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Biggest mistake of my life
August 18, 2003
11:34 pm
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Zinnie,

I hope that the things your cousin is doing won't cause you to feel the need to beat yourself up! What is a mistake? It's something you learned from! Think of all the children who'll be living in safer environments because you stood your ground!

It must be an awful feeling to open a letter and find those nasty words, like opening a piece of fruit and finding a big slimy worm! But know this: I know someone who worked at a guard in a NM prison, not a max security, but a prison nonetheless. You would not believe the horror stories this person would tell about things that happened to inmates convicted of rape and child sexual abuse. The other inmates hate them. In the prison, they are considered the absolute lowest on the hierarchy. I won't repeat any of the stories I heard. No one can feel good about knowing what these men endure, except maybe Ladeska and me 😉 because we are cold-hearted even though we seem shy and introverted when you read our posts, right Ladeska?

Just keep yourself safe, and give your spirit a little bubble bath tonight so you won't feel so creeped out!

Love,

Arwen

August 18, 2003
11:52 pm
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Hi Arwen,

Yes, I have thought about all the others that are now safe. This man has been doing these things for over 40 years, and getting away with it.

After my husband told me what he did about the "Angel" comment, I went back and re-read the letters I have. In that context they make my skin crawl. I had planned on shredding them, but I have now decided to keep them in case I need them for something at some later time down the road.

Yes, to open that letter and read that "don't believe any lies people tell you about me, and I want to call you Little Angel, and Peanut" - what the hell? What kind of man writes that to a nine year old little girl. Well, we know what kind, but still. What would have happened if she did live with us, and did pick up the mail herself? She would see a letter addressed to her, and open it I'm sure.

There is a part of me that feels compassion for him as a fellow human being in the fact that he is locked away from society for the next six years. But, he needs to be punished accordingly, which he is. Well, kind of, he in reality should be in for life based on all of the other stuff that came out. But then there is another part of me that says "what happens happens, and he get's what he has coming to him."

You know another thing that I thought of? Last summer, the little one came down and spent three weeks with us. I was not working at the time, so we did lots of stuff every day, so we were always out, and on the go. Well, when he found out she was here, he called, it must have been 10-15 times a day. Then when he did finally get me on the phone, she was staying at our neighbors house with her little friend for the night. Thinking back, would you believe he wanted me to go and get her so he could talk to her on the phone. Lordy, I should have started the noggin' thinking then.

That is sick.

Love,
Zinnie

August 20, 2003
2:54 pm
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Hi all,

His mother called me again today, and I happened to answer the phone, as I was expecting a call from my sister.

She just got a letter from him at the new place where he is. Now remember she cleaned out most of his account, but he will have a dispersement coming in a few days.

Anyway... long story short, he wants me to send him some $$$ for his account so he can get a TV, and a stereo.

I thought this was a prison?

Love,
Zinnie

August 20, 2003
7:01 pm
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Unfortunately Zinnie.......in spite of how Arwen and those like us might feel about - them getting their just due in prison.......it doesn't always happen. Alot of times they just learn how to do what they do - better and with more of a sick twist to it.

Prisons are no place to rehabilitate much of anyone. Not sure why that is to be quite honest with you. I do know that it can be really bad in there for people like him and then again, they might like it. You never know. And once those times are over, they just go right on - being who they are and getting nastier every day.

Some of these prisons are more like a motel than a prison. And if you know how to work the system on the inside - being in there is a cakewalk. You can get anything you want in there, sex, drugs, you name it.

So if we think that they are being punished in there, I don't know so much about that one. We might not like it so very much but - they are not "us". Different breed altogether.

I do feel better now, Zinnie, since you told me about your hubby. (smile)

But to respond to what you said Arwen......if I was Queen of All That Is......um, I might make some past people in history look pale in comparison. I am nowhere near a nice person when it comes to filth like this. Cold and ruthless? You betcha. However, over the last few years, I have gotten better in that - I don't think torture is what it's cracked up to be. I think snapping the neck and just getting it over with is a much better use of time and resources.

I don't get why people like this are even allowed to breathe. I'm sorry, just don't get it. Call me stupid. There is no saving this man or making him into anything else other than what he is. There is only - the saving of his victims before he has a chance to get to them by keeping him the hell away. And like you said - in 6 to 8 if not earlier - he'll be out and about.

In alot of prisons it's an honor to be in there sometimes.....depends on what crowd you get in with. It can be a real "learning" experience where you just bone up on how to do it all better and get away with it. A melding of the minds, so to speak. Depends on the prison and depends on the elements inside the prison.

Tell me again, Zinnie, what the particular charges were for why he's in right now? I know it was child abuse but not much more than that.

And sweetheart.......I also want to talk to you at some point about how things really progressed into such a point here of you being blinded by this man. I know he is your cousin and I understand all that but - there is a webwork here that maybe needs to be examined a little more closely because you really went way beyond the call of duty here for him and maybe part of the reason you beat yourself up so much is - you don't really understand that element of your relationship. Maybe we need to talk about how it got that way. I just don't buy that it's because you're family. Maybe by talking about it, we can see how this slowly emerged into this.

You're a smart lady but you've been conditioned and bewitched here and sometimes, or most of the time really.....I think it's real necessary for us to go back and really examine the webwork and see how it was laid out over time and how we fell into well thought out snares. I just want to help you really, really get free of all this and sometimes you have to do some close-up examination of fibers.

And uh, you know what I think you should tell his mother the next time she calls, right? Sick lot, all of them.

August 21, 2003
10:44 pm
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Hi Ladeska,

Well... how did I get pulled into this?

My Dad called me when this first happened to find out if he ever bothered my sister or myself. I told him no, and he told me what had happened. So, I trying to be a nice person, and not believing this because of the person I thought he was sent him a letter. Not really saying anything, just kind of "heard you were in jail, and I hope things work out for you." Well, then I get an eight page letter, laying out the "conspiracy" the wife and her family, the ex-wife and her family, and his sister and all of her family, and this that and the other. So, I replied, "well, hope it works out for you, I will be happy to provide you with a reference when the time comes" - well, then next thing you know, he calls, and we talk. The next day his mother calls, and starts the crying and sobbing and carrying on, and the "I'm just a sick old woman, and I know I'm not smart, and I got married at 14, and blah, blah, blah" - so I feel sorry for the whole lot of 'em, and that is how I was pulled in so to speak.

