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Husband & His Fantasies

UserPost

12:57 pm
September 7, 2005


Juanita

Member

posts 25

Most of you probably don't remember why I originally came here… so heartbroken & devastated due to pressure from my spouse to fulfill certain fantasies of his. I know a lot of you here now are very religious & will probably think the worst of me, but I just need to type and vent or share.

WD, Twinks, perhaps Sew, if you are around, you may remember how my spouse wanted to "share" me. How I resisted. How I had a dear male friend caught in the middle… My male friend, whom my spouse encouraged me to "Be" with, backed away from the scene for a while. We maintained contact via email, but no phone nor in person.

Recently, my friend has come back into my life in 'person' so to speak…. meaning actual person to person contact. Nothing bad. Nothing improper. He needed some help with insurance & I helped – thereby resuming the contact we lost a bit ago. It was so nice to see him again, to talk with him again & joke. He has a wonderful wry sense of humor the computer email just doesn't do justice to.

Now, here's the crux for my spouse. He has always encouraged my contact with this man. Both platonic, and then some. He knew we emailed & stayed in touch after my friend drifted away. He was even fine with my friend & his daughter coming over to visit a couple times now…. both in group situations.

Last nite, I think my spouse had a revelation. His fantasy last night was not of him getting to have a 3 or 4 some. It was of my & my pal having relations, & him being excluded. Of me & my pal sharing (our) bedroom & my spouse being left out – sleeping in another room. That my friend & I became the "couple" and he was allowed to live here.

I have no idea what to do. I find it hard to have compassion when he put me thru Hell & later told me he was 'joking'. That I was being over dramatic, making mountains out of mole hills. These fantasies that plague him are his own creation. I would never have thought of sleeping with my friend (which I haven't) on my own. Sure, my friend & I are playful & a tiny bit flirtatious – but nothing has been done that couldn't be done in front of my spouse.

My spouse tells me of how he teases and flirts with the women he works with. Imitating pole dancers, rubbing (each their own) nipples in front of one another…. I mean 'come on!' …. I have never ever done anything that flirtatious in my life.

Now he told me of his latest dream (or fantasy), and I find no sympathy. He created the scenario in his own mind. He pressured me till I was emotionally hurt. To protect myself, I've put up a wall. I know this.

I also know some of you out there will say I should give up my friend for the sake of my marriage.

Seems wrong. I did nothing wrong, and don't feel I should have to. I was hurt in the process of all this. Why should I sacrafice a friendship that I greatly enjoy & makes me feel good? To assuage my spouse's insecurity over his own fantasy when he was the one to pressure me about it?

I think he finally realizes I am not the woman from before. Adoring & putting him on a pedalstal.

I think he realizes to some tiny degree "Oops, what did I start?".

I am sad, but I will get over it. I wish WD could see this if he's still around – just so he knows my spouse finally seems to realize what his fantasies could mean if they ever came true.

Thanks all for allowing me to vent. Sometimes it just helps to share to complete strangers.

Please don't judge me & think I am bad. I have not fulfilled any fantasy that involved another person. I just suffer from the knowledge of that (1) what my spouse would like me to do, and now (2) that same fantasy is what's causing my spouse some bad dreams….

after 2-3 yrs…. Wow. slow learning curve.

1:56 pm
September 7, 2005


jamaicanwife

New Member

posts -1

I'm not realy clear – are you saying that your husband had a bad dream in which he lost you to this other guy?

2:12 pm
September 7, 2005


exoticflower

New Member

posts -1

Fantasies that make you uncomfortable are not apropriate for him to share with you, period. Shame on your husband for disrespecting you.

4:58 pm
September 7, 2005


Juanita

Member

posts 25

Let's just say he works in a school & the cafeteria women are just as playful as he.

I feel miserable in one way cuz I don't want to give up my male friend. Glad spouse is realizing what his fantasy ideas could cost him. But also sad knowing what they've already cost me in self-esteem, and trust in him. I know what he wants. I also know if my male friend ever decided he wanted "more" how very torn I'd be.

