Now is not one of those times though.RIght now I feel like she is the only part of the life that I hated before that is left and I am ready to let her go.

October 27, 2006
11:04 pm
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loverbee
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bumping this thread up

October 27, 2006
11:15 pm
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needtoheal
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HI again loverbee--- just got home from work... my kids are with their father for the weekend and I have been keeping myself busy with work.. and thought I would come here because I am alone with my puppy and I know that I can never be alone because I have friends here who will listen and support me....

How are you feeling now?

October 28, 2006
11:43 am
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loverbee
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feeling used and abandoned by my mother but oddly, today, I am being pampered and taken care of. My bf has decided that this day is all mine. So I am happy to have someone to take the wheel when I am too tired.

October 28, 2006
6:10 pm
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StronginHim77
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loverbee -

You are paying her rent for the past five months? WHOA. Major red flag. WHY??????

You owe her NOTHING. Absolutely NOTHING. She should get help from Welfare or a local shelter for the homeless.

Period.

- Strong

October 28, 2006
8:05 pm
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loverbee
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shes on welfare but still has problems paying. I don't owe her anything but I can't in good conscious let her go out on the street.

October 28, 2006
8:15 pm
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Anonymous
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I can understand that you don't want her out on the streets. Think about this though. Since you've been paying her rent, you have the right to know where her welfare is going and why she can't pay her own. Does she have a substance abuse problem? If that's not the problem, maybe you could help her recognize why she hasn't been able to pay her own rent.

If that IS the problem, stop feeling obligated and don't pay her rent. She's done this to herself.

October 28, 2006
11:13 pm
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loverbee
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I told her this was the last time I was paying it and that I meant. But it is really hard not to feel guilty and feel pity for a schitzophrenic alcoholic person who was raped by her father and abused by her mother. I can't help it most of the time especially because I know that she loves me very much but she is sick and can't help that (I am talking about the shitzophrenia not the alcohoism) and I am a very loving and caring person. It makes me sad to see her so pathetic but it is frustrating that I cant just shake her and say shut the f*** up and get off your butt and do something to fix your life. Cause that won't do anything.

October 28, 2006
11:36 pm
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sis_who_got_help
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Sometimes you need to set up boundries to protect yourself. I am having issues with my mom right now and having to limit contact to phone only. Maybe you could try limiting your contact with her.

October 29, 2006
9:09 am
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loverbee
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The way I deal with it is that if she calls me, I don't pick up. Instead, I wait for a time when I am ready to talk so that way it is on my terms. But I still have issues with it. Can you ever really make the issues just go away? It seems like you can't. No matter how hard I try, I can't just abandon her. I know that may be pathetic but she is my mother. So I can't just cut her out of my life. Especially since I cut my dad out of my life and she was so supportive of me. So I feel as though it would be wrong to just abandon her. Especially now that I am pretty sure her liver is failing. She has been complaining about diarhea for the last few months and her hair is falling out. I don't know that I can do anything to help her physically but I know that I can keep her off the streets. So in the meantime I am torn and just frustrated.

October 29, 2006
1:52 pm
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gracenotes
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loverbee,

If your mom is on welfare and has a schizophrenic diagnosis, is she not on any MediCaid or MediCare? If she is not, they maybe she needs assistance by someone (doesn't have to be you, sometimes agencies can help with this) to get her these benefits. That might take a load off of you. Also, can she sign up for housing assistance? Where I live, they have Section 8 housing where people can get low cost housing. It sounds like your mom needs to be hooked up with some mental health agency and she needs a case manager who can help her get at least sustenance benefits for medical, housing, and mental health. I would check with your county health department or mental health department or, if she is older, with some elder assistance programs. I think you and your mother need information on what is available and dealing with this disease. Maybe she sabotaged benefits and help in the past, didn't fill out forms, etc., but that can most likely be remedied and it might be worth another try.

Keep up the good boundary work!! Sounds like you are on track with this.

October 30, 2006
8:38 am
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loverbee
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It is very difficult because of the fact that my mother has Paranoid schitzophrenia which makes her afraid of case workers and government officials and doctors and therapists and lawyers. It is next to impossible to get her to talk to anyone without freaking out. I wish there was something I could do to make both our lives a little easier but for now I told her this was the last month I was paying her rent and that she needed to get her act together.