His mother has access to his bank account and was spending the money faster then it was coming in. He started calling me for help, and wanting to talk to my husband for legal advice, and he is telling us that he has the worst Public Defender in the world. Then, I called the attorney, and he was a little less than helpful. Of course he had already been dealing with the cousin and his wacky mother, so he thinks I'm just another nut on the family tree. Now, he and I have developed a friendship, which I'm sure puts me on the "other side" for what it's worth. Anyway, as things progressed, and he is telling me how bad things are, and I'm believing him. His case worker said an interesting statement to me after sentencing, that I have pondered over, and that is "you believe what you love." Well, I guess that is true. No one wants to believe, deep in their heart that they are being lied to, or are a fool. At least I didn't.

I have learned through this little excercise in futility that I am a "rescuer" - I have always taken up for the underdog. When I was talking with my folks about this, both of them told me that I reminded them of my Great Grandmother. I said how is that, and they said that I feel for others too deeply, and I will not back down from a fight.

When all of this began, my husband, who thinks very logically and methodically, told me "Z. he could have done this, prepared yourself" - well, he was right. The nice thing about him though is that he is not saying "told ya so" and I appreciate that.

So, Ladeska, I hope that helps a little?

Thoughts?

Love,
Zinnie

August 22, 2003
1:27 am
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Yea, that does help paint a picture for me. And you're real unprepared for a con artist / psychopath like this guy and his family. No doubt the apple didn't fall far from the tree here, right?

And that is always the case that they take advantage of people who have a big heart and they just drag you right through the mud.

I remember being so angry when I used to go to church and telling people - you are not equipping people with how to deal with really dark people. Call them possessed or whatever - they got game all over you and your flock.

And this is just something that we're not taught from the cradle on up. We're taught how to be willing sacrifices for these people and how to be their victims.

I can't tell you how many people have actually gotten mad at me because I was so hard-nosed with them about getting "wise", it was almost like they enjoyed being delusional. Don't teach me all this because I really don't want to know kind of thing.

Well we better start teaching our kids this because this world is getting a wee bit more populated with people of this caliber. The predator / prey ratio - just went up dramatically.

But if you study people like the Irish Tinkers for example......they know how to work you so well and so slick you never knew what hit you. And all these people who are psychics and the like - it's all con artist stuff and cold reading and an endless array of very honed skilled abilities to part you from everything you hold near and dear and sometimes it's your life or the life of your children.

So doing things like becoming aware and reading books like "People of the Lie" and "Without Conscience" and books by Ann Rule - is something we need to really be doing here and there and at least getting a broad working knowlege of what we are up against out there and then......teach that to our children on a daily basis how to be very, very wise.

This thing of "if I'm a good person I'll be rewarded" is a bunch of bunk. Maybe in heaven, but not in this life. If you have goodness in you, please know that you are going to get the crap kicked right out of you more times than not. Therefore, you have to learn as early as possible how to have a good, pliable suit of armor on yourself that protects this goodness and keeps it safe for using when - it's appropriate and can be applied in the right direction.

Sort of like if you have a high powered lazer beam or a fine violin - they both have to be in an extremely well crafted case that is built with very precise measurements and craftsmanship that protects the contents because the least little jar can upset the fine tuning of the instrument.

If you are an honest, decent person with strong character, my advice to you or anyone else is - learn how to protect it and learn how to "know" your enemy because like I've said alot on here before - be very sure - your enemy knows all about - you and how to get to you.

Don't continue to beat yourself up here, Zinnie. It's not worth it. You had no idea what you were up against and we all do this. We're just not prepared at points like this in our life to know what is coming at us. But we can learn from it and grow and teach our children and teach other people how to be wiser and stronger.

The mark of character is never about how much you beat yourself up over a mistake, but how well you learn from it and how much you accept the fact that you are a perpetual student in this life. Mistakes are necessary for human growth. And in as much as someone like this may gut you from time to time, there is nothing like taking quite a bit of knowledge away from the experience that says - next time I meet you or anyone like you in battle, I will smell you coming and prepare myself to outfox you.

You're a beautiful person and you need to be really kind to yourself here and realize that - you've learned some very valuable information here that will do nothing but make you stronger and this man will do nothing but continue to rot inside his carcass that's still running around on this earth.

Too bad that for crimes like his - the punishment isn't death. It is deserved.

August 28, 2003
3:46 am
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Hi All,

Ladeska, I thought you would find this interesting. My best friend here locally has a very what she terms passive/aggressive son. Now, don't get me wrong, he is not a pedophile, but so much of what he is putting her through is similar to what I went through with my cousin.

She told me today that my new in-sights have been helping her tremendously. Today I lent her my copy of "People of the Lie" in hopes that she can learn some of these things too. Her son is the classic "victim" - although he neglects to look at the reason he is the victim, and that is he created the problem himself. Kind of like my cousin believing that he is the victim in this case. The persecutors are "the other side, the law, etc" and I'm sure I'm now on that list as well.

I have finished "People of the Lie" and had planned on starting the other book you suggested, but then I came across a book called "Obsession" by John Douglas which is about serial predators, and boy are my eyes popping out of my head now. The point that the author is getting across is that these people have an agenda so to speak, and that agenda is: "Manipulation, Domination and Control" The man is considered the first criminal profiler in the FBI, and I suggest reading this book not only to learn what to look for, but also to learn more about how to protect ourselves. This is not just for women either. Very interesting stuff, and one of the first comments he makes is one that my husband has been saying for years "that we will see a huge wave of crime come to fruition between 2005 and 2010" - due to the changes in society.

One of the things my friends son does to her and the family is when he has been caught in a lie, or has pulled one of his stunts, he will not contact them. He will change his number, or not return phone calls, block e-mails, things like that. Then, when HE decides things are blown over, he strolls right up the front walk way.

So, knowing that, I'm kind of waiting for the next attack to come. I have not heard from my cousin for some time now. Nothing. No more phone call attempts, no letters, nothing. Which is fine by me, but I have this feeling that he thinks it is worrying me. Does this make sense? My line of thinking? I say this because in correlating him to my friends son, I have this feeling that he feels he is "punishing" me for not acting according to his plans. I cut the puppet strings so to speak. But, I will be honest the desire is there to write to him and say something like "wow, I thought you thought of me all the time, and prayed for me every day, and worry about my health issues, etc... yet interestingly enough, now you cannot take the time to write" - but isn't that playing right into his hands?