After all, don't most women want a one-woman man?

blech. I'm back on that roller coaster again.

5:54 pm
September 7, 2005


jamaicanwife

New Member

posts -1

I don't think rubbing your nipples is flirtatious. That is possibly felonious, not flirtatious!

10:03 pm
September 7, 2005


exoticflower

New Member

posts -1

LOL, I think ONE man rubbing his ONE womans nipples is totally cool…beyond that, it's just as disrespectful as the rest of this stuff.

Again I say "shame on your husband", because in re-reading I was struck with your inteligance, and though if I had a guy that was as good as you are a woman, I wouldn NEVER want to share him!

11:18 pm
September 7, 2005


Juanita

Member

posts 25

(((( Twinks )))) thanks for the hug. My earlier response got cut short as someone walked in.

No, my friend no longer has his psycho g/f. Eesh, glad she is gone. A lot, though, of what he speaks of is how he does miss her even though what they want from life is not compatable. (He wants his career, she wanted kids 'yesterday'.)

In all honesty, I've never been the type of woman who looks at other men. This man, good friend that he is, is husband material. He is very similar to mine in many ways. Perhaps that's the draw or compatability? Who knows. We like one another, can talk about anything, and can tease one another. I love talking with him, he is so very interesting, & has done so much with his life. Yeah, he can put too much on his plate too.

My spouse keeps hoping he'll get a wild g/f (no need to explain why – I'm sure you can guess).

My spouse keeps telling me it's all 'in fun & teasing'. Ok, he is keeping it light in tone, but he's serious in opportunity. Let's face it, the topic does arise every so often. I wasn't borne yesterday.

I'm still hanging in here. Too many years invested. Not enough 'wrong' per se to give up. Just a few big differences. (what the heck, eh? … that's the Canadian French in me)

A harem, yuck? Well, I'm thinking it must have some ADVANTAGES too …. 'nah, I don't want him tonite, YOU take him!' Definite draw back would be that we'd all suffer PMS at the same time …. (hehe, must be misery for the man!) Perhaps separate living quarters would be best? ;-} The man would have to own a Florist Shop & Chocolate factory to keep all the women happy…. I'm imagining Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus, and the man running around just saying "I'm so confused!" We could gang up on him & pick on him, eh? (how the imagination can wander – so sorry)

Jamaicanwife & Exoticflower, thank you for your input. My spouse is a bit kinkier than some (er, maybe most). Some people have pointed out that it is not a lack of respect -that at least he respects me and trusts me enough to share his desires with me (verbally) rather than seeking to relieve them elsewhere secretly. At least I know what's going on in his mind, even if I don't totally agree. Don't you just love it when the coin always has 2 sides? It just depends on which side you are looking at? (can drive me nuts occassionally)

I just found it amazing after all this time, he had a dream that he lost me as a lover to my friend & he was only allowed to live here in a separate bedroom. A tiny fear showing up now? wow.

I asked him if he was nervous about me seeing my friend again. My spouse says 'no', he's not nervous & for me not to jump to conclusions about his dream.

?? ah-huh

I guess if I'm gonna keep both men in my life, it's going to get interesting every so often. My hope is, actually, the more my friend is around – perhaps this stuff will wear off. You know, get old.

My spouse even asked me what the draw was for his man to befriend himself to me & our family. Let's face it, he's single, good looking, quite a catch. Why spend time with a family rather than look for a new g/f? He's highly educated & we are not (meaning no college). My spouse wonders what it is I/we are fulfilling in his life.

Ok, I refuse to have my self-worth tampered with. The man just likes me. I'm cute & sassy & that's enough to make me worthwhile. right? Right…

Hubby has just gone off to bed. I will too shortly. I wonder what dreams will come our way tonite?

Thanks guys for listening.

11:04 am
September 8, 2005


Worried_Dad

Member

posts 41

Hi Juanita,

I think what bothers me mst here is your feelings lost self esteem. First because I care about you and secondly because it is darned irrational.

Don't judge your husband for being kinky–and he should not judge you for not being kinky.

