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An update.....Lolli
October 14, 2006
7:33 am
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lollipop3
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KROIKA,

Gosh...reading what you wrote felt like I could have written it myself. Minus the degree part. I'm still only working on my Associates and I find THAT overwhelming. The thought of a graduate degree makes me hyperventilate!

I too have gone too long without seeing my therapist, which is never good for me. I really need to get in to see her.

I'm sorry about the ex-bf. Do you want to talk about it?

I had a dream last night that seemed to go on forever about the Snowblower. In my dream he had brought someone home (downstairs). I'm certain the reason behind it is that I agreed to let the ex-ex pick me up at my house later today.

On the one hand, I need to move on or at least let him believe that I have moved on. On the other hand....judging by the dream...I'm still not so sure that I am ready for him to do the same. 🙁

Anyway, I hope today is a better day for you.

As far as the school work goes....you can do it. You've come this far.....and what a long way you've come!

Love,
Lolli

October 14, 2006
9:41 am
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Oh and Elizabeth....I wanted to thank you for sharing your thoughtful post on Oct.10th.

You have been a good friend to me and it means a lot.

Love,
Lolli

October 14, 2006
3:02 pm
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hi lolli,

I'd never heard the term "associate degree" until reading these boards. Maybe it's the US term for a Bachelor's degree, which is all that I'm getting. But mine is taken 25 years after I originally got a diploma nursing certificate (which are now being phased out. You used to be able to prepare for RN qualification with a 2-year community college program, which is what I did. Now they are making a BScN degree the standard for "entry to practice").

So going back to school after 20 years was pretty challenging, plus doing it on top of working not-quite-fulltime. Throw in an unstable relationship and you find a kroika who is just plain burned out after toiling at this for 5 years.

I've been discussing the relationship a bit with sleepless in uk on the thread "desperately seeking Kroika" which you are very welcome to drop in and comment on if you wish.

hugs to you, k

October 14, 2006
10:21 pm
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Hi Kroika,

Sorry my friend, didn't mean to confuse you.

The term "associates degree" referrs to the degree you get after completing your two years at the Community College (or Junior College). When I am finished with that...I will transfer to a 4 year and after completeing the next two years will receive my Bachelor's degree.

I understand what you mean about juggling all of this stuff. I am working full time, going to school part time...and like you, up until a few months ago, was dealing with b/f issues as well. The fact that he was threatened by my intelligence and feels the field I am entering is "nonsense" didn't help either.

But despite his best efforts to pull me down...I was still able to maintain my 4.0 gpa.

All I have to say about that is....how ya like me now, sucka?

Ain't nothing gonna break my stride....ain't nothing gonna slow me down...whoa no...I've got to keep on movin'.

I've got to get some work done...but I'll check out your thread when I take a break.

Lolli

October 15, 2006
2:07 am
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{how ya like me now, sucka?}

Yah!! Go Lolli!!

Thanks for the explanation of "associate degree". What will your Bachelor's be in? (Sorry, I think I should know that but can't call up the file right now...)

There was a bit of that, lack of support re my academic endeavours, with my xbf but I never could take it seriously. He did say once or twice in a matter-of-fact way that he thought I was smarter than he was, but he didn't seem to say it in a resentful way. I don't know. I thought he was pretty secure in his own intelligence, but maybe not as secure as I thought, or why would he not have been more supportive?

Oh, don't get me started.... I have work to do to!!

catch you later,

kroiks

October 15, 2006
10:44 pm
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First I have to say.....what's this? What's happening? What's going on here?

Imagine my surprise when I read a thread and thought.....what the? I didn't write that. Apparently there is another Lolli in our midsts?

It's all good. If all the free's and mama's of the world can do it....so can we Lollis.

Anyway.....

I am having a major pressure cooker of a day.

First, I went shopping yesterday with the ex-ex. We had a great time and of course I bought myself two new pairs of shoes (somebody stop me!) He bought some new clothes as part of his new "makeover" but wasn't as sucessful as he had hoped. After shopping we went to dinner and then went to a "pumpkin spectacular"....which consisted of 5000 fantastically carved pumpkins inside of our local baseball stadium. Very cool.