Thoughts?

Love,
Zinnie

August 29, 2003
11:30 am
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Well... and here I thought he had finally fallen into the black hole, or at least got the hint!

NO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

We got an eight page letter yesterday, ranting about not being able to get through on the phone, and upset that I did not give my daughter the letters and card he sent her. Actually he demanded to know if I did and what she had said about them because he has not heard back. What does he expect? People wrote to him for close to two years, and he never replied to one single letter. Now because I think he thinks he has found another woman to prey on, he is scathing about them not writing back. Just shows how selfish he is.

Then of course he gave me a detailed list of things he "needs" me to do. He also wants to force his ex-wife into bankruptcy so when he gets out he can sue her, and she will not be able to file for bankruptcy again.

Where do people like this get these thoughts. If you could call them thoughts.

Apparently, he now realizes that my husband is very real and very much aware of what goes on in this household. Remember, I had written a letter about him taking over the mail and bill paying after he found out how much this was costing us. So, he starts both of his letters with he is sorry if he caused any kind of problem. But get this, ultimately, his ending words were "I hope you have not given up on me, and I'm waiting for your reply."

He then ended his letter that "through the trickery, lies, and perjury by the D.A., his lawyer and the Judge" is why he is there.

What do you folks thing?

Love,
Zinnie

August 29, 2003
2:13 pm
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What a whack job this guys is, Zinnie. You know what I think about all this. I mean you do, right? The poisonous oooze from this guy will just come on coming because that's all that resides within, ya know?

I would seriously consider, that if you want to know what is in those letters, that from now on when you do open them - I'd give them my husband instead and let him decide if there is anything that needs to be discussed or acted on here. I don't think it's good for you to keep reading his letters. Even though there is a pull there for you to do so, not healthy sweetheart. He's still - getting at you, by doing this. Your husband is a strong, savvy guy and he can weed out whatever it is that is really pertinent stuff. Otherwise, it needs to be dealt with like the trash that it is.

I have a saying and it is - watch what your eyes see and what your ears hear. Don't mistake that though for turning a blind eye or whatever. Not what I mean at all, but you know me better than that. Just saying - you have to be real careful what you allow into your space when it comes to people like this. I often advise people who are being harrassed, tormented by someone they used to be close to - to be real careful about what is said that goes into their mind and clutters things up, becoming active poison. And to be careful about what they read or see from them, too. I just think your husband would be a great filter/buffer for you...let him help you in this way.

I think what we're seeing in our society is an increase in the ratio of predators to prey. When the sheep increase, the wolves become plentiful also and maybe more cunning when it comes to the human species. Actually it's very hard for me to talk about wolves in any negative fashion. They make us look pale in comparison. I rather adore them. But what we have personified them to be is how I use them here.

I think that as time goes on here, we seek to purge ourselves, maybe even the planet of this thing in us that doesn't know what to do with our illicitness. All we know how to do is feed it and try to cover the pain and guilt somehow. But maybe we create our own weapon to be used against us at some point, in order to bring us to either a point of cleansing or complete destruction. We don't "rule" ourselves very well, do we? We have all this freedom and choice and yet....we continually sabotage our real progress by the greed and lust for power, domination and gluttonous wants of the flesh. And yet.......it does not satisfy. Our spirit writhes within us like an angry animal, driven mad because the things it really needs to flourish and grow are being kept from it by the outside hand that feeds... When will the eternal overpower the temporal? Maybe in death...or what we perceive as death...

I have been amazed with our species here......in how or why we do this "denial" thing. Even good people turn away and do nothing, when something would/could/needed to BE done. It's like we welcome predators among us. As if we admire their power and yet - would never speak such an abomination!! We would "deny" that also....

There just seems to be something larger at play here than we all see. I often wonder...how many times have we done this, how many civilizations have...climbed this tower only to set within the structure timed devices that implode it at some point and then cry as it is falling that we had no idea WHY is this happening???? What is it that we are looking for and yet when we glimpse it...we run from it in fear...

The book sounds interesting! I'll have to check that out. And yes, that is definitely an old trick to "withdraw their attentions" and punish you by their silence. ....yawn....boring....overdone.... After awhile, Zinnie..you'll see that what lurks within man that is evil and if that has really taken over their persona - you'll find that evil isn't really creative... Light creates, darkness imitates.

It's manipulative - true. Good at disguise - true. Good at reading how they can con you - true. But not creative in the true sense of the word. There is a basic *sketch* there that Dr. Peck nails to the wall all too well. And by their fruits - you will "Know" them..

Like he said also - they lack "liveliness". They can make a counterfeit of that but it lacks the real juice upon close examination. It's "hollow" so to speak. Is the difference between a singer that gives you chills and one who just - sings well.

And yes, yes....there the "agendas"...millions of them. They change with the wind but always the same flavor. To consume life and liveliness. As if to stuff oneself with the essence of light and yet - have no candle from whence to keep the fire lit. They are forever ravenous...a black hole.

I'm so proud of you for really doing the work here of trying to understand the ins and outs of what's gone on with this you and this man. Few will venture down this path of how it happened, what it's made of and the mechanics and guts of it all. But do understand, like Peck pointed out...there comes a point and time when - being that close to it and trying to understand it better and better - may become too close and need to be adjusted. Make sure that you don't stand too close to anything that poisonous for longer than you should. Even when you are trying to educate yourself.

Do it in a balanced way. Give much time to tending your garden...(smiles) Become like the willow...and not the oak. One bends and is graceful and harmonious with the wind and the other is stoic, hard and resists the wind. In the end, the oak topples and the willow remains.

As any warrior should....we learn how to do battle and then we learn how to dance. In all things - balance, harmony and wisdom.

August 29, 2003
7:48 pm
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Hi Ladeska,

I suffer from depression, the clinical type which we have found out is hereditary. With meds and counseling though, I can usually work through most things. Once I had my really major issues worked out, I now only see my counselor when needed.

