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All about the truth of allaboutcounseling
September 25, 2009
8:54 pm
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Paul Elam
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I will test this first as I got an email from someone who says they were banned from here and the submit button was coded to redirect them to a porn site.

September 25, 2009
8:55 pm
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Healing.. and peace
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Andii,

I wouldn't waste 2 calories going to his site, but thank you for your insite after you googled his name... it brought light to the most probable reason why more then likely he has posted here.

September 25, 2009
9:14 pm
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andii
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WEll, it worked Mr. Elam.

September 25, 2009
9:18 pm
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Paul Elam
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Ok, to attempt, and for the last time, to answer some questions here, I will address some of the points made and then step back. My time regarding AAC is better spent on larger audiences.

My apologies if I miss anyones questions.

Andi, my motive for posting here is the same motive I have for placing that article where it will be read by many thousands of people. And it is the same reason I have for preparing formal complaints to be lodge first, but certainly not last, with the California Board of Behavioral Sciences.

Unfortunately, those complaints will have to be lodged against the clinicians who list their services here since the site is immune from CBBS purview.

The reason I am doing it is because the information presented here fraudulently promotes hate and division along the lines of gender. And it does so while proffering the services of mental health professionals. If that is not enough of an explanation, I don't know what to tell you. My job is to tell everyone associated with this site in any way, and as many other people as possible.

What I want is simple. The first and most preferable is for whoever is running this place to present valid information that does not foster misguided stereotypes based on gender. It is just that simple.

Someone questioned that maybe the information is just old. Fine, then why aren't they updating it? I am not buying it. This site is designed to promote hatred.

Sexism is sexism. And I, as a men's rights activist, have had many disputes and falling outs with other men in the movement who insist on demonizing women. That sort of thing is part of the problem.

But when I hear people reference something like "so called" mens rights, I am reminded of how far we have to go in this.

If people think that men don't face hardships and discrimination based on gender that needs to be corrected, then their beliefs are out of chosen ignorance. And pointing to men that don't agree goes nowhere, at least with me.

There were many women that ridiculed feminists when feminism was about voting, employment opportunity and education. That there were women that could not see the justice in equal rights didn't make equal rights any less valid.

Do people really imagine that the same isn't true of men in their struggles?

Isn't that what feminism, after all, promised to be the outcome of the feminist movement? Equality.

My website doesn't even have a donation button, nor have I made a nickel ever on what I do. And if you read through enough of my site you will see that I am not indifferent to the struggles of women, see "PTSD" nor do I give men a pass on what they are doing to contribute to modern problems, see "A Letter to Men"

Question my motives all you want. I do what I do because I believe in my heart it is right.

I'll come back and read your comments if the thread is still here. But this is the last post. I am not here to debate but to put what I think out there. I wish everyone here nothing but the best.

September 25, 2009
9:35 pm
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MsGuided
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andii

exactly what I thought.

A male lamenting his eroding entitlements ( to have absolute authority over women and other men who are less "capable"?)

Dominate and win at all costs when it comes to the opposite sex?

http://whatmenthinkofwomen.blo.....-hate.html

On this site he writes an article about how men are maligned in one of his lectures. But women are elevated.

Who was in the audience and what were their motivations? It seems it was a majority of women in a psychology based class.

I doubt the same responses would of come from a group of senior citizens or Geologists.

EESH. Talk about being one dimensional. Using that lecture to paint society as a whole.
Maybe Elam should escape his own head for a bit and be more objective.

Really open his eyes and understanding to a changing landscape for men and women.It's not a bad thing, but there are growing pains. Lots of them.

(Did Freud favour women? Far from it)

Elam writes:

Currently, male bashing monarch Phil McGraw reigns in the ratings, and it won’t be long before another emerges, fighting to be top dog in dogging men. All you need is a warped worldview and a nod from Oprah.

HUH? Dr. Phil seeks level ground. He doesn't favour either sex. His aim is to make men and women grow up, stop dominating eachother and work TOGETHER as a TEAM! Seek peace resolution and respect eachother

It depends where a persons mindset is.

That's tough for me to say because Dr. Phil is Xtian. His good book professes men rule over women. Hm. I guess he doesn't take it so literally.

Lets remember there are 100 times more derogatory words and social malignanacies hurled toward women who "step out of line".

Too bad women don't need to stay in abusive relationships. That they have rights now to leave AND are entitled to half the marital assets, decent shelter and support. Can live a relatively safe life as a single person living alone!

Not so in the past.

Besides the economic realities for women are still less favourable than men overall.

