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God answering prayers
November 27, 2000
7:44 am
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eye_can_c_u
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I've read most of the threads, and some advise I read was that you should pray allot. What makes you think that God will answer you're prayers if you only pray when you're going through a tough time or when you need his help. Don't you think you should pray when things are going well, too?

November 27, 2000
5:03 pm
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eye_can_c_u

Why do you think that you should pray at all?

November 27, 2000
7:55 pm
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vr
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Oh no don't get me going!!! No I won't. Maybe another day. I have to go pray now, and always. Even for you Tez since maybe you don't.heehee

November 28, 2000
4:07 pm
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Vr(j)

I just about pissed myself laughing, then. I set a sprat to catch a mackeral. But instead I caught a very nice dolphin by mistake. I'm sorry... šŸ™‚

I sensed that 'eye_can_c_u' has a concept of a merchant god who trades with humans using prayers and worship as currency. My response was about confirming or invalidating that hypothesis of mine.

November 28, 2000
4:07 pm
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Vr(j)

I just about pissed myself laughing, then. I set a sprat to catch a mackeral. But instead I caught a very nice dolphin by mistake. I'm sorry... šŸ™‚

I sensed that 'eye_can_c_u' has a concept of a merchant god who trades with humans using prayers and worship as currency. My response was about confirming or invalidating that hypothesis of mine.

November 28, 2000
7:33 pm
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vr
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I set a sprat to catch a mackeral? Does that mean you went fishing? And please don't piss yourself. Yes, we use the same expression here! I'm glad you laughed though. You only get to live this day once and it's nice if you can find something nice, or funny, or worthwhile in it. And yes, God does answer prayers if you ask for the right thing. Like the Rolling Stones say, "you don't always get what you want . . . but you just might find, you get what you need".

November 28, 2000
8:14 pm
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gingerleigh
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What happens when you go looking for God and He doesn't answer? I'm very malnourished spiritually, and have no relationship with God. I grew up Catholic, and watched my Sunday church-going friends do evil the rest of the week. I asked Jesus Christ to come into my heart and I felt nothing, only lonely, wondering if there was something wrong with me and evil in me that even God didn't want me.

How do you start a relationship with God? I'm not certain that Christianity is the right way, but I do believe that there has to be a higher power out there. Where do I find Him/Her/It? I'm very lonely.

November 29, 2000
2:05 pm
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Cici
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You can only find whatever you feel as God within yourself. God is beyond words, beyond human comprehension, merely an ideal. This is why different religions have different images of God, from Allah to A'lluah to the Trinity to the Buddha to the Mahavira.

The divine is expressed in religions in culture-speciic ways. I think, in order to make God more accessible to that community. The Japanese will not experience the Divine in the same way that the Western Islamics would, or in the same way as Western Christians would.

Since GOd is divine and beyond human comprehension it makes no sense to describe God through limiting culture-specific ideology.

I was raised Catholic by a Buddhist mother and an agnostic father. But my experience with God has been personal, inexplicable, no one could understand your relationship with God but you and however you understnad God to be. When I was a little child, I imagined God to be an old man with a long white beard. Now, my vision of God is more abstract, less constricting.

Blind faith is stupid. Doubt causes us to question and explore, rather than bleat around like dumb sheep, led by a leader just as fallible as ourselves. God isn't a physical presence, a man with man's thoughts or impulses. God is God. Divine, inexplicable, total.

I see no difference between God and the Shinto idea of divine Kami infusing every thing of nature, or between God and the paternalistic shepard of Christianity, or between God and the Buddha who urged us to seek release through our own effort. God doesn't DO things for you, God merely is comfort in our desolate Kali Yuga (as the Hare Kirshna's term it).

Two books:
"The Kingdom of God is Within You" by Leo Tolstoy (yes, THAT Tolstoy, who converted to Christianity after 35 years of being atheist). Written at the turn of the century, c. 1890-1900

"Ghandi: My Experiments with Truth (an autobiography)" By Mohandas Ghandi, with an introduction by Sissela Bok. Written in 1925.