I had an appointment with her at the beginning of the week, and we discussed this. I told her about me feeling like a fool, etc. But, then I told her of all of my reading, research and our board here. She made me laugh when she said "I have always known you have one of the finest and sharpest minds I have ever encountered (big blush there), so now you are over-intellectualizing, but not really in a bad way." I told her no, I did not think I was over doing it because I now know what to look out for. I know the signs. Just in reading the letter. Remember, the other two he sent over a month ago I sent back. I had planned on just sending this one back when I realized it was not sealed. So, I thought well I will take a chance and read the letter, then tuck the flap in like it was and send it back.

Yes, my husband is an excellent "buffer" so to say, both personally and professionally. I completely respect his opinions. I know sometimes I can be a hot head so to speak, and when you are supervising 300 + people you have to keep your cool. Well, actually most of the time I do, but there are times when I have to go to my husband for advice because my automatic reaction is just that automatic, where he logics things out.

In any case, he even wrote to my husband about how he was not defended properly due to his attorney, and how he even gave his attorney copies of the laws that were pertinent to his case. Somehow, I have a strange feeling that his attorney knows more about the law!!! Now, he is wanting my husband to "take on his case" so to speak, so they can win the appeal, and he can sue his ex-wife.

I have told him time and again, as well as my husband has told him that although he has a law degree, he also has a Masters in Biohazardous Chemical Engineering. He now works in private industry. What he does is keeps the company in compliance legally with Hasmat (sp?), EPA, local and federal laws. He has not set foot in a court room because he has kept his company out of trouble for the last ten years, much less a criminal court room. Of course don't forget, he wants all of this done for free. Now, occasionally my husband does consulting for other companies for various reasons as he is so specialized, but you had better believe that the clock is ticking. Yet, again, he thinks nothing of taking up anyone else's time or resources as long as he get's his own way. So he perpetually makes himself into a victim.

As I have told you before I completely trust my husband and respect him for his opinions. I honestly believe that by the time all of this is over, he is going to want to confront me, or something. But again, I will take measures to keep myself safe, and as you know I sure don't have to worry about anything with my hubby around, like I told you before, he has shot competitively for years, is highly regarded, and trains SWAT teams throughout the country in rifle sharp-shooting, and combat shotgun. So, yes, he would be messing with the wrong man.

Then, the other disturbing aspect of this letter, he asks about our daughter receiving his letters, he wanted to know how she reacted, what did she say, etc. I mean that is a little to much interest, but we all know why. Right? Of course, I did not give him the letters, he knows that because the officers went out to the prison and talked to him about it. He is just trying to push buttons and make me feel guilty. Sadly, his thoughts are also "when I get out of here, I'm going to make sure to marry a decent wife this time" - too freaky for me!

Insights?

Love,
Zinnie

August 29, 2003
10:28 pm
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I think you're doing just fine, Zinnie. But as far as this letter, him talking about your daughter - that one for sure needs to go straight to the authorities. THAT is bullshit, straight up. If it were me, I'm afraid I'd go off like a bottle rocket over that one. I don't like that one little bit. Slimey piece of you know what!!

I'd just catalog this guy for what he is, wouldn't give him the time of day, or his little troll family. I'd send any letters you get from now on - straight to the authorities and say - just so you know where this guy's mind is, okay? And I'd go on with my life.

The thing is - you didn't know how a person's mind like this works. You've spent time now looking into that and will probably devote some more time it, but don't let it become an obssession, Zinnie. Time to let go of wanting to beat yourself up here for "not having knowledge of". None of us do, until we are bitten by people like this. And unfortunately we aren't taught squat about it from people who DO know what's up. People like Scott Peck and Dr. Hare do their part but it's really not enough.

For the most part we have no idea and neither do our children - what lurks as far as predators are concerned. I hated like hell to teach my daughter this from the cradle up. You just have no idea how much I hated it. But I'll tell you one thing, she's a very savvy young lady and alot of her friends got an education along the way as well.

It's not to be the main fare all the time, but it needs to be woven in with other things like learning to ride a bike and how to tie your shoes and get a driver's license and passing the SAT's. It's essential stuff.

I mean when you just do a search on the web about "cold reading" for example - you learn real quick how people do what they do and how so many fall prey to people like the Tinkers for example. We don't see it coming. So pat yourself on the back for pulling away from all this when you did and know that - it's okay that you make mistakes and learn and hopefully get out alive and basically unharmed. Alot of people can't say that because they are dead now OR they are seriously maimed for life.

I'm just afraid for you.....as far as going down this dark path too much of trying to figure him out. I think part of that is - your search for finding out why you fell for all of his baloney. Don't get too close to the flame, sweetheart...

Be very, very careful here. I'm telling you all this because I have been there. You have to stay as balanced as is possible here.

August 30, 2003
4:24 pm
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Well then today, checked the mail box when I saw the little mail truck go by, and sure enough he sent on all kinds of forms and documents for my husband and myself to sign to be put on the visitors list.

UH... NO!

I sent them back to the office that sent them, and said we did not need to be added, as I did not plan on making any visits.

The nerve of this individual has done nothing but amaze me.

Zinnie

August 30, 2003
5:04 pm
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Good for you, Zinnie!

If I sent you a package in the mail, you opened it, and it was full of shit, what would you do with it? And if I sent you another package, looking a little different this time, and when you opened it, it was full of shit, what would you do with it? And if I sent you yet another package, this time FedEX, with lovely ribbons and bows and wrapping paper, and you opened it, and it was full of shit, what would you do?

I have a feeling that pretty soon I would find myself the recipient of my own packages full of the shit I packed up with the intention of leaving it for you to deal with...

I love you!!!

Arwen

August 30, 2003
6:38 pm
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Absolutely Arwen,

By the way, welcome home!

But, remember in his sick twisted mind he does not realize that he has done anything wrong. But, when he thinks (knows) someone is mad at him, of course he puts on the act of "poor me, I'm so sorry" - again, "it was a mis-understanding, a mistake, they took it the wrong way." He has lived for 50 years like this. He was able to get away with it for a very long time because I think he can be a smooth talker, and prior to retirement, he had a military uniform to hide behind, which he did.

This is where it is hard to distinguish between, is he really is so sick he does not understand that what he has done is wrong? Or, does he knows it is wrong, but he has gotten away with it before, so he keeps pushing?