Women are socialized to serve, and subordinate themselves to men, and their families, still so once they put trust into an abuser, what do they do, where do they go? Does the job of taking care of her spouse and children have no $ value?

How wonderful it would be to go back to the good ole days when women had no rights whatsoever except what men deemed acceptable.

I doubt men, as a group, would ever embrace such a life.

There are good men out there, who have been liberated from misogynistic thinking. And Yes, like andii says, they accept the outcomes of marriage breakdown, and the mutual responsibilities if children are involved.

I was thankful that my abusive X came around to a level head, and resumed his role as a responsible FATHER. He finally put his battle with me aside.

All people should be judged by their character and actions not by what sex they are.

Some of us are working toward that goal.

Paul Elam. he wants to censor this site or close it down?

I wonder how many women are aiming to do that to his? Him and Henry Markow. Brothers in allegiance. Who's aim is to send all women back to the dark ages. OFF with her head if she doesn't accept her position to be the "weaker sex".

BTW AAC friends check out this site:

http://mensnewsdaily.com/autho.....paul-elam/

This is the source of Elams first rant. It's an article online that he C&P'd

Why couldn't he post this on the Liberation Brew side?

He professes to be a counsellor/psychologist in the past but hasn't the sensitivity to respect the young participants here who suffer from sexual abuse and neglect?

People in crisis, just needing a place to vent?

Why should it bother him so much? He just chooses to look at a fragment of what goes on here.

These minds can't fathom where his educated stance comes from.

He may as well cut in on a Crisis help line for Kids and pretend he's "daddy", come to offer some more "comfort"??!

The obvious disdain, disrespect for everything this site embodies, the particiapnts here who aren't guilty of his accusations, was his aim.

He's an "Authority"?

Question AUTHORITY

September 25, 2009
9:41 pm
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MsGuided
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In response to Elams claim that men also face hardships.

I agree.

This exists within our belief systems revolving around power, dominance, divisiveness, greed and the brutality that is so entrenched in Western culture.

Humans, for all our altruistic and kind motives have just as many ugly and perverse beahviours.

Maybe question how we are all socialized. Where our beliefs and strengths are derived.

September 25, 2009
9:43 pm
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lollipop3
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Free, I mean andii.... Get off your freakin' soap box. You're full of shit and you and I both know it so don't presume to lecture me about what my accusations are doing to posters here. Your psychotic obsession with this site is far more detrimental in my opinion than my calling you and your cohorts out.

You can go straight to hell you lying freak. And go ahead and try to do to me what you and Shonda tried to do to Destiny. You could never be smart enough.

September 25, 2009
9:58 pm
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nedv
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I just joined this site to voice a concern over the 'new masculinity' page and the 'women's issues' pages. Namely the heavy about of sexist stereotyping on both.

Happy to see I'm not the only one who was worried by this.

September 25, 2009
10:04 pm
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lollipop3
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Paul Elam may be Paul Elam but you are still Free. As am I ... to state my opinions.

September 25, 2009
10:30 pm
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andii
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Whatever lollipop3. Whatever. How about just joining the discussion instead of causing crap? Now THAT's a novel idea.

@Paul

Thank you for responding. I have to go into work tonight, but I will get back to you.

andii

September 25, 2009
11:20 pm
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lovinglife
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so...anyhow... this whole fricken’ weekend I HAVE to spend finishing up a presentation for Monday...SO like being ole me - I'm procrastinating AGAIN and thought "HEY - wonder what the drama will be THIS weekend on AAC to keep me from focusing on what I should be focusing on... I love this!! Thanks Elmo : )

and I didn't know there was anything more to this site then these boards -How many of us honestly have read all the stuff he is talking about?! I’ve looked at some of it in the past – like communicating, self esteem etc.

BUT

Elmo you have landed in the right place – and the right side of AAC – I’m sensing a lot of anger in your posts – the women (and there are men here as well) are here to support you …Where is your anger stemming from? Do you need to talk? We’re here to listen … not professionals though - well some of us are becoming experts as we tend to repeat a few of the same patterns in our lives…but regardless there is A LOT of support and understanding to be found on these boards - from just your everyday folk with issues like yourself.

**Also I think its important before spouting off as a professional of ‘whatever’ - you should do you homework first on what this site is really about...THEN if necessary deal with the appropriate people (like the administrator of this site) regarding your issues. Know though you'll still be loved and supported when your ready to talk.**

I understand you're here to inform - you feel its your calling in life, right?? - good gawd I'm dating "an activist" and he drives me insane because he doesn't care who gets hurt along the way (innocent people like those who post here) - just as long as he gets his message out - that HIS agenda and needs are met. It’s great to be an informer - but do so wisely, professionally by doing your homework first.