It sounds like you have let your self esteem suffer because you found out your husband is kinkier than you.

People are different. Involving a third person is a very common fantasy–one of the most common. Men tend to be kinkier than women. That's life–don't let it throw you.

You had a fantasy. Your fantasy was that your husband would not have certain fantasies. When you found out that your fantasy was just that–a fantasy you let it affect your self esteem. That's…kind of silly.

Dan Savage always warns vanilla people not to get involved with kinky people–his opinion is that the kinky one will either find someone to act out their kink with (i.e. cheat) or else resent their vanilla partner forever.

I don't know if that is true in your case, but your husband is being rude and disrespectful by inflicting his fantasies on you. He needs to cut it out.

And you need to stop letting what is going on in your husband's mind affect your self esteem.

11:32 am
September 8, 2005


jamaicanwife

New Member

posts -1

I agree with WD – your husband needs to cut it out. I accept that you have many years invested in a perfectly good relationship, but Ifigure that once he throws the threesome or whatever out there and you shoot it down, he may mention it again but if he is sure that you aren't interested, he would back off.

Question for you – have you made it clear to your husband that you are not interested, or is he left with the feeling that you just need to be persuaded/convinced? You seem to be pretty clear in your own mind, but I know how difficult it is to say 'No, never' to someone, even if that is the honest answer. If I can get away with an 'I don't think so, not right now, I'm not ready to discuss this, can we talk about this later?', a vague answer that is intended to keep people from losing their temper, I usually avoid honesty.

If you have been as firm and direct as possible and your husband still persists in bringing this matter up, then maybe you need to restate your feelings and ask him to let it drop, forever.

1:44 pm
September 8, 2005


mamacinnamon

New Member

posts -1

Juanita:

(((( hugs ))))

I'm sorry your hubby is actingl like such a jerk. My hubby used to make incenuations about other women, including multiples. It really hurt. He would say he was teasing, but I really wonder. He did finally stop the teasing. Think I told him if he was that keen on other women he could walk thru that door and I hoped it smacked some sense into him when it hit him in the butt. I don't know if that stopped it or if he just got tired of me not playin along.

I don't judge you. It's actually sad and heartbreaking at the things a woman will compromise for her husband. Have seen it w/ my friends as well.

There was a bit of advise given to me last night on the support side. Thread is called something like Neshema's ?? – Wed. Go check it out. It is very close to the end. L&F has it pegged and mastered. Think maybe it could help you out as well. She also recommends a book called Boundaries by Town/? (lost my note, I hate when that happens).

You work on regaining your self esteem and then show the dumba** just where you stand. And no, I don't think you should have to give up your friend. Just tell hubby your friend is "off limits" and stand your ground.

8:27 am
September 9, 2005


Juanita

Member

posts 25

I originally started this thread b/c it surprised me that my spouse had this 'bad' dream of losing me to the fantasy he has, over the past couple yrs, let me know he is very interested in having.

I work on my self-image by maintaining my belly dancing (don't laugh – I'm serious & I like it). I've been dancing for 1 yr now. It helps rebuild my self image b/c you have to love, or at least be very comfortable in, your body to do this style dance. It is a sensual form of dance, but it doesn't mean 'cheap'or 'bordello' looking costuming. Picture a Gypsy instead.

Did I make myself clear way back to my spouse? Yes, I do believe so. (the talking, the antidepressants, the counselling for myself) However, a person cannot change someone else. I have to be willing to accept him for himself, and likewise he of myself. He has greatly alieveated the pressure, but in passing conversations or comments, I know he'd still be ready if I just give the ok. This may be a very common fantasy of men, but it also can make a woman wonder what she is not doing to keep him happy. Let's face it WD, I'm not exactly a prude in that sense.

Like I said. I was amazed he had a dream that he could lose me.

Dumbfounded me, & I had a lack of compassion considering he began it all.

It is ironically funny b/c he had the dream & still would be interested. Isn't that a double edge sword he is playing with? He loves it, yet hates it? Strange after all this time.