Like I said before, he cannot understand why everyone is flipping out over his previous affairs, because to him they were consensual. Of course, to us it is disgusting because the girls were between the ages of 12 and 14, and he was a married adult. Now to me, I think he knows it is wrong, but as he has gotten away with so much for so long, he just keeps on. My husband on the feels pretty much like I do, but he also feels like he literally does not realize the boundaries that society holds, and keeps doing what he has been doing. But, he agrees that the reason he has continued, and the problems have escalated are to the fact that he was able to get away with it for so long.

If this makes any sense?

But, he is right back to his old M.O. so to speak. He knows he has made me angry because I have returned his letters. He knows that I turned over the letters he sent to my step-daughter over to the authorities, because they have been out to see him. So, he is "testing the waters" - I think. He is now writing like nothing at all has happened. He just carry's on about how he would "like pictures of his extended family in Canada, praying for my health, how is my Dad doing, etc." Then he throws in other weird statements and requests. Mostly for money. He starts out at the beginning of the letter asking for $200.00 for his commissary account, by the end of the letter it is up to $500.00. Then, he jumps all over the place.

Now, the letter he wrote to my husband begins with "hearing from Z. was a prayer answered, she is my Angel (if he only knew how that enrages hubby), and I never meant to cause any trouble or grief or financial hardship between you." Then he goes into how his lawyer was so awful, and on and on. His final sentence to my husband was "so you see why I need you to come to my defense on appeal, beacause of the lies, perjury, and screw ups of my own attorney, that is why I'm in here. I will wait for your reply."

Long wait.

Love,
Zinnie

August 30, 2003
6:39 pm
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Oopssssssss!!!!!!!

I cannot believe I forgot to include this little tidbit... he is thinking of putting in for a furlough to come to my sister's wedding next weekend in CA.

Aaaaaah?????

Z.

o.k. - Everyone get up off of the floor from laughing!

August 30, 2003
7:54 pm
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Furlough? Oh good thing I'm not around that neck of the woods if he did get one and I knew.

Anywho! Um, one statement stood out to me in your post here above all others and that was....

My husband on the feels pretty much like I do, but he also feels like he literally does not realize the boundaries that society holds, and keeps doing what he has been doing.

Yikes, I have a problem with that statement! Having sex with 12 and 14 year olds is not "just having an affair" and not something that society just has a problem with as in - it's just a taboo thing with us. It's called - child molestation, straight up, pure and simple.

Your husband really thinks this way? If so, I'm appaulled. Don't mean to insult you or him, but Zinnie, sweetheart - HUH?????

This isn't just about him having extramarital affairs here. This is about CHILD SEXUAL ABUSE! Regardless of whether or not - they thought he was their friend or they even if they had a crush on them. Not okay! They are CHILDREN. And this is what perps do - they get them to thinking all sorts of things, prey on emotionally unstable girls, girls that need attention of a father figure, etc.

I mean it's one thing that your husband feels this way, but for you to write it like you just did - sends red flags up in front of me all over the place. Just trying to help you really clean out this wound here, Zinnie and see real, real clear.

The way your husband feels about this, if this is the way it is - just makes my blood boil. And to have you repeat it like it was okay - makes me go ZINNIE - did you really, really SEE what you just wrote here????

Please talk to me about this. I'm just sitting here with my mouth open. Love you to pieces, I hope you know that. I'm all in your corner and I know exactly what you are dealing with. Know the mentality all TOO Well. And yes, he knows exactly what he is doing, btw. Seen too many of them admit it when they are boasting about how gullible people are and how they are just using them. He knows. Don't EVEN cut this prick any slack okay? NONE whatsoever. He wouldn't cut YOU any slack if he had your daughter in front of him right now. Trust me on that one, okay?

I want you HEALED from all this poison, Zinnie, but when things like this fly out into the open and I see it - this tells me there are root systems here that go real, real deep.

And yes, I've talked to guys before who are all over men like this, hate their guts, etc. and yet - they will say things like this and I just back up and go WHAT DID YOU JUST SAY TO ME??? I used to date a guy like that. He had a friend who was in prison for molesting a little girl, but he made the mistake one night of saying to me that he feels bad for him because - he was drunk at the time and it was just a "one time thing" and who's to say - the little girl might have enjoyed it so was any harm really done and why should he spend so many years in jail for something like that? Well DONE is what he and I were, right then and right there.

August 30, 2003
10:13 pm
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Ladeska,

I wrote that completely wrong, and after re-reading it, I understand why you are doing backflips! I would be too.

Let me clarify... my husband agree's with me 100%, and he keeps telling me that these "others" just don't feel/think like you or I. They do not even recognize the normal boundries that society sets, and why we see what they are doing is morally wrong.

When all of this first started, me realizing that I had been duped, I could not figure out how it happened, how could I have been so fooled, and mostly why would this man do this, then dig in his heels, and make himself the ultimate victim. Now... after reading, researching and discussing it much I realize that hubby and others were right that this man does not see/understand/think as we do. He thinks completely different. Where my husbands goal in life is to live a good one, happy with home/family/profession, and I'm happy with home/family/crazy red dog, this man's goal is obsession/control/manipulation.

So, what I was trying to say is that although my husband agree's with me, on my question of does he know he is doing wrong, but has boundry issues; I meant that he (hubby) understands that this man does not think like you or I do. In this book that I'm reading, Mr. Douglas makes reference to another book called "The Criminal Mind" - and my counselor told me about that one as well. Both say, that it talks about how these people see/do things completely different from us, outside of society, and never once feel one bit of remorse for any thing.

I hope that helps clarify what I was trying to say. Trust me, if my husband said something like "well, maybe they came on to him, or oh well you know he was just drunk" - uh trust me... the locks on the door would be changed after he left for work. I can forgive many things, but not ever anyone that would hurt a child.

Love,
Zinnie

August 30, 2003
11:30 pm
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Okay, I understand somewhat, but am still having trouble, but that's what writing as a communicationg is all about, huh? It takes you so much longer sometimes....arrgghhhhh.... But I'll just keep at it until we understand each other or whatever it is we're hammering at here. Just clarification more than anything. I actually like doing this and like having someone to do it with. (smile)

I have to say I disagree with they don't even recognize the boundaries that society sets. They know all about them, see them, recognize them, know them full well but consciously disrespect them, take what they want and on you and anyone else into allowing them to do so.