October 30, 2006
11:48 am
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cyndra820
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Loverbee,

I'm sorry that dealing with your mother has become so difficult. I understand that she's due to her illness she is afraid of people, some who are in a position to help her. When she got the housing assistance did she do it alone, or was it facillitated by someone else? Does she have a social worker assigned to her that you can talk to?

As for paying her rent, she needs to explain to you where her rental assistance money is going to. If she isn't using it for her rent she is committing fraud. Do you know if they periodically check with her landlord to see how the rent is being paid? I know they do that in the state where I live.

I know it's hard. I admire you for trying to help her, but you have to decide if it is healthier for you to NOT help her. You have to protect you. No one else will.

Take care,
Cyndra

October 30, 2006
1:46 pm
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Dear loverbee,

I'm so sorry you are having to deal with this horrible situation with your mother.

It does sound like she is physically ill, and not doing well mentally. That she chooses to drink on top of it only tells me that she "gave up" a long time ago.

I just wrote a rather long story and accidentally "lost" it before I posted it.

It was about a friend from our past who managed to drink his way from passably happy younger days into staying in a room in his son's family's basement. He lost his wife and kids to alcohol. He was never criminal or in jail or drove drunk and killed anyone, etc. He just NEVER TRIED to help himself. All his friends over the years would try to help -- we'd give him money, find him jobs, give him an old truck or give him rides to work when he had a job -- but he never chose to use his own ingenuity or look into himself. He was smart once!! We all remember his dry wit. Sometimes I saw his lack of action almost as a character flaw. Other times we saw his inability to "step up" to anything challenging as mental illness (Poor P it was genetic he can't help it). A few times I thought he was just being beliggerant. Sometimes I just thought he was lousy selfish bum. I know I wanted him WELL AWAY from my own family because he was such a slug and I didn't want his influence around -- and if you offered him a couch to sleep on temporarily you knew he'd be living with you in short order. ISH.

Frankly, I don't blame you for paying her rent, in that it keeps her from the streets. But chances are more likely that it would be your couch, and that's scarey.

If I were in your shoes, I would do my best to "Prick" her pride. However, whatever, it takes to get her to acknowledge what she is doing.

If you can detach emotionally and just ask her some direct questions like: It seems like you really are not trying at all to take care of anything -- you drink, you don't eat right, etc. Are you really giving up? Do you want to die?

What are you planning to do this evening? Tomorrow? What are you going to do to try to make things better? You know I can't afford to take care of you financially, and it isn't fair to expect it of me.

Are you going to drink tonight? That will make you feel worse tomorrow, and you need to do things that make you feel stronger, not weaker.

Can you go in to a free clinic?

Or, "You know I will take care of you the best way I can, but I really hate that you do not care enough about me or yourself that you are letting this happen AT you and choosing to not do anything at all." You used to have so much fight and so much talent -- why did you stop using it?

You are NOT OLD, though you are getting older. It's more important than ever now (if you want to continue to live) to FIGHT for your life by making good choices.

I personally think that alcoholics cannot "hear", but if you say this sort of thing to her repeatedly, it might get through, and then she might try.

I just re-read your post. She put you in the hospital??????? I'm so sorry. You are such an awesome person. You have sounded like someone way older than 24, loverbee.

She's like our friend P because she/he was such a victim in their own growing up that there was no way to learn another way.

YOU, HOWEVER, Loverbee, are the place where all that ends. I wish you all the endless energy that loverbees are naturally endowed with. All the forgiveness that is possible. The cleverness and ingenuity to make dreams come true. A beautiful family of your own when you are ready for it. And always, the capacity to cope.

Please keep talking about this. It seems like you need more input from others.

October 30, 2006
2:29 pm
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loverbee
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Its strange to me to think about saying that "she used to have so much fight" because as long as I have been around and alive, she hasn't had any fight. You see, I was the product of an affair and it drove my mom even more batty than she already was. When I think about her its like all I want to do is end the conversation as soon as possible. I look at her as something I survived and also as someone I feel sorry for. I am just frustrated and feeling so ready to give up on her.

October 30, 2006
2:59 pm
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Wait, I guess I ASSUMED she had fight.

Still, you weren't around when she was young enough to have fight.

