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The world is flat & dinosaurs & humans lived at the same time

UserPost

7:19 pm
April 21, 2009


marypoppins

Member

posts 4

no, Glittered, you're not the only one…

Imagine

Imagine there's no Heaven
It's easy if you try
No hell below us
Above us only sky
Imagine all the people
Living for today

Imagine there's no countries
It isn't hard to do
Nothing to kill or die for
And no religion too
Imagine all the people
Living life in peace

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will be as one

Imagine no possessions
I wonder if you can
No need for greed or hunger
A brotherhood of man
Imagine all the people
Sharing all the world

You may say that I'm a dreamer
But I'm not the only one
I hope someday you'll join us
And the world will live as one

8:57 pm
April 21, 2009


on my way

New Member

posts -1

Ma Strong,

Has it ever been politically correct to be a Christian? :)…..no, and it will most likely never be until Jesus comes back.

Love ya sis,
omw

12:47 pm
April 23, 2009


StronginHim77

Member

posts 453

OMW -

(With a smile)…Yes. Good reminder that Jesus, Himself, warned that the world has hated Him and we would be no different. We would be hated, too.

How quickly we forget that loving warning!

As a minister, I go about the world "in cognito." I never wear my "collar," unless I need entrance to a hospital ER or a hospice…or I'm doing a funeral…

It is easier for me to simply move amongst people, blessing and encouraging them wherever and however I can anonymously…without being identified as a Christian. I rarely even wear a cross. A real Christian doesn't need to "advertize." They should know us by our fruit: love, joy, peace, patience, goodness, meekness, longsuffering…

Sometimes, people find out I am a minister and then start apologizing for cussing around me, etc. Just makes me laugh. I am not religious and not offended. I am simply there to enjoy and love on them, the way my Lord does.

- Ma Strong

12:51 pm
April 23, 2009


StronginHim77

Member

posts 453

P.S. I have nicknamed my ministry the "Biker/Brothel/Bar" ministry, since I will sit down with anyone and match them, drink for drink while listening…go to biker bars and hangouts and — again — listen to their needs and struggles…provide a nonjudgmental ear for women prostitutes (some have exited successfully…some are still in the trenches)…and I try to support alcoholics and addicts in faith-based halfway programs.

In short I like being around real people with real struggles in the real world. When people can't afford a car repair or get hit with a scary STD or find themselves battling foreclosure or need to unload alot of guilt from their past, they will seek me out and talk to me. That blesses me beyond words and makes my life worthwhile.

All in His Name.

- Ma Strong

12:54 pm
April 23, 2009


StronginHim77

Member

posts 453

Do I tell non-believers the Truth about sin and salvation? Yes…IF (and only IF) they ask me. I am not in this world to preach to anyone…only to encourage, to listen and to make myself available when they long to turn to God for His help and knowledge/understanding of HIS ways.

= Ma Strong

1:42 pm
April 23, 2009


glittered when he walked

New Member

posts -1

Maybe I'm looking at this differently, but I really don't see how it is currently politically incorrect to call oneself a christian..well, not in the US anyway…nor has it been so in western europe dating back to Rome's heydey. Obama had a christian minister speak/pray at his inauguartion, the Bush's the were heavily ensconced within the moral majority/evangelical christian base. Billy Graham had the ear of many presidents going back as far as Nixon at least.

Fully 76% of the US population in 2008 considered themselves to be christian. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_States#Religious_self-identification_of_the_U.S._adult_population:_1990.2C_2001.2C_2008)

3.9% were non-christian and 15% were atheist – with the balance (~5%) not answering.

The numbers prior to that in the US and western Europe only show a greater share for chirstianity…I'm guessing all the way back to the years 400 to 600.

My guess is you are referring to specific "christian" actions perhaps being considered politically incorrect?

5:46 pm
April 23, 2009


soofoo

New Member

posts -1

Glittered,

Those numbers lie, because they include the majority of folks who check off Christian on a slip of paper because they are culturally connected to the religion and not because of faith. I am not judging those people. I am simply acknowledging their vast numbers.