8:45 pm
September 9, 2005


Zinnie

New Member

posts 1

and then one day… the magical wish came true – and the dolt lost his princess to someone that treated her with the respect and dignity she deserved.

Reading yet?

8:34 am
September 14, 2005


Juanita

Member

posts 25

You know… no big deal … but WD has used the term 'vanilla' with me a couple times. I've decided I don't like the term 'vanilla'. It implies dull, boring, and without flavor or excitement. That's not me. I may not be the wildest thing in the bunch, but I'm not Vanilla. Definitely not vanilla with the right man & mood. However, that said – having the right man & mood is the key. Passion cannot be achieved if there is stress or angst.

I hate plain, and don't like being labeled as such. Labels pre-judge someone & I don't like them in general … but being termed as vanilla has hurt my feelings to some degree.

Decided not to keep my mouth shut this time.

3:08 pm
September 14, 2005


jamaicanwife

New Member

posts -1

Vanilla is a flavour. You watch the cooking channels, the chefs groan orgasmically as they taste their own creations made with Vanilla Beans!!

One thing struck me – you seem upset about being called vanilla, but not upset about your husband wanting a two and a halfsome. Have you achieved a calm acceptance of this as a part of your life? Are you interested in your husband's idea? I jumped right in with advice and husband-bashing, but you seem a bit – ambiguous. Why is it significant that your husband had this dream? You didn't even make it clear if he was upset by the dream or not. Maybe it was a realy great dream, and he just loves the idea of throwing you out there to see if you'll come back?

Your feelings about your relationship are confusing to me.

7:05 pm
September 14, 2005


shyshy

New Member

posts -1

I think if my husband ever suggested that I would leave him for the friend. He sounds like he has a better head on his shoulders. But then, I don't know the whole story either.

7:07 pm
September 14, 2005


shyshy

New Member

posts -1

My bf used to suggest threesomes all the time when we first started dating and he finally got the hint that I was not interested. That was before there were any feelings invested.

If he mentioned that to me now I would leave him. That, to me, would be a clear indication that he had no feelings for me whatsoever and no respect.

7:55 pm
September 14, 2005


jamaicanwife

New Member

posts -1

My husband has enough trouble getting me to sleep with him, much less him and some other guy – or, heaven forfend, other woman. I don't live at that speed.

9:58 pm
September 14, 2005


Juanita

Member

posts 25

JW, you commented … "Vanilla is a flavour. You watch the cooking channels, the chefs groan orgasmically as they taste their own creations made with Vanilla Beans!! "

Yes, vanilla beans are very nice. (so are big O's) However, when comparing them to the world of spices, they are rather tame compared against some others. My comment was meaning, I felt lacking in "flavour" enough – considering my spouse wanted to perhaps sample some others. The metaphor just bothered me. I don't like being labeled, called, or insinuated as dull. Call me oversensitive if you want, but I still somewhat smarting that I am not 'spicy' enough for my spouse & he's interested in sampling some others. The comment just bothered me a little. I have supported & 'loved' WD for a long time – I think he's a great guy – He knows a lot about me & I just don't feel very vanilla. Being termed vanilla just made me feel Down. Like I'm not spicy enough. It is easier to tell someone here, I don't like X than face to face. In my opinion, and from what I hear other wives say (and from what I hear from men too), I am not a prude, but I do have some limits. No chandliers, no exits, one on one a yes … no cameras or video tape.

"One thing struck me – you seem upset about being called vanilla, but not upset about your husband wanting a two and a halfsome. Have you achieved a calm acceptance of this as a part of your life? "

To get thru it, yes, I accepted it. We agreed to disagree. I have to respect his thoughts, opinions, and feelings as much as I expect him to respect mine. We are both human and have equal rights. However, we don't have to agree. I cannot change him & I wouldn't believe if he said he did.

"Are you interested in your husband's idea? I jumped right in with advice and husband-bashing, but you seem a bit – ambiguous."

