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AFRAID TO CHANGE
June 27, 2000
3:44 pm
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sad and stuck
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I am the very sad and depressed. My husband is an alcoholic and I have been caught up in this behavior for 18 years and I am numb, I do not do anything about anything, I rarely fight back, I rarely have a comment back about the snide remarks, I think I am just tired and do not have the courage or the strenght to leave. I have a beautiful daughter and a nice house, I hate to leave it, and I really do not have anywhere to go. I think I am going crazy. Verbal abuse is on the rise, there is no physical abuse, thank goodness, just wondering if anyone out there has had the same problem and had the courage to do something and could pass along the insight to me... thank you for listening......

June 28, 2000
9:46 pm
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DONNIE
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Read my feel the need to talk....
I too am afraid to leave. I think I just don't trust my judgement anymore. My husband is not an alcholic but he has a few beers and gets pretty mouthy. He is a controller and it's always my fault. His every failure and pain is because I made him do it. I understand but sometime we have got to get hold of our own lives and do something for us. What do we get out of our relationships. Or is it always giving in to their needs. I have gotten pretty cold hearted lately time tends to do that. He says but does not prove out in actions that he wants things to work and is willing to do whatever is neccessary. WELL , what took 16 years for him to decide this??? He still does nothing to prove it just talk. Sorry, it could be toooooo late. Let me know how your life goes I may be right in there with you. Let's get strong, for us. They'll shape up or ship out.

June 29, 2000
10:41 am
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Donnie, Thanks for writing, I appreciate the fact that I'm not alone. Maybe you are right, maybe it is to late to fix the relationship and we just get comfortable with the behavior and can't bring ourselves to do anything about it. I can relate to the cold hearted way you have been feeling and acting. That is not my personality at all, but he brings that out in me. Normally I love people and I show it, at home I guess I'm so afraid to be myself that I am not, it is so depressing. My husband is a controller as well, I am trying to tell myself to get strong and take care of myself, I will try very hard and you let me know... Thanks for talking, it always helps.

June 30, 2000
8:30 pm
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janes
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You both sound like you may be codependent....this is something you can change about yourself and start living a life you would rather have.

Read the definition of codependent on this site and seek help for yourself .

You cannot change the person you are with but you CAN change your reaction to how they are and how you feel.

If you are feeling like you have lost something...you have and it is your self.

It can be found again.

Just take baby steps and improve your life. It doesn't have to change over night or anything!!!

July 3, 2000
9:24 am
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hazza
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Sad and Donnie,

a year ago I was writing posts just like yours.
I was at the same place as you, but it got to the point where I had had enough.
I had been made a fool of once to often and decided no more.

Nothing will change unless you decide you want it to.

you must be firm. Also why do you have to leave - can you not say to your husbands that unless they stop this behaviour they must leave the house?

You really have to decide that you want no more of this. it is making that decision itself that is the hard part! I know from experience.

I too have become cold hearted a little - that is something that can happen - but either way I will NOT take his shit anymore and because I have made it clear that if he does any of that stuff again it is OVER, he was forced to take a look at himself - he had no reason to even question his behaviour before did he when I never got angry back or complained.

I left it far too long to get mad! but you need to express that anger instead of letting it smother your soul.
Start by talking to us here if you like - it really helps you find yourself by talking here, then the way forward for you bith will become a little clearer.
Peace
Hazza

July 10, 2000
11:32 am
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sad and stuck
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I just read the last 2 reply's and I just want to thank you both for taking the time to talk to me and offer some great advise. I know that I am codependant and I know I am stuck... For years I keep telling myself to stop this cycle but I continue, why I do not know, I just thought there would come a day that I would just scream and be done with it, I have lost myself, I do not know what I want or what I should do and the day never comes to leave or change, thank you for encouraging me and caring, it helps more than you know.
thanks again, Sad....

July 10, 2000
5:38 pm
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janes
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Knowing you are stuck is the first step. Now you need to move. You do not have to stay stuck. You can change. And if your spouse does not like the changes he will either "see the light" or perhaps change with you.

Nothing ever stays the same.

Make yor life better. You are the only one who can.

July 11, 2000
8:39 am
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I am so touched by the people who responded to me, I can't thank you enough for your encouragement.....

July 13, 2000
12:47 am
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heartfelt
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Sad and stuck......ACOA and alanon meetings along with reading material such as the alanon book will be most helful for you I believe. If you recieve your black belt in alanon the sky's the limit in taking care of you, knowing you are not responsible for the alcoholism. Your a human being, not a human doing so learn how to stop being the doormat. If it's tough to start for yourself, it should'nt be tough to start for your daughter, who is and will be affected as time goes on, hopefully not carrying on this unhealthy cycle.

