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britney spears
February 23, 2007
12:16 pm
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msguud
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I think the poor kid needs a hug and someone to talk to and someone to help her make better decisions. Let's not forget her age.

February 23, 2007
6:13 pm
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tiedupinknots
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I think Brittany should go into recovery. Here is a super interesting email I got today. I thought some of you may enjoy it. 🙂
Quote
An Original Essay:
The Narcissist/Borderline Spectrum

When I was an impressionable high school kid, I had a science teacher who informed us that glass is a supercooled liquid. He went on to joke that all we needed to do was to sit down in a rocking chair with a six pack in front of a window to observe the flow of this mysterious liquid. In my naiveté, it didn't occur to me that a six pack was simply a way to pass the time waiting for the glass to flow down onto the window sill, which it will do if you - and your descendants - are patient enough. I've since realized that one six pack isn't quite enough, but that's another matter altogether.

Anyway, today I sit down with a slightly different drug - my morning latte - to observe the words flow out onto the computer screen, admittedly somewhat faster than my windows are moving. Who am I kidding? I already wrote this essay while I was asleep last night. My problem is slowing my fingers down enough to get all the letters and words out in the right order. Maybe I should skip that latte. Skip the latte? What am I saying? There must be some reason for living.

Actually, I'm writing today to advance my own perspective on personality disorders, at the expense of all the mental health experts and professionals in the world. I've been watching a little of the coverage of the theatrics following Anna Nicole Smith's death. Many of you may know that the classic wisdom surrounding Marilyn Monroe, Princess Diana, and others is that they suffered from borderline personality disorder. Smith falls squarely in this hole. I'm not going to argue that, but rather I'm going to argue that what are commonly referred to as borderline and narcissistic personality disorders are actually different manifestations of the same disease.

The classic characterization of these disorders goes something like this: borderline PD is characterized by a fear of abandonment along with a lot of unstable and hurtful behavior. Narcissistic PD is characterized by grandiosity and self-absorption, with a lot of stable and hurtful behavior. But after reading a gazillion stories, and talking with many people in depth about their experiences, I think these are wrong. I think these disorders share the same underlying driver - an intense fear of judgment by others and of the consequences of that judgment.

I observe that people with this underlying dynamic typically move up and down along what I'll call today the narcissist/borderline spectrum. As they move, the primary change is not in their motivation but in their level and type of coping. People who would be labeled as narcissistic tend to establish a stable set of psychological defenses, behind which they can carry on from day to day and month to month. I refer to this as climbing up to a stable narcissistic defense, because it does require a building effort, and it usually requires a tremendous effort on the part of the disordered person to maintain those defenses.

The bulwark of a stable narcissistic defense is a pattern of interaction with a set group of people, such as work, church, and neighborhood people, within which the disordered person can maintain a perception of being without flaw. The perception here is not in the minds of the people around the defensive perimeter, but rather within the mind of the disordered person.

Stability is key, because the disordered on this spectrum have intense and extremely irrational fears triggered by events that usually have no significance to healthy people. Imagine, for example, that as a six-year old you had been brutally hit and screamed at for putting the silverware in the drawer the wrong way. Thirty years later, you or I might be putting silverware in a drawer - just fine, I might add - and find ourselves being attacked by a narcissist/borderline. Though the memory of that mistreatment might have long faded from conscious awareness, the mind nevertheless remains alert to danger. Seeing the same action again can trigger an intense, immediate, and overwhelming fear, and the reaction might be a violent outburst intended to avert the danger associated with this.

For a narcissist/borderline, life is an endless minefield of such opportunities. Thus, keeping things stable allows the disordered person some ability to step over and around these many landmines.

Interactions, especially work, present tremendous challenges. Everything must be done without flaw, often demanding a tremendous effort on the part of the narcissist borderline. Such a person might likely return home from work exhausted and spent. Their reputation at work is often that of a stellar contributor; a wonderful person; a role model. This standard of performance is not an innate desire of the person; it is a defensive position, maintained at great cost, to protect them from feeling that someone else has observed that the person ever did any one small thing less than perfectly.