She HAD to have had some fight in her in order to have had the affair that caused her pregnancy.

She is a product (as we all are) of her own decisions, non-decisions, etc. and her REACTIONS. So, if she was fond enough of your father to have an affair with him, she had to have had at least that much "fire" in her to rebel against her then husband.

But whatever happened in the aftermath of that shut her down.

Whether it was hurt from husband, family, friends, she must have experienced enough of it to just want to escape. Booze works. You don't have to take responsibility if you just let your sanity fly out the window. People accept "crazy" as a reason.

I can't get afeeling for what a conversation with her is like. I'm sorry I assumed it was more rational. I'm trying to imagine how you could feel responsible for her. Because you cannot, I guess, be as cruel and incapable as she was with you.

Howcome SHE gets to be a screwball and you don't??????? Did you say you have siblings to discuss your mother with?

October 30, 2006
8:17 pm
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loverbee
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Well here is the catch. I am a product of an affair but was raised by my father who was not my father (she had cheated on him) but never found out who my biological father was because she was on heroin at the time she slept with him so I have never met my real father. In terms of a conversation with her...well let me see if I can't help

"Hi M. How is everything?"
"Good mom, I am doing well in school."
"I am so proud of you and your sister. I just wish these damn foreigners weren't stealing all the money from the goverment so that they would leave me alone. I am trying so hard and I hate that you girls have to help me but the damn government won't give me a break and I am short on rent again because they won't give me my welfare check. I feel so bad asking again though."
"Mom, do you need help paying rent?"
"Let me see if I can do it on my own because I don't want you to feel obligated but the help is so appreciated. You are the best daughter ever."

Several hours later and after a bottle of wine

"M. I am so sorry for hitting you when you were little I can't believe that I put your hand to the stove and allowed that monster to sodomize you when you were so little and helpless."
"Its ok mom."
"If only the government hadn't been after me then I would have stayed sober but they cause so much stress because they are always trying to get me."

So you get the jist. It is horrible and repetitive but confusing and unpredictable at the same time. The latest is saying that everything she screws up at her new job is because she can't see cause she can't afford new glasses. Shes nuts and my sis and I hang together and try to do the best we can but it is hard.

October 30, 2006
8:36 pm
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loverbee
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Oh and today I sent out the check with a letter that said she was going to have to get her act together because I couldn't afford to keep paying her rent. She is deteriorating before my eyes and it is hard having to say goodbye again.

October 30, 2006
10:29 pm
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loverbee
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bumpity bump

October 30, 2006
10:29 pm
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Wow. I'm such a tool. I had her pictured as sort of "belly up". Sorry. Your description makes her much more real.

She manipulates everyone and blames everyone and everything and lies. Did I get it now? And she's confused and living in her own world.

I'm so sorry, loverbee. You and your sister are a "source" for her? She sounds just completely narcissistic.

I'm not trying to be mean when I put this one out here, but someone once asked me when I was very upset about a crazy co-worker, "why do you think that person was put in your life's path? what is it you think you were supposed to learn from him/her?" I'm starting to get SOME of the question now.

I am just astounded you are the awesome person you are. Someone helped you grow up intact in spite of all the chaos and abuse. I know a young woman who had a very hard childhood and she finally finished college and got her first teaching job at 29. She is just a wonderful teacher. Caring people who reach out with so much love to those who need it so much.... Like RADAR for other people's feelings.....that's maybe what your mom gave you. You're no fool. But your heart is right.

October 30, 2006
10:41 pm
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loverbee
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I feel like right now I am just waiting for her to die. It makes me feel guilty but at the same time her death is a source of my relief.

October 30, 2006
11:06 pm
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You sound pretty sure that she is dying. It is very understandable that you will feel relief. And you might experience an incredible amount of grief for the lack of good mothering as well as the loss of someone you love and feel conflicted towards.

I've gotten a big aversion to talking to or listening to drunks. I will lie to get off the phone, leave, go to bed, choose to be alone. It's like talking to a wall for all you get out of it yourself.

October 31, 2006
8:09 am
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loverbee
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Yeah and I am pretty sure that if she doesn't die (which is possible because I am not really sure how the heck she is still alive now) then I hope she is declared unfit to take care of herself and put in a home where she can get help. But for now, seems I am the only one here that can do anything.

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