Sounds great right? Well, not really. Again, he is trying very hard and doing all of the "right" things but the chemistry is still just not there. As a matter of fact....I noticed that every time he touched me it actually made me very tense. Not a good sign. Not to mention he has been subtly bringing up the issue of sex which I am just not prepared to do. Hell, I can't even bring myself to kiss him...let alone sleep with him. Then there is the issue of the house. He is still trying to decide but is making it clear that it would make his decision easier if I would decide to move in with him! Not gonna happen. He has also made mention of me "cooking" for him on several occations now. Don't get me wrong...I don't mind cooking....when *I* want to. I don't like it to be expected of me...especially when we're not even sleeping together.

And when he dropped me off last night (I allowed him to pick me up at my house)...I could tell that he wanted to kiss me and I didn't want to...so I didn't. I could tell by the crestfallen look on his face that he was disappointed.

What does all of this mean? I'll tell you what it means.....way too much pressure on Lolli.

Now back to the kiss goodnight. First, I didn't want to. Second, the Snowblower was home and all of his lights were on and even if I wanted to kiss him goodnight...I would not have felt comfortable doing it 6 feet from the Snowblowers door, especially considering the ex-ex's truck is kind of loud and I know Snowblower would have looked out. Needless to say...all he got was a peck.

Back to the pressure cooker......

Not long after I came upstairs....I heard the Snowblower close his door hard and I heard his truck leave. My first thought.....he saw me and he's upset. I heard his truck again a few minutes later. The door opened and closed again....and again...and I heard his truck leave again. This was all at 11pm. Now I KNOW he's upset.

I talked myself through it knowing that this was going to happen eventually and that is was not a bad thing that he knows that I am moving on (even thought I haven't technically moved on). I was actually okay about it and when to sleep.

Okay...today....(sorry I know these are long these days)

Not surprisingly...he caught me outside today and the first thing he asked was...."how was your date last night". Thus began our conversation.

He was not happy. I'll spare you all the details but the conversation resembled the "meltdown" that he had several weeks ago...swearing up and down that he will do whatever it takes to fix the problem...if only I would give him the chance.

I was very open and honest. Probably more honest (i.e. vulnerable) than I have ever been with him and possibly more honest than I should have been (for my own good I mean)

Having said that....I was also very strong. Strong to the point that I heard the words "cold" and "stubborn" quite a few times. It is what it is...is all I can say about that.

Other than telling him exactly how I feel....I told him as for the rest of it....I will take some time to "absorb" what he has said and get back to him another time. I needed to do that for me....otherwise I wouldn't be here writing right now....I'd probably be in his bed.

What does this mean you ask? I'll tell you what it means....way too much pressure for Lolli.

So, as it stands...at this moment.....I will be going shopping again with the ex-ex next weekend (because he managed to talk me into it again even though I didn't want to) and while doing so....I am going to tell him that I am sorry but I cannot give him what he wants.

Then...I am going to put myself right back into the mindset that I had when Snowblower and I first broke up, which is.....I am going to put my effort and energy into MYSELF and my healing. I am going to concentrate on my school work. I am going to spend time with my GIRL friend, my sisters and my father. I have just started in a new store (in addition to my exisiting store) so I will be meeting differnet people. In addition to going to school, at some point, I will be starting a new career and will meet different types of people there as well. And when the time is right and *I* am ready.....then whatever happens...happens. And until then.....the pressure cooking of Lolli....is all done.

If anyone is still here....thanks for listening.

Love,
lolli

October 15, 2006
11:07 pm
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I'm here... just got on, so I'm about to read your novel. Be back asap. :o)

October 15, 2006
11:09 pm
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(((Shaney)))

The fun just never seems to stop!

October 15, 2006
11:15 pm
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Hi ((lolli))

I'm still here.... very quick thought about your shopping trip next week. You're allowed to change your mind. You don't have to go if you don't want to.

Sorry you are feeling so pressured.

take care, kroika

October 15, 2006
11:20 pm
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Hi Kriok,

Thank you and I know you're right. But, as usual, if I don't. I'll feel bad.

And unlike the old boss situation, I do feel as though I owe the ex-ex a truthful, face to face conversation.

And speaking of the old boss....I was talking to my best friend today about all of this and we had to laugh.

Does this acutally happen to people? I mean really....the Snowblower, the ex-ex, the stalking Pakistani store keeper and an old boss who thinks I'm some kind of escort service!!! Are they kidding me????

What is going on people?

Thank God my parents blessed me with a good sense of humor!

October 15, 2006
11:23 pm
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{I do feel as though I owe the ex-ex a truthful, face to face conversation.}

Fair enough. But does it have to be tacked onto a shopping trip you don't want to go on? Does it have to be this week?