September 26, 2009
12:15 am
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mamacinnamon
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OK Folks.. I think it's time to cut Mr Elam loose. I looked my own places and found the two paragraphs in quotes. This is not a person comin here from care and concern for anyone. He is here to hurt and devastate.

" I'd like to announce a new web site for men. It's main purpose is to
provide a brief explanation/intro into "masculinism" and current gender
insanity, as well as a lead in to an excellent discussion group on men's
issues. Voice for Men doesn't want your money, but your thoughtful
contributions to the discussion will be very appreciated. "

" Are you a guy with PMS (puttin' up with missy's shit)? Take a trip to
the Voice for Men web site. Unlike Missy, we don't want your money, and
never will. We won't get all hurt if you don't pay enough attention to
us, and we don't give a damn if you ask for directions or leave the lid
up on the toilet. No porno here, just a place for guys to take an
honest look at what really drives women: narcissism, indulgent romantic
fantasy...and your wallet. "

I wash my hands of you Mr Elam and shame on you for trying to hurt the good folks here.

September 26, 2009
12:37 am
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lovinglife
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So Mamma he does have deep seated issues – sounds like MAJOR issues with women. I sensed alot of hostility in his posts and now it makes sense- he took from here the only thing he was looking for – to give more fuel for his fire – to his agenda. Poor soul (but very selfish). Wonder what happened to him in his childhood to make him this way or maybe he got burned real bad by some woman…

Well that was a quick AAC drama moment! And Lolli – I do agree with you that it had a very familiar ring to it (the site bashing stuff). For once though I think we got ourselves a real one - the real McCoy ; )

SC- remember adversity creates strength and when we chose to look at it as way to grow – it always has a way to make things better : )

Rock’on AAC!

I think I may be able to use his writings for one of my classes on 'research'...we're to find an article and find the holes in it - he writes emotionally filled but doesn't give any credibility to it. It’s a dangerous style of writing because he finds people of like minds that don’t care about facts. He seems very unstable (like some of us!)

(And I do believe I can talk about him in the 3rd person as he stated he wasn't going to write again.)

September 26, 2009
12:54 am
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lovinglife
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In reading just a few of his writings on the net – my take is he got his ass burned bad. Apparently he isn't attracted to codependent women as codependent women aren’t about taking men to the cleaners – just about fixing them.

Oh Paul please come back – seriously we will love you!! You haven’t experienced a codependent woman yet –We (I) are the most beautiful and giving creatures you’ll ever cross paths with.

September 26, 2009
1:22 am
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lovinglife
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This was taken from the net about what Paul wrote about regarding his experience here... then I'm done for the weekend : )
http://whatmenthinkofwomen.blo.....aul%20elam

"Allaboutcounseling.com is purportedly an information and referral resource for people seeking mental health services. What it is in reality is a portal, a conduit that induces women into the mentality that it is the vile scourge of manhood at the root of their problems.

And they offer feminism as the solution before the first session is booked.

Some tidbits from their site include some detailed hype about the fundamentals of feminism and some reassurances that not all feminists are lesbians.

I suppose they figure heterosexual women need such basics. And it’s good pre-sell to overcome objections before they are raised. Ask any used car salesman.

They even have a nifty section promoting a new masculinity. These Freudettes have the key to re-engineering men for the better, with the implication, of course, that the way men are now is defective and in need of an overhaul.

Part of that overhaul is a gag. This is just one of the standouts, as it appears word for word on the site.

Openness- To others (especially to women) criticism of our behaviors and attitudes, listen, listen some more, and only speak if the critic wants feedback.

This isn’t even speak when spoken to. It is shut up and take it. Speak with permission only, from whichever woman is attacking you at the moment.

Ah, the finer aspects of mental health.

They have much more there. Enough bogus stats on domestic violence, rape and sexual abuse for a N.O.W. convention, and staunch defenses of feminism tied in directly with the counseling message. Their ultimate point is clearly that sound mental health for women depends on embracing feminism, and with it the hatred for men.

Sound advice for those seeking love and intimacy if I ever saw it.

At this point, the grease board is showing more grease than board.

I wish I could say that this was the bottom of the pit; that the infection stopped there, but we are still dealing more with the symptoms than the actual disease.

Enter the American Psychological Association, and it’s Division 51 group The Society for the Psychological Study of Men and Masculinity. (SPSMM) You can pronounce the acronym spasm if you want to. I do. And it fits.