It is very, very, un-hip, uncool, square, redneck, lowbrow, ignorant and white trashy to be a Christian. When you are one and you dare to let people know, or have to let people know you find this out.

You can't understand the subtle ways people are discriminated against unless you walk a mile in their shoes. You might, I guess, claim to be a Christian and then observe how people proceed to treat you and behave around you. That might give you a hint as to what it's like. But I wouldn't recommend it.

Love to you, my friend.

11:01 pm
April 23, 2009


bereft

New Member

posts -1

it's not "calling" yourself a Christian that is politically incorrect, it's being a Christian that people can't seem to tolerate. just about the only remaining taboo in this "tolerant" society is the naive and politically incorrect notion that another person's "alternative lifestyle," religion, or different perspective is wrong.

of course, one major exception to that rule stands out starkly: it is OK to be intolerant of biblical Christianity.

can you imagine what people would say if you described today's society as "lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, revilers, disobedient to parents, ungrateful, unholy, unloving, irreconcilable, malicious gossips, without self- control, haters of good, treacherous, reckless, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God?" (2 Timothy 3:2) if you stood up and applied that list to anybody today, it would be seriously politically incorrect…wouldn't it?

grace and peace

12:25 pm
April 24, 2009


glittered when he walked

New Member

posts -1

Well that is unfortunate. In the US, the freedoms of religion and speech will butt heads or at least will create scenarios wherein belief systems impact/drive legislation and that seems to be where the real thorny stuff happens. Gay marriage…sodomy laws..abortion…blue laws etc.

These issues won't go away anytime, but they are the price we pay for a free society.

It's not ok to be intolerant of christianity. How are we defining intolerance?

12:43 pm
April 24, 2009


Bitsy

Member

posts 71

I will give you an example:

Miss California in the Miss USA Pageant. She was asked her opinion of gay marriage. She said she was raised to believe marriage was between one man and one woman. She stated she was a Christian. Google it and read all the broo ha ha that got stirred up about her answer. That has been the definition of marriage since the first caveman said to the first cavewoman "grunt, grunt, howsa bout you move your bearskin over here by mine"

You and I do not have to agree with her opinion but we do have to defend her right to her opinion. Everyone is saying that she most likely lost the Miss USA crown because of that one answer.

Bitsy

3:20 pm
April 24, 2009


glittered when he walked

New Member

posts -1

I don't think it was her stance in so much as it was her bumbling answer and inaccuracy. Let's look at her answer:

"We live in a land where you can choose same-sex marriage or opposite. And you know what, I think in my country, in my family, I think that I believe that a marriage should be between a man and a woman. No offense to anybody out there, but that's how I was raised."

Not exactly a very eloquently worded answer. In fact, it's lousy. Opposite Marriage?…isn't that divorce? did she mean homosexual and heterosexual marriage? Regardless of stance – it's cumbersome and confusing and inaccurate. Only four states allow gay marriage, and california is not one of them, clearly we do not live in a land where you can choose same sex marriage..that is not something afforded to most people throughout the United States.

Granted, it's not as bad as the "map" answer from a while back.. "I think that U.S. americans….need more maps….for our children"

I know crapola about the miss USA paegent but isn't eloquence and poise something the judges claim to evalaute for each woman?

If she had said "I have a strong faith, and as such I cannot condone gay marriage within my faith, but I do believe in that homosexuals have rights through civil unions as our country has a long established practice of separation of church and state" that she would not have faired better?

3:41 pm
April 24, 2009


glittered when he walked

New Member

posts -1

So I really don't see how her claims that her stance on gay marriage cost her the Miss USA crown is an example of intolerance…other than it does infer that she is intolerant of gay marriage based on her principles.