Behind this perception, a narcissist/borderline finds safety. Because their life dynamic is one of fear, seeking safety is the great driving force and objective. But safety takes a tremendous effort. Remember, the standard is not in the mind of the coworkers, neighbors or church members. It is in the mind of the narcissist/borderline, and they perceive threat from thousands of tiny and irrelevant events. (I haven't included family here, because family falls within an entirely different dynamic.)

Of course, this defense has to be difficult to hold up. And for many, it does not hold up. Reality is imperfect, and situations cannot be controlled. When the defense begins to crack, the fears of the narcissist/borderline grow exponentially. As fears increase, coping becomes more difficult. Like a Dutch boy without enough fingers to plug the dike, the narcissist/borderline finds the water breaking through.

As the fears flood in, coping becomes impossible. The disordered person, who just little while ago would have been considered a narcissist, now has no stable defensive perimeter, and becomes unable to cope effectively. Fear becomes dominant in the person's awareness, and with that fear comes an undeniable feeling of worthlessness. Everyone can see how flawed the person is, and in their mind this leads to the automatic conclusion that everyone will abandon the person.

This person has slipped down the narcissist/borderline spectrum, and is now functioning with defenses that would be characterized as borderline. Expressing fears of abandonment; failing to cope from day to day; intensely manipulating significant others to avoid abandonment - all typical of what is considered borderline PD. The underlying psychological dynamic has not changed.

With time, many such people will stabilize their situation, re-establish that defensive perimeter, and build their narcissist shield back up. Climbing up usually takes longer than slipping down. It's not uncommon for narcissist/borderline to slide up and down this spectrum repeatedly in their adult lives. It's just too difficult to maintain the narcissistic defense, because the standards are so high and so irrational.

So, coming round again to Smith, you can see in her life the ups and down along this spectrum. Her desire was to find approval. You can literally see how intense her actions were in front of the camera, as if every ounce of energy were poured into making just the impression she hoped for. At the high end, she succeeded as playmate, red carpet queen, and sexual icon. On the downside, she suffered despondence, isolation, substance abuse, and self-loathing. Like many, she repeated climbed up, failed to hold the perimeter, and fell back down. I believe this pattern is typical of most all people who are considered to be either borderline or narcissistic.

So, with one simple essay, I shatter the foundations of modern mental health care and redefine two very common and important illnesses. Meanwhile, my windows are still standing upright. My book that explores the dynamics of these illnesses is Meaning from Madness.

Tears & Healing explores the emotional issues in being in, and getting out of, an abusive relationship. In Love and Loving It - Or Not! explains how and why we fall in love, what real love is, and how to make changes so love works for us and not against us. Meaning from Madness explains what motivates the disordered, how they distort reality and what the prospects for improvement are. Get all three together in a package and save. My fourth and favorite book is The Way of Respect. Based on the ancient Chinese Tao te Ching, it offers an intriguing and artful perspective on how to achieve respectful interactions, especially in leadership roles. There is also a package. that includes The Way of Respect.

I just added a great book on sociopathy, The Sociopath Next Door, and the sociopath pack that combines this with my books.

Also, check out my new Borderline Pack which combine my books with Stop Walking on Eggshells by Mason and Kreger.

New Packages:
My Books Plus a Recommended Book:
Sociopath Pack &
Borderline Pack

Why do they do it?

Meaning from Madness
Understanding the Hidden Patterns that Motivate Abusers
Also by Richard

Triple-Pack &
Full-Pack -
All 3 or 4 books together.

Struggling with feelings of love?
In Love and Loving It - Or Not!
A User's Guide to Love and Falling in Love
Also by Richard
Personal
Consulting
Tap my knowledge and insight to understand your situation.

Eastern Philosophy
Also by Richard

The Way of Respect
Ancient Wisdom Expressed for Today
Recommended:
Stop Walking
On Eggshells
(paperback)

by
Mason,Kreger

Are you battered by a narcissist/borderline? Get all three books and get the whole picture on your situation.