When my spouse introduced his fantasy to me it was a slow, well thought out process on his part. Encouraging a friendship between me & a guy. At first his comments were light and teasing, to which I'd be saying 'are you nuts, no way'… then they progress to more serious & so did my "Are You Nuts? No way"… to finally 'teasing' accusations. After many "No Ways" in a fit of frustration to stop things I said ONCE "Yeah, I did …" Which, of course I didn't – I just wanted to hurt him back – Didn't work… it fed the flame so to speak.

You have to understand, after hearing his fantasy so long & so much (this lasted over a year's time), I was hurt. I counter acted his fantasy with one of my own. Still have it in bad times, but hey, I sure many women have the same. It's along the lines of Mr X would be SO over come with love for me, he'd risk it all (considering I'm married), to try & romance me. He, of course, would be the perfect guy & nuts about me & only me. The fantasy is, my knight in shining armour would 'save' me & heal my wounds making me feel oh-so-loved again.

Reality check – I know it – It's NOT gonna happen. There are NO knights in shining armour. I don't need rescuing. This is my life… I have to make of it what I will. WD summed it well when he said MY fantasy did not come true (wanting a husband who only wants one woman forever & always). Oh well. I didn't get my fantasy. He's not getting his. Simple.

"Why is it significant that your husband had this dream? You didn't even make it clear if he was upset by the dream or not."

It was significant b/c I never thought he realized he could lose me to someone else. My friend returns in person for a couple of group situations & bam, hubby has a dream of losing me to him. Amazing. It stunned me. I was amazed at my lack of compassion for his being upset by this dream. Normally, I am a compassionate person – this I was not.

If you think you were confused by this – you shoulda tried living in my brain & heart when this was going on more prevalently!

I had to 'let it go' to survive & not remain depressed. I tried anti-depressants and counseling both. Basically, to 'let it go' I had to de-sensitize myself in some ways. Is this my blazay-ness about it? Call it survival or scar tissue or whatever. Letting it go was the only thing I could do to stay sane. It took me a long time to do it & I still have days when I revisit everything again. I get rather depressed, cynical & grouchy then. Not emotions I like.

Passing the test of time is the only thing left to do. I plan on staying here unless things get bad like a couple years ago. I won't relive that again… no way. But everyone deserves a second chance… especially when everything else is relatively ok to good within the relationship. Sex is not everything.

Again, I started this thread b/c I was surprised by his realizing if his fantasy came true he could risk losing me, and by my lack of compassion for him.

AND, Shyshy, I did not forget you. I did think of leaving him for my friend so very long ago. I was devastated. If my friend would have loved me – in the true meaning of love – maybe I'd being somewhere else right now. But, he didn't, we don't, & I still do love my husband – we have worked on some of our other issues. He is a good man in very many ways. We just have our problems like everyone else… just a little kinkier than most (or perhaps most people don't want to talk about it & it is more prevalent that I think?) Who knows.

I used to say "if my man ever wanted me to do X, I'd leave him." I found out the hard way, never say never – there are always more factors involved. Things are rarely as Black & White as they seem.

10:50 pm
September 14, 2005


Juanita

Member

posts 25

A thought came to me after sending my above post. My prayers from back then were answered…

God granted me the Serenity to ACCEPT the things I Cannot Change… (ie, my spouse)

Courage to Change the Things I Can … (myself)

And Wisdom To KNOW the Difference…
(the figuring out I can't change anyone but myself)

JW's questions got me to mulling it over. Amazing how it just dawned on me.

7:22 am
September 15, 2005


Zinnie

New Member

posts 1

J –

Will post more later (and give more comparisons, because you know I'm a cooking freak – something, I'm greatly missing while on the road) BUT… I suggest this…

bake something WITHOUT vanilla – and try it – bet you go BLECH! Vanilla, although often disguised as "plain and ordinary" is anything but – it is one of the essentials to baking, cooking and life – as are YOU my dear.

Love to all,

Z.

8:45 am
September 15, 2005


Juanita

Member

posts 25

Zinnie,

Sweetie, You know I love you & hold you dear. Feeling plain though is just terrible when I fight to remember I am not.