Just saying....

give yourself a break. (Easy for me to say!)

good thoughts, kroika

October 15, 2006
11:38 pm
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Wow. Yep, you can't force that special feeling for someone, so what's happening (or NOT happening) with exex doesn't suprise me. It's OKAY! You've let him know all along, where he stands. He KNOWS, yet he is still persuing you... NOT your issue so please don't feel guilty. He can stop anytime he wants to, but he keeps on. So, as much as we don't like to hurt peoples' feelings, he may end up getting a little hurt... but AGAIN, it's not your fault. He chose to be in this situation with you... to be your friend, all the while hoping and working towards more. He will understand. I know he will, and won't hold it against you. I think you'll always be friends. That's a GOOD GOOD thing, lolli.

Now, SNOWBLOWER is reacting. I have not doubt in my mind that IF he begins to feel like you start having ANY expectations of him... he'll turn. He does EVERY single time, and I just can't see you taking those 50 steps backwards. My biggest concern is that simply being without you wasn't reason enough for him to change. He had to see you with someone else and get his ego bruised to entertain the idea of change. I just feel that that speaks volumes of where his mind is.

Are you still around?

October 15, 2006
11:41 pm
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I can't type tonight to save my life. Did I make any sense at all?

Hi kroika :o)

October 15, 2006
11:44 pm
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Hi Shaney :0)

I think you make a lot of sense. Always like reading what you write!

take care

October 16, 2006
12:28 am
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Hi Lollipop,

Just thought I'd chime in here since I can relate to your intimacy paradox (as you get closer to ex-ex, you want to pull further away). This happens with people who have been abused in the past by others. They desperately want to be close to someone but as soon as the possibility arises, they get scared of being hurt (because others they were close to before hurt them). Might this be what's happening with you???

Or perhaps you do have an instinct that your ex-ex is not right for you? Maybe some little red flags and you are instead internalizing them and thinking you are bad?

Hang in there... trust yourself. You will figure it out.

ps. it's kind of cool you are Lollipop and I am lolli... we are nickname sisters:)

October 16, 2006
11:56 am
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Hello Ladies,

Shaney... you are right about the Snowblower and I know that. I would be lying if I said my mind wasn't thinking...."what if this time he is telling the truth" but on the flip side of that....history tells a different story.

Believe me...not too much went unsaid yesterday. I told him exaclty how I felt about the whole situation. I told him what my feelings were and why I felt the way I did. I told him that I don't trust him, I don't believe him and he has done absolutely nothing to make me believe otherwise. I even told him...."Jesus B-----...you couldn't even be bothered to take two minutes of your time to go and get a card to cover for your lie, for crying out loud!"

In the end, nothing has changed. I think you are right in that he is REACTING. He saw me with someone else and he panicked. Plain and simple. And I know that. And I will get through this.

In the meantime...I am just under way too much pressure and it is beginning to make me physically sick. I can't sleep well, my neck hurts and I'm getting pains in my stomach. And let us not forget the anxiety all of this is producing. I feel like each one of them has an arm and they are pulling me in two different directions. It's got to stop.

And as far as the ex-ex goes...I honestly don't believe that it has a whole lot to do with the Snowblower. I have asked myself the same question that Lolli (hi Lolli) asked about whether or not I am just "scared". I wish I new the answer to that. I have wondered for weeks now.....Is it that I am not ready to let go of the Snowblower? Is the ex-ex just not the "one"? Or am I just fucked and need the drama and chaos in order to feel happy/unhappy? I think if I could figure that out I would have a better idea of what the hell I should do. But I don't know the answer. I truely believe that if it was right with the ex-ex and I was attracted to him....I'd be thinking....Snowblower who? But I'm not and after 4 months...I still don't even want to kiss him. That has to be saying something.

The only thing I can figure is that neither of them are the "one" and that I need to take time for myself (which is what I wanted to do in the first place) to figure out exactly who I am and what I want.

Unfortunately, that is going to require me to have a couple of very uncomfortable conversations and ya'll know how much I love that.

Which brings me back to what I was saying earlier in the week. I have been very honest, very forward and very direct with both of them. Yet...here I am, once again, in the uncomfortable position of having to stand my ground to protect my boundaries. Can't anyone....just one person LISTEN to me and RESPECT what it is I'm saying? EVER????

Is that really to much to ask of people?