Did you know the books and packages come in softcover, e-book, and the combination quick-pack? You can see all the choices you have on this page.

Why does your partner treat you like that? Get Meaning from Madness and get the explanation for what drives disordered behavior.

Are you sick of being drawn back to someone who hurts you? Would you like to understand how to enable a healthy, loving relationship in your life?

Have you been reading excerpts for a while? Are you ready to get the books and get serious about change?

One reader: "Thank you so much for sharing your story ... you have helped me to release a lot of stress and tension and I feel I can move on."

© 2006-7 Richard, 21CP Author and Publisher

To stop these mailings, click here http://tearsandhealing.com/exc.....ptout.aspx and enter that email address was entered on http://tearsandhealing.com/ to receive excerpts from the book Tears & Healing by email.

February 24, 2007
5:05 pm
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mumubaby89
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GET OVER IT..read my comment above somewhere.
Shes human like me and you. She wants to do that so LET her.
No offence but why are most of you on this site? to get advice..help etc

She has problems just like evryone on here and in this world.
Wherever you are from Hollywood or some village no bodys heard of...everybody deals with thing in their own way

I feel sorry for the poor kid because her life is printed for everybody to see and its unfair ..they make her out to be a crazy headbamger whens shes just normal.They will be someone on here that will have been through similar problems.

LET BRITNEY LIVE HER LIFE AND MOVE ONTO PEOPLE THREADS WHOM NEED UR HELP ..

=] and well she just needs someone to talk to ..poor kids and her partner was not excatlly the perfect husband he was never in looking after the kids...and proberly only wants custody to get more attention and they are all falling into the trap and giving britney a bad name

February 24, 2007
5:20 pm
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addicts wife
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welll, ive had mixed feelings on this topic, one of which is "Oh geeeeezusss, THIS is news???
but seriously, Ijust had friend getdumped by her fiance and had totalk her out of the bathroom with the scissors and hair dye. So many girls/women do weird things ottheir hair after a traumatic break up. That could be part of it. And then again, she is kind of a train wreck. her parents( I think, I mena who REALY knows) practically bred her to be their meal ticket, notthat a lot of little girls dont dream of being singers/models etc, but she has been force fed this lifestyle fro mthe age of like 8, never really having the time to develop a real personality, she has been told what ot say, what to wear/ how to dress, how to answer questions, etc forever. she married a loser(IMHO) and got a little wacky(how many of us havent had a bad relationship?? can you imagine it being on every paper, magazine adn trash show there is?? GOSH, I shudder to think of some of my brief relationships making national headlines when theywere so bad adn gross I wish I didnt know about them.. so here she is, sinlge, on herown(Probably for the first time EVER) and wakjg up one day realizing she doesnt know who she is, shes been told who she is for wver, a mother, adn getting divorced for ma less than savory man, who really knows what drugs etc, so on she ws on, if any... but she is really kinda lost adn part of me feels sad for her. Our sountry puts so much value into celebrity, and shes had crowds of screaming adoring fans for so long that she has n oreal self worth, all these fans were screaming for her becaseu of how she ws told to be, not because she did anything heroic, intelligent, etc, becaseu she ws a good Hollywood puppet" and now shes like in hermid 20s adn doesnt have a clue where she is, how she got there and ids trying to pick up the peices of a broekn marraige and get herself an identity, al while trying to go out, have friends like a teenager should.. she ws touring the world when I was hanging out, going to partieds and figuring out who I was/wasnt/wanted to be.
being a "hollywood success" is NOT all its cracked up to be.
Then again, I also think she may have just shaved her head because all those extensions grew lice and some kind of fungus, or that she didnt want the rehab to find out what drugs she ws on..who knows, I just hope she can get the help she needs, It is pretty sad.

February 24, 2007
5:55 pm
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Anonymous
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Well, even if she did shave her head for drug reasons, it won't work unless she keeps shaving it for some time. Drugs would show up in the root of the hair for some time.