July 18, 2000
3:29 pm
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sad and stuck
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You hit the nail on the head when you talked about my daughter, I do not want her to accept unacceptable behavior like her mother, I talk to her all the time, I just hope she does not think less of me for trying to stick this all out and mend our family somehow??? She has a stronger personality then me, I can see already and I pray that helps her to be strong and not take anything from anyone??? Thank you from the bottom of my heart for taking the time to talk to me, I'm so grateful for this site and the kind people who are encouraging me to seek help, because I need it desperately and I've been stuck for to many years and cannot under stand why I am so stupid and put up with this!!! thank you again, you'll never know how much you all have helped.

July 19, 2000
5:36 am
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hazza
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Hey there Sad,

It took me a while between realising that I was co-dep and doing soething about it.

it is normal, right now you are learning a lot of new stuff, you dont wake up and learn all this and change it all the same day.

It took me about 2 months from learning that this shit I was in was WRONG and finding the courage to change it.
at first it s really scary, but once you realise that you are being misused and you are LETTING this happn, you will start to get in touch with how ANGRY you are and things will get clearer, you will just start to feel that you dont want this anymore. it doesn't happen overnight.

The best thing youc an do now while you are starting to get in touch with what it is you ARE feeling (takes a while to find YOU you know!) is to read up on co-dep and alcohol issues, talk here and take advice.

I personally have not uses any of the 12 step programms because I do not belive in the theory that some of them have that we should "let it all be given up to a higher power" I personally believe that WE must be in control of OUR choices and cannot wait to see what FATE, GOD or whatever delievers. But that is just my opinion, you must find what works for you, but you can do it.
there is no one organisation or person or book that will make it "right" try all the different approaches and see what makes sense to YOU.
either way, you will learn and start to see what YOU want out of life and learn that you can and do have a right to expect that people should treat you RIGHT and with respect.

it also helps just to talk through all the stuff that pisses you off. so talk to us, a councellor an Al-Anon group, you cat or whatever you find comfortable, but talking it through out loud clears things in your mind. You will find out what is hurting you and then that means that you can start working on a solution.
Peace and Hugs
Hazza

July 20, 2000
12:58 am
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DONNIE
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I too am thankful for these talks. I definately have needed for years to get it all out. But felt people would not understand. There are so many of us out there I just didn't realize. And my children are very affected by what goes on. I have gotten stronger as you said. Not for me but for them. I don't want my son to think this is the way men are suppose to be. And I don't want my daughter to think she has to put up with it. We have not seperated yet but I quite giving in to his demands. I am making choices for me and my children and I have told him. In his own words, If you don't like it leave........I love him but I am miserable. My kids know when I'm happy and they see me stressed. But things are going to change one way or another. Thanks for listening.

July 20, 2000
1:01 am
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DONNIE
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I too am thankful for these talks. I definately have needed for years to get it all out. But felt people would not understand. There are so many of us out there I just didn't realize. And my children are very affected by what goes on. I have gotten stronger as you said. Not for me but for them. I don't want my son to think this is the way men are suppose to be. And I don't want my daughter to think she has to put up with it. We have not seperated yet but I quite giving in to his demands. I am making choices for me and my children and I have told him. In his own words, If you don't like it leave........I love him but I am miserable. My kids know when I'm happy and they see me stressed. But things are going to change one way or another. Thanks for listening.

July 20, 2000
11:20 am
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lucky
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SAD AND STUCK, I WAS TO STRUGGELING WITH AN ALCOHOLIC . ONLY DIFFERENC WAS MY HUSBAND WAS PHISICALLY ABUSIVE. I TO GREW A COLD AND MEAN HEART EVEN TO MY CHILDREN ,I THOUGHT MAYBE THAT IF I HAD A DRINK IT WOULD EASE SOME OF MY PAIN AND ANGER EVENTUALLY I BECAME SOMEWHAT LIKE HIM THEN A DEAR FRIEND SHOWED ME A/A AND N/A (NARCOTICS AND ALCOHOLICS ANON )AFTER A FEW MONTHS OF THAT AND A GREAT SUPPORT SYSTEM I REALIZED WHEN I WOKE UP ONE DAY AND I SAW WHAT I WAS DOING I REALIZED I HAD TO DO SOME THING AND I KNOW THAT FOR ME I HAD TO CHANGE THE SITUATION I LIVED WITH FOR YEARS. I STARTED OFF SAYING IF YOU DONT QUIT I AM GOING TO LEAVE BUT AFTER A YEAR OR SO I REALALIZED IT WAS NEVER GOING TO CHANGE UNLESS I DID SOMETHING TO BETTER THE SITUATION. THE WORST THING I DID WAS TELL HIM I WAS LEAVING CAUSE HE BEAT ME, THATS WHEN I LEFT. I TO HAD EVERY THING A NICE HOME ALOT OF FURNITURE AND EVERTHING BUT I LEFT IT I TOOK OUR CLOTHING AND ALL. MY RELATIONSHIP START JUST LIKE YOURS AND IT WAS A DRINK HERE AND THERE THEN IT WAS EVERY DAY MORNING NOON AND NIGHT AND IT GOT TO THE POINT VERBAL ABUSE WASNT ENOUGH THATS WHEN THE PHISICAL ABUSE STARTED. I PRAY FOR YOU THAT YOUR MARRIAGE WORKS OUT BUT I ALSO PRAY THAT IF IT DOSENT THAT YOU BE ABLE TO GET OUT IN TIME. IT SCARES ME TO SEE OTHERS IN THIS KIND OF SITUATION AND I WANT TO DO ANYTHING I CAN TO HELP EVEN IF IT MEANS JUST LISTENING SO THAT YOU CAN GET IT OFF YOUR CHEST. SORRY TO GO INTO DETAIL ABOUT ME ITS JUST I HAD TO GET IT OFF MY CHEST TO AND MAYBE WHAT I HAVE SHARED CAN HELP YOU AS WELL AS OTHERS . I WILL AWAIT YOUR REPLY AND HOPE TO HEAR FROM YOU SOON. WELL HAVE TO GO TILL LATER BYE, LUCKY