October 16, 2006
1:03 pm
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Hmm. Good question. The only thing that I have to say about people respecting your boundaries, is that actions speak louder than words. (I made that up, just in case you're wondering how I came up with such a mind blowing thought). You've been saying all along to exex, that you need space, he's a good friend (blah blah)... BUT you've been spending every weekend with him doing couple stuff. I'm not saying that you're leading him on, but whether you're spending time with him as a friend or otherwise, it keeps his hope alive and kicking. I know that you were trying to see if this attraction thing would kick in, and you really did need to give that some time and effort to find that out. But while you were testing the waters, he was obviously becoming more and more attached to you. I mean, you've gone from a simple lunch, to him wanting to get a place and you to move in. I think, for the both of you, taking time for yourself (like you already stated) is what would be best for all involved. And he'll understand, I know he will.

Snoblo, in true form, will feel bad for a few days, but soon talk himself out of everything that he threw out there on the table, during his moment of weakness. It will all become clear to him once again, that he's not to blame for anything whatsoever, and that you're the one with the problem. Then he'll make some lame comment to you, as you water your flowers, summarizing his feelings of relief in one sentence, that his life is just the way that he wants it, and that he's happy with the way things turned out. He hasn't grown at all despite all of our prayers for him to do so. I want him to be the guy that you deserve, but all he does is frustrate the hell out of me. I can only imagine what he does to YOU.

My only advice is to follow the plan that you've already stated - it's a good one :o).

October 16, 2006
1:38 pm
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lolli,

did you start posting here at the very beginning? If so, what's your original thread? I am really struggling right now with letting go of a relationship that is not right for me, and I need some help - the fact that you have been able to move on with your life with your ex right next door is amazing, and I really need to know how to do that. Thanks,

zax

October 16, 2006
1:56 pm
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Hi lolli! When I saw your post first thing which came to my mind was that lollipop3 is posting to herself, then I noticed the nickname on the top.

lollipop3 ~ it seems like you’ve came again another full circle? I know I am repeating myself, but my opinion didn’t change and I think that you should move on leaving your exs where they both belong – in the past.

You said that you’ve asked yourself for the reason why this all is happening to you, and I don’t think there is any straight and simple answer; I suspect the answer to this question is complex. I think that you like drama and being happy/unhappy with it is one reason. The question is why do you like this drama and what void it fills in your life? You are asking if it’s too much to ask to listen and respect, but I think this is not the question you should be asking. It is not too much to ask, but as you already know some people will not listen and respect no matter how many times they will be asked, so the best thing is – to stop asking. There are other ways to make them listen to you, lollipop3. Instead of worrying about them not respecting your boundaries – just make the boundaries. Other words – instead of dwelling on how to talk to them and how they will react – think about yourself and what do you want and then tell them, and don’t worry about their reactions. You don’t owe them anything, including any explanation, period and you don’t need to spend anymore time thinking about them. Ask yourself what purpose that kind of drama serves in your life and change that, instead of trying to change them.

Another question I would ask is what void those two people fill in you? What is what they have to offer what attracts you? They are both much older than you and you’ve said that you would want a house, etc., etc. Perhaps those security issues? Do you feel safe with them because they are older and more stable and mature (which they are not anyway?) I know that age doesn’t matter that much and it is just a number – but wouldn’t you date people different of age if it didn’t matter to you? And if it does – than why? Think about the hook they have on you, what is it and why – read, search, reflect.

If, by any chances, you are looking for a financial security – perhaps not even quite consciously – then know that no matter how much and what you will have – you will not be secure until you will feel secure with yourself. That security is really a state of mind only for as long as one has a roof over their head and doesn’t starve. I’ve got to know people in my life who were millionaires and felt poor and the other way around: those who didn’t posses or own much and were rich, simply because they felt rich.

I have no idea, maybe my guesses are right, maybe it is something very different, but no matter what it might be, ask yourself what attracts you in them first, and take it from there. Looking at your situation – I see the same happening over and over and you are the only one to change that. Not by molding them to your needs wants and desires – you can do only so much of that – and you know already it doesn’t work, but by changing the people involved in your life. If those in your life will not change, in a few months we will have another update like this on the thread which will be almost identical to this one.

For the moment, I think that you should seriously consider giving up on dating and put your effort and energy into dating yourself and eventually try to change what you don’t like about the only one you can truly change. Good luck.