I don't cut the "criminal mind" any breaks whatsoever. It's not that they are just so different or impaired that they don't know - what they are doing is wrong or that we somehow think sex with a minor is wrong and they don't. Therefore, they are just "different" than us.

They are different alright, in that they are pure cold blooded predators. They like feeling, empathy for anyone's feelings, not even their own. If there is a difference, that would be part of it.

They gain immense pleasure by hurting the innocent and robbing them of that innocence because they themselves do not possess it. It excites them sexually to do harm to others, they in effect - get quite the "rise" from it, thus the reason for many a rape and then vicious murder. It never had one thing do with - fulfilling a sexual fantasy or loving a child or anything even remotely close to that.

It's true they do feel no remorse for what they do but it's not just because they are boundary busters. It's because boundaries don't exist for them at all because you are not worthy of it. No one is to them. They are the ALL and end all of everything from beginning to end, thus the reason for someone butchering a child and then having a baloney sandwich with little regard to what they had just done, as if a fly had landed on them and they swatted it. Basically the fly asked for it by coming into their space, same with the child.

They are literal monsters unleashed upon society and we cage them for awhile, intimately trying to "understand" them, give them some kind of labelling or excuse for what they do so that what? So that then "we" could "control" them maybe? Then we would feel powerful over them if we could somehow find an answer that makes "us" feel better about us being "conned" by them in the first place? Hard question, but one that begs answering.

I wonder much about your need to keep digging and digging in order to really, really understand this man....and to finally put some kind of description or label on "why" he does what he does as if evil of this nature could ever really be understood by us because I think to really do so, you might have to cross over from the real of sane into insane....to be where they are like the detective in Hannibal. It's tricky business...and I'm not so sure it will render anything even close to satisfying your questions.

It is, in effect - a void, a bottomless pit, a darkness so incomprehensible that it is totally without reason.

Some hypothesis that people such as this have something chemically wrong with their brain or that part of their brain never did develop properly, thus presenting them to this world without a conscience. I almost buy that and then I don't and I'll tell you why.

They know enough to play you, so that means that they have full knowledge of how the "moral" thing works. They study it actually, they dismantle it and put it back together and spend endless hours seeing how they can trap their prey. Most often it is done through the "morality" end of things. Case in point - they become a Christian, learn the bible, get in with people, speak the lingo and even strut the walk, "mimick" I believe is the correct word I'm looking for here.

So they DO very much "have knowledge" and quite a good bit of it. They just "choose" to not be accountable to it and to not let it govern their actions. They consider it weak and beneath them, as Scott Peck explained time and time again...it's not random evil that we are looking at when we see People of the Lie in action. It's the consistency of their sins that give them away. It is the mindfulness of what they are doing, the game so to speak, the intricate workings of - working you their prey that gives them away and points straight at the fact that they very well KNOW what they are doing and that is very wrong. They just willfully will not be displeasing to themselves at all costs. There is nothing random about what they do. It is very orchestrated and it is very finely tuned to your own morality, in fact they "play" to it quite a bit, otherwise you would have never fallen into his trap in the first place.

I know you "desperately" want to find out why "you" fell for his bag of tricks...... you want to find some definition, explanation that will somehow make all this better in some way... The thing is - finding out why he is the way he is - isn't connected to why you fell for his deception, Zinnie. The two are completely different.

It doesn't mean that you are "bad" because you got caught up in all of his little games. It doesn't mean you were less intelligent because you didn't see him coming. It simply means that so far, during your walk through the forest of this life, you had never ran up against a predator of this caliber. Somehow I sense, and I may be completely wrong, but I sense that if you can somehow give him a reason for what he does that cuts him a little slack, then you can feel better about yourself for being fooled by him.

I think I said it to you before and I will say it to you again....no one....not you, not me, not anyone is EVER prepared for someone like this if they have never either had prior experience or been very, very trained as to how to spot them and even if the latter were true - you'd probably still be in for the battle of your life.

We learn in this life, by.....coming into contact with......most of the time. We don't like to teach each other about the horrors of life. So much of life is taken up by horrors anyways, why spend time talking about something that isn't happening right this minute. Eat, drink and be merry for tommorrow you may die. Understandable, I mean who wants to focus on the negative anymore than we have to? Life should be about so many other things.....

But you, Zinnie..........I just have this thing in my heart that tells me you are searching, searching, searching for a key that will go into a door that will somehow take you off the guilty box in your own heart. And all I can say to you is...he's a coldblooded predator and what he does is governed by one thing and one thing only and that is satisfying his hunger. And no, your needs, your pain and your wants and thoughts are completely null and invalid to him. He is a machine and in my humble opinion should be led out to the nearest field and shot at daybreak.

I think the only reason that we do not do this, which would be the most humane thing to do for them and for the victims past and to be when they let him out and - they will... But for some reason we want to learn how to fix this, or control it ourselves so that we then have the power. There are some things in this life we will never have the power to fix or control or completely understand. We hold the harpie behind bars and put him through rigorous tests, knowing that he hasn't changed when we let him out but OH MY we almost formed one more brilliant hypothesis for WHY he does the things he does. But gentlemen....and ladies.....if it please you that I approach your high and lofty bench....um, you do see that this man has played you right? I mean this game of chess you lost...he's still a psychopath and you are releasing him right back into society...so what was REALLY up here? A good game of chess maybe? And a bloody good one at that!! You guys ALMOST figured him out by hell, let him go and go back to your little drawing boards and see if you can match wits with him better when he comes back in and maybe EVEN write an award winning book or thesis on - one more theory about - why evil is evil. Egads.........excuse me, but I have barf now that all that just came out of my mouth. Feel dirty..

I just find no other reason for us doing the "study" thingie. It's great and wonderful that we do study, don't get me wrong but - alongside of that comes..........the whole deal of we're really not rehabilitating these guys. They go in and come out more clever than before and we pat ourselves on the backs as if - we almost figured out the Rubics cube that time, didn't we??? Um fellas, guys....uh, when he comes back this time you do know that uh, he will probably have assaulted countless children, probably even murdered some brutally but....does any of this really matter? Or does the "thesis" all that matters? That we can somehow feel better about ourselves if we can "understand evil".

I like to understand it - just enough to - deal with it. I'm not compassionate at all when it comes to people like this. There are certain people in this life who fly certain colors like this man is doing that absolutely means - this man is unreachable. He will dick with you to his grave or to yours. Sorry if that sounds a bit arrogant or "all knowing" on my part.