July 21, 2000
4:33 pm
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sad and stuck
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I'm sitting here reading each and every word from people who do not even know me but are talking to me like they know my life. The inspiration you are giving is very helpful. Let me start with hazza, what you said about alanon, some of it I agree with. I did like the some of the ideas and some of the people years ago when I went but I was never truly agreed with everything so I stopped going. Also getting to know me and talking things out loud make me think and feel, over the years I have developed a numbing I can make myself do, I just kind of zone out and don't feel anything, it is awful but that is how I cope, I know I need to get angry and talk, I do have some close friends I share with and I have made some baby steps at home and I pray that I they can turn into bigger steps. thanks and keep in touch, you have helped me more than you know.
Donnie, I hope things go better for you also, you sound like your mad and I think we need to do that until we think of ourselves and our children and make a better life, I will pray for you as well, we will stick together.
Lucky listening to you put things in perspective for me, I'm so sorry to hear what happened to you and thanks for making thing it could happen to me, I've thought about that and I hope I can come to my senses before that ever happens. Losing the house, furniture, etc. it may sound materialistic (can't spell), but that makes me sad as well, but I've been thinking allot and just the other day, I was getting picked on by my husband and he knew I was mad and said you know if we get divorsed we have to split everything to make me angry and that used to bother me and I heard myself say very calmly yes I know we split what little money we have and sell the house and split that and the bills, I agree it is the right thing to do and if that what has to be done that will be fine, I want our daughter and my buddy the dog first and foremost, everything else after that will be second, well he just looked at me, baby steps, it might not sound like much to you, but I'm feeling a little more... Thank you from the bottom of heart to all of you...
Sad and Stuck.... (Happy and stuck today)

July 21, 2000
6:46 pm
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Sad and stuck.....truly what's keeping you , as you say stuck, is yourself.....you've given your power of choice to someone who controls and decides which path you need to take. Think about it. Your life, your future, your choices, your best interest. Allowing someone else to make these decisions for you is not in your best interest, but theirs for their own motives. One has to take a stand as they bring the tools to do so into their heart. As has been mentioned, read co-dependency, but focus on the ways of change. We make things so complicated at times, when in reality these decisions truly are not. Do not seek outside yourself for it implies you are not whole within. Material things come and go, big deal. The will come again for people and places you;d never expect. Gather your resourses, all that you can get and work at them , in turn they will be there for you.

July 22, 2000
3:20 pm
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lucky
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SAD AND STUCK
I am glad to hear that you were able to get something out of what I wrote. I know the future hold alot of good things for you and your family. I hope that you will be able to enjoy them stay strong and may god bless you and your daughter sincerly lucky

July 23, 2000
6:53 am
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hazza
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sad and stuck and everyone else,
I wish you peace.
It takes time, but sad, what youa re doing is the right way, You must keep calm and try your hardest NOT to rise to his bullying.
That is his way of controling you and making you scared.
Keep strong and calm, and keep telling him what you will not put up with calmly, leave the room if you need to but be firm.
You deserve respect.
will talk more soon okay, pushed for time right now buit I wanted to see how you were doing.
Peace
Hazza