3:48 pm
April 24, 2009


bereft

New Member

posts -1

Bitsy, i believe you meant Adam and Eve. when Adam met his wife, he said, “This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.” actually, in the Hebrew it was in the form of a poem, the first love poem. perhaps he grunted when he first saw her…wooooh, man!! i can only imagine.

the chapter continues, “Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh." our definition of marriage.

GWHW, i agree she didn't give a very eloquent answer, but at least she has class. the gay activist judge, on the other hand, who marked her card with a zero and then gave a hate-filled, misogynistic response to her answer and the disgraceful, knee-jerk defense of that response by liberals in Hollywood, the media and organized homosexuality, is how to define intolerance.

grace and peace

3:57 pm
April 24, 2009


Tiger Trainer

Member

posts 5

bereft, I agree with you. It seems that the world is tolerant of everything except for Christianity and high moral standards.

6:13 pm
April 25, 2009


marypoppins

Member

posts 4

Hmm…guess I have yet to hear stories of Christians being treated the way other groups in our society, and in the world, are treated.

Doctors helping women follow through with decisions about their own bodies are at risk in some places, even shot, by those who disagree.

Gays are rejected by parents, denied civil rights in some cases, tormented, injured, even killed.

Minorities are still discriminated against – denied equal access to jobs, housing, educational opportunities – despite laws that are in place.

Throughout the world, women are not only denied equal wages, in many countries they are denied safe lives. They're raped, beaten, treated as property – sometimes killed.

Crimes against children occur worldwide.

Poverty we cannot leaves many hopeless and helpless.

Not all of this evil is done in the name of religion, of course, but some of it is.

If what a person believes in helps him/her to be a better person and love and accept others, I'm all for it.

However, there are those whose beliefs exclude others based on a very narrow definition of what is moral and good, completely disregarding different cultural beliefs and customs and life circumstances. These same people may hide behind words in a book written by other humans in order to feel superior in some way.

BEREFT posted to me once that if I didn't believe what she does, I'll burn in hell for eternity.

THAT is bullshit.

If others have to be wrong for you (universal "you") to be right, then I suggest that YOU travel the world a bit, read more, open your mind. There are other countries, other cultures, and other ways to live. There are truly good people everywhere, and I believe in a heaven and a God that recognizes those people, wherever they are, whatever they call themselves.

It takes no courage, in my opinon, to hide behind a book and judge others. Again, I'm not saying all religious people do that, but more than enough of them do.

Mary

6:26 pm
April 25, 2009


marypoppins

Member

posts 4

And very specifically, if a "Christian" wants to pray and go to church and believe Jesus is the only path to heaven, that's fine.

BUT stay out of the lives of others. Which group goes to women's clinics and demonstrates outside, calling women "murderers"? Which group speaks out against gays, calling them immoral?

If Christians are somehow discriminated against, it's likely because some of them tried to tell others how to live. If you judge others, you have to expect that the tables will be turned.

Again, I'm not saying ALL, I'm saying some. And even one is too many many.

Mary

8:53 pm
April 25, 2009


marypoppins

Member

posts 4

And quoting the Bible is only effective with people who believe what is written in the Bible. It wouldn't be a credible source in journalism or in university work – unless it were a Christian university. It's no more credible than the Koran or other Holy Books.

In my opinion, we'll get a lot further in getting along with one another if we admit that our "books" may be true for us but not necessarily for others. Likewise, our cultural values are good for us but not necessarily for others. Why not strive to get past our ethnocentrism?

If we want to be respected, don't we have to show respect to others?

It's a cop out to play the martyr.

Mary

9:42 pm
April 25, 2009


Bitsy

Member

posts 71

Mary, let's just agree to disagree. I really do try to be tolerant and not be judgemental. Hopefully that is the reflection of God that I have shown. I firmly believe that God meets you where you are be that in a biker bar or a church.

Bitsy

3:27 am
April 26, 2009


glittered when he walked

New Member

posts -1

Sorry,

I do not agree that the world is tolerant of EVERYTHING except christianity.