I just got through watching The Emperors Club and I "highly" suggest you go rent it and watch it. I almost bagged the movie before I got to the end because I'm saying - Okay, if this is ONE more movie where you rehabilitate the little psychopath by coddling him and thinking that you can change him opr thinking he can all of a sudden grow a heart - I'm just not watching this crap. But the movie did redeem itself. It could have been done better, but the message is painfully clear.

Please don't get me wrong here, I study "what goes wrong" with these people very intently and I applaud you that you do, too and want to. But what I'm really focusing in on here, and I don't want you to mistake me here for any other reason for this post.....I want to make very, very sure that......this search, this need to study isn't about - you absolving yourself for being so taken in by him by trying to give him some excuse for his behavior.

Yes, you and I are clear on the fact that they are "different". But what I'm stressing here is - he has chosen a great deal of his "differentness", has discarded your pain or anyone else's as rubbish in order to get what he wants, that he studies your moral fiber like one would read the bible maybe. And he will get out and keep doing his crimes until someday, a father finds him molesting his daughter and puts a bullet right through his head.

August 31, 2003
4:48 am
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Hi Ladeska,

Let me explain part of my personality. I was fortunate enough to be the child of immigrant parents, who stressed education and knowledge. So when something like this comes along, yes, I do tend to throw myself into study of what is going on so I can get a handle on it, which is what I feel I'm doing now.

You made the following statement:
Somehow I sense, and I may be completely wrong, but I sense that if you can somehow give him a reason for what he does that cuts him a little slack, then you can feel better about yourself for being fooled by him.

That might have been what I started out as doing, but yet, the end result is I'm now sorry that they did not find him guilty on the original 17 charges, and I'm angry at the family members that knew this was going on and did nothing. Had the childs teacher not found out, and taken it to CPS none of this would have happened. I don't understand, and probably never will these people that would willingly send their kids into the snake pit so to speak. As I have said before, I only have step-children, but I would give up my life for any one of them before I saw them hurt; and I sure as hell would not keep sending my daughter over there because "well I did not want to disrupt her schedule." The other strange aspect of all of this is that I wonder why they never went after the kids mother for neglect.

Through my research and study, I know for a solid fact that he will never stop. You are right the only way he will ever stop is if someone puts a bullet through his head. Will prison do anything for him? No, except to make him better at what he does. He will be in there with his own kind and will learn new and interesting ways to lure kids, and it scares the hell out of me.

Now see, another thing and I will pass this on to my husband as I think this is what he is missing, and why you thought what you did after reading over my post. My husband is very very logical. He thinks things through, not just for the time being, but for the long term effect. I think in his mind he is thinking "this guy has no boundry issues" - where, since you work with these kinds of people all the time, you understand that yes, they do know the boundries, but bottom line they don't care.

Another thing you said is: It is, in effect - a void, a bottomless pit, a darkness so incomprehensible that it is totally without reason.

Interesting enough, over dinner tonight we were talking about the fact that we now hear from him like nothing has happened. My husband actually made a statement very similar. He said, this man's audacity and selfishness knows no end, there is no bottom.

Does this clarify it further?

Love,
Z.

August 31, 2003
1:49 pm
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Hey Zinnie-girl,

I think your cousin, based on my experience, knows he has done wrong, knows he is sick, knows he needs help, and lives in secret fear. I think one of his ways of coping with this is to try to live in denial. I think he looks for people who will support him because he twists it into a message he tells himself "I must be okay..." He doesn't know how to function in a relationship with someone who sees him for who he is at this time, and calls him on it. I think in a way, he says to himself "If so-and-so is willing to have contact with me, I must not be a bad guy..." The more people realize who he is, the more it forces him to look at who he is so he gets desperate in his plotting to regain contact. He is looking for absolution. Not because he isn't sick anymore, but because he doesn't want anyone to know that he is.

I think for him, part of the need he satisfied in abusing children was knowing it was wrong, and feeling like he was getting away with it. I also think there was an aspect of emotional/spiritual predation in the abuse. He drained his victims of their innocence. He fed off it. He doesn't know how to nourish this part of himself now that it is so difficult to find victims. I think he would like to feed off you at every given opportunity, and feed of your sweet little step-daughter by establishing a false rapport with her.

The things he is doing are desperate attempts to feed his inner "monster". I hope that the more it starves, the louder it becomes until everyone else can see it, and he can no longer hide it from himself. Then he will have to face it head on. Most likely, though, when the monster gets hungry enough, it's going to devour him. Perhaps this has already happened, but at least he didn't take you and your family down with him!!!

Love,

Arwen

August 31, 2003
3:17 pm
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Something else that I wondered is in connection to what you mention above Arwen. That he knew he was doing wrong, and by not cooperating with the lawyer, and other things he was doing that purposly made it worse for him was his own weird way of self-punishment.

I also wonder if being in the Military, not that he intentionally wanted to go to prison, but once there he actually feels a level of comfort because he is back to being so reginmented.

Bottom line? I don't know, and I don't know if we will ever know what makes these kinds of people tick.

But I do agree with the people he is trying to keep in contact with. He figures well I still hear from them, so I can't be THAT bad.

Love,
Z.

August 31, 2003
3:34 pm
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Yes Zinnie...(smile) thanks for hanging in there with me. I knew we could talk like this and just go back and forth real honestly. I just needed to say those things to you, to put it "in the pot" so to speak. And I know you are a research kind of person, much like me - you want to get to the roots of things as much as possible.

This thing of wondering what in the hell was up with - all the people who knew and yet did nothing is quite the shocke in and of itself, huh? That has been a huge thing for me to deal with myself. Why does the herd look the other way when a predator steals one savagely from the flock?

We assume alot of things about human nature that at some point clash with reality and it really messes with our head. But, but, we are SUPPOSED to care for our young! Well......yes, we do have the capacity for doing that but the reality of what we really do - is all about us for the - seeing.

When you get right down to it, honorable, brave, loving people are really quite rare in this world and I think they always have been. We just assume and tell fairy tales to ourselves about it being on a grander scale than it really is.