February 24, 2007
7:00 pm
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Rasputin
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well-articulated Aw!

Folks: Do you think Britney would end up just like Anna Nicole Smith?

February 25, 2007
2:59 pm
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Zinnie
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Ras,

If you read one of my earlier posts on this thread, that is exactly what I likened Britney to be. Sadly, it has now come out that Anna Nicole even tried reaching out to Britney saying they "have so much in common."

Very sad indeed.

Again, her parents as AW said "bred" her into this life, and now? They are doing the very same thing to the younger sister.

I honestly hope she gets the help that she so desperately needs - once again the saddest thing? There are two little boys out there under the age of two who need a mother who can and will care for them, and a father who is not looking for his next meal ticket. Add to that? They even need grandparents who are not hoping that they will be the next performing meal tickets.

It is a sad thing all around.

February 25, 2007
5:15 pm
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addicts wife
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ras... I sure hope not, perhaps the demise of Anna is one of th reasns that prompted Brit to get help?? (hopefully)????)))
I still think she was soo overproduced n over toured when she needed to figure out who she ws that she kinda went voerboard rebelling adn resorting ot chemicals to make her feel good, or perhaps, I know some drugs make you think and think adn think while feeling euphoric it may have been a counter productive "crash course) on self identifying..
ya think??

February 25, 2007
5:30 pm
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Thanks Zinnie and Aw for your responses!

Isn't it Tragic how we mirror our parents values and principles??? All their dysfunction is brought forward in their offspring's life.

Now that Brit is 25 years, meaning she is of age at least, she is able to think reasonably & wisely and realize that her parents taught her something incorrect and hopefully she would seek some professional help B4 it's too late.

I hope and pray Brit would be SMART enough to realize that & Forgive her parents.

Let's keep Brit in our prayers! I dunno why I have so much sympathy for her. I feel that Brit is a good person, but she is a victim of her parents WRONG upbringing.

~Ras

February 25, 2007
10:30 pm
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Zinnie
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Ras & all,

I think perhaps that is what tugs at the heart strings for the Britney's and the Anna Nicole's of this world. It is the same thing that happened with Marilyn Monroe and Elvis. They were kept "drugged up" and were essentially made to perform when you really think about it.

I see the way Lynne Spears has done her children, and I'm sorry it is just wrong. She deprived them of a "normal" childhood. Going to school, having friends, doing things that children should be doing. I am the mother of artistic children of unlimited musical talents myself. But, it was of the utmost importance that they have the best childhoods that we could provide them with. When they graduated college and were old enough and mature enough to make their own decisions is when they went on to work in the music industry. With all the pressure that goes on in the entertainment world it would have to be devastating to be a child growing up like that. Think about all of these people who were child actors and what are most of them like now? Look at Michael Jackson, Danny Bonaduce and that is only two that come to mind.

I have to agree, let us hope that this child (yes, I know she is 25 - but, looking at her actions, she is a child) will get the help she so desperately needs, and her children will have the good lives that all children deserve.

Z.

February 26, 2007
1:20 pm
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Has anybody even considered that she may have a bad bout of post partum depression? I had a friend who was impulsive with a predisposition to drug/alcohol addiction (that she had under control) until she had 3 children in 4 years and then went off the rails. The only thing was her every move wasn't documented by the paparazzi. Just small town gossips. But, it was every bit as destructive and horrifying to watch. She ended up in mental health and detox and is doing much better (5 years later). I hope Brit gets the help she needs and does the work she needs to do.

February 26, 2007
3:31 pm
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mumubaby89
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Find the drugs in her hair haha....i dont think shes on them..because their is the press who will have got pictures like they always do

She wouldnt resort to that...