If one adheres strictly to any of the myriad of christian/non-christian faiths to the point where one is denying to others certain rights based solely on something like homosexuality then that is markedly intolerant. By denying them these rights one affects how they can and cannot live..that is punitive. One is certainly free to believe that they may burn in hell for all eternity, but the moment one takes steps to penalize homosexuals (either directly through sodomy laws or indirectly through the denial of rights) in this life for being homosexuals – THAT is textbook intolerance.

In certain instances, religion does experience intolerance for certain. We maintain a separation of church and state in the US..or well we at least try to do so. That may be defined as intolerance, but that is an intolerance which is reasonable IMO.

10:36 pm
April 26, 2009


Terriberry

New Member

posts -1

I read these comments on tolerance, and the sum up my beliefs on how Christians should view the subject of Tolerance. Let me know your thoughts.

In our age of “tolerance,” moral relativism is touted as the supreme virtue. Every philosophy, idea, and faith system has equal merit, says the relativist, and is worthy of equal respect. Those who favor one faith system over another or—even worse—claim a knowledge of absolute truth are considered narrow-minded, unenlightened, or even bigoted.

Of course, different religions make mutually exclusive claims, and the relativist is unable to logically reconcile outright contradictions. For example, the Bible makes the claim that “man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment” (Hebrews 9:27), while some Eastern religions teach reincarnation. So, do we die once, or many times? Both teachings cannot be true. The relativist essentially redefines truth in order to create a paradoxical world where multiple, contradictory “truths” can co-exist.

Jesus said, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). A Christian has accepted Truth, not just as a concept, but as a Person. This acknowledgment of Truth distances the Christian from the so-called “open-mindedness” of the day.

The Christian has publicly acknowledged that Jesus rose from the dead (Romans 10:9-10). If he truly believes in the Resurrection, how can he be “open-minded” concerning an unbeliever’s assertion that Jesus never rose again? For a Christian to deny the clear teaching of God’s Word would indeed be a betrayal of God.

Note that we have cited the fundamentals of the faith in our examples so far. Some things (such as the bodily resurrection of Christ) are non-negotiable. Other things may be open to debate, such as who wrote the book of Hebrews, or the nature of Paul’s “thorn in the flesh.” We should avoid becoming embroiled in disputations over secondary matters (2 Timothy 2:23; Titus 3:9).

Even when disputing/dialoguing over prominent doctrines, a Christian should exercise restraint and show respect. It is one thing to disagree with a position; it is quite another to disparage a person. We must hold fast to the Truth while showing compassion to those who question Truth. Like Jesus, we must be full of grace and truth both (John 1:14). Peter strikes a good balance between having the answer and having humility: “Always be prepared to give an answer to everyone who asks you to give the reason for the hope that you have. But do this with gentleness and respect” (1 Peter 3:15).

11:15 pm
April 26, 2009


marypoppins

Member

posts 4

what's your source for this propaganda, TB?

11:30 pm
April 26, 2009


marypoppins

Member

posts 4

That's great that you find this useful to you, but the writer is no more RIGHT or CREDIBLE than any other person with a particular belief. He/She may have some credibility for you because you believe in the Bible.

However, NO ONE REALLY KNOWS what happens after we die or IF there's a God or a heaven or a hell. People simply have their beliefs.

You may need to believe that you have chosen "correctly" and that this particular way is the true and only way.

Whatever.

10:40 am
April 27, 2009


Terriberry

New Member

posts -1

The bible. Whats your source..?

11:05 am
April 27, 2009


marypoppins

Member

posts 4

TB,
you wrote "these comments on tolerance"

what is your source for THESE COMMENTS? I realize Bible references are made in the comments, but where did the COMMENTS come from? are they your original words? it seems that you copied and pasted them from another writer

and though you may see the Bible as a kind of trump card, I don't

11:17 am
April 27, 2009


Terriberry

New Member

posts -1

LOL… the Bible is the trump card.
It's ok, with me if you dont beleive. It's not me you have to worry about.


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