I couldn't hold onto so many fantasies that are so much apart of how we think because, early on in life, I had to see differently whether I wanted to or not. And like you, even as a child - I was extremely questionning and thought then - just like I do now. Bullshit could fly a little while with me, but not for long. And it broke my heart.....I saw the facade and then I saw the truth of the matter and it pretty much gutted me to be very honest with you. I tried real, real hard to cling to denial and to repeat those fairy tales over and over in my head... didn't work.

I looked around me and I saw not just one or two, but quite a large network of people who were holding hands around me, like one giant web who absoutely "knew" what has going with me and yet.........did nothing. Now these were people who - in every day life were just the nicest people in the world, had children of their own, respectable people in society, good jobs, church goers, sunday school teachers, etc. And when I learned some of the underpinnings that went even further than just turning a blind eye - it really became quite vile to me. I didn't want to see it.....and I didn't want to believe it. The truth was there though, staring me right in the face. I had no choice - but - to see. It was like someone holding a child's eyes wide open by force and saying you WILL SEE. I realized early that the people who turn a blind eye, are just as bad as the one who holds the knife.

And I also realize that we need an amount of denial in our lives to be going all the time so that we can - stay sane. Because to really "see" all the time, would drive us quite mad. But thank God, I've always had this ability to stop in the middle of whirlwind and see the flower with all it's intricate beauty and be able to focus just as much on that, as I did looking evil in the face. I think without this ability, I would have perished long ago.

I used to think like so many people, too that my father and people like him - knew that they were sick and deep down wanted help. My father used to say that now and then. But as time played out - nothing could have been farther from the truth. I think it made me feel better somehow, made the ugly a little bit easier to look at - if I believed him. But the real truth was - that was a con as well. Yes, yes, I sat with him while he cried after he would severely injure me. I would feel bad for "him" instead of me. But I learned it was part of that black hole thing that is always, always consuming, taking, putting the attention on themselves in the cruelest most horrible ways, playing you, constantly playing you. And yes, living in quite a great deal of fear all the time. Fear of being found out - more than anything else.

The real important thing to realize is that...IF....someone really wants help when it is a disease of the very soul....their will has to be activated in order for that to happen. So anytime that "them getting help" depends on YOU fixing it or understanding or making them better in any way - WITHOUT seeing this willful force coming from THEM by taking responsibility, if you never really see them looking in the mirror - then it is all a lie and a con job. They lie - in order - to get. It's quite simple.

I have to laugh when I hear people say - but, but, they really, really want to change, they are really sorry, and, and, they know they are sick and blah, blah, blah. And yet.....this person never, ever turns their hand to the plow in any consistent fashion whatsoever... BUT, they do put tremendous force and energy into - making someone Believe this....

It's always the guy or woman who - is going to go to counseling IF the other person does this and that. And JUST NOW because their partner has left - all of a sudden they are going to change and become a different person...... What they are really doing is playing into someone's ego and laying out the old trap of....OH SWEETHEART, it's only because of my grief over you leaving me that - I know (brushing back their tears) NOW, now I SEE the LIGHT and will do ANYTHING to get you back!!! I'm soo, soo sorry!! (sob, lick, hump your leg)

I have to ask people when they go into this "void"....so why now? Why all of a sudden when the feeding trough is removed that NOW they suddenly SEE the light?

IF someone sees that something is illicit inside them and they really, really own it - they do something about it - right then and there, without prompting from an outside source or waiting for that to happen. Their will goes into action.

August 31, 2003
3:41 pm
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I'd also want to add here that - being a sexual predator isn't just like someone having a drinking problem or an anger problem or a gambling habit. There are lines on the gauge here that indicate....the state of someone's very soul. There is a level of darkness that indicates a point of no return. Some things are not on an equal playing field - with other things.

To take into your hands, another's life like this and manipulate it and squeeze it dry of it's vital energy is "murder" or attempted murder. It's a particular deed that is so horrendous and void - you have to really, really see it for what it is. To me, there is no crime, short of actually ending someone's physical life, than to sexually harm a child. I look at that and I know the extent of darkness within this individual and it is a void that knows no bounds.

August 31, 2003
5:10 pm
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I have thought some of the very same things, regarding the use of manipulation. We live in a gated community, made up of mostly families. There is a group of little girls that live right up the street, I would say they are probably between 9 and 11 years old. Anyway, they are in love with my little white dog. It is so cute, they will come and knock on the door and want to know if Hope can come over for a tea party.

When we were out walking yesterday, my husband and I, with the dogs, we saw our neighbors and of course they came running over to see the dogs. When we walked off, my husband said to me "see, when I see those little girls, I just think of them as that - they are kids who are well behaved. The way cousin looks at them is in a peverse way, and I shudder to think if he had gotten off and here we are offering him a place to stay. He said he would offer to walk these guys all the time because when the kids see them they come running."

I thought that was interesting that he thought that. But, bottom line he was right. This man get's to kids by being nice, buying them things, understanding them better than others.

But, yes, what bothers me the most is the fact that all of these people know what is going on, yet do NOTHING! Why?

But, he is not at that stage yet, of "changing" - right now he is still screaming "innocence, he was framed." So at this point he is not even saying, anything of the sort about oh, I'll change, or I will do whatever I need to so you will come back. He thinks that he did nothing wrong.

I'm still having a hard time dealing with this. Because as I have said before, he knows he did it, how could he not? But I think he has lied so much to so many people including himself that he see's himself as telling the complete truth. Even though he tells a lie, and knows it is a lie, I think he actually believes it.

Thoughts?

Love,
Zinnie

August 31, 2003
6:52 pm
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I think he wants to believe it, and he looks for people to support him so he can say to himself "See?! I am innocent!!!" When he doesn't get that, he is forced to continue on and on and on, searching for someone to embrace his lies--even if it is a 10 year old girl who touches him. I mean, if she does it without him holding a gun to her head, then she must have "wanted" to in his sick mind. So he says it was "mutual". There's really no way to understand him. He is so sick and twisted. The only way to fully understand would be to twist your thoughts as violently, and you don't have the capability or desire to bend your mind that way.

He simply doesn't see ANYONE the way you do--child or adult--everyone is there to serve his needs and nothing more. This is who he has chosen to be in this time and place. Only he can make a different choice.

I'm glad you and your husband are able to speak so openly with one another about the dynamic and perceptions of your cousin. He must be a real gem indeed!!!

Love,

Arwen

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