Here are two of the bullet points from the Mission Statement on their home page, out there for the world to see.
# Endeavors to erode constraining definitions of masculinity which have historically inhibited men’s development, their capacity to form meaningful relationships, and have contributed to the oppression of other people.

# Acknowledges its historical debt to feminist-inspired scholarship, and commits itself to support groups such as women, gays, lesbians and people of color that have been uniquely oppressed by the gender/class/race system.

Aye, there‘s the rub, and with it goes the last remaining bit of room on the grease board. Men are defective, pernicious banes to civilized society. And feminism is the answer.

Even our most revered experts in human nature are saying as much.

And this is how it worked in the old Soviet Union. It is wise to consider that in the Solzhenitsyn era of gulags and iron fisted reaction to political dissent, that most of the dissidents were imprisoned in “mental health facilities,” the logic being that if you disagreed with the state, there must be something wrong with your mind.

It was also a strategy of, and yes, I will say it without reservation, the Hitler regime, to poison the minds of the populace with disinformation about Jews, prepping the people to look the other way while they were dispatched in the name of a master race.

The plans for men may be less extreme and of longer duration, but it is happening nonetheless. Men are being marginalized year after year. Their numbers in college graduating classes are waning; 42% at last count. They have lost over 80% of the jobs in the current recession. They are dying by suicide and all other manners of death at rates that make women’s lives look like vacations in Fiji.

It’s hell having all this power. It is a wonder how we find time to oppress the world with it, much less twirl our mustaches and snicker while we do it.

But the anti-male hate machine keeps grinding away. Spasm would no doubt classify the MRM as a mass shared psychosis, and MRA’s individually as antithetical to humanity.

I used to remember that social worker who threw the tantrum in my class with a smile. It was a funny image. But that was some years ago. At the time, I knew the sexism was there, but it was not entrenched as deeply as it is today. And I naively thought it would go away.

I am not smiling about it any more."

Paul Elam is the publisher of A Voice for Men

September 26, 2009
8:30 am
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Lollipop- Thank you for your support and validating my feelings. I admire you for the way you stand your ground.

September 26, 2009
9:33 am
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lollipop3
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Whatever is right Free. I'm not interested in joining this non-sensicle conversation filled with these paranoid conspiricy theories. Of course that's right up your alley (along with creating drama), so feel free to carry on.

Just don't think your going to poke at me in the process.

September 26, 2009
9:45 am
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lollipop3
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LL,
Yes, I agree that this one appears to be the real McCoy. However like you, I have a lot of work to do today and so far there has been so much MIS-information presented in this thread by The Women haters vs. The Men Haters that I wouldn't even know where to begin.

So I am going to get to work and let them hash it out.

Good luck on your assignment!

September 26, 2009
9:52 am
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lollipop3
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I should clarify when I said "men haters" I was not grouping all the women who posted on this thread together. I was only referring to anyone who has repeatedly shown a deep seated anger towards men over the years.

September 26, 2009
9:53 am
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lollipop3
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(((((Destiny)))))

September 26, 2009
11:03 am
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(((((((((lollipop3)))))))))))

September 26, 2009
1:07 pm
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andii
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I don't see how I created drama here lollipop3, you were the one foaming at the mouth and vomiting all over the place. I didn't start this thread, I didn't start the other thread where you foamed and vomited everywhere. I have responded and responded only partially. I poke at you? YOu and Destiny attacked me lollipop3 and I responded some. And now you attack again on a thread I posted on. I must have alot of power over you and destiny and lovinglife to have your little adolescent mob stalking me on the net and following me around on threads in snarling pack formation. Now that's just pathetic. You have now power over me. Absolutely none. So yeah.

Whatever.

September 26, 2009
1:19 pm
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andii
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@Paul Elam

Elam backwards spells male. That's interesting.

Truthfully Paul, I never read through the statistics and data presented on this site and am not interested in doing so. Consequently, I can't really comment in that area.

You are certainly spreading your perspective as I amongst others have read through your site. I am sure there are some good men who have faced hardship because of their gender.

I just don't see how this site, AAC, is spreading hatred along gender lines, and I don't find validity in your attack.

Discussion here on this thread will be difficult at best due to some posters with mental issues wherein I've become a target for their emotional release, so I will "see" you at your site if that is okay with you. I would like to gain an understanding as to your perspective.

andii

September 26, 2009
2:13 pm
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lollipop3
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As usual Free, you are delusional.

September 26, 2009
2:20 pm
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andii
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Speaking to me twinks, I mean lollipop3? Yeah. Let's talk truth here. Twinks.

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