Both are a defense of general theism and advocate ahimsa, complete nonviolence, and Tolstoy's book is more of Chirstianity as a way of life rather than a religious instiution.

November 29, 2000
10:21 pm
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Molly
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With lots of my clients, I suggest to go to any church or temple just to experience the energy. Not to go to become enlightened, or to fill a hole, just to sit back and feel, see, join in if they feel moved. I have had so many great responses. Sometimes when we do things, in order to... i.e., expectations, we end up feeling short changed. Like I asked God to come into my heart. My spouse not unlike Tez, has a real hard time with the God concept, but he can buy into the energy concept. Energy continues to flow, and change, and there is obviously good and bad energy, just like a higher and lower power, depends on what you want to tap into, experience, or seek. It is real hard to find bad energy in a group experience with others who are seeking good energy, or love. Its like the love- fear thing. good, bad thing. One "psychic" I know claims to go to churches and steal energy when he feels low, go figure.

November 30, 2000
4:19 pm
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Molly.

You said, "My spouse not unlike Tez, has a real hard time with the God concept..."

Well... I don't have any problem with my concept of a supreme life force behind all we perceive. I just have very great difficulties reconciling the anthropomorphic concepts of God as held and preached by present day christianity. Even their own scriptures are contradictory. I've sure had a good exposure to some 'gun' preachers in gathering my evidence.

I suspect that Christ knew and preached very different concepts to that generally held by christians today.

Given that we have a familiar genre, we can't even pass a message accurately through a couple of people today. What chance did Christ have over two thousand years, many mutations in each language, and many interpretations between languages; Aramaic into ancient Greek, Hebrew, Latin, old english etc. Hell, even words like 'clapped',and 'buggered', have have changed their meaning in just a few short years. Then there's the international differences in english usage of legitimised slang. A 'fanny' to you Americans is 'buttocks'; to us Aussies it's a 'vagina'. Yet Christians think that despite the Council of Nicea and all the other factors, a few of which I have touched upon above, that they have an accurate account of Christ's message. Hmmmm!

November 30, 2000
5:54 pm
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Molly
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I should have said the anthropomorphic concepts of God,currently held and preached by todays Christians. I was general in my statement, sorry.

December 1, 2000
1:27 pm
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Cici
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My religion professor said somethign interesting today in class. Little known Pure Land Buddhism is very popular in Japan. The central tenant is that we live in a degenerate age right now (Mappo), and that by having faith in the Amida Buddha of life and light, the Amida will grant you re-birth in the Pure Land where you will be born into an enlightened, androgenous state.

They utilize a mantra-like repition of the Amida Buddha's Name: Namu Amida Butsu. Somewhat like the Sikh repitition of Sat Nam (True Name) to achieve union with God, or the Eastern Orthodox Chrisitan repition-prayer of belief in Jesus Christ as the Savior.

Jesuits, the first missionaries to reach Japan in the 17th Century, wrote in their journals that they wondered how the "blasphemous teaching of Martin Luther" had reached Japan before they had!

Bottom line (here's where what my prof said comes in): there is no perfect religion, no perfect believer. There is only faith, and a nobiilty in holding faith. Religions are part political institution, part spiritual center. They provide a community, ground us in a moral structure that with intelligent discussion and examination we can choose for ourselves. Even the transtheistic Buddhists have faith that their self-power will propel them to moksha, release from samsara.

Regardless of interpretation, the acts of fallible men should not sway the faith that is true in your heart.

I read an article by a biologist researcher called "Nature Does Not Exist". (http://www.spectator.co.uk/art.....038;id=239) Interestingly, the author uses biblical arguments to reject the idea that there is a natural balance. He states, "I have seen a tree, but I have never seen nature."