July 24, 2000
3:10 pm
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I hate to repeat myself over and over, but I am truly thankful for your caring, understanding and insight you are all showing me, it is making feel like there is someone out there pulling for me and giving me the strength to try. We had an incident the other night when he was drunk, words went back and forth and boy I let him push my buttons and then I took a deep breath and said to myself, is this worth getting myself all worked up and I looked at him and left the room and did not say another word. The next day he apolized and what he said he would not do which was an important issue the night before, he did the next day without any problem, he has a good heart and can be so kind and caring, but I have almost given up hope for recovery, I better work on mine instead. I belive being an alcoholic you try and take people down with you sometime and I am not going down with him. He told me the other day he envies me because I look at life positivily and to him it seems like I have a good head on my shoulders and look toward the future with hope, he said he wishes he could feel that way, he drinks and drives all the time and I worry, but if I way anything he said it would be a blessing if he died, then there would be no more suffering and his daughter and me would have peace without him... I wish he could find peace, but I can't do that for him, only try and do it for me. I do feel a little inspired the last few days and have been plugging along better than I have in awhile, please keep talking to me.. I know they say there allot of rotten people in this world but there allot of good ones too and you are all proof of that. thanks, Sad

July 28, 2000
7:14 am
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hazza
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Hey there sad,
See how the small changes are starting to happen?

Now I used to HATE my partner drinking and driving, especially as I didn't drive myself - It caused a lot of problems for me. Eventually I refused to go ANYWHERE with him, because I could just never know if he would end up drinking and I didn't want to be with him when he was.

I just had to remove myself from those situations because I could not rely on him to make sure he didn't put me in danger.

I used to ache so badly at wishing he were happy, well, safe and so on. But eventually I came to realise that is he has no respect for his own happiness and life then there is NOTHING that I could do about that.

I spent a while here, just like you getting such great support from people. I started to realise how much pain he was putting me through. I got really angry actually once I saw how the pain was always there, making me worry, making me not be able to even plan a dinner date or even know that next week would be okay.

Then I just had enough, he went out partying and broke my heart with the things he did that night, things he had promised me he would never do (drink and drugs)
And for me that was it, like a blinding rush, suddenly I wasn't afraid of him any more - I didn't want him - Well I loved him, but I didn't want the man he had become. I wasn't afraid of him leaving, I was afraid of us staying together like that for another minute.

Every truth I had kept hidden from him because I loved him before, came out that day. How much he had hurt me, how I felt sick with rage when I even looked at him, how his mother felt the same way, how my friends stopped calling because of him, how people thought he was a joke - all of it.

In short, I stopped protecting him from the truth.

It shocked the hell out of him, I think torealise that I had finally had enough, I don't think even he realised how much of a mess he had become.

But we are still together, it is far from perfect - I don't know what the future holds, I only ever let him stay because he literally had nowhere else, but if he EVER puts me through any of that again then he knows he is GONE - he can sleep in his car for all I care. I went through SO much pain back then, that I will NEVER feel that way again.
SO, now he doesn't drink - well I know that he has the odd one, but quite frankly that is his business - I don't care what he does - I am not trying to control him, I only care what he brings to ME.
He knows better than to ever come home smelling of alcohol near me again.
The behaviour that hurt me so much has stopped. I will NOT take name calling, abuse, drink, drugs, broken promises anymore.
Even a year on, the relationship is so different, I still have problems trusting him, but we talk about that. There are still situations where I will not feel comfortable, but I make my own life now.
But I think at least now, we have a chance of making things work again - It may not work in the end, but the only way we are together now is because I stopped trying to make a "happy ever after" ending.
I set my boundaries, but I did it too late that is why there is still a lot of hurt and scars that we are working through, but if I hadn't stopped taking it and DEMANDED better treatment then we would not even be talking by now I think!

These are not really issues about how much the person loves you. Ironically, my partner loves me more than anyone and is a very true soul indeed. Infact I have never known sucha true and genuine love, i Know that. But this is about how they feel about THEMSELVES.
if they cannot respect themselves then they just can't understand why anyone else would love them.
The think "this woman must be stupid to love me!" and then they treat that woman as if she is stupid.
Deep down they NEED the person to say "okay - I am NOT stupid, I love you - yes, But I will not be treated this way"
Only then can they start to respect you again.
Very annoying, but it just seems to be the way it goes.

You need to make it very clear that you are NOT his keeper - he is an adult, he is not stricken by some disease - he makes the choice to life that glass to his lips. His arm does not reach for a beer as some kind of reflex - it is a CHOICE.
so he can choose that if he wants, but only YOU decide if he gets you as well.

If you are sick of the things he does then you need to make a decision. it is no good going "honey pleas don't..." he knows that you are not serious.
you need to decide if it hurts you that much then are youready to say "Honey, if you do this .... then I am not gonna stick by you anymore."

maybe that will be enough to jolt him into reality, maybe not.
The point is you don't have to take it.
it doesn't mean it stops, it just means you take yourself away from it. that is all you can do if something is hurting you.

If he decided that you mean that much to him that he will wake up to his problems then great, but there are no guarentees.

But many of us have been there, and I know that eventually there comes a time when you just think "shit life is too short for all this - I want to be HAPPY again - whatever that takes"

Peace to you
Hazza

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