October 16, 2006
4:11 pm
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Hi All,

Shaney and Matteo....thank you both so much for your thoughtful and well thought out posts. There's lots to take in there and I am feeling more and more certain as time goes on that I do need to spend some signficant time alone or "dating myself" as Matteo puts it.

And Shaney you are right...I suppose I was giving mixed messages. Although I was trying very hard not to. Unfortunately, it is pretty easy to talk me into doing things and believe me....everyone who knows me..knows it. In truth, Matteo is correct. It was *I* who allowed my boundaries to be violated and it is *I* that has to change that pattern of behavior. The funny part to me is that a lot of people think it is because I am afraid to be alone...or that I need a man to be happy. That is actually not the truth. I believe it is these men that are afraid to be alone and I am afraid to hurt their feelings or let them down. Who knew it could be so hard to put your own feelings first?

Anyway, thank you both again for being here. It has been and continues to be a long, hard struggle...that would be a lot longer and a lot harder if not for friends like you. 🙂

Love,
Lolli

p.s. Matteo...the other Lolli kinda freaked me out for second there too.

October 16, 2006
4:19 pm
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Hi Zax,

Yes, this whole thing has been written on, in detail, since the beginning.

I have been coming here since Nov. of 2004. It seems so long ago now but I believe that I actually posted for the first time in April of 2005 when I found out that the Snowblower had lied to me about having a child... and although I don't remember it exactly...the thread title was something along the lines of "he lied about having children" or something to that effect. I would have to search it myself to be sure.

At the time I had wanted my relationship to work out and thus began posting the up and down rollarcoaster that was my relationship. I have written many threads and written on many others but a majority of mine have my name "lolli" in the title. If you search that...you should find a good lot of them.

I hope my experience helps you in some way and always feel free to ask anything. I will do my best to answer as honestly as possible.

Take care and good luck,

Lolli

October 16, 2006
7:21 pm
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Hi Lollipop,

I think you are right on track about taking time for yourself to figure out what/who you really want. If it counts for anything (I know we are all just online people here)... there are a bunch of us here listening to you AND respecting you! So, it is possible;)

To the others - sorry to freak you all out! I didn't look at everyone's nicknames when I signed up and chose mine (Sorry to the other Lolli too!)... but I can say I'm glad to be here and it seems like a really good and supportive group.

It is nice to talk to people who are struggling with the same issues and at least aware of and trying to change these issues. It seems like so many people in life (e.g., your old boss- Lolli! geesh -what is up with him?!!!) who just are in such denial they don't even realize they have issues. It's like they are operating on a different planet from the rest of us in recovery.

well, that's it. hi everyone. hang in there Lolli. 🙂

October 16, 2006
8:29 pm
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Lolli,

" If it counts for anything (I know we are all just online people here)... there are a bunch of us here listening to you AND respecting you! So, it is possible;)"

Thank you for that.

No worries about the name....it takes someone pretty special to be a Lolli. I am certain that I am in good company 🙂

October 16, 2006
8:45 pm
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Shaney,

I was re-reading this thread and I have to tell ya...

This......

"Snoblo, in true form, will feel bad for a few days, but soon talk himself out of everything that he threw out there on the table, during his moment of weakness. It will all become clear to him once again, that he's not to blame for anything whatsoever, and that you're the one with the problem. Then he'll make some lame comment to you, as you water your flowers, summarizing his feelings of relief in one sentence, that his life is just the way that he wants it, and that he's happy with the way things turned out.

......was brilliant.

You have no idea how much I would like to print this out and hand it to him the day he does EXACTLY what you just said.

But then...what would be the use?

He really has no idea how predictable he really is.

October 17, 2006
12:45 pm
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Hey there :o)

The reason that flowed so easily was because he's repeated that same scenario about 50 times, since I've *known* him. I really DO feel like I know Snoblo... isn't that funny? The funniest thing about it, is that he repeats it with the same conviction as the time before... as if he's come to a major realization, and he's stating it for the first time. Ugh. Lame. The great part about this, is that you aren't falling for it anymore. You've become a master at stepping away in the heat of the moment, and not re-committing yourself to this insanity. He used to reel you back in with that act, but now you know better. It may still stir up some feelings, but the end result is you KNOWING what path to take.

You need a break from all this shit... just like I need a break from all of mine (or everyone elses, actually). I think I told you, but the girls are going to Vegas for the National Finals Rodeo for a few days the beginning of Dec. I'm cuttin' loose... you should come.

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