It saddens me, because this is a perceptual blindness that makes for a depressing worldview. We are nothing but biological entities, we'll end up as dust. It's not just faith that drives me to reject this hypothesis (as this point of view is just as unproveable as creationism), it is my personal experience with divinity. It is the fact that I have felt the presence of God in my heart since I was a little child. It is hard for me to imagine how it must feel to not know the feeling of the divine in your own heart, and in nature.

The reductionist logician Nagarjuna, who lived in the 1st century CE, came to the conclusion that in most matters, especially those of spirituality, logic falls short of being able to be useful in explaining phenomena. Everything arises because of complementary conditions, therefore whatever proof you get from isolating a system and analyzing it is by essence misleading. Then again, you cannot have theism without atheism.

December 1, 2000
4:27 pm
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Cici.

... and thus my argument that the only thing that we can know beyond doubt is that there is an awareness.

I cannot know that an awareness exists in anyone or anything beyond doubt except in what I assume to be 'me'. I cannot even know beyond doubt that 'I' exist. I can only know beyond doubt that an 'awareness' exists.

What's the point of this? It humbles me somewhat to realise that I am not the possessor of absolute truth, nor anyone else. This 'knowledge' frees me to listen to the ideas of others with an open mind that is not impeded by thinking that I know something beyond doubt other than there is an awareness. In other words I see that life's a game not to be taken too seriously.

If someone - the Buddha maybe - does know 'reality' beyond doubt, I doubt that such an entity would exist in this domain of ignorance. Without the ignorance, the drama as we know it would not exist. Yet we are blithely ignorant of our own ignorance. šŸ™‚

December 1, 2000
4:35 pm
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Molly.

Nothing to be sorry about. I take all of the postings light heartedly. I can honestly say that I seldom ever feel threatened or offended by anyones postings. Even the one from 'Observer' a year ago who said that I was a f...wit and a wanker only produced a twinge followed by a wry smile. He/she was probably right. šŸ™‚

My major flaw of mine is assuming that everyone else is the same. Without meaning to, I probably get peoples backs up by some of my mischevious challenges.

In the first place, I probably should have realized what you meant anyway. šŸ™‚

December 1, 2000
6:46 pm
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Molly
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I'm ok, not a problem here, just a lesson in spelling out the complete thought. šŸ™‚ back to you.

December 2, 2000
12:15 pm
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egg
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Dear Friend.
This world did not begin with a big bang.God is real and he is in control.
The best way to learn about God The father God the Son and God The Holy Spirit and how they work together is to read the Bible. There are truths in the Bible,search the word of God and all of your questions will be answered. Begin in Matthew the New Testament. Pray for God to open your eyes and your heart and sincerly seek the truth. I will be praying for you.Love Josie If you have any sincere
question about God please e-mail me at [email protected]
W

December 2, 2000
3:05 pm
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drugfreemeggie
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this is probably going to sound silly, but if there is a god, then why do people that have done nothing wrong and that are very caring people end up suffering.. my cousin died two months ago she was 24 years old, she got in a car accident and was in a coma for a few weeks and they couldnt do anything for her so they took her off life support and she pasted away 18 hours later...she was the most caring person in the world she loved life and she didnt deserve this at all..and during this tough period in my life i always question if there is a god and he is so great then why would something like this happen..and why would my grandfather being dying of liver cancer..he is a very strict catholic and goes to church all the time....and during all this crap he still believes there is a god..so whats gods purpose for taking these people from my life ??? no one seems to be able to answer that for me...

December 2, 2000
3:08 pm
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egg.

You said, "The best way to learn about God The father God the Son and God The Holy Spirit and how they work together is to read the Bible" What about the Bhagavard Gita, the Upanishads, the Koran, the Granth, the Rig Vedas, the book of Morman, the Bardo Thodol, etc.

Do you think that they all second best? On what basis do you think that the bible is the best way to god? If your time worn reply is "because it is the word of god" I would ask for a sound reason for drawing this conclusion. I've never yet been given one, other than quotes from that book claiming its own divine inspiration. Remember most of the other scriptures claim the supreme authority within their writings too.