Pathetic

February 26, 2007
4:45 pm
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addicts wife
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Well, I have to ask then, IF she's not on drugs then why is she in a rehab? Britneys train wreck of a "reality" show with STBX was so bad I couldnt watch it theywere always at LEAST intoxicated with alcohol. It was pitiful, really.
I do pray that she gets the help she needs, however, I was not and am not a fan, I just see a terribly lost young woman (child) who never got her own identity, everything has been scripted for her since she was old enough to memorize a song.
Igrew up with a few kids who had over zealous parents and were I guess what is called "stage mom." look at that poor little girl ( I forget her name) who was a beuty pagaent girl from the time she could walk that got killed in her home on Christmas Oh, Jon Benet ramsey.. that's it. Imagine what she sould ve ended up like IF that tragedy didnt happen?
One of my childhood freinds moms ws sooooo overbearing, constantly telling her daughter not to make those faces(beiing a dilly kid) becasue it was ugly, and that she should walk THIS way, adn how to stand, so it would look more attratcive...more attrative?!?!?!?to whom?? she was TEN than. who wantd their ten year old daughter ot be sexy? anyone??? not in my head should a child be trained to be alluring, sexy, flirtatious, or cunning manipulators starved for attention, usually the wrong kind if attention at that.

I did wonder about post partum, I didnt hink It was possible for me to have it after having a miscarraige at three and a half months, but something went seriously array,a rye? (dont know how to spell it)and that was only a couple weeks ago, which has been hell for both me and j.
I have always been very empathetic, but seing these victims of paparazzi,and celebrity is terrible. Lindsay Lohan, britney, Michael Jackson,the list goes on. I do feel for them.

February 26, 2007
7:40 pm
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Zinnie
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I do agree that adding to her burden at this point in her life could very well be post-partum depression. On CNN last night they made note that on her web site she wrote something like "I have been baby-makin' for two years, now I'm gonna have fun." This could be a combination of post-partum depression, drug/alcohol problems combined with not having a clue about what life is really about. She has been a "super-star" since what? 2000 or before? Since her teen and early adult years.

My first husband was under a recording contract for many years as a session man. He was far more talented than many of the musicians that are at the top of the charts - but, he was a very private and almost shy person. He liked working "behind the scenes" - his love of life was to make music, and that is how he made his living. But, at the end of the day - he could go to any grocery store in the world, or come home and we did not have photographers sitting in our bushes.

You know the saddest thing - Britney gave an interview to Diane Sawyer about two (plus) years ago, before she married K-Fed - and I started to turn the channel. I ended up watching it, and my comment to my husband was "she is going to be the next Michael Jackson." He asked me why I thought that, and I said in that she is in her own world, and has no clue what life is really about.

It is just sad, and again, I feel for the kids - both parents are marathon party people, and let's not forget that if these kids didn't have the price tags attached to them that they do - he would not be around, just like he has not been (as has been well documented and reported) for his other two children. The grandparents? Again... they turned their daughter into their money machine, they are doing it now with the younger sister and I'm sure they figure these two can bring in even more money.

I hope that she can get the help and direction that she so desperately needs and start taking care of those children.

March 4, 2007
2:23 pm
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mumubaby89
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WHO THE FLIPPING HELL CARES...I FEEL SORY FOR THE POOR LASS BECAUSE PEOPLE TALK ABOUT AND MAKE UP THINGS SAYING THAT SHE IS DRUGS...ETC.

IT HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH US AT ALL AND THIS IS HOW IT ALL STARTS IN THE MEDIA

TO BE HONEST TODAYS SOCIETY ARE WORSE THAN EVER

LEAVE BRITNEY ALONE

MANY PEOPLE ON HERE HAVE MAJOR PROBS BUT YOU DONT SEE PEOPLE GOSSIPING

March 6, 2007
9:33 am
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but you also have to think about the whole fact that a few years back when matt lauer did an enterview with her(when she was still pregnant with her baby) she said that she was so sick and tired of the poparatzi ALWAYS bothering her, and she wanted them to leave her alone and all that other bull crap, then she goes and does these things to get the media's attention... so if she wants ppl to leave her alone, she needs to quit doing stuff TO get their attention... but that's jus me replying to this thread. got to go... luv butterfly.

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