I'm sorry if people didn't like that I didn't appreciate being 'vanillerized'. It is all in how it is taken or perceived.

I fear I am a practical person without flair sometimes which equates to strong, sturdy, dependable & boring.

Shoot, I'm performing in a B Dance Hufla this w/e. How dull can I be? Sure, I like to quilt too…. but there is a whole spectrum of colors to me.

I just wish people could see me in full blooming color sometimes instead of Black & White, or shades of Vanilla.

Yes, I know Vanilla is sweet & essential – but it is also mild & gentle. I guess these things to describe me in one way. I just would like to think I contain some teeny tiny bit of Jalapeno Pepper in me too.

Sorry if I offended anyone by not appreciating Vanilla enough.

12:00 pm
September 15, 2005


jamaicanwife

New Member

posts -1

If I may take the metaphor one step further, take that mild and gentle bottle of vanilla flavouring and put it to your head, take a big gulp and see how you like it. Nasty, and bitter is what you'll get. There's a reason why you only put in a spoonful.

12:52 am
September 16, 2005


Zinnie

New Member

posts 1

Good point JW – also, Juanita keep in mind that vanilla comes in varying types.

Sure, you can buy plain ol' imitation vanilla extract and think? Hum, Plain Jane.

Or you can pay a few pennies more for the bottle and get the pure vanilla extact – which is deep and rich.

Or you can really go for the gusto and get some Adam's Extract and get the mixture of the two – which is great, goes a long way, mixes and cooks well.

OR…

The fresh beans when grated are exotic and hard to find fresh here in the United States. I have seen grown men give up almost an entire meal to eat some vanilla flan that I have made and almost fight over who gets the last little bit. The beans are hard to find and expensive and a little bit goes a long way.

So, although the jalapeno might be hot and spicy it is often doused with water or even pushed to the side – where the vanilla bean is savored and enjoyed, talked about and remembered.

3:07 am
September 16, 2005


sewunique

New Member

posts -1

Say, Juanita!

Sorry I haven't responded as yet. My time here has been limited; partially self imposed, other due to a lost modem on my laptop. This pc am using is so old and poor memory, it keeps being knocked off line or I loose my work.

Belly dancing sounds like fun! I'd give it a try, but my stiff back just does'nt do it. Yoga is my recourse.

Zinnie has some great thoughts and insights. WD, of course, always faithful to give a strong robust word.

What more can I add here? You are a bright, adventerous, loving and caring person. Pretty good looking too from what you describe. Alot going for you. Embrace it. Gleam from it to add to your inner beauty. Share your best with others and find happiness in who you are and what you can share!

I am learning about my Finnish heritage from people at work. I now work in an American-Finnish nursing home. It feels like community there. (Hard to describe what community means unless you been there). The acceptance is so great, like none I have experinced in my career!

I found a Finnish proverb to share with you. It is: "Happiness is somewhere between having too much and too little." Guess that about sums it up for me. Easier than trying to measure what happiness is.

As for your hubby; all I can say is, kick his ideas to the curb. It is/was very hurtful what he asked of you. Deep wounds heal slowly. They need nurturing and good care daily to mend well without getting infected. You understand? And the scarring is pretty sensitive too, until the scars toughen up a bit.

And I still remember what Zinnie said…"bump, bump." And another bump for good measure.

And also to what WD said…"he did what? He…..what?" (Venicular specific for added effect).

I do not like the word 'vanilla' either. Sort of like a black and white world. I like rainbow colours best. My world is bettere that way, with the sunshine to make it so. Besides, there are too many shades of grey between black and white, anyway. But, vanilla does make the point and clearer for others to understand it. So if one is not a vanilla bean, can they be a coffee bean or a soy bean or just plain beans?

Take care, my friend. You sound much better than the past. I hope this is so.

Warm hugs with love and sunshine,

~Sew~

3:15 am
September 16, 2005


sewunique

New Member

posts -1

Doggone, Juanita,

I posted before I read your entire thread! Yes, we ARE so similiar in many ways………sunshine and rainbows of every colour to you!

~Sew~


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