Don't you think that its possible that people of other religions might find your statements offensive? It is religious intolerance that causes much harm in the world.

December 4, 2000
7:32 am
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i_can_c_u
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drugfreemeggie

Do you honestly think there are people that have done nothing wrong in their whole entire life? Honestly? Everyone sins. Everyone.

December 4, 2000
11:00 am
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drugfreemeggie
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i_can_c_u... so your saying my cousin died because she has sinned before thats why your so called "god" took her away from me?? ive sinned plenty of times and guess what?? IM STILL HERE!!! and u know why..because were here to live and when your done living you die....thats it nothing else... and i wasnt saying she has never sinned before...obviously we can't be as perfect as your bible says were suppose be, i was stating a fact that my cousin was a very caring and nice person and she has NEVER done harm to anyone and never would...i suppose u have some sort of excuse to why she was raped 8 years ago too, is that cause she sinned and thats "gods" way of punishing her?? i hardly think so, its cause some person with some serious mental issues decided to do it..grrr!!

December 4, 2000
11:37 am
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Cici
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Well, here's the thing. Job asked why bad things happen to good people. All religions ask this.

You can't have happiness without suffering, good without bad, ingorance without knowledge. We have all experienced these tragedies and traumas in our lives, some more than others. If God made everything happy and great for everyone all the time, there would be no reason to live. Everything would be handed to you and there would never be any suffering.

Life comes from experiencing tragedies and growing from them. God doesn't hold your hand, God is merely a source of comfort for some. I happen to believe that however you experience the divine is positive. Sarvepalli Radhakrishnan said, "Each form of faith appeals in precisely the same way to the inner certitude and devotion of its followers. It is their deepest apprehension that God and God's fullest revelation to them. The claim of any religion to validity is teh fact that only through it have its followers become what they are."

If everything were good, beautiful, perfect, if we never suffered, if that which is unjust did not exist, we could not HAVE life. Life is going through troubles and becoming stronger, pursuing knowlegde and growth in a degenerate time. I mourn for things lost forever, from my own health to my family that has passed on, but if you cling to and hold on to these tragedies, they will weigh you down until you cannot move forward yourself.

December 4, 2000
1:45 pm
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drugfreemeggie
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Cici, i understand what your saying,and i do feel that god is just a source of comfort for people and if thats how people want to live there lives then thats their choice... i don't think peoples lives end because they have sinned..if that were true then there should be no one existing on this earth.. i believe that everyone eventually learns from their mistakes and that is a part of life...
and i know that i have to move on from the tragedies that have been happening in my life..im only 18 years old this is my first death experience and my cousin and i were like sisters so it hasnt been easy for me... but i'm not that blind i know i have to move on..im still in my grieving process i suppose...

December 5, 2000
4:51 pm
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Cici, bless you, what an angel. I do believe angels exist on this earth, and you are one of them.
Dear drugfreemeggie, I feel for you, I am so sorry your friend died, your relative who is dying of liver cancer and still holds his faith in god is a great teacher to you, you may not see that now but you will, as is your friend who passed.
we are the co-creators of our destiny, this is a tough concept to grasp, but god, in all divine unconditional love, gave us free will, this free will is what brings us closer and closer to god, if we make choices that come from our true sacred and divine selves. You will expereince many ups and downs in life, but all are bringing you closer to the truth, the truth that neither you, me, cici, your friend, your uncle, or any one else here is alone.
God is much more than comfort to those who have found the suffering and the joys of life to be our keys to ourselves and god. You still hold out the hope and the light inside of you, and certain teacher will come to you when you are ready, be that in the form of life lessons ( pain and joy ) or people ( painful or joyful )
I pray that you will operate from the place that is closest to god, your true self. What is your true self?
That is your purpose here, find her and you will find god. God bless

December 5, 2000
4:53 pm
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Love you all, hope you are all having or will have peaceful, joyful and meaningful holidays. I care

December 7, 2000
1:39 am
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Brenda
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a persons environment